Veroman - could you please translate it or refer with a Google picture since I am not so familiar with electronics :)
And then how should I perform the trick :)
And then how should I perform the trick :)
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I have another question for those more familiar with the electronics - today I had some short power outages which resulted in broken audio system again - the light which indicates the power is blinking. When i got the system from the repair shop (they didnt repair it at all) I plugged it in and it was working, but since today after those bad power inputs it is not again. I wonder what that could be - it seems only after a power surge of some sort this can happen. |
OK, my old system works without repair :) I would like to ask if anyone can give an opinion - I am using PC optic output from HD sound card, but when listen to STEREO media, the sound is not good I mean is flat, no deep bass, etc.. Only when I listen to the Dolby/DTS media like movies the sound is far better. |
Back to OP, I had Avalon Eclipse, B&W 801 S3, Merlin TSMM, Spendor 7/1, Vendersteen 3a and 2Ce, NHT 2.5i, Canton Carat, and Definitive Tech BP10 speakers in last 24 years. All their mid/high freq. were faded and washed off with any powered sub-woofer. The powered sub doesnt blend at all with almost speakers. The mid and high freq units on floorstanders or standmounts are same The floorstander has bigger cabinet for only (low) bass. The floorstander is worse with powered subs because the juice/power from amplifier is wasted on woofers on the floorstander and the mid/high freq. are weaker. The standmount speaker has cleaner/stronger mid/high freq. with more juice from amps. Still they dont blends well with powerful subs. The conventional speaker doesnt blend well with any powered-subs. A good satellite speaker system (whether floorstand or standmount) requires vivid and strong mid and high freq. Nowadays, many high output ribbon tweeters (94db) make a good match with powered subs. However, the mid range drivers (89 db max.) are still with low output and cant be match with powered subs. Wavetouch Grand Teton speaker has strong and vivid mid and high frequencies to match even with multiple powered subs. Only Grand Teton offers mid range horns in their price range. OP asked which ones are the top brands and worth the money? Grand Teton is not a top brand, but its worth the money. Alex/Wavetouch Audio |
Addressing the original question Its a very difficult question to answer. First there are many speakers out there made by small manufacturers, you are unlikely ever to hear, that, to my ears anyway, simply blow away commercial stuff. There is a guy in Sydney Australia who has a home made Axiom 80 based system that is very famous. Some guys from the US were in Sydney and decided to check it out, as well as other systems here in Aus. Their verdict was it outshone by a wide margin anything else they heard here or in the US. But of the speakers most people are likely to have access to, my personal favourite is the Rockport's. That however is just my view. For example I don't like Magico much - too brittle in their sound for me - yet some love em. I really dislike B&W's 802D's - grungy midrange, boomy bass and tissy treble - but again some love em and really argue with me about why I feel that way about them despite I am not the only one of that view. Heard the PSB Synchrony a while ago and thought they were ghastly - but again some love em. The Martin Logans have this utterly entrancing midrange you can reach out and touch, but sound disjointed in the bass as if you are listening to a separate subwoffer. Yet some are not bothered by this at all. I could go on but hopefully you get the idea there is really no answer to such questions except to experience it yourself. Thanks Bill |
Last year I did demo one time at the show with this combination. It is a musical combination. I talked to a some people who still owned the old Onkyo amps. They said it is still the same kind of sound. The best cables like the Audioquest Wel let you hear differences in Heights better than I ever heard with other highend cables. This is a part what makes a 3D sound even more involving. That is why it should be used at shows more often. These kind of level you hear not so many times at shows. But it is stunning to experience it. @ZD542; I love depth with my screen as well. That is why I bought the Samsung 64F8500 plasma. It outperforms the Panasonic V60 and Z60 in depth......:) 3D everywhere......in my sound and plasma! |
Bo, your words..."I spoke with Onkyo about it. I will try to get it from them as well. I got an email that I was right about the words I used. I will send you a personal message when I recieved it." As indicated in my last post, don't bother. Whatever Onkyo or Marja had to say is just their SUBJECTIVE opinion and meaningless to most of us on the forum. Of course, they are going to say they are impressed with the sound of equipment they MANUFACTURE and SELL! But you said, you were the absolute best sound at the show. Only a panel of independent judges voting you the best in show, would carry some OBJECTIVE meaning when trying to prove your boasts. Again, good job pleasing your bosses but its pretty meaningless to me. Just because Onkyo or MA says their products are the best, and so are you who they pay for consulting, doesn't make anyone want to buy one. Unless consumers are truly that gullible in your country but I doubt it. Its no different than a Mother saying her newborn is the beautiful baby in the world. Even if the baby looks like ET. For the thousandth time, don't you get it??? |
I spoke with Onkyo about it. I will try to get it from them as well. I got an email that I was right about the words I used. I will send you a personal message when I recieved it. I am Always honest and things are exactly as I said they are. I will do some shows this years. I will make a professional video with my Sony pro equipment. The best sound Always will win :) |
Well Bo, true to your word you had one of your buddies at Monitor Audio NL post a message that you did an incredible job with their own equipment. I don't think any of us are surprised by their opinion about their own equipment though. Thank Marja for a well written post even if it doesn't say that Bo was best in show. I see no need to email her or Onkyo for that matter. This isn't the kind of critical feedback the forum was expecting. But good job making your bosses happy! |
Dear Paraneer, During the AV Show, organised by Audio Video2day, in Veldhoven, in the demonstration room of Onkyo, Mr. Bobby Kingma, put down a incredible demonstration with the following equipment: At last someone who dares to trust his own ears and experience, obtained by years of working in renowned hifi retail stores. And dares to put down a HiEnd set of the best of the best, without no compromises. No hidden agendas, just hours and hours of listening and combining the best. Knowing how to get the best out of, in this case, a Monitor Audio Platinum 5.1 set. Creating depth, a true performance experience. Alex Brady, one of the directors from Monitor Audio UK was a visitor on the show and he was impressed, one of the best or even the best demonstration ever with a Platinum 5.1 set, he remarked. Monitor Audio Nederland B.V. Marja Hoogendoorn info@monitoraudionederland.nl * Paraneer you can email her when you want to. |
These sort of statements should set off our BS detectors. If your little voice inside says "something's not right here", pay attention to it. Actual proof is hard to come by, but at least expect (preferably independent) evidence and/or some sort of demonstration of claimed expertise before accepting someone as an earned authority in any given field.I take this as a direct assault on my claims of N-dimensional sound! I would also hold it up as an example of the pettiness that runs through the high end audio business which I and I alone will be the savoir of. You question my credibility, well who are you? Just because you're a successful loudspeaker designer with impressive technical chops doesn't make you an authority on quantum micro dimensional coherence wave theory. (Sure, my certificate is in cosmetology, not cosmology, but I've read a lot on my own.) It's quite apparent that you don't understand N-dimensional sound. I'd explain it to you, but it's so complicated that you wouldn't understand the explanation. I'm doing you a favor. If you could grasp just a portion of what I have achieved with N-dimensional sound your head would start spinning and you'd end up in the fetal position crying like a baby. N-dimensional sound is hyper-palpable! Duke, sorry to make this so personal. I realize you are totally intimidated by my extensive internet forum persona and was acting defensively. I accept you your apology. |
In general I try to avoid internet squabbles with fellow industry members because I think it's bad form. But I will toss out a few thoughts on the concept of unearned authority, which is something that arises beyond these walls as well. In any field, authority should be earned and expertise should be demonstrated or documented, and not merely claimed, nor carelessly granted to any claimant that comes along. For instance, if you need to have your website translated into French, you might ask someone claiming expertise to demonstrate, or provide documentation of, his expertise before you hire him. Note that claims (no matter how numerous and impressive) are not proof, and may not even constitute evidence if there is no true source cited or reference provided. Statements such as "So you want proof; just ask them"; and "I have proven this more than once"; and "They know that I can create a superior end result... I do not have to prove this anymore. They know it!!" are attempts to elevate a mere claim to the status "proof" when it does not even qualify as "evidence". These are pretty clear indications that unearned authority is being sought. These sort of statements should set off our BS detectors. If your little voice inside says "something's not right here", pay attention to it. Actual proof is hard to come by, but at least expect (preferably independent) evidence and/or some sort of demonstration of claimed expertise before accepting someone as an earned authority in any given field. Duke |
Good analogy Tls but I attribute his behavior as a result of one of four possibilities... 1. He was dropped on his head too many times as a baby. 2. He was over lavished with praise, affection and money as a child. 3. He constantly forgets to takes his morning meds as an adult. 4. Or all of the above. And he can't prove one damned thing that he spouts off. |
Read better, you are a bad reader.......I use Only Pass Labs poweramps for my front speakers since 2009. I am talking about my personal set. The PR-SC5509 I only use as a pre amp. I did not expect to create such an extrme level. You Always need some luck in life. Marantz does not even come close to all the parts you Judge a poweramp for compared to Marantz. Marantz can only dream about that..... For my work I beat Marantz and Denon amps for supper!! People who buy Monitor Audio speakers often have a Marantz or Denon amp. 2 dimensional sound is for mongols. You bring in a 3 dimensional amp........ The addictive part does his work. It is difficult to go back to 2 dimensional sound. You don't want to be a mongol....do ya? |
Per Bo..."Depth give instruments and voices a much more realistic and involving experience. Same thing about an intimate physical stage. This part Marantz does not own." And you base this statement on what proof Bo? More Bo..."When you compare the more expensive Marantz amps with Pass labs in sound realism, they are of a much lower level." I thought your were comparing the upper level Marantz amps to a mainstream Onkyo AVR Bo. Now its Pass Labs??? Make up your mind. |
Depth give instruments and voices a much more realistic and involving experience. Same thing about an intimate physical stage. This part Marantz does not own. When you compare the more expensive Marantz amps with Pass labs in sound realism, they are of a much lower level. All the parts togheter they never will win any war. This is clear and simple as 1 and 1=2. When you use the best cables, you also go to a much higher endresult. When you put all the parts togheter you have a change to create the magic audio can give. At the end it is about emotion and feeling. |
More boasting from Bo... "I have even proven that I beat a Marantz KI integrated of 3000 dollar with a Onkyo 5010 with Pro. It was superior in every single aspect you Judge an amp for." I have the Marantz PM15S2, that is very similar to the KI Pearl. And in my opinion, these Marantz integrateds are very good sounding and extremely well built amps. Further, I need no DSP to get the performance I want for stereo. I rely on careful speaker placement and an understanding of room acoustics. Along with properly matching an amps output to the load given by the speaker. And as happy as I am with the results, I would never make the claims that you do. Because it is still an opinion and opinions are like A**Holes Bo. We all have them. So I am curious how exactly you have proven that the Onkyo AVR with Audyssey Pro is superior for 2 channel stereo. You say "you have proven" it. Along with "every single aspect you judge an amp for". Pretty strong words sport. I don't know about you, but most EE's judge aspects of an amps performance by benching it and evaluating the numbers. And numbers can be offered as written proof. So, just how would you prove your statements to the forum Bo? |
The fun thing in audio is beating the competition. When you work more precise you Always will win. The main reason why I am so persisting in winning is based on the fact that too many people deliver a low endresult in audio. In 16 years of time I have seen too many average and worse shows. Visit too many people at home with a low level in endresult who spend a lot of money. |
"I can tell you that I can crush all Marantz and Denon surround and integrated amps with ease. " Crush, Kill....Destroy!!!! |
With the Onkyo PR-SC5509 with my way of pro I achieve a stunning level as a pre amp. I play about 80% in stereo. Since 2009 I use Pass labs poweramps. I owned the Pass Labs XP-20 for 2 years of time. With the Onkyo PR-SC5509 and my pro measurement I get a superior level compared to the XP-20 with Pass Labs. The biggest differences are: a much sharper individual focus of instruments and voices. This you easilly can hear in 2th and 3th voices. They are a lot more clear than what you get with the XP-20. With the target curves I used I have a much better articulation of voices. You hear deatials which are not there or almost not there with the XP-20. In drive it is the same thing. You also can play a lot louder without any roomacoustic limitation. Withe the XP-20 the room will work against you a lot sooner. With the Stillpoints, Audioquest Wel, Redwood and Purist Audio LE powercables you get an extreme level of 3D sound. Instruments and voices are physical apparent at a level most people never heard. The differences in Heights give you a new level in listening to music. The air around voices make them so much more intimate. We had a long discussion here at Audiogon about why some cables are so expensive. Audio needs to be more open and transparent. That is why this monday I had a dicussion about cables with the head of Audioquest Europe. I said to him; this need to be heard. This makes music so much more involving and unique. That is why shows needs be held differently. |