I’ve replaced all 5 of the SR BLACK fuses in my system with the new SR BLUE fuses. Cold, out of the box, the BLUE fuses stomped the fully broken-in SR BLACKS in a big way. As good as the SR BLACK fuses were/are, especially in comparison with the SR RED fuses, SR has found another break-through in fuses.
1. Musicality ... The system is totally seamless at this point. Its as if there is no system in the room, only a wall to wall, front to back and floor to ceiling music presentation with true to life tonality from the various instruments.
2. Extension ... I’ve seemed to gain about an octave in low bass response. This has the effect of putting more meat on the bones of the instruments. Highs are very extended, breathing new life into my magic percussion recordings. Vibes, chimes, bells, and triangles positioned in the rear of the orchestra all have improved. I’ve experienced no roll-off of the highs what so ever with the new BLUE fuses. Just a more relaxed natural presentation.
3. Dynamics ... This is a huge improvement over the BLACK fuses. Piano and vibes fans ... this is fantastic.
I have a Japanese audiophile CD of Flamenco music ... the foot stomps on the stage, the hand clapping and the castanets are present like never before. Want to hear natural sounding castanets? Get the BLUE fuses.
4. Mid range ... Ha! Put on your favorite Ben Webster album ... and a pair of adult diapers. Play Chris Connor singing "All About Ronnie," its to die for.
Quick .... someone here HAS to buy this double album. Its a bargain at this price. Audiophile sound, excellent performance by the one and only Chris Connor. Yes, its mono ... but so what? Its so good you won’t miss the stereo effects. If you’re the lucky person who scores this album, please post your results here.
Where the RED fuses took about 20 hours to sound their best, and the BLACK fuses took upwards of 200 hours of total break-in, the BLUE fuses sounded really good right out of the box ... and that’s without doing anything about proper directional positioning. Not that the BLUE fuses don’t need breaking in, they do. The improvement continues through week three. Its a gradual break-in thing where each listening session is better than the last.
Everything I described above continues to break new ground in my system as the fuses continue breaking in. Quite honestly, I find it difficult to tear myself away from the system in order to get things done. Its truly been transformed into a magical music machine. With the expenditure of $150.00 and a 30 day return policy there’s really nothing to lose. In my system, its like upgrading to a better pre amp, amp, CD player or phono stage. Highly recommended.
Kudos to Ted Denney and the entire staff at SR. Amazing stuff, guys. :-)
Frank
PS: If you try the SR BLUE fuses, please post your results here. Seems the naysayers, the Debbie Downers and Negative Nellie’s have hijacked the original RED fuse thread. A pox on their houses and their Pioneer receivers.
geoffkait - I realize this remark will be met with some skepticism, but there has never been an audiophile tweak that has been proven to be a hoax or a fraud. Sorry for bursting any bubbles.
My proposed test isn't meant to nor will it prove anything. But it can be useful to demonstrate if what someone claims to hear they actually can hear, or are merely in a state of delusion.
In other words, you are correct. It won't prove a fuse is or isn't a hoax or a fraud. But it will provide opportunity to offer into evidence whether or not the impossible, is possible. Sorry for bursting any bubbles.
Certainly I've seen electrical engineers - the ones who don't have an investment in selling audiophile fuses - saying it's nonsense.
Have you seen the video or read the posting of PS Audio's Paul McGowan stating that fuses do make a difference though he can't explain why?
Further, my skepticism is based both on my own experience
Are you implying you've tried aftermarket fuses? Or are you able to divine that they don't work? It's difficult to figure where the mysticism lies.
All tweaks can't be conflated. If you've been following this thread, someone made an audio waveform copy of the same system with two different power conditioners and there was more info on one than the other. That slight trace of sound was distinguishable enough to recognize the music being played and it added to it, for the better.
Rather than sit on one's high horse and decry things, get on with it, try a fuse, or test one, or carry on yelling from the rooftops, which seems to be de rigueur for naysayers.
The view must be breathtaking though the air is thin.
prof - ....And my own blind tests have given me personal acquaintance with just how easy it is to think I perceive a sonic difference that isn't really there. ....
+1
And the proponents are admitting they are not blind testing, including all the wrong reasons (delusion, denial and invalidity of test) presented by GK.
Very puzzling to say/write the least, especially given how enjoyable it can be to **listen** to Amy > Bob > Amy > Bob, repeat a few times and see if you can guess right. Simple.
Geoff, maybe your statement should include that there is a tweak for every system as nearly all audio systems (equipment and room treatment) vary. What works in one of my audio systems does not necessarily work in my other audio system the same way. However, the SR fuse had such an obvious and apparent improvement over stock cheap fuses that an equipment designer thought it was easy to upgrade his equipment after hearing it without a double blind test. Frank knows that a few (6) high quality capacitors in the right place changes a now cheap DVD player into a world beater CD player.
We have done double blind tests on his IC cables from earlier to later versions which have great similarity. They require this type of test to ferret out what we like and dislike concerning the new versus older design cables. We use different types of music repeated on a CD recording with a third party organizing the CD. Then we listen, make comments and the cable designer decides what he will do next to his new design to keep it or start again and try something else (really subtle changes such as 26g. silver ribbon in place of a 28g. copper ribbon to obtain more open highs).
I realize this remark will be met with some skepticism, but there has never been an audiophile tweak that has been proven to be a hoax or a fraud. Sorry for bursting any bubbles.
Prof I respect your distrust of tweaks and some of your reasoning for said attitude, some of the claims for some tweaks I have seen are borderline idiocy I agree.
However please do not tar ALL tweaks with the same brush.
Not repeating myself yet again, scroll back a few posts and you will see where I have come from as far as fuses are concerned.
And before you ask, yes I AM a working EE but do NOT believe that science has the answer for everything or can explain all.
I keep an open mind on quite a variety of things, not all in the audio world either.
Ridicule away, I am happy with having spent my money where I chose too.
When you rely on the really poor protocols that many audiophiles use to declare sonic differences, it’s not surprising that virtually anything can be claimed to have made a sonic difference.
But, go ahead and spend away on audiophile fuses if you want. It’s your dime, your game.
I’m an audiophile insofar as I love high end audio. But it’s also sometimes frustrating to be associated with a hobby that also comes in for so much well deserved ridicule.
+1 Prof
If you go back to the OP’s first post and see the differences one "black" fuse did, them maybe multiples into all the equipment, then after that the massive improvements the "blue" does over the "black" then the massive improvements multiple "blues" do.
You’ve got to think to your self, that system of his must of sounded real t**d before any of these boutique $150 fuses came along.
Your question is like "how do you know magnetic bracelets don't work in healing people don't work if you haven't tried it?"
Just as a magnetic bracelet is based on medical claims that have no main-stream medical backing and the "evidence" is of the unreliable personal anecdote variety, it's the same with audiophile fuses.
As far as I know...and I'm happy to be corrected...the claim that introducing an audiophile grade fues in place of (a competently implemented) existing fuse in a component will alter the sound doesn't have backing by electrical engineers. Certainly I've seen electrical engineers - the ones who don't have an investment in selling audiophile fuses - saying it's nonsense.
Further, my skepticism is based both on my own experience, and in understanding the reasoning for why the scientific method exists.
I am well aware how fallible human perception is - there's a ton of science showing this. And my own blind tests have given me personal acquaintance with just how easy it is to think I perceive a sonic difference that isn't really there.
If there are measurements showing the output of a competently designed component actually changes with the introduction of an audiophile fuse...I'm not aware of it. But I'd appreciate a link if you have one.
But the talk of "200 hour break in" of a fuse is, I'm sorry, tin-foil-hat territory. And the method the OP used to determine the amazing sonic effects of these fuses is indistinguishable from those used to determine coloring or demagtezing CDs, or little resonating discs, "change" the sound, which electrical engineers (who aren't trying to sell these products) will explain as nonsense.
Nope, not aware of any "nutty reputations" enjoyed by audiophiles other than the hobby seems to attract "nerds." All one has to do to verify this is to attend any audio show and just look around.
Who exactly is pointing their fingers at audiophiles and their "wacky beliefs about tweaks?" Most non-audiophiles aren't aware of tweaks, or anything else about the hobby. So ... that begs the question if its just closed minded audiophiles accusing other audiophiles of being "nutty" that you're referring to.
I HAVE tried a multitude of various tweaks over the 40+ years in the hobby. Some have validity, and some don't. SR Blue fuses do ... as does some others that I've posted about. If they don't work to improve the SQ in my system, I don't post about them.
Question: Have you tried the SR Blue fuses in your system? If not, then how are you forming the opinion that they're bunk?
Another question: What tweaks have you tried in your system that actually improved SQ? Anything??
But it's also sometimes frustrating to be associated with a hobby that also comes in for so much well deserved ridicule.
That's a bit arrogant on your part, wouldn't you say?
Out here in the fields I fight for my meals I get my back into my living I don't need to fight To prove I'm right I don't need to be forgiven Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Just curious, what is your music preference, assuming you listen at all.
Someone else with an ax to grind? And ... what is that reputation, exactly?
Are you seriously unaware of the nutty reputation audiophiles have for having wacky beliefs about tweaks etc? I can't be bringing this up to you for the first time, can I?
Audiophile fuses, and especially the effusive subjective claims of the OP, are of a piece with markers on CDs, tinfoil pieces placed around a system, little "resonating" discs placed on components or around a room, and the countless other dubious beliefs held by many audiophiles.
When you rely on the really poor protocols that many audiophiles use to declare sonic differences, it's not surprising that virtually anything can be claimed to have made a sonic difference.
But, go ahead and spend away on audiophile fuses if you want. It's your dime, your game.
I'm an audiophile insofar as I love high end audio. But it's also sometimes frustrating to be associated with a hobby that also comes in for so much well deserved ridicule.
If an OP had the ability to delete posts, I’d be tempted to delete those that are either personal attacks, or those that are obviously designed to harm the businesses of producers. Other than that, I’d say that anything goes. Don’t know about anyone else, but I’ve learned a lot since I started my first thread ... even from the naysayers.
I posted on another audiophile site the other day that I don’t frequent often. Someone asked the question as to what he could do to get his room under control. All I did was make a simple suggestion that he might want to try SR HFT’s. Well, based upon the shrill, negative personal attacks directed my way, and toward Ted Denney by another member, you’d think I was suggesting killing everyone’s first born. I did some research and found that the guy is a manufacturer and seller of room treatments. Yep ... I suspect there’s a lot of that going on these audiophile forums not just here but elsewhere too.
nonoise - In the case of this thread, I agree. Oregonpapa (Frank) would probably love to have that ability to keep this thread going the way it was intended.
@nonoise
Terrific!!
Your statement begs the question:
In the case of which thread would you *disagree* with my suggestion?
The OP of any particular thread should also be afforded the function of removing any particular post and/or blocking a poster altogether from his/her thread.
In the case of this thread, I agree. Oregonpapa (Frank) would probably love to have that ability to keep this thread going the way it was intended.
Prof Just the sort of remark I expected. You had a real opportunity to actually post something constructive. Seems everyone thinks they are a comedienne nowadays......
Ah it is all good Nonoise, I think I now have a grand total of 3 posts deleted in the forums, all on this thread....lol.
Actually even though it sounds like a heaven send to this thread, the idea of an OP being able to remove posts and block users, I think it would or could just be seen as intolerance of others views, especially if the privilege is abused. Of course I am not saying Frank would do that but I certainly could envisage a scenario where some OPS, may do so.
I think the better course is for certain members to learn to exercise some degree of self control. If they cannot and this is proven by a number of posts then possibly a time out imposed by admin would be in order.
Just my thoughts and not advocating ANY of the actions mentioned.
To those who must keep asking, "But WHY do these fuses work?", I have simply suggested superior materials over that glass tube, etc., but this idea is just not satisfactory--has to more than that--couldn't be that obvious. I am reminded of my co-worker, a follower of a health guru, and a conversation we had in a buffet line. I remarked, "Look at that nice cut of roast--I'm having some of that!" He replied, "Well, I don't eat cooked meat because the heat destroys all the proteins." I said, "What do you mean--that meat IS the protein--you're LOOKING at it."
I am proud to report that my suggestion in the Please Read and express your feelings and opinions thread ****is going to be CONSIDERED by Audiogon development staff****.
To reiterate the suggestion:
The OP of any particular thread should also be afforded the function of removing any particular post and/or blocking a poster altogether from his/her thread.
Posting here to provide advanced warning should any member be prone to withdrawal symptoms.
The same thing happened to me but I inquired and got my post reinstated after it was reviewed. There seems to be a desire to frame this thread in such a way so as to give legitimacy to one side over the other.
@gdhal
A long time ago had a friend who got his psychology degree from Berkeley and he had this habit of steering conversation through gentle manipulations to get a person to see things his way or just for the fun of it.
I caught on rather quickly so he'd probe others and use people for his enjoyment. I'd always catch his eye and shake my head. It's something I haven't forgotten.
As to the topics being different, that's incidental as it's the tactic I sense you're using. It looks like you're trying to gently corner someone into that bet again. I could be wrong and would be glad to be but I've seen this before and it's uncannily like what I've experienced.
The way wolf KEEPS banging on about the cost of these fuses, anyone would think he was an under-achiever in life and this was just a bit of projected resentment against those who can buy as many of these fuses as they wish. Perish the thought, obviously, hahaha. This thread is pure entertainment and an insight into human psychology all at the same time. Please don't stop.
I meant by my post last night of it being pretty quiet in here, with the exception of somebody's nonsense.
Now I see the problem, my post where I stated that from now on I would ignore every single post made by George and not entertain any further bickering got removed, probably at his doing even though there was nothing offensive about the post at all.
nonoise - ....You asked me in such a manner as to become tiresome so I put a stop to it and now you move on to another, with the same approach, manner and questions. I find it so curious.
Hi nonoise.
The questions I asked you on 4/13 are entirely different than the question I asked uberwaltz on 4/14. You may recall I asked you the following three questions:
How does fuse and/or wire directionality change/effect your "enjoyment" of listening to music?
Please speculate, in what way(s) should someone who doesn't believe in wire/fuse directionality, such as myself, expect to benefit if fuses and/or wire is oriented correctly?
The "not subtle" difference you are reporting, is this something you can or did hear in a blind test, or sighted?
You were kind enough to answer all three, I thanked you for doing so and mentioned (paraphrasing) that it concluded my inquiry, however, that the conclusion was specific to you and I.
The question I asked uberwaltz was specific to my search for directionality of fuses websites and being presented with driving information.
nonoise, geoffkait - regarding the relentlessness of my questions as you put it, why not ask uberwaltz if he feels the same way about it as you do?
It's not how uberwatlz feels about it, but how I feel about it. I'm not defending or speaking up for uberwaltz. You've gone from an aggressive, in your face promoter of betting in order to settle this dispute on fuses to an oh-so-kind and endearing chap who constantly wants to know why one thinks a fuse could do what it does.
You asked me in such a manner as to become tiresome so I put a stop to it and now you move on to another, with the same approach, manner and questions.
You just can't help yourself, ya just gotta keep it going, it's you there looking at.
It's you, George, not the mods. What was deleted was not offensive. The following post was along the very same line and it's still there. You've just take the low road and make everything personal.
As I said before: This is all you have to do to give boutique fusing some credibility, just get Synergistic Research (who's an advertiser here) to back you guys, and if they did back you guys up personally with the same sound quality and directionalality improvement claims made here, it would certainly give their product the credibility it sorely needs, instead of leaving it to a bunch no-bodies to man the credibility boat.
"Really!!! How would you know? This sounds like an admission of collusion with SR or employment, which is it???"
Its neither one George. I have talked with the dealer I’ve purchased my fuses from and he tells me that SR Fuses are his biggest seller. I’ve also toured the SR factory. I’ve seen the assembly station for the SR Blue fuses.
I’m in direct contact with Tim Mrock, maker of TC, on almost a daily basis (we have become friends). I know EXACTLY how many sales have been made.
Any more questions Georgie?
Frank
PS: George ... was there a second shooter on the grassy knoll?
Which way does a fuse fit anyway. maybe I am ignorant,
Spin the bottle that all the fuser’s do.
but I always just stuck a fuse in where the old one was.
That’s all you have to do nothing more nothing less.
a new blue fuse would blow the amp and all my other stuff.
They’ve been known to fail, when replaced with the correct manufacturers amperage. The fuser’s say stick a bigger one in than the manufacturers specs if they blow, then x your fingers and pray. Very safe??????????????
Which way does a fuse fit anyway. maybe I am ignorant, but I always just stuck a fuse in where the old one was. Maybe my equipment is that old, a new blue fuse would blow the amp and all my other stuff.
It’s obviously a relentless inquisition. The cuteness and extreme courteousness is a new ploy designed to avoid blowback and moderation intervention and to ingratiate himself.
Yond Cassius has a mean and hungry look. - Shakespeare
There’s something rotten in Denmark. - Shakespeare
@gdhal Due to the relentlessness of you questions concerning testing for fuse directions, I can't tell if you're being too cute by half. You're kind to a fault but you keep asking the same thing over and over.
Pretty quiet in here tonight, no silly posts but I guess it is early yet...
That was a nice approach, after George posted his usual blather. He needs some new writers or he'll get cancelled by the producers.
uberwaltz - Not sure if that helps or was the answer you were looking for.
Yes, it helps. Very much so. But I wasn't looking:)
Your response is interesting to say the least, and a rather candid testimonial. SR should take note and consider your (and other) testimonials.
As you mention that you're hearing differences but have no explanation, have you considered "verifying" the differences you're hearing? We've back-and-forth'ed the blind test, and you stated you haven't tried. Curious why you wouldn't. I would.
In any case, you truly have given me something to ponder. I haven't "changed my mind", and remain in the camp that believes "a fuse is a fuse", nevertheless, I respect your opinion and reiterate what I stated initially... you're kewl and respond as a gentlemen.
Tbh my friend, I cannot say as I had ever searched for information on fuse directionality.
If you had asked me a year ago about an aftermarket fuse making any sq change never mind the direction of said fuse I would have launched so hard my socks would have flew off!
It was only after reading Frank's original red fuse thread that I thought why not try a fuse, it can't hurt.
And to my ears I heard a distinct difference none of which I can offer any explanation for.
Now the directionality came later. I was given a black fuse for my DAC and after fitting it I sat back, listened and thought well, that's flat. A few minutes reflection and I opened the DAC up again and reversed the direction and I was honestly totally shocked. Again I can offer no explanation.
So to sum up I had not read about it anywhere previous to in these forums and not sure if fuse manufacturer make any directional claims at all? Not sure if that helps or was the answer you were looking for.
uberwaltz - Pretty quiet in here tonight, no silly posts but I guess it is early yet...lol
Hi uberwaltz.
I'd just like to offer/extend the proverbial carrot to you for a moment. You're kewl in that at least you (unlike some others) respond as a gentlemen.
Lets consider directionality for the moment. When I search this term (or related stemmed terms like direction) on web sites that sell fuses, the results that I'm presented with are google maps, driving directions, and
mileage calculations.
Am I doing something wrong, with regard to searching for fuse manufacturer directionality information?
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