I would strongly recommend this one. Good stuff + good sound.
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The mystery of sound can be manifested to a consciousness on a bad radio or anywhere... The mystery of music is not even related to audio playback ...
For sure the mystery of sound is THROUGH a playback system and THROUGH ears/brain manifested to a consciousness prepared to perceive it ... But this mystery is for consciousness in sound perception and music perception and is not directly related to engineering audio system nor to IMMEDIATE unreflective perception... I am sure you understand what i spoke about because we discuss as gentlemen do ...
But most narrow mind dont want to understand anything for example this poster insulting all those who differ and participated ...
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No psycho as in psychoacoustics is studies and concepts and parameters controls experiments done statistically with all subjects, average dude or maestros and musicians ...
This thread is not about high end audio... 😊 Anything in high end audio is parametrized by acoustics... Read about acoustics... We dont need special ears to tune a room or a system , only to know the basic concepts and experiment with them ... And the "phantom thing" as in the phantom image is a very well understood acoustic phenomenon ... There is no mystics in audio, only ignorance or knowledge... There is in sound experience and in music experience , some mystical experience, which are change in consciousness and attention levels yes, this is caused by the way frequencies and rythm affect the heart/body/mind...... This has nothing to do with audio system ... Speech -singing-dancing is the basic human experience about sound and music... The mysteries are here not in audio engineering or among audiophiles consumers ... 😁
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No it is not whatever people think it is... Sorry...
High end audio is grounded in psychoacoustics... The latest revolution is the BACCH filters which corrected stereo flaws in any system at any price ... No mystery here , it is acoustical physics using inner ear and HTRF, head transfer related functions... What you want to say had no relation to audio objective set of parameters which are not electronical and electrical merely, but mechanical, acoustical and psychoacoustical measures... No mystery here...It is technological basic task for designers or audiophiles who learn them ... But the mystery in science exist here : what is hearing , how it is grounded in the ears structures and dynamic and brain and in time and frequencies, why cant we explain hearing only with Fourier maps ? etc Another mystery and a deeper one, is the relation between sound and consciousness levels...We had spoken a bit about it in this thread... This thread is not about audio gear system but about the mystery of the sound/music relation ... Another mystery is the concept of "meaning" in thinking and perception and in body gesture dynamics (speech) , as a non purely physical and non purely mental phenomenon but an embodied one integrating the two by synchorization at all scales from hertz to megaHertz and Gigahertz by what Anirban called time crystals ....
The way this integration is done is explained in the book "nanobrain" by the Indian genius Anirban ... «How information grows in Fractal Information Theory (FIT), this growth of information forms a structure that is like playing music, so we call it Geometric Musical Language (GML). In order to understand this video, please run it several times. You can notice that a triangle is embedded in the sphere in the beginning. This is the most fundamental unit of information. The geometric shape does not have to be always a triangle, it could be a square, or other 2D or 3D geometric shapes. So, the topological information of any big size data should hold inside this normalized sphere, we call it phase sphere. Now, one could notice that the corner of a geometric shape blasts and a new sphere is born. As the sphere rotates you can see three spheres are born. Each sphere holds a new and unique geometric shape. So, from one sphere, three spheres are born. Then at the corner points of these spheres, new spheres are born. We are showing here three times, because if we take three steps, the central layer is independent of environment. This is how information grows in nature. Note that the unit of information follows neither quantum information theory, nor classical information theory. This is fractal, undefined in both classical information theory and quantum information theory.»
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The mystery of high end audio ( as opposed to mere good sound) revolves around the fact that it can’t seem to be quantified or detected consistently in any objective way. It is somewhat of a phantom thing and different for each and It seems to require special ears with mysterious capabilities to really know…audio mystics in a sense. The one thing about it that can be reliably discerned is it usually comes for a premium cost which is high end. That makes sense and can be detected consistently by all including mere mortals. Otherwise, it’s hard for mere mortals to judge. Maybe the mystery is part of the appeal? That makes sense, I think. |
No the so called by you " mystery" of high end audio is relatively easy to decipher... Buy books on sound and acoustic and go on read the valuable indications on many forums and articles about acoustics ...I summarized it all with my three working dimensions embeddings controls basic concept ... If i could do it for myself with a budget system any body can do it if he dare to STUDY AND EXPERIMENT ...And low cost system or high end high cost one dont change the necessary embeddings controls tasks in mechanical, electrical and acoustical working dimensions of the system synergy ... Then Audio high end is not a mystery but a set of questions and answers and experiments... Sound and music are the science mystery not high end audio, which is only a set of engineering tasks and a set of experiments to do for the audiophiles... ... Audio high end is a"mystery" for passive consumers buying gear as upgrades in a frustrating series of stopgap and obsessive race in their journey ...Many collected 40 amplifiers or as many speakers without learning how to embed them EVEN ONE satisfactorily enough to forgot obsession about sound and focus on music ... Studies protected me of this dead end obsession, and indicate me what to do , nevermind the gear price, to reach a minimal optimum of S. Q. with the gear i could afford and accordingly to his design quality level... And trust me even with a relatively low cost system as mine it is good enough to forget higher costlier products temptation and frustrations ... Creativity and acoustics rules audio...No mysteries here ...
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The mystery of high end audio is way more mysterious than that of music. When someone figures out how high end audio really works let me know. It’s hard to make any sense out of a lot that is written about it. We’re talking Twilight Zone here in many cases folks. Where normal things don’t happen very often…. Cue Rod Serling. 🪄 Could it be magic? |
A metronome or a tuning fork are clocks, and as you know the basis and ground of all music is rythm , synchronizing set of clocks or instruments or bodies keeping the various rythm flows together... Listening music is reclocking his brain ...Elevating our consciousness levels... For those of you who may think that i am in poetry and metaphors...Stop right here and look at this 43 seconds video by the greatest researcher and the more revolutionary one on consciousness and A. I. and A.C. ( artificial consciousness) ... His video describe something in his book "nanobrain", one of the most important book i ever read:
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Reincarnation is a fact for those who knows or for those who study and remember .. Read the OM SETI case of Dorothy Eady ... A british born girl remembering his life in Egypt as lover of Seti in London and who became self taught a top recognized egyptologist... One of the best love story ever written, she made love with Seti even during his life as Dorothy Eady ...Read his book ...
Now listen to this songs in Farsi from many thousand years ago in Persia and remember one of your probable life perhaps... Music is mystery manifested as evidences as well as evidence manifested as mysteries...Music spoke....
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If music was only a question about our "tastes", there will be no mystery at all for us... We will be only programmed robots by specific habits and specific society and we will call our program our dearest "taste" it will even conflate with our "flag" in war time ... Music would only be a consumers products for leisure as intended by our older brain the limbic system and amygdala circling around primary recognized emotions ... But music is the occasion to liberate ourself from these programs and becoming conscious of them and of their meanings and starting from that deconditioning of our "tastes", music can speak to the higher brain or to the superior part of the mind and reactivate the heart on a new path , a more universal one way over primal satisfaction ...It is why listening to others culture music is essential...Deprogramming and then free conscious reprogramming BY US ... Music and sounds are tools to reprogram ourselves on a higher consciousness levels ...Not merely tastes habits so necessary they could be nor herd hits favorites... Some musicians are more talented than others for doing that in any styles, genres or cultures... |
Weaving is a women working activity which inspired a lot sufism and his poetry and singing and music...
Weaving is related to rythmical gesture, geometrical pattern and the image/ground metaphor .... Sound is always a conscious experience together in singing and working as old as fire ... Music is spiritual flames coming from the heart...The goal of music is uniting and going over this world through this world ...
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Setar and tombak.... The setar in the lute family is very small and magical... Kiya Tabassian give many concert in Montreal where i think he lives ... He seems to me that this music is there to elevate consciousness not to merely distract or please it .... Consciousness change when the content in the thought process is no more a mere sensible content but a suprasensible one too through the body of the musicians and the listener....Then many consciousness unite together participating in one content ....This is music and speech well done and poetry....The same is true for any geometric object meditation ...But with music the heart dance with the mind and the body .... And anyway the heart is a polyhedron...And the heart create his own music... listen to this documentary about the heart polyedron specific shape ...
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I made enough experiments with various minerals to understand what you spoke about... But if you mention that they will put you a "tin foil hat" insult ...Ignorance rule as well with or without the clothing of established science ... I prefer science in the making with inter disciplinary sciences, philosophy included , using my modest experiments to develop my "opinion" ...
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Any vibrating materials, a flute, an iron sphere with a hole or without a hole, a piece of shungite or of quartz, a fruit which is ripe or not ripe, a human speaking voice; anything as a sound potential vibrating source OWN his vibratory imprint and transmit it trough a medium as air when put in vibratory modes ... The air is only the medium for the waves transmitting these imprint information coming from the vibrating sound sources "qualities" and recognized and/or decoded by the ears/brain ... We dont know HOW exactly the ears/brain recognize "immediately" or at his high speed time ratio beating the Fourier uncertainty between frequency and time for example more than ten times and interpreted this information ABOUT the qualitative signature and nature of the sound vibrating sources... Read what said Magnasco an acoustician : «"In seminars, I like demonstrating how much information is conveyed in sound by playing the sound from the scene in Casablanca where Ilsa pleads, "Play it once, Sam," Sam feigns ignorance, Ilsa insists," Magnasco said. "You can recognize the text being spoken, but you can also recognize the volume of the utterance, the emotional stance of both speakers, the identity of the speakers including the speaker’s accent (Ingrid’s faint Swedish, though her character is Norwegian, which I am told Norwegians can distinguish; Sam’s AAVE [African American Vernacular English]), the distance to the speaker (Ilsa whispers but she’s closer, Sam loudly feigns ignorance but he’s in the back), the position of the speaker (in your house you know when someone’s calling you from another room, in which room they are!), the orientation of the speaker (looking at you or away from you), an impression of the room (large, small, carpeted)» https://phys.org/news/2013-02-human-fourier-uncertainty-principle.html
To all this for sure we can add vibrations or pattern in vibrations resulting from non acoustic influences, which may be other non audible vibrations or supra sensible information ... Any minerals own his own "signatures"; even water can memorize any minerals signature ( Nobel prize winner Luc Montagnier) ...i will stop here for this matter...😊 |
As a maker and purveyor of orgonite for the past ten years, I understand what you are saying - there are vibrations we experience that are not acoustic but which suggest sound as we interact with them and which give us something analogous to sound when searching for descriptions. My orgonite can be "flavored" with different additives such as lithium crystals, beryllium crystals, moldavite, etc. that all give an impression that something akin to sound is interacting with us and that this sound can vary quite a bit, which just further argues that acoustic sound is probably made up of things and influences beyond the wave forms accessible to us on oscilloscopes. |
Sound is not ONLY the wave in the medium... The waves structures and forms convey infornation ... It is first the vibrating body source which vibrate even in the empty void...We cannot hear it without a medium , that does not mean that sound does not exist as " internal music of the sound source " ...Earth vibrate as any living organism... Music is the informative qualities associated with the sound source vibrating body ...With or without a medium to convey it message ... Sound as qualitative information related to a vibrating source composition, a rock or a not riped yet fruit or as a cavernous metallic sphere or as a wood flute , exist as the prime numbers exist and as music exist as the transcendent circle which is perfect exist, before any ears even existed , they exist in the source or call it God ... Anyway even a black hole has a sound which no one can hear because it is so low only angels can hear it ...But sound exist as sound source vibrating in the void, as a tuning fork will vibrate between stars even if we could not hear it we will see it vibrating.... |
We take it for granted that sound is everywhere, but it's not. In most of the universal vacuum there is only an ultra-low frequency hum in some gas and dust clouds. All other sounds are non-existent, and even that hum is not audible to sentient beings. Sound is a luxury of having an atmosphere. It is incredibly rarefied compared to the whole of the universe. |
So true! Happy new year...
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Music is ALL the things described in this forum. It can also be a life experience where we are fully resonating with the performance, and the time, date, sounds, smells, visuals, and emotional bonds with others are recorded. When the music is reproduced in our homes, it opens a gateway to recalling the the moment in time when those experiences occurred, exponentially elevating the emotional attachment to the music. |
"Sound is Brahman" https://twitter.com/anirbanbandyo/status/1742143258426314963 |
Mathematics as said J.J. Sylvester, is the music of reason... But peace is the invisible core of all numbers, the invisible breath of music and the ultimate key of reason ...Because all there is and will be lie in absolute peace .... Now you understand why mysteries are in plain sight and only few are able to see them ...We must own the eyes of peace to see them ... Even the silence look for the peace which is in front of him and farthest ... The only possible image for peace is the universal mother , her alone give peace as she give life in the same breath ... Only the mother voice exceed silence ... For me the mathematical equation symbolizing peace is the Euler formula ...Which equation is there before and after anything can be as his lying ground as the mother womb ... For those who will mock my claim read this before laughing 😊:
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Now listen to the music of a true spiritual master Peter Deunov.... And look all 180 songs are here on the same channel ...Incredible ...9 hours of peace songs ... His music as Liszt Christus is permeated by the mystery of peace... Peace is a mystery unexplainable by anything because peace is deeper than anything , because the roots of peace are BEFORE anything that was or AFTER anything that could be ... The peace mystery is the mystery of introduction to all there is and the conclusion about all there is and ever will be ... As you see peace is even deeper than joy ....As deep sleep is deeper than the most beautiful dreams ... Peace is before zero and after the infinite, it is a complex number conjugating everything ....
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTNypuLgY9fEdocDWHrOUhytEIvK0GxhZ
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Obrecht is a genius... One of the greatest composer of his era... Listen to the rythm here in the Kyrie and in the Gloria pervading all the mass ... The irresistible joy behind the singing ... This is the mystery : the joy as irresistible flowing dance ... By the way i consider this interpretation by the Madrigaliste of Praga by Miroslav Venhoda superior to the interpretation of the Tallis scholars, why ? Because of the rythm of the springing joy we felt here and not at all with the more esthetically cold and slower version of the Tallis Scholars ... I had listened to this version for more than fifty years ....😊 The same mystery surge plain as the sun sight ... There is only joy nothing else...
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Can we recreate something from the past and summon it in our present through a work of art ? Can we introduce ourself into a mystery ? Yes we can ....In it there is the secret of immortal consciousness which is the participation to the cosmos consciously... And it is also about the lost of this consciouness ... Each day we awake in awe and go back to sleep in fear or forgetfulness , as civilizations did who passed and will come again ... All experienced this cosmic rythms ... The day will come when death or being born will no more be behind or under the forgetfulness veil ... listen to this 2 hours :
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Then even when it look like as just a mere entertainment , music hide his deep mystery in the open surface for all to see and we do not see it whithout attention or without a little bit of help though... If not awaken we will say that there is no mysteries in sound no more than in music or no mysteries in speech ... But dont ask to an ostrich with his head in the sand to think ...😊
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«7 “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 8 For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. 9 “Which of you, if your son asks for bread, will give him a stone? 10 Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? 11 If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him! »Matthew 7-7-11
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But we can also coming back from the stars cosmic voices or from the human voices entering in the earth grounded rythms mysteries with the yoruba drums coming, back near Australian earth grounded and cosmic dreams inspired didgeridoo ... (By the way the best book i read about music mystery was a doctorate thesis in acoustics inspired by the Yoruba drums sound source : "Sound sources" by Akpan J. Essien) :
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I like didgeridoo because with it we learn how there is a cosmic voice who spoke through the human voice and a human voice speak also with the cosmic voice ...
The "primitive" didgeridoo do it already in a way even the "sophisticated" sarangi could not do so evidently ...(video in the post above) Some being deaf can claim there is no mystey in the didgeridoo voicing, they are deaf in a way that even deaf people are not ......
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Your teacher is right... In mystical experience or in samadhi experience the spirit decide not the ego , nevermind his work quality and quantity ultimetaly ... But here in this thread i dont spoke about the high levels of spiritual experience, i spoke about the way to meditate music mysteries, numbers mysteries. poetic mysteries , mammals morphology mystery , plant morphology mystery , any Natural science mystery as observing water properties etc ... Here we must ask for our sense to be initiated in Nature or in mind over the ego and his habits ... And here a truely spiritual perception change us ...At least we learn how to forgot the ego for a moment ... But no one achieve the highest spiritual heights because he, his ego , decide ...We are guided and not alone ...We are all ONE ... Anyway we are all already enlightened but we dont know yet...We need some help ... And those who love anyway are the helpers... And those who dont love are the best teachers ... Love your enemy say the Christ... But here more modestly we spoke about sound mysteries ...Nature seen before the ego birth ...Numbers thought out of any logic ... Mammals seen for the first time... Plant seen where they are : in time flow...
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The world dont lack enigmas... But enigmas always had an answers even if we dont know it... But some questions, as said Alexander Grothendieck ( "Nothing important can be proved") are mysteries which ask for our being itself and cannot be investigated without a transformation of the one who ask the question first ... Such are mysteries, which we cannot and must not confuse with enigmas ... Consciousness is a mystery not a mere enigma... Who was the man with the iron mask in history was an enigma that can be or could not be solved... But this question has an answer independant of the investigator ... As most scientific questions...But not all scientific questions are enigmas waiting to be solved ... Some are mystery waiting for us to be transformed first ... A mystery cannot be solved in the same way as a mere enigma ... A mystery ask for an initiation and a transformation from the inquirer ... In mathematics as in religions, as in science, there is enigmas, but there is also mysteries ... Dont confuse and dont conflate them ... All the work of Blaise Pascal turn around the relation between question of reason and question of faith, between intuition and between logic...."Esprit de finesse et esprit de géométrie" ... An enigma has a ready made answer waiting for us in history, in mathematics or in Nature ... A mystery has only for answer our own being before and after... "A felt change in consciousness" as said Owen Barfield speaking of the language and the mystery of words which used in certain way modify the consciousness level ... There is enigmas in linguistic , many; but the mystery goes way deeper than all the enigmas and questions we can asked .... Studying linguistic was for me as discovering mathematics, a stupendous mystery and a transformation of my being ... |
