Yes, the signal into a transister modulates the DC in the following stage, hence the term semi-conductor though properly written the hyphen isn’t there of course. It doesn’t actually conduct. There is always a PN junction, or a barrier. In a tube the electrons flow through. That likely accounts for the preception that tubes sound faster when dealing with good quality tubes in a well designed tube circuit. It only takes one crappy capacitor to screw up either type of circuit.
Solid State vs. Tubes - What if Transistors came first?
What do you guys think?
If transistors came first, and then decades later tubes were invented, would we have any tube amps we would call high end?
Wouldn’t they all fail to reach the height of performance and transparency set by transistor amps?
Best,
E
P.S. I love Conrad Johnson. I'm just wondering how much of our arguments have to do with timing.
If transistors came first, and then decades later tubes were invented, would we have any tube amps we would call high end?
Wouldn’t they all fail to reach the height of performance and transparency set by transistor amps?
Best,
E
P.S. I love Conrad Johnson. I'm just wondering how much of our arguments have to do with timing.
559 responses Add your response
Transistors don't transmit, they modulate. Therefore what follows is a representation of the original input signal, it's not the input signal itself amplified. Tubes amplify the signal itself. That's an important distinction. Furthermore, tube circuits should have less components in them to screw up the sound. Obviously tubes have their own issues, but only the best of the best solid state circuits can compare to tube gear that you can buy from small manufacturers for a fraction of the price of the high end transistor gear. Just stick to octal tube gear. All that said, it would be unfair to not recognize the improvements in solid state of late. High speed demands are raising the bar for passive and active devices, therefore semiconductors are getting better and more accurate all the time, but for now the best bang for the buck is still tube equipment. It's just too bad that it took me decades to figure this out! |
I haven't read the entire thread but here goes. My pre-amp and phono amp use subminiature tubes. They are military rated for minimal vibration (extreme, like for use in bombs and portable delicate equipment) are ultra low noise (not as much as a transistor but better than it's 12AX7 or 6SN7 counterparts) high output, relatively cool running, and lastly 100,000 hour use rating. They sound fantastic in my gear and minimize the size of the gear as well. My 125w. tube amps run in voltage regulated mode (not triode, SET, ultralinear). After 3 hours, you can place your hand on the output transformers (Peerless) and it will be about 90 to 100 degrees warmth. I did not enjoy listening to CDs as much as analog until I purchased an EAR Acute CD player which can use NOS Amperex 6922s. Sure, I've tried Counterpoint hybrid and a host of SS amps and pre-amps. Even the Yamaha's C4 preamp ran silent with great tonal quality but had a flat soundstage. Many SS preamps and amps I tried just couldn't bring the sound to life like tubes. Until 2005, I tried 40 or 50 amps and pre-amps over 30 years until I found what I liked. I have heard some great sounding SS pieces at audio shows but more often enjoyed the sound of tube gear, including some high power SETs but mostly Class A/B designs. |
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sfcfran, My little question was really just asking what someone else’s thoughts would be on a subject that I come across quite often while reading "press". "The best in its price range", you know the drill. I used to wonder why buy anything else then. Then I concluded, shorter but in the same vein, what you said. Pass may be great, best ever for anywhere close to that money, but some would, just as you said, not care as it is unsightly, too heavy, too hot, too big for the room, whatever else. Which brings me to another point that I sometimes try to mention here and then it feels like blasphemy of sorts. Some things are bought, or not bought, because of the way they look. To align it with this thread, tubes are more inconvenient even if you do not need to change them ever. I would dread trying to get the dust off of them but someone may not care and may enjoy it. |
duglas" I paid probably $3000. I’m pretty convinced that my setup is high enough on the curve of diminishing returns to be considered as equivalent to the best available." This is absurd on the face of it you do not understand or comprehend the meaning of "diminishing returns" it does not mean "no return" there is no way a $3,000 USD system can compete with the best available but if you are more satisfied, comfortable, and content with that belief that is fine of course but it is fantasy. |
Sorry to be “no fun” here but imho like vinyl, high priced speaker cable, high priced preamps, speaker breakin, power conditioners, equipment pedestals and on and on, tubes are just another audio myth designed to generate sales. Money is best spent on a good solid state amp and speakers. Diminishing returns is very real as well. I’m listing to stacked ET lft-8b’s driven by a B&K PT-3 preamp and two dynamo stereo 400 ii amps connected by copper speaker cable and I guess copper interconnects. Probably a $7000 setup though I paid probably $3000. I’m pretty convinced that my setup is high enough on the curve of diminishing returns to be considered as equivalent to the best available. |
@glupson Hey Glupson,,,sorry so long to notice your comment ref my post. Thanks for taking note. "Why was/is anybody buying anything else? That would be an interesting marketing research, or at least Audiogon thread." While I should have been a little lighter stated in my example to avoid distracting a reader from my intended point, I was hoping to use the Pass Labs XA/X Series as an example, since they are the same price point by the same manufacturer, and best fit the line I was attempting to draw within the scope of my knowledge and experience with manufacturers. Yet, do not misunderstand...I thoroughly enjoyed your response, and understand your point made. I agree with the thread notion you present ...lots of food for thought would likely be produced there. Generally though.... Even if something is mostly considered as best in its target, that does not equal perfect, nor that everyone agrees. So with the inevitable weaknesses or drawbacks, there are so many factors, such as compatibility and personal needs. Throw in individual sound preferences, individual home preferences, local availability, and even individual awareness or education, to name a few of many. To apply that to the Pass Labs XA Analog series... they are Huge...Heavy,,,OMG HOT...draw continuous hi power consumption even at idle (600 Watts I believe for the XA 250, or something like that) … have a distinct look not to everyone's taste … then other stuff with compatibility, sound preferences, ... hey,,,even unknown gems that compete but are not known to the masses, etc. |
erik....squires - the tube revival started with William Zane Johnson, but also with the review of his SP-3 in The Abso!ute Sound, which also started publishing at that time. It was TAS and its reviewers who re-discovered the pleasures of tubes and promoted the POV. However, they also enjoyed and appreciated some solid state gear. For example, the Audionics CC-2 was the first low TIM amplifier and the TAS staff loved it (and the BT-2) preamp because it lacked the "nasties" of some (much) of the solid state gear at the time. Since then, both technologies have matured toward neutrality, so whichever way you prefer to go it is less likely to be "wrong" than in the past. |
You don’t have to be Mark Twain to write these kinds of garbage. Check out some I came up with while writing a stupid program. I’ll do more once I get a my next Mark Twain inspiration.
There are two kinds of audiophiles. Those who are tubes and those who are going to be tubes. Audiophiles tend to write checks to hi-end gears their bodies can’t cash. It’s easier to convince an audiophile to upgrade his cables than his speakers which ends up costing the same as the speakers. In a perfect world, the Brits make mid fi gears, the Germans make cars, the Americans run securities. In a not so perfect world, the Brits make cars, the American make mid fi gears, the Germans run securities. He whose DAC costs more than the entire system has dog ears. You can make an audiophile buy any gear in your shop by convincing him his chosen gear is also one of your favorite. The greatest audiophile equalizer is Audiogon. I don’t have any data but I am pretty sure a high percentage of college drop outs either become writers or audiophile addicts. |
Maritime Rules Part 51Crew AccommodationCurrent version of Part 51This rule applies to:
Download Maritime Rules Part 51[PDF: 505kB, 61 pages] Part 51 prescribes the crew accommodation standards for certain New Zealand commercial ships operating in offshore limits and the unlimited area. The standards, which give effect to International Labour Organisation crew accommodation conventions and recommendations, cover all those areas of a ship that crew occupy or use outside the ship’s workspaces, including:
Part 51 also sets minimum standards for heating, ventilation and, for new ships of 1600 tonnes or more, sound insulation of bulkheads and decks. Crew accommodation requirements for ships not covered by Part 51 are found in Parts 40A, 40C, 40D and 40E. Advisory circularsAdvisory circulars describe a rule, its purpose and how to complyPart 51 advisory circular |
I've used a few decent SS guitar amps over 5 decades of being a professional musician, and by few I mean few, and by decent I mean simply OK...Music man hybrids with a SS front end and tube output, a "Legend" amp with a tube front end a SS output, a Fender London Reverb...etc., and always returned to tubes...my trusty '61 Fender Blonde Bandmaster, 60 Deluxe, a couple of Fender Twins, Boogies, a Matchless combo, Marshalls, and my current faves are a Reverend Goblin 5/15 6V6 combo and a Burris Royal Bluesman single ended Class A 18 watt EL84 head...you get the point. Tube amps respond to your guitar touch and, either clean or overdriven, are simply right. My hifi rig currently features a Had hand built SEP amp and a Freya preamp through efficient speakers, and sounds more alive and beautiful than any SS amp setup I've owned over many decades...better in all ways, period. Plus, tubes are more fun. |
