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My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
20,890 responses
Back to the synergy issue for just a moment. I think the cabling and matched equipment idea has significant merit. I went through a bunch of equipment in my limited price range in order to find the best for me sound from my 3.6 Maggie’s until I paired a McIntosh tube preamp with a pair of MC501 amps. My thought became McIntosh is always comparable with itself and for me and my limited budget it is true. No reason that high end equipment would not make their gear match as they control the design Of their matched components. |
good on ya Jay ! keep chasing the dream your way. As for any comparison between you the manner in which you comport yourself and Mr. Miller, there is zero comparison. Viber give it a rest and some of us prefer more distant microphone placement, after all it is an orchestra not the violin solo string band. carry on! |
I don’t think the videos started at the same time as the thread did, they seem to be much more recent, unless I’m missing something. New speakers will be intresting. In the early 2000s is when I started into high end audio, or higher end than a few hundred dollars of equipment. I started with psb and a Sony reciever. When I heard police radios in the courtyard of my townhome while watching law and order, and took me thirty minutes to realize it was in the background of the tv show, not in my courtyard, I was hooked. my next setup was a surround setup of higher end Martian Logan’s in my living room with their top sub at the time, the depth I believe. Great resolution. Wonderful, elevated to another level. Then I decided to build a dedicated home theater, and listened to many speakers, bw, von schweikert, linn, etc etc. while I was waiting to listen to the top linns, they put me in a room with the Vandersteen 3As. Wow, blew me away. I listened to the linns and was much less than impressed. Listened to the Vandy 5As , this bigger would be better, but the 3s just had more soundstage and something I could not define that no other speaker I had heard to that point. So I put together a system for 7.2 sourround at a time when 5.1 was considered state of the art. While I loved the Logan’s, and loved cymbals, and their precision, they didn’t have the dynamics, slams, and soul that the Vandys had. Now over 15 years later, I’m quite sure the Logan’s have evolved substantially come what I’ve read, while the Vandys have had no real updates. ( not that they needed any and I’d love to own them again to compare) I had considered the 15As when I started back into the hobby again recently after being absent for a decade, mostly due to the economic downturn, getting married and just life in general. I’m excited about the new addition and anticipating their audition in the system. I think most people feel speakers give the single biggest differences in sound. Maybe someday the Tekton’s will get their chance also, lol. |
Hmmm My post yesterday got deleted, too. In it I commented on viber6s use of warm v detailed when he said WW is warm. I disagree as I have WW Series 6 PCs, and Series 7 XLRs and speaker cables. Now, they MAY sound warm in a system with warm sounding components and rolled off speakers, but my system has neither When listening to violin, for example, if only the strings are heard that system LACKS the ability to hear the instrument body, whereas, if only the body is heard (obscuring the string detail) then it is too warm/softThink Little Red Riding Hood and the porridge and beds hth |
Looks like the martin logan 13a have a lot of subscribers quite excited because they want to hear it against the magnepan. I don't believe ANYONE on YouTube has done what im about to do: A shootout between two panels that are hardly ever heard next to each other in the same room conditions and with good components. |
speedbump6, I think you said that you preferred the Vandy 3A to both the 5A, and the Linn speaker. So you liked the sound of the 3A, while realizing that it is cheaper than the the 5A. And you didn't like the top Linn, which was probably the most expensive of them all. You have confirmed my point that bigger and more expensive isn't necessarily better. |
I hope WC writes about his golden ear Gryphon cables and how much they are the cream of the crop for weeks or months. After all , it makes this cable thread so much more enjoyable and credible............ No, it doesn’t seem at all like marketing from his dealer and him pumping the Gryphon kit a bit... No, the Gryphon preamp coming in soon doesn’t seem like the final marketing trick a bit... This kind of thinking is all in our mind guys. WC and his connections are pure honesty at its best example on audiogon...nothing to be gained here. You do not even need to subscribe to his youtube videos, he doesn’t care at all this is not the goal here... |
Yes viber, I don’t think more expensive is always better, though I bet most people would say the 5A is better than the 3A. It’s just how it worked out for me in that case. Tecno you will lead a sad life if you’re always envious of what others can do compared to what you can. There’s always someone with more. Learn to appreciate what you can do within your means and don’t worry about what others can do. I’d love a Bugatti, but I’ll likely never own one. But I don’t have to disparage those who can. I’m happy for them that they can. |
If and when that day comes that I begin to get compensated FOR REAL, I will announce it here. Don't worry I won't hide. I don't need to hide because I wouldn't get paid if I can't deliver either product or a service. It is coming though...how long have I been doing this here? 4 years ? I think 4 years is as long as it takes to get a bachelor's? To finish high school? I take the good with the bad. I got scammed here by a dealer, you (techno) have been for some reason just bitter with me as if I am personally attacking you from the beginning. Others tend to fight you off and you keep coming at me like with vengeance and I don't know why? Am I taking food off your plate? Am I somehow impacting your life ? Hurting your family? Those are things that I don't get about some people in this world. It's like they are angry at others who haven't done anything to them but they have this drive to be mad and salty non-stop. Why?? I've been doing this for 4 years here!! My daughter wasn't even born when I started this and I keep getting slammed by multiple people. Luckily, it is not everyone but man I can NOT imagine how dealers - REAL DEALERS handle bs all day long from customers. I guess they can justify the bs by looking at the digits in their bank account. I hear all sorts of stories from many dealers about all kinds of customers and the bs they try to pull. My jaw drops at some of the things I have heard. That said, I have been here for 4 years posting and I am planning to "graduate" soon from the freebies and begin to see some light at the end of the tunnel. I'll leave it at that. |
Well, just up this post, he basically admits the goal of this from the beginning... It’s easy to realise you do this for your dealer close relations. The dealer friend gets to push and sell his high end products with your help. In return, you get to try the gear of your dreams for well below msrp or free if it is borrowed... And your dealer gets to sell directly, or indirectly going through you. This explains why the gear comes in your room and gets out quickly...sometimes with very few time for you to evaluate it reasonably. You say you trade it. No, it gets sale or resale. Not saying it is bad to do this. We just don’t get why you deny it when it is so obvious. |
WC, Yes, the high end audio business is tough. I do understand how many customers give the dealers a rough time, but unfortunately sometimes they cheat an honorable customer like you. You do a great job presenting the equipment as truthfully as possible. And thanks for beginning to recognize some of the points I have made, such as the value of listening at modest levels to best appreciate the subtle differences and to avoid ear fatigue. Like you, I have made errors in not keeping the volumes the same when making comparisons, which has led me to incorrect conclusions. Also, thanks for bringing the ML 13A, and your open mind to the fact that maybe this modestly priced speaker has a combination of attributes that exceed much more expensive speakers. When you set them up, I hope you accept my suggestions about how to max out the performance of them. |
Not saying the thread is bad and serves nothing. The thread is actually very fun, it’s about big systems that play loud...concert level, etc. But WC deals in absolute, like this is rocket science and is caught in its own illusion of the bigger and more expensive the better and more resolving. This is absolutely not the case in this retail field and hobby. It’s not cars, or rockets... It ´s jewels we are dealing with here. Circuit boards, etc. are not deep science and tech. Bigger and more expensive does not mean better. Simple amps with just 2 transistors will aways bring more transparency and resolution. Less cables and contact points also. Anybody can absolutely build a small system with very high sensitivity speakers and get the same transparency, detail, emotion, dynamics , for reasonable money. |
I just don't get the few posters that seem to be obsessed with discrediting the OP. It's obvious he works very hard to keep up the thread and the YouTube channel. I believe Jay has been nothing but honest with everything he reviews....he doesn't like everything. If you think he's making a lot of money buying and selling amps or working through a dealer to promote gear for the dealer, then take what he has to say with a grain of salt....or better yet don't participate in the thread or video channel.....simple as that. I've been an active participant in this thread almost since the beginning. I find it very entertaining, informative and yet another way to stay connected to music reproduction. I have also made a handful of really good friends from this thread. Techno, you seem to have made it your goal to badger and discredit the OP. Why waste your precious time on this thread? grey9hound, not happy either? Awww....I don't think he's doing this out of the kindness of his heart, I think he's obsessed with audio gear and music. |
Greyhound, he does it because he finds happiness in it. That’s been made very obvious if you bother to have read all of this thread. Tecno is just being a jerk, and that’s just how some people are. Jay has never denied that he pays less than retail, and if something isn’t his that he bought, he has said so. And, why does it matter? Why is it anyone’s business either way? He’s made no claims that would be refuted by the facts. From what he has said, I assume he does get good deals, I think he’s made that very clear. Who knows, maybe he makes a little from the sales of an item here and there once he’s down with it. Again, why is that any of our business? Has nothing at all to do with his channel and what he’s doing there. Maybe you wish you could do that also? Then do it. Does anyone think he’s making a mint doing this? Then you need a serious reality check if so. And even if he was, why does it matter? Dosnt take anything from what he’s doing. Stop worrying about how much others make, what they can afford, etc, just enjoy the channel as something you can’t get anywhere else, or ignore it if you don’t like it.no one is trying to force anyone. Why do so many on the forums feel the need to be rude, and try to disrupt civil actual convo about a subject. If you like something, you’re labeled as a fanboy,lol. Some very small minds lurking here. |
“This is absolutely not the case in this retail field and hobby. It’s not cars, or rockets... It ´s jewels we are dealing with here. Bigger and more expensive does not mean better. Simple amps with just 2 transistors will aways bring more transparency and resolution. Less cables and contact points also. Anybody can absolutely build a small system with very high sensitivity speakers and get the same transparency, detail, and emotion, and dynamics for reasonable money.” @techno__dude, Sounds good, start ‘your own thread’ already. |
pokey77, bvdiman and speedbump6 Thank you for saving me the time of having to post similar observations. techno_dude's mantra and repeated flogging of this issue is bordering on the aberrant. I couldn't care less what, if any, arrangements Jay may have with anyone. Why would someone care ? Take the flea-powered, high sensitivity, inexpensive sales pitch somewhere else. |
Human nature. Jealousy is unfortunately a huge component of it. |
Techno clearly has an agenda but I think it's important we keep the discussion and exchanges going which, in addition to the journey itself, have made this thread interesting. I've noticed that recently, this thread has gone down the "if you did not listen to the equipment yourself then shut up" path and that's unfortunate. Probably ~30% of the posts are about bashing people who express different opinions and points of view. Yes it's WC's thread and we are all free to jump out of the bandwagon if we don't like the direction or the content but I believe the 'conversational' aspect and sharing ideas and point of views should be the main goal here. Otherwise, there's no point. WC is testing very expensive gear right now and many cannot afford or simply don't want to invest that kind of money into audio but if they are shut down each time they make the mistake to voice a diverging opinion simply because they did not hear the gear then this activity loses a lot of value IMHO. My point is that it's easy to simply buy the 'best' (most expensive) equipment and say "guys it sounds so much better than the crap you can afford". What I find much more interesting personally is how to get 90% of this great sound for 40% less for instance. People who have expressed this kind of point of view and/or have opened the door to discussing these aspects have been asked to start their own thread. That's a pity. |
@guyl Well stated, and I agree with your point. It is only two or three posters that take it too far or just exhibit very poor social and communication skills. Hopefully this fantastic thread can continue to maintain a balance that keeps it informative and entertaining. WCSS - I have enjoyed it all, please let us continue to share your experiences and the knowledge you gain. |
True guyl, I never understood why some people seem to think you’re not allowed to discuss your opinions unless you’ve heard, owned, owned with x other products in the system, etc. most have read enough of reviews etc to have had an idea to start a discussion. Problem is that they think they can define everything, and then try to exclude anyone who doesn’t agree with them, with a set of parameters that no on but them could meet. Since you didn’t hear it in my grandmas living room at 2pm on Thursday, your opinion couldn’t possibly be valid, lol. They've been told to start their own thread, and their own you tube channel so they can prove anything they wish to their own personal “fanboys”. Seems like they prefer to stay and pester here. |
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Thank you guys. Your comments add more weight to my points. Personally I liked the fact that WC initially changed directions a few times and came up with 'surprises' i.e. the journey was not a straight line. Experimentations, discoveries, etc. all of that was the interesting part. The discussion about the Luxman amp for instance was great: good value for the money, synergy with X or Y components, etc was something very interesting I believe even for people who do not want to buy one. We could also learn from Mrdecibel's journey with his Adcom amp or somebody else's Bryston. I had the impression money was not the only factor at the beginning - yes I've read the whole thread too :-). You guys are right, a lot of people following this thread have experience buying, selling, listening to great audio systems, are musicians and so on. I believe they can contribute positively to this thread and share their views as long as we stay on track with OP's main topic. I guess I've seen less and less of that recently and it seems I'm not the only one. The richness of this hobby comes from sharing experiences with people (I mean both ways). Otherwise, it is simply a question of opening a wallet, buy the most expensive MBL gear and be done. In other words, is it a one man show or a conversation with the audience? That 'd be great to get WC's view on this. |
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guyl, I agree with your balanced view of things. I like your goal of getting 90% of the benefits for 60% of the price. In other aspects of life, there is the 80/20 rule. In the stock market, a great investor gets 80% of the returns with only 20% of the risk. I like to fantasize that as a good amateur violinist, I sound 80% as good as a professional with only 20% of the practice time. If I actually put in 20% of the time, that might be true, but actually I put in only 5% of the time due to my real profession as a doctor, and get significantly less than 80% of the results. |
All- I believe the title of this thread is very clear: "My Long List Of Amplifiers and MY REVIEW of each" To me, that implies it is about ONE MAN’S opinion & journey on amplifiers he has owned. It means you are reading someone’s feedback based on what he has had or currently has. That said, we are "supposed" to be grown men here and not kids and i am assuming (fingers crossed) that there isn’t anyone underage reading or posting here. i consider EACH and EVERYONE OF YOU grown men. As grown men, we have families, bills, responsibilities, jobs, businesses and so on. I have been here on a 4 year journey now and some people have come and gone and i am sure there are plenty of people who still read this thread and don’t post which is totally fine. Anyhow, and to be frank with everyone, i am NOT HERE luring kids into buying candy. I am also not here to convince ANYONE of buying ANYTHING. You are all GROWN A$$ MEN and can make your own buying decisions. If my input and/or feedback resulted in you making the correct purchase that helped your own personal journey then i am glad that i was able to help you somehow. If we start to observe the behavior of some individuals here, notice that the hate started ever since i began to explore higher end offerings (Gryphon, Alexia 2, Nordost Odin, DCS, etc, etc). It never happened while i reviewed more "affordable" equipment. I personally feel like i am entitled to review whatever my financial situation allows me to have. I don’t feel that i need to follow someone else’s protocol because the title already implies what this is about. I don’t need to articulate it further. If you feel content with the more affordable lines and that has taken you to happiness then be happy that you don’t have to spend the money i have spent. I applaud you for putting together the perfect system FOR YOU for less money. Kudos to you! With that out of the way, I don’t appreciate the bashing, constant punches, criticism (unless it is really REALLY CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM). I do, however, appreciate advise when given appropriately. i do not accept "orders" because i left the military many years ago and quite frankly nobody here can order me to do anything i don’t want to do because (and again i don’t want to sound harsh) it is MY MONEY. How would you all feel if you lived all by yourself, you pay all your bills, mortgage, etc and a stranger from the streets who you have never ever seen before comes into your home and tells you how to decorate your home? Your first reaction would be " who the F--- are you to tell me how to decorate MY HOUSE?" Granted, this is a public forum and i understand it is different, but you all get what i am trying to say. I sent 2 private messages over the last 24 hours to 2 people with whom i had no beef with, but who suddenly came on here and began to say things that really took me by surprise. Long story short, is that i need to start doing? Do i have to call you out privately? It is totally out of my character to be an a$$hole and i demonstrated this HERE for a LOOOOONG time when i did not confront ANYONE EVER, and MANY OF YOU messaged me to tell me "hey Jay don’t take that bs man..say something to those who attack you etc, etc." Well, a man reaches his limit and i am there now. I will plaster it here as smoothly as possible: IF YOU FIND ZERO VALUE IN MY TRIALS AND JOURNEY THEN STAY OFF THE THREAD. I DO NOT NEED YOUR CRITICISM AND CONSTANT BS. IF YOU ARE MAD BECAUSE YOU ARE IRRELEVANT TO ANYONE AT ALL AND I MANAGED TO CREATE THE LONGEST RUNNING THREAD EVER IN THE HISTORY OF THIS WEBSITE AND NOW I AM WORKING ON GROWING MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL THEN BE SALTY WITH SOMEONE ELSE. -THE END |
WCSS, I have followed this tread off and on since the beginning. I am in complete agreement with you as it is Your journey. Some folks with agendas have been a thorn for a long time IMHO. I need to thank you for all the work and insight provided. You are the only reviewer I trust. Putting your own money into the journey has demonstrated a love for knowledge amid a search for great sound. I have been away for a while, and learning you have a pair of big Maggie’s makes me smile and look forward to your shootout upcoming. Again, missing your acquisition on 20.7s (I think), did you ever consider the 30.7 models or did you get a great bargain on the ones you have. Just curious about the process and forgive my failure to read about six months of attacks on you to catch up. |