Next upgrade options

I personally prefer separates, but definitely a tube preamp.

Sell the Luxman and get a tube preamp (Aric Audio Motherlode $5,500, Don Sachs/Lynn Olson Raven $5,500 (sold by Spatial Audio), Backert Labs Rhumba Extreme 1.4 $8,500, Supratek Cabernet $4,000 to $6,500.

Add the amplifier of your choice (Audio Research, CODA, Audio Research, Gryphon, etc), and you will be on your way. For disclosure, I own the Aric Audio Motherlode XL (with XLR connections), with CODA S5.5 class A SS amplifier and an Aric Audio Transcend EL34 "Push Pull" amp

I touched on this earlier, but I have a pair of the same subwoofers. My son has an excellent ear for music and his hearing is better than mine. He talked me into increasing the gain on the subs tonight and it definitely helped add some fullness to songs that had sounded thin.  The gain is set really low and even one click makes a difference. I don't like boomy bass.  We left the crossover frequency really low. 

The tweaking all started when I did an a/b comparison between my dac/streamer and my sacd player.  The sacd player initially sounded better until I realized that my dac had somehow had the filter changed from fast to slow. The slow definitely has a warmer sound, but I wasn't looking for warmth.  If your dac has filter settings, you might try changing those. 

I've also been able to add warmth with certain copper cables. 

Anyway, this is probably all stuff you know, but I thought I'd share my experience. 

I've liked the B&W speakers that I've heard. The brightness that I mentioned was just from comments that I had read. 

I have been demo'd the 804 D4 Diamond Speakers in a system where a selection of Digital Sources were used with Devialet 1000 Amp's.

The Amp's are able to be configured in many different ways, very user tweakable.

It was noted these Speakers can Bloom with certain Amp' settings, and the owners settings were tweaked by the attendees to create a much more honest coherence across the frequency ranges.

The Speakers come into their own following attendees chosen settings, and were substantially impressive with a Valve Based Circuitry for a DAC used on the Digital Source.

Hence, my earlier suggestion to investigate a alternate Source.

I am impressed by 804 D4 Diamond Speakers as a result of the demo's had using different Digital Sources. I have even made it known, I would be happy to have these used for a Demo' in my own system, and not many Audio Devices experienced get put onto that list. 

I would not be hasty to consider suggestions to change Speakers.

My experience does leave me to strongly suggest Careful Valve Amp' matching would be advised if a Amp' of this Circuit Type were to be introduced.

The following is an attendees emailed comments following the HiFi Groups Meet Up at a Group Members Home to be demo'd their System:

" I can now see why the B&W's have such a reputation. Lovely clarity in the mid and treble and fantastic articulation in the bass. That they also look like modern sculptures is the icing on the cake.

Like John, my personal preference was that the speakers sounded better with the flat eq.  I would even try pointing them straight down the room as from memory I think they have a lift in the treble and so may sound flatter when you listen slightly off axis. Having said that I am quite sensitive to treble so that might just be me ".

@fthompson251 a big +1

@saurabhgarg Class A amps have warmer sound, in general. However, keep in mind each brand will have its own house sound. In example, Pass Labs amps are on the warmer side of neutral. Their Class A/B amps like the X250.8 are biased into Class A for the first 20-25w then transitions into Class A/B with tons of headroom. Pass Class A amps are even warmer. While they’re primarily biased into Class A, they still have some headroom in Class A/B. But the sound is unmistakably Pass Labs - warm, laid back with big bass. To me, Pass X series sound more dynamic and open than their XA series but what works for you in your system is impossible to predict.

Luxman Class A/B or Class A will also have their house sound and even the Class A Luxman will probably retain some of the top end qualities and may be only slightly warmer. It won’t be a full 180 from the sound you’re getting now.

If you can swing the Diablo 300, that would be my choice if I were you. With that amp you can experiment with pretty much any speaker down the road.

Good luck!

Coda amps are high performing and reasonable costs. Class A. 

I would invest in a trip to hear a variety of other speakers, whether that is a metro with multiple shops or an audio show. This will give you some perspective on your existing system/speakers. It will be fun and money well spent. 

@ghdprentice thanks for the suggestions. I was thinking to get a Type A Amplifier . Heard it is tube sounding. I am happy with most of other facets except getting a more fuller sound. 509z is the only amp I have tried. 

@audphile1 thanks for suggestion. I am tilting towards getting Diablo 300 or Luxman 590 axii. Latter is type A amplifier. 

If you dare, Loan a CDT / CDP > DAC ( your own model ) to produce a Source and compare to to your Source in use.

There is the suggestion that the Hard Media Option will enable the Downstream devices to present in a way that creates an impressive End Sound and totally acceptable to your preferences, when experienced as a comparison to what is already on offer.

Limiting oneself to one source, or one version only of a Source is a limitation to the End Sound that can be experienced and in many cases a thoroughly enjoyed alternate sonic.

I have been at comparisons with DAC's and could easily live with a Third of what has been demo'd, some might win more favour if experienced for a longer period. Even with some models being notably different in how they influence the End Sound produced.   

The same happens for myself with Phonostages and Speakers.

In one home, there is more than one permutation for an assembly of a System that can totally satisfy the end user an additional Source is not too invasive. 

Stick with what you have but consider different speakers like Revel Salon 2's. You certainly have spent plenty of money already! Speakers always make the biggest difference in any system!

@saurabhgarg B&Ws do midrange really well. They also throw a very nice soundstage. My recommendation would be to change the amp. Your Luxman us very nice but you probably need something fuller and warmer without accentuating the top end. If you decide to go the route of separates, Pass Labs X250.8 with Audio Research tube preamp would be a good combination. You can also do all tubes and get ARC separates. Depending how much you want to spend you can try a used Gryphon Diablo 300 integrated. New Simaudio Moon North series is supposed to be excellent, there’s also a new ARC integrated amp. 

Just guessing here, but the first thing I would try is new speakers. I've read a number of comments about some B&W being bright.  You could maybe raise the crossover frequency on your subs, but that won't fix the brightness. 

I'm running Von Schweikert Endeavor RE speakers with a pair of REL S/510 subs.

A tube preamp would perhaps help, but I don't think that's the best solution in your case. 

Electrocompaniet separates
Audiovector R1 serie

Sell the amp & speakers...
 Get some Sonus Faber,Spendor or Harbeth speakers and a Class A amplifier...

I understand your desire. it is clear that you have made careful choices of compatible equipment that have delivered the excellent sound you are getting. Each of your components are tuned to be on the lean side. From your description of the way forward seems to play towards the sound qualities I strive for.

I had a very high end system that delivered great detail and dynamics, not unlike yours. One day I upgraded my headphone system with a high powered 300B tubed head amp. I was blown away. It sounded so great, so musical, natural and powerful I wanted more so I went to my main system and turned it on. My face turned red with disappointment… it was lean and flat, nothing like the beautiful rich sonic quality of my headphone system. It had little music or midrange in it. That began a complete system upgrade. You can see my systems under my user ID. Both systems are very musical and natural with great midrange bloom. I have to drag myself away each day… and I often listen for two or three hours. 

Your Aurrender is great… a keeper. The dCs and Luxman are both very lean components the are low on mid-range bloom and rhythm and pace. If I were you I would start by swapping out the integrated amp with an Audio Research LS28se and VSI 80. If you are not open to tube amps… still get the Audio Research LS28SE and look at a Pass XA amp. Then swap either the speakers for Sonus Faber or the dCS for a warmer more natural DAC.

Lots of possible solutions are possible.