Upcoming Technics SP-10R (100th Anniversary Model)

It appeared as if jpjones3318 had torn apart an sp 10R only to return it.  I may have read into that wrong, my bad.

Pani

Some of these guys have compared the Sp10 Mk3 and Sp10-R. Every one of them preferred the Sp10 Mk3. Again same observation, Mk3 has much more drive and pace while 10-R is more audiophile kinds, sophisticated and nice types.

 Every serious audiophile I personally know and trust has mirrored the identical sentiments.  For raw playback capability, the Sp10Mk.3 remains at the top of the heap.  Whereas, the Technics Sp10R is brand new, important for those worried about such things (...not me...) but sound to my ears is more relaxed, laid back still with great detail.  Naturally speed pitch is superb, this is a given.  I will leave more colorful audiophile adjectives and storytelling anecdotes for others.  I heard one in person now twice for extended listening sessions, and they are nice, however my Mk.3 NGS is clearly on another level.  

  

tzh21y

It appeared as if jpjones3318 had torn apart an sp 10R only to return it.  I may have read into that wrong, my bad.

After speaking with the designer of my direct drive, I can understand why, as what is under the hood may be a shock to some.  People always assume that something "new" = better.  This is not always the case.  Technics clearly did not produce a modern day Mk.3 equivalent, they made a great table, but not a world beater.      

I predict in about five years or so, people will be saying OMG that sp 10R, I have to have one, they are just so much better than a Mk III, which whether they are or not 72 hours run in will not give you any idea of whats to come my friend.

The verbal description of the difference between the SP10R and the SP10 Mk3 SQ sounds to me like what I would describe as the difference between a coreless motor (in the 10R) and an iron core motor (in the Mk3).  I run my (JP- and Krebs-modified) Mk3 right next to a Kenwood L07D (coreless motor), and the difference between those two, to my ears in my system, I would describe in about the same language.  My conclusion is different, however.  I don't say the Mk3 is "better", necessarily.  There are certain qualities of the L07D that I find to be more mellifluous, at times when I notice the difference, although I'd have to say the Mk3 is a tiny notch above these days.  Before JP and Krebs mods were applied, I'd say I preferred the L07D by maybe a hair.  I had already come to believe that coreless motors are to be preferred in direct-drive, so I applaud Technics for going in that direction.

tzh, Where does JP say he returned his 10R?  Also, where does he say that the Mk3 sounded "better"?  From what I read, he said the 10R very slightly outperformed the Mk3 in terms of measurements only and that the Mk3 is built better.  He made no comment on SQ.  Thanks, JP.

right I said I read it wrong, my bad....

The other relevant comparison that I would like to see done is between the SP 10R or SL1000R and any of several modern direct drive turn tables that have hit the market in the last five years or so. One example is the VPI classic. Another is the Brinkmann Bardo.

A friend of mine has a Brinkmam Bardo.

He just bought a vintage Yamaha GT2000.

He said the speed control and grip of the Yammy is in another world - more akin to his old Monaco.

I don't think he will be keeping his more expensive Bardo.

So why did he sell the Monaco?  (Presumably you refer to the Grand Prix Monaco, a turntable we once thought was "expensive" at $20,000 or so.)

Thanks, Lew.  Hope you’re doing well. 

Hi Lew

He sold the Monaco and the rest of his gear (kept his vinyl) as he moved to Cambodia for the last 4 years. He is back in AU and back buying hifi again.

I liked the sound of the Monaco, but hated the ergonomics of the screw down clamp and how bloody long it took to  start up and slow down.

cheers

I confess that I was biased against the GP Monaco because of its carbon fiber chassis.  In general, I have not liked carbon fiber as used in vinyl reproduction.  Also, the Monaco was deliberately low in mass; I have another bias in favor of high mass for direct-drive.  This is not to say that I know I am right, and they were wrong.  There's a good argument for low density/low mass, as well.

Shane (Downunder), I am rather surprised that the GT2000 so outperforms the Bardo.  In this case, both use coreless motors, and I would not have thought that the Bardo would have audible "speed control" issues at all, certainly not in comparison to a vintage control circuit.  Maybe he is hearing differences between the two that are caused by something other than imprecise speed control. (Or maybe his Bardo is "broken"?)

Hi Lew

GT2000 has high torque motor and Bardo low torque motor.  

This may have something to do with it.

I can't really understand why anyone would design DD table that takes 8-12 seconds to start up. Is there something the Japanese knew how to do that current manufacturers don't?

VPI strikes back......

https://www.analogplanet.com/content/vpi-debuts-new-15000-hw-40-direct-drive-turntable

oh boy

I can’t really understand why anyone would design DD table that takes 8-12 seconds to start up. Is there something the Japanese knew how to do that current manufacturers don’t?

This "white paper" from Brinkmann on the Oasis kind of explains the low-torque choice, though I’m not sure it really says anything more than "we think it sounds better."
https://www.brinkmann-audio.de/inhalt/en/whitepaper/oasis.pdf
I’m a happy Oasis user but I’m definitely intrigued by the GT2000. How does one fine-tune speed? I don’t see a controller in the images I find on the web.

You're going slightly off-topic here, this thread is about Technics 

halcro2,197 posts10-23-2018 12:29amVPI strikes back......

https://www.analogplanet.com/content/vpi-debuts-new-15000-hw-40-direct-drive-turntable

Henry.  It undercuts the Technics by almost 5k.   And has a decent tonearm.

Unlike the Brinkman and Monaco - it starts and stops in 1 second. 

Yes Shane....
It appears that VPI has declared war on Technics...?
It requires chutzpah to take on a company the size of Matsushita at their own game...🤪
And I suspect that this new table will sound as good as (if not better than) their $30,000 VPI Direct which Fremer has as his only A+ turntable I believe...?

The VPI looks just okay to me. I don't yet believe their styling has caught up with their engineering.

It appears that VPI has declared war on Technics...?

David VS Goliath? Who knows who will win, I have already done a thought but I do not say it.  LoL

@rwwear 

I have to agree. That is a very plain, almost ugly table to me. I hope it sounds amazing and they restyle it in the future.

I am the person Downunder mentioned who bought the GT2000 and also has the Bardo. Just to clarify, the Bardo is not "broken" as someone suggested and it is a very fine turntable and the 12.1 is an excellent arm. While I am attempting to sell this combination that has nothing to do with dissatisfaction in its performance or quality of finish which is well above the Yamaha(the finish just to be clear). Rather, it is my interest to strike off in another direction in the hobby via 1980's DD turntables. I have recently purchased a Technics SL1000 MK3 without arm unfortunately(EPA100 on the way) and if I sell the Bardo I will look for another lower cost DD option. If I do not sell the Bardo I will keep put a high quality MC in it. I currently use only MM carts, the Clearaudio Virtuoso V1 and the Clearaudio Charisma V2. For the Yamaha arm and hopefully the EPA100 I am using the Yamamoto HS-4S headshell with adjustable azimuth.

Regarding the Yamaha GT2000, this has been an eye opener for me. With an arm that seems a bit crude by the standards of the acknowledged top Japanese arms of the period, let alone modern arms, and with the standard phono cable the turntable manages to sound very, very good. The music just sounds right with this table, with excellent dynamics (better than the Bardo) and sound staging (equal to the Bardo). With its very low price point it is, IMO exceptional value for money even considering the potential for additional expenditure if something happens to go wrong given its age. I will soon be getting a clone YOP-1 that many seem to feel improves the presentation and I have recently tried out a copper mat from Artisan Fidelity following positive reports from Downunder. I think this has made a significant improvement to what I already thought was an excellent presentation. How much is in the copper material and how much is the added mass I cannot say but it just sounds more natural to me with this mat. Of course it may not suit other's tastes as it adds no warmth that many crave. I will also try this mat with my Technics when it arrives later this week. 

Ian

welcome to the vintage DD club!!   don't say I didn't tell you over the years :-)

how cool is it to have superb sound and the table starts and stops within one second.

Its a slippery slope from here thou, as you know :-)

wait til you get a Lyra cartridge.

I have a suspicion you will be looking for a 2nd copper platter.  lol.

@phaser you should try an original Micro Seiki CU-500 gunmetal mat on Technics. It’s much thicker and much heavier than CU-180. Also extremely rare compared to CU-180. I don’t have Technics anymore, but still have CU-500, sadly it’s too heavy for my Luxman PD-444. The quality of gunmetal that japanese used to make CU-500 is unbeatable. The size of CU-500 is spot on for Technics SP-10mkIII and MKII. Simply amazing. I don’t think any modern mats can compete with the Micro Seiki CU-500 (2.8 kg, gunmetal).

At the moment i’m using lighter CU-180 on my Luxman and love it. Best mats in my opinion!

SAEC SS-300 is cheaper alternative, this is the 3rd mat in my rating after CU-500 and CU-180. But SAEC is more universal for any turntables, even for belt drive, because of its lightweight..

Ok, there is a NEW MODEL of Technics turntable announced on the official website: Technics SL1210 mk7 

They won't stop! 

There you go .... 

https://www.technics.com/us/news/20190107-sl-1200mk7/

Technics Introduces the New, Long-awaited Direct Drive Turntable SL-1200MK7* Series with Technology for Outstanding Sound Quality

*The European model is the SL-1210MK7.*

January 2019

simply the black version.

simply the black version

They are not black, it’s a classic technics color for 1210 index, one of the GR is same color.

This new SL1210 mk7 will be available in silver too. I think mk7 must be cheaper as it is primary targeted for deejays.

BUT THERE IS ANOTHER ONE
Omg... upcoming SL1500C !!!
How about this one?! LoL

@smer319 

The Technics SL-1000R is $18000.00 
 
The SL-1200G is a bargain at $3995.00

The Technics SL-1000R is finally in our store...Who's the lucky one ?

Sunny Components Inc, USA
626-966-6259.
We shall be displaying the new 1000 Technics Turntable at the Los Angeles Audio Show this Summer.

hello, could you let us know the prices for two brand new models released in 2019?  

1) SL1210 mk7
2) SL1500c  

The new model pricing from Technics is not yet finalized. It will be below $1500.00 for sure ! Could be very revolutionary..

Nice, let us know when you will be able to get the pricelist, thanks 

There are 2 Turntables released. One of them is to get back business lost to the DJ market. The other one is a no frills serious 2 channel table with an improved motor without the DJ mumbo Jumbo stuff. That my friends is going to be DA BOMB ! I will keep you informed.

Just Released pricing for new Technics Models.
The new SL-1500C is at $1399.00 Truly Sublime this table will be.
The new DJ Version SL-1200Mk7 is going to be $1199.00The new SACD / Media server will be $3499.00

Technics SL 1500C is announced an approximate price of around 800 €

https://www.technics.com/us/news/20190107-sl-1500c/

SL1500C

To simplify the playing of analogue records, the built-in Phono EQ connects to a wide variety of devices. 

I wonder if that built-in will be bypassable, so we can use our own phono if we want to.

Certainly the internal phono and the Ortofon cartridge already connected to 1500 will help many noobs that will approach the turntable for the first time; but I do not want to believe this product was designed only for people who want to buy entry level turntables all manufactured by Hampin, or by Rega or Project :(

Just watched Steve Guttenberg’s video with that new Iron Cast Plinth for Technics SP-10R. It’s on 3:55 timeline here. Very impressive. The whole video is not about turntables, but i hope he will make another with OMA just about turntables. There is also Graphite Slate Plinth in the same reportage. Oh, and new Schroeder tonearm?

Look real hard at the pdf 

 

The mk II is much better.  The tone arm is responsive but stays in the groove with no more than 1g more accurately than any arm ever made.  The others that are almost as good but not available separately are those of Denon DP80 and the unobtainium Kenwood L-07D.  Engineering is long gone for this kind of initiative and honesty as I see that few know anything of Physics, Chemistry, Metallurgy or much of anything since the companies are all held by holding companies or fools looking for big bucks for a lot of shiny metals and lights.  Cartridges are the worst.

I own and use the SP10 MkII, in the form of a modified version, in my own system, as the preferred TT, over other owned TT's available such as DD's, Idler Drive and Belt Drive.

Additionally, I am regularly able to receive demo's of other SP10 MkII's in other environments, as well as a SP10R. 

What I have learnt from this is that I am quite stimulated by the presentation of the SP10 MkII's and R, the enjoyment factor is present for myself when a Tonearm or Cart' is in use that differs from my own selection. At no time I have been presented with a presentation that has been repelled and not wanted to be continued.

The nitty gritty of design and spec' differences between the former and later models in use, is not something I have got too bogged down in, even though I have been on a few occasions in lengthy discussions about the merits of these variants of design.

As my own is a Bespoke Tweak Model SP10 MkII, and I know how the original and later models show differences in their design and function.

From my standpoint, the stimulus on offer from a performance is what really matters, and from all Versions encountered, there is stimulus aplenty, enough to keep other available TT's in their storage boxes or as dust collectors on shelves.