speaker cables for Wilson Sophia

As above, your speakers are hard-wired w/ Transparent.
A few weeks ago, I had the listening pleasure w/ the Sophia and Transparent Opus MM2 series = purely sublime!

I'm breaking in Proteus Provectus yea even as I type (about 50 hours), so a final eval is not nearly ready. Amp is VAC Phi 300, speakers, Sophia 3's. First impressions were HUGE soundstage, ease (the whole system breathes without effort) and black background. This cable is pure copper, the IC from Shindo preamp is pure silver. That synergy matters, I sense. I've read that this is a dark cable - but the jury is still out until about 200 hours. That's my only caveat so far. Good luck !
-john

best i heard of following (transparent ref mm, isoclean, ks emotion, jorma prime, audioquest redwood), is the aq.

best i heard w older wilsons (as a fmrm wp6 owner) was ks emotion. wonderful synergy. oddly upgrading cables to the aq caused me to sell the speakers...so much for upgrades.

w/ my rockports, which i like infinitely more, i like the aq. but now i've not heard those former cables again (though KS would not be ideal w what i have)....its always about synergy

From Nelson Pass' article on speaker cable;

Ordinarily a discussion of loudspeaker cables would stop here, at 100kHz, where we could safely say that the performance is becoming negligible, if for no other reason than that we cannot hear this frequency (a concept disputed by some audiophiles). However, the advent of wide bandwidth power amplifiers has demonstrated other new effects; several amplifier designs (stable with reactive loads such as capacitors) oscillate into low inductance cables with a variety of results. Threshold Stax, and Electro- Research designs behave violently, while others acquire oscillation-caused colorations, usually either a hard, etched, high end or warmth and thickness in the vocal range (due to low order intermodulation sidebands and harmonics).

The Schnerzinger cables from Dortmund(Germany)are unbelievable!
I live nearby Dortmund and was looking all over the world for my ultimate solution, not knowing that such fantastic cables are right by my side.
Life is sometimes strange!
When i first heard of Schnerzinger from an enthusiastic article in the Analogue Audio Association Switzerland magazin, i did not pay much attention on Schnerzinger.
But after reading both reviews in Audiogon of the Schnerzinger X-3000 and X-5000 i gave them a try, especially as i noticed that they are only 50 kilometers away.

After listening i have to say: These cables should be named M O R E!
More information, more atmosphere, more realism, more dynamic, more natural, more body, more precise, more deep+ tight, more space...and even the weakest part of my speaker, the tweeter at once learned to fly... Now I got everything i wanted!
I strongly recommend serious musiclovers to pay attention to these cables.

I tried the new Stealth Dream and it was a very good match with my Wilsons, but also a bitlaid back and rounded in the bass. Damm i think you cant get everything!!!

I use Harmonic Tech Pro 9 Reference SE and I think
its a very synergistic match , I found the earlier
pro 9 ref ( non se ) to have slightly less
well defined bass . I have not tried anything
really expensive as no point listening to what
I can't afford .....

If you can find, try the old Shunyata Orion.
They match perfect with Wilson speakers.
Hope this help you.

i tried the audience and the golden reference and found both very good but not outstanding to the others. tommorrow i m testing a new stealth cable.
has anybody heard a zellaton speaker?

thanks for help!

Sashafan - you might be trying to fix with cables a problem that resides in your gear elsewhere. I couldn't think of anything worse than listening to Wilsons at a high sound level. The Sasha's have a suckout in the lower midrange, cone breakup at 4k and big peak in the upper midrange/treble. Check out the Stereophile review - they are extremely difficult to set up due to these on/off axis frequency aberrations and impedance dips that the amplifiers see.

thanks for help, but in my setup the mit oracle was not my favourite choice and with the others i didn t have technical problem althought i drove the amps very very hard.
my problem is that i wasn not fully satisfied with the already mentioned cable in all areas.
so i m looking for altrnative solutions.

thanks for help, peter

Tpreaves- when you do, make sure you have you videotape it because the fireworks show will be unbelievable!!! That is if the occilations don't kill you first. Post on YouTube for all to see.

So I shouldn't use 12 ga. speaker cable from Ace Hardware on the Spectral amplifiers?

Cable threads are the gift that keeps on giving.

Unreal. Ok, lets start here...I'm not a scientist therefore do not present science to "back up" my posts nor do I feel it necessary. The requirement of using MIT cables with Spectral amplifiers comes from the designer/manufacturer, Prof Kieth Johnson, who happens to be not only one of the absolute brightest minds in the industry over the past few decades but also one of the most respected. Your challenge of his integrity strikes me as pretty odd and even more uninformed.

Back to my point, I was trying to offer Peter some input regarding his query and your suggestion that he should ignore the designer's operational direction could very well result in toasting his big dollar gear...very uncool.

Yes boys and girls, never use a "standard bandwidth" speaker cable with an "ultrahigh bandwidth" amplifier. Always have your "articulation poles" set to the maximum possible and "impedance switches" matched!!

Take a step back and listen to this garbage.... Then admit that we've all been had.......

Nothing I read on almargs(thank you for bringing technical information) documents aludes to the possibility of damage to an amp if not using brand specific cables. Sounds to me like spectral and MIT created a cable together with merits, real or perceived, mutually beneficial. If you want to argue that you like the sound of MIT more than xyz, fine. To threaten damage to users without backing up your claims with science is just as poor advice as me telling you to use MY favorite cable with an amp and speaker I have never heard.

Enjoy your sophias!

I don't have a Spectral amp, but apparently blew out my McCormak DNA-1 with some Goertz cables. The amp is currently in for repairs, unfortunately. So, I would advise caution.

Hessec - The $1500 check I wrote to Spectral 2 years ago to rebuild a DMA 180 that oscillated and fried was hilarious.

From a technical standpoint Richard's comments strike me as plausible. Which is not to say that using non-MIT cables will invariably blow up the amplifier, but it seems conceivable to me that under some circumstances either a full-blown oscillation or adverse sonic effects could result.

An amplifier that has extremely wide bandwidth and that uses feedback and that is driving a heavily capacitive load can easily turn into an oscillator. The Spectral's certainly have extremely wide bandwidth, although I don't know how much feedback they use. Keep in mind that the load capacitance is not necessarily just that of the cables, but might be the speakers themselves, if the speakers happen to have capacitive phase angles at frequencies that may be problematic to amplifier stability. That would especially be a concern with electrostatic speakers. The networks in the recommended cables presumably isolate the amplifier from speaker capacitance to some degree.

This paper pertains to op amps, but the basic principles it presents are relevant to any amplifier that uses feedback and is faced with a capacitive load. Note the reference to "problems such as peaking in frequency response, and overshoot or ringing in step response" that can occur even if the point of instability is not reached, but is approached.

Also see this paper at the Spectral site, which also strikes me as plausible, at least for the most part (the exception being the references to time alignment, about which I am a skeptic in the context of cables).

Regards,
-- Al

That was exactly the response I thought I would get.....too funny.

Guys, your uniformed suggestions could guide someone to severely damage their $20,000 amplifiers. Probably best to be certain of that before you go and tell someone It's ok...or "preposterous". With all due respect, it's just not good advice.

I do not have the technical language to explain "how" but if you are interested I'm sure you could contact any Spectral dealer and they could provide the how/why of it.

Please explain to me how you could possibly fry an amp by not using MIT cables..... Preposterous.

It does sound a bit far-fetched. There has been a story on the Internet that extremely high capacitance speaker cables affected certain amplifiers (I believe naim were mentioned) causing oscillation, but one would imagine (if the report is true) that some protection circuit would kick in and shutdown the amplifier. Spectral would surely have such a circuit.

Regards,

Please explain to me how you could possibly fry an amp by not using MIT cables..... Preposterous.

BTW Peter, my speakers are Sasha's also and I think the Spectral/Sasha combination is pretty damn special. Enjoy!

Hello Peter - I think you run a real risk using cables other than MIT with those amps (which I think are among the best in the world:)). I use Spectral amps as well (360 at present, DMA 260 coming next week) and have been discussing cables over on the Spectral forum, there has been some good input. I'm currently using Oracle MA-X and find them to be an amazing tool. I have used the MIT/Spectral cables then moved to the Matrix 50 and now the MA-X. With the MA-X you get tremendous authority, presence and depth and all this comes while maintaining tonal accuracy. The improvement is substantial...very substantial. It's hard to articulate everything that they do so I will just say I recommend giving them a go. I think you would likely get a similar impact from the Oracle MA and even more from the MA-X revision 2. As for speaker cables, I am using the Matrix 90 HD and sort of stuck there due to cost. I can only imagine what the addition of the MA-X speaker cables would be like.

Be really careful using those other cables, you can fry your amps pretty quick.

i m driving my sahas with spectral 360 Mk 2 and was using the original spectral cables. Now i was testing several other cables like jps aluminata, MIT oracle, audioquest wel. those cables makes the sound different and i like them better than the original spectral but each of those cables is superior in some areas but none really satisfies me.
is there somebody who has another recomandation?

peter

thanks for the replies. Trying to find out which of the cables is synergy with the wilson speakers.
Different speaker cables have different character & for sure, there are some that is more synergistic with other speakers. In this thread, trying to specifically find out which speaker cables is in good synergy with Wilson speakers.
One thing for sure, Transparent is a very common cable with Wilson Audio.
Hope that clarifies things.

I have owned Transparent, MIT, Kimber, Goertz, Dynamic Design, Maestro, AQ and many others but JPS Labs Superconductor 3 puts them all to shame without a question.

Although I don't own any Wilsons or Transparent cable, I have heard the entire Wilson line with Transparent cable many times, as that's how my local dealer sets them up. Second, I owned MIT MH-750 II for several years. The MITs sounded darker than the Transparent, but they both have a similar presentation in low noise floor and phase coherency resulting in better bass weight, midrange clarity, inner detail, extended but not spitty treble, and well defined imaging and soundstage.

Recently I got a pair of Zu Cable Libtecs and they remind me of the very expensive Transparents--dead quiet, very fast and dynamic, speed that translates into great transparency and clarity, and yet a relaxed overall presentation (once they burn in, which takes awhile) where the top end is airy but not spitty or hashy, and the presentation is well-detailed but in perspective to the heft, body, and rhythm of the music.

The point I'm making is that--given Zu' 60-day in-home trial period, you might give their top line Ibis cables a try. At $2K/10-ft pair they're a third less than Cardas GR and a fraction of what the equivalent Transparent would be.

If you don't like 'em you're out maybe 2-3 weeks of burn-in and $15 return shipping.

Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with Zu Cable; I'm just a very satisfied customer.

The Wilson speakers work well with nearly everything. It is up to you. Cardas is a good choice, my favorite was XLO Limited Edition (super Top end, Air and Life in the upper Highs, excellent speed and Body...)

STEALTH CABLES!!

Thanks for those who replied.

I was using Purist Proteus Provectus S/C's and I/C's before trying Cardas GR. I'll put them back in to compare again in two weeks.

Hi, I've used Purist Dominus Ferrox and now Purist Proteus Provectus Praesto. Very very nice match with Wilsons...

Glad Wilson speakers can work with other cables other than Transparent cables.
Has anyone here tried Purist Audio Design w/ the Wilsons ?

I've been using Cardas Golden Ref for years. I just had them reterminated using their new forging process for an even smoother transparent presentation. I partner my WP7s w/ Ayre MX-Rs. I had a ML335 before that.

Hi your speakers are internally wired with Transparent. So that certainly is a good choice.

I am using Purist Audio Designes currently. I really like these cables. Current amp is a Ayre MX R, past amps were BAT VK150SE's...

Since Albert Von Schweikert patterned his speakers after Wilsons, you may find his cabling a good match. I've heard them in his rooms, and they are very good.
I've heard Wireworld Platinum Eclipse with WP8's. Very nice indeed!

I used Acoustic Zens Holograms and it worked out well. I would think Audience would be another good brand to try.

If the amp struggles power wise with the impedance dip of the Sophia from 150k-450k some cables may highlight the treble, be ultra clear and not be very fleshed out at all . I'm trying Cardas Golden Reference S/C's and I/C's and so far am happy with the results. I'm learning/hearing the placement of the Sophias balancing the bass with the mids is of equal importance in dealing with the impedance drop. With a powerful enough amp the choice should be easier.

The very best that I EVER heard a Sophia sound was with Synergistic Research Tesla speakers cables at the 2009 CES. YMMV

My friend with a pair of Sasha uses Cardas Golden Reference. I do also with Spendor S 100s and another friend uses it with AvauntGuard horns. The first uses Lamm, I use a CJ 350 SS, the last uses some exotic Brazilian tube amps so the GRs work with a wide variety of speakers and amps.