The had and the had nots. I think my favorite quote of his in the video is, I have a list of bull crap in my mind. I’ve oft commented that amplifier designers are perhaps the last to get the memo on fuses and wire directionality. Nobody knows why.😳
The new Synergistic Research BLUE fuses ....
New SR BLUE fuse thread ...
I’ve replaced all 5 of the SR BLACK fuses in my system with the new SR BLUE fuses. Cold, out of the box, the BLUE fuses stomped the fully broken-in SR BLACKS in a big way. As good as the SR BLACK fuses were/are, especially in comparison with the SR RED fuses, SR has found another break-through in fuses.
1. Musicality ... The system is totally seamless at this point. Its as if there is no system in the room, only a wall to wall, front to back and floor to ceiling music presentation with true to life tonality from the various instruments.
2. Extension ... I’ve seemed to gain about an octave in low bass response. This has the effect of putting more meat on the bones of the instruments. Highs are very extended, breathing new life into my magic percussion recordings. Vibes, chimes, bells, and triangles positioned in the rear of the orchestra all have improved. I’ve experienced no roll-off of the highs what so ever with the new BLUE fuses. Just a more relaxed natural presentation.
3. Dynamics ... This is a huge improvement over the BLACK fuses. Piano and vibes fans ... this is fantastic.
I have a Japanese audiophile CD of Flamenco music ... the foot stomps on the stage, the hand clapping and the castanets are present like never before. Want to hear natural sounding castanets? Get the BLUE fuses.
4. Mid range ... Ha! Put on your favorite Ben Webster album ... and a pair of adult diapers. Play Chris Connor singing "All About Ronnie," its to die for.
Quick .... someone here HAS to buy this double album. Its a bargain at this price. Audiophile sound, excellent performance by the one and only Chris Connor. Yes, its mono ... but so what? Its so good you won’t miss the stereo effects. If you’re the lucky person who scores this album, please post your results here.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ULTRASONIC-CLEAN-The-Finest-Of-CHRIS-CONNOR-Bethlehem-Jazz-1975-NM-UNPLAYED-...
Overall impressions:
Where the RED fuses took about 20 hours to sound their best, and the BLACK fuses took upwards of 200 hours of total break-in, the BLUE fuses sounded really good right out of the box ... and that’s without doing anything about proper directional positioning. Not that the BLUE fuses don’t need breaking in, they do. The improvement continues through week three. Its a gradual break-in thing where each listening session is better than the last.
Everything I described above continues to break new ground in my system as the fuses continue breaking in. Quite honestly, I find it difficult to tear myself away from the system in order to get things done. Its truly been transformed into a magical music machine. With the expenditure of $150.00 and a 30 day return policy there’s really nothing to lose. In my system, its like upgrading to a better pre amp, amp, CD player or phono stage. Highly recommended.
Kudos to Ted Denney and the entire staff at SR. Amazing stuff, guys. :-)
Frank
PS: If you try the SR BLUE fuses, please post your results here. Seems the naysayers, the Debbie Downers and Negative Nellie’s have hijacked the original RED fuse thread. A pox on their houses and their Pioneer receivers.
Frank
I’ve replaced all 5 of the SR BLACK fuses in my system with the new SR BLUE fuses. Cold, out of the box, the BLUE fuses stomped the fully broken-in SR BLACKS in a big way. As good as the SR BLACK fuses were/are, especially in comparison with the SR RED fuses, SR has found another break-through in fuses.
1. Musicality ... The system is totally seamless at this point. Its as if there is no system in the room, only a wall to wall, front to back and floor to ceiling music presentation with true to life tonality from the various instruments.
2. Extension ... I’ve seemed to gain about an octave in low bass response. This has the effect of putting more meat on the bones of the instruments. Highs are very extended, breathing new life into my magic percussion recordings. Vibes, chimes, bells, and triangles positioned in the rear of the orchestra all have improved. I’ve experienced no roll-off of the highs what so ever with the new BLUE fuses. Just a more relaxed natural presentation.
3. Dynamics ... This is a huge improvement over the BLACK fuses. Piano and vibes fans ... this is fantastic.
I have a Japanese audiophile CD of Flamenco music ... the foot stomps on the stage, the hand clapping and the castanets are present like never before. Want to hear natural sounding castanets? Get the BLUE fuses.
4. Mid range ... Ha! Put on your favorite Ben Webster album ... and a pair of adult diapers. Play Chris Connor singing "All About Ronnie," its to die for.
Quick .... someone here HAS to buy this double album. Its a bargain at this price. Audiophile sound, excellent performance by the one and only Chris Connor. Yes, its mono ... but so what? Its so good you won’t miss the stereo effects. If you’re the lucky person who scores this album, please post your results here.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ULTRASONIC-CLEAN-The-Finest-Of-CHRIS-CONNOR-Bethlehem-Jazz-1975-NM-UNPLAYED-...
Overall impressions:
Where the RED fuses took about 20 hours to sound their best, and the BLACK fuses took upwards of 200 hours of total break-in, the BLUE fuses sounded really good right out of the box ... and that’s without doing anything about proper directional positioning. Not that the BLUE fuses don’t need breaking in, they do. The improvement continues through week three. Its a gradual break-in thing where each listening session is better than the last.
Everything I described above continues to break new ground in my system as the fuses continue breaking in. Quite honestly, I find it difficult to tear myself away from the system in order to get things done. Its truly been transformed into a magical music machine. With the expenditure of $150.00 and a 30 day return policy there’s really nothing to lose. In my system, its like upgrading to a better pre amp, amp, CD player or phono stage. Highly recommended.
Kudos to Ted Denney and the entire staff at SR. Amazing stuff, guys. :-)
Frank
PS: If you try the SR BLUE fuses, please post your results here. Seems the naysayers, the Debbie Downers and Negative Nellie’s have hijacked the original RED fuse thread. A pox on their houses and their Pioneer receivers.
Frank
2,978 responses
I could tell immediately whether the fuses were in phase or out of phase. Oh dear!!! Clean up aisle 4. Ask Dennis Had of Cary Audio fame, he’ll set you straight on where and how to insert your fuse.. https://youtu.be/xLQsEeBKg1E?t=1791 Cheers George |
Geoffkait. I immediately noticed a weird out of phase sound from the first SR black fuses in my amps. Upon reversing their direction, the focus returned between the speakers. Same thing with the blue fuse in both my audio systems. I could tell immediately whether the fuses were in phase or out of phase. Hope that helps |
As a group there’s substantial diversity of opinion amongst audio equipment manufacturers and designers. Some recognize the improved sound quality of better fuses and some don’t. Same with capacitors,resistors, wire, vibration control products etc. Opinions are all across the spectrum. I’ve read where some don’t believe in tube rolling and say the chosen stock tube can’t be improved upon. Which again is why people have to listen and make their own judgements concerning audio products. At some point of acquired experience most listeners gain the confidence to trust their ears and not care any longer what others think. Charles |
I bypassed my fuses with solid silver 26ga wire for about a month. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmyucZa6wD0 Cheers George |
For those that need some different views on fuse "snake oil" in audio, in which he singled out boutique fuses here is a video interview with Dennis Had, founder/owner of Cary Audio when it was on top, also Dentron and Inspire amps. https://youtu.be/xLQsEeBKg1E?t=1791 Cheers George |
Bdp24 I bypassed my fuses with solid silver 26ga wire for about a month. My amp was about 20 yrs old and I felt it was pretty stable in my system. Anyway it sounded easily noticeably better in every-way. So I got me some SR fuses and they sounded better than the silver wire. I don't know why. But I do not care because me likes it. |
One can google to see that some modders eliminate the soldered in fuse on their mods. OPPPMOD and Clones power supply boards do away with the soldered in fuses as well. Also, I believe OPPOMOD upgrades the fuse as well as part of their work, or it could be Clones (I forget). Frankly, anything that can do away with the fuse, retaining the designers goals, while maintaining safety, would benefit everyone. All the best, Nonoise |
ARC tube power amp owners know (or should know) that the company made the engineering choice to not fuse their output tubes Most good audio amps don’t fuse in this location or on the power rails save for a few PA amps I've seen. But all ARC amps have fused mains, just like any other manufacturers. Today it is starting to become common practice to do away with your everyday fuse and holder and also circuit breakers, because of the cost of these. And in their place many now are starting to use SMD (surface mount device) fuses which are around 2-3mm long and soldered in. These are saving manufacturers around 80% of the cost of using fuses/holders and circuit breakers. (sorry no snake oil ones of these, yet?) http://www.mouser.com/pdfdocs/TEConnectivitysurfacemountfuses.pdf Cheers George |
Thanks for posting. My take away is he doesn’t know. One wonders if he’s still looking. That’s what we used to call a CYA. 😬 ”With the clarity of hindsight there are many explanations of why this mattered, damping factor changes not the least of them. The point of the story is simple. Fuses matter. But why should they matter in the AC circuit? I don’t have a great answer handy. But we’ll look some more tomorrow.” |
And, I’d like to ask if anyone knows whether after this discovery, that lots of amps are now designed with the fuse "in the feedback loop" and as a result, will definitely sound better with a better made fuse. And as a result, has the "manual" that naysayers refer to been updated to reflect this. All the best, Nonoise |
FusesJoin Our CommunitySubscribe to Paul's PostsI thought this would add some perspective as it comes from a very talented amp builder. All the best, Nonoise |
A hypothetical question---no snarkiness intended---for those who have heard a significant improvement in sound by installing an "audiophile" fuse in place of a garden variety one: For the absolute best sound possible, it makes sense to consider the possibility that the altogether elimination of a fuse may be expected to result in sound superior to even the best "sounding" fuse (parenthesis for the benefit of those who don’t cotton to such a notion). When I had Ric Schultz "modify" (if you know Ric, you know his mods are far more than mere "mods" ;-) my Audible Illusions Modulus 2 pre-amp, I was given the choice of having the fuse removed from the pre-amp. Being young(er) and opposed to compromise, I elected to have Ric remove it. In the promotional literature for his mod, Ric stated removing the fuse would enable the pre to provide slightly improved sound quality. Having heard the modified Modulus only with the fuse removed, I can’t testify to the truth of that claim. So my question is: Audiophile-grade fuse enthusiasts are obviously very serious about doing whatever is possible to squeeze the maximum potential out of their gear. Does that include throwing caution to the wind by removing the fuses from their electronics? ARC tube power amp owners know (or should know) that the company made the engineering choice to not fuse their output tubes, as they feel fuses in those locations compromise the sound quality of their amps. The penalty for doing so is damage to the amp in the (inevitable) case of a tube going bad. Are there any audiophile fuse proponents willing to go "all the way"? |
Many feel that the hyperbole attached to subjectively experienced esoteric tweaks is worthy of discussion, and even though disagreements occur, I imagine most should be able to handle it and not feel personally offended.With just a change or two: Many feel that the hyperbole attached to subjectively held beliefs they feel to be beyond reproach due to their basis on the limits of what we know is worthy of discussion, and even though..... It's not one sided, like the picture you paint. There is no high ground of any sort here, only two (or more) sides to all of this, so yes, most shouldn't take it personally. All the best, Nonoise |
I think the ebb and flow of discussions, where a forum participant feels another member's comments are worthy of response and might be critical of that persons opinions, shouldn't be considered a "personal" comment if that opinion disagrees with his, or anybody else's shared point of view. If a forum participant deems that any disagreement is a personal attack due to their their unimpeachable background and listening skills, that individual might not be suited to participate in a public forum. Many feel that the hyperbole attached to subjectively experienced esoteric tweaks is worthy of discussion, and even though disagreements occur, I imagine most should be able to handle it and not feel personally offended. |
After my friend heard my system with 5 blue fuses replacing the blacks asked me to order some blues for the pre and phono stage. We installed them last night. Night to day difference in sound quality. My friend couldn't beleive it and was a smiles. Speaking of smiles, I have one now reading all the naysayers post. You guys are really missing out music wise. |
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Well, I've caught up on several days banter. Again, I personally tested a new Littlefuse and Buss fuse a year ago, in both directions as well. My conclusion was there was NO difference than with the same fuses from 10 years ago. However, installing SR fuses made a very significant and beneficial improvement WHEREBY, the manufacturer of my amps chose to upgrade his amps with circuit breakers since he is adverse to spending $149 on per fuse. As to Wolf_Garcia, I stopped reporting him when he stopped attacking me personally. I am very well educated (2 BAs, JD, MPA, OREA licensed commercial appraiser), worked in construction building homes and apartments, recording and mastering engineer for projects for UCLA, USC, LAJS, AJU, VBS, TRZ, Viklarbo Ensemble as well as professional musicians. When I pay my money for an tweak, it better work or back it goes. I tried 8 different brands of vibration control devices prior to sticking with Stillpoints. The point is that an attack on me personally is personal and I hate personal attacks. A difference of opinion is fine, as my manufacturing engineer friend and I have many differences of opinion. I will report only those attacks which I find to be personal. |
I don't care what you say, I will still inform the non EE educated of the technical side of fuses and what they can and can't do. What to get how much they should cost, as so not to get ripped off. BTW I use $2 "Little Fuses" every bit as good as what your using. https://www.digikey.com.au/products/en/circuit-protection/fuses/139?k=fuses&k=&pkeyword=fuse... Cheers George |
George, Then why, oh why, do you hawk like a harpy with shots of ancient fuses that no one in their right mind (except you, maybe) would advocate using? It can’t be to prove a point because it’s been shot down many times over and it’s only when I give you an opening, that there are fuses that can protect as well as sound better, you chomp down on it like the dog who chased the car? What does a mouth full of car taste like? Similar to crow? It’s been painfully pointed out, and most likely glossed over by you, that those better $4 fuses are a starting point for audiophile fuses. Those very same $4 fuses have been evaluated many years ago and though they sound better than the cheap ones you’ve been shouting about, there are still better ones out there. Those other fuses have been tested and refined over the years and thousands of satisfied audiophiles are enjoying a better listening experience for it. And, as for your "gods", you may have a need to worship them on false premises, but don’t think for a moment, that anyone else does to the exclusion of what could be a better listening experience. All the best, Nonoise |
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Georgehifi sez ...
Perhaps you'd be better off hanging out at DIYAudio George. Birds of a feather and all that jazz... frank |
Name dropping of famous amp designers is not only an Appeal to Authority, I.e., logical fallacy, but frankly cannot support the anti re-fusers since amp designers are almost always the LAST to hear about aftermarket fuses. Curl was very much pro using whatever caps, resistors, etc. sounded best back in the day. Probably would be pro fuse these days, actually. |
They’re readily available, cost only $4 apieceHey, put your ! cap on, I’ve got nothing bad to say about quality fuses for a couple of dollars, it’s all about the >$100 boutique ones, that bleed the gullible of their hard earned cash. As I said before you wouldn’t get notables like the industries design "gods" like Nelson Pass, John Curl, Dan D’Agostino ect ect ect talking about fuses the way they are frothed about here. And if those fuse froth’ers went to the sites like DIYAudio.com where they (the gods) hang out, and started talking about fuses they way they do here, they would get toyed around with then spat out severely once they tried of them. As for sand/quartz filled fuses. It doesn’t make them sound any better. It also absorbs the energy when they blow and stops a big mess by most of the time not shattering into pieces.. " Current limiting fuses contain a granular filler, usually high purity quartz sand of a defined grain size and packaging density. The specific grain size distribution provides room to expand for the vapours and gases produced by the arc and offers a large surface for efficient cooling. The filler does melt under the influence of high arc temperatures, absorbing an enormous amount of energy and extinguishing the arc well before current zero. Fused quartz and metal form a non-conductive fulgurite body that prevents re-striking of the arc." Cheers George |
What about the fuses I’ve linked to that use powder to keep the temp down so it doesn’t age the same as the fuses you use? They’re readily available, cost only $4 apiece, and perform better. They’ve been around for many years and the technically proficient know of them. It’s the type of fuse that aftermarket makes based their audio fuses on with an ear and eye towards bettering the sound, and admittedly, making a profit on. You don’t need to spend what SR changes unless you like the results you get as there are well made ones for a lot less. But to each, their own. Get a new hobby horse, George. All the best, Nonoise |
It is just his one sided determination to derail this thread with bunkum No sorry, it’s giving the technically weak a chance to compare a side (dominated by the awesome foursome) that’s not at all technical and considered to be "snake oil". To be compared to a side that has only presented technical merit, that a >$100 boutique AC mains fuse is no better than a quality $2 fuse. If you have a tired original fuse because of too many switch on surges, all you have to do is change it for the same quality $2 one. A slow-blo fuse "ageing" right to left https://peakpinball.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/fuse-8312-640x426.jpg A fast-blo fuse "ageing" left to right https://i.stack.imgur.com/0uqWX.jpg%20 Fuse aging by switching loads The fuse wire gets hot and expands when current flows. At high temperatures, oxidation may happen, which weakens the wire mechanically, and may be electrically, too. Switching on/off a load means the wire is bent each time. Another way to look at this: a fuse is like a light bulb, the old type with a hot filament. Although very hot, it still takes some amazing 1000 hr to melt. And even at under-voltage, burning lower, it will not light ’forever’ and will get dimmer as resistance builds then blows, always at switch-on, that's why the new globe always seems/is brighter, even though the same wattage. Cheers George |
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George why do u feel the need to insult me personally every post you make? because this is exactly what you are doing by insinuating that I cannot possibly be hearing what I know I am hearing you are now just stooping to belittle everyone,s intelligence here who does not or will not agree with your extremely narrow minded and vindictive view. time to get a life Georgie......... |
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At least we have hauled this thread back into a semblance of sanity with relevant posts.Never happen, not while >$100 fuse "snake oil" is said to to be so (unbelievably) much better than a quality $2 fuse. It’s a disease in this industry that needs to be stamped out at every opportunity even if it’s just to protect the gullible from those unscrupulous few that push it. http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-L1VojouAg8E/Vh0U7V3AlAI/AAAAAAADvfY/6D-SJjEJ7FA/s1600/Acerbic%2B02135.jpg Cheers George |
