@whitecamaross i hope you get to review pass XS300 :D
My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
20,890 responses
Let’s not forget that , usually, dac direct to amplifier(s) is supposed to sound thin, sterile... and less dynamic. This is absolutely not the case with the DcS dac, which means it has stunning preamplifier capabilities. Imho, there is not enough gap here to justify the huge price increase in adding the Ref6 SE ( add to that a power cable and a set of interconnects). But if you absolutely crave for that « tube sound » in the mix, go for it. It’s your money. |
I have always had a preamp in my system and never tried the direct from DAC to amp route. I listen at low to moderate levels so detail and resolution are at the top of my list of fun things....however if going direct from DAC to amp robs the natural warmth and richness, I will choose a less detailed but warmer, richer presentation every time. From what I could hear in the video the preamp added a more natural 'you are there sound' rather than a detailed hi-fi sound. Listening in person might change my mind because deep, tight focused bass is very important to me also and there was no bass to be heard in that track. I vote for the preamp in. There are ways of tightening things up when using a tubed preamp like isolation and a slightly lean power cord...that's what I would try. Thanks for the video! |
@ron17...interesting thoughts. I really don't think going either route is wrong, but i do believe that a lot of people should find this experiment interesting and recognize that going dac direct is not really better or worse than having a preamp in the mix. Yes there is more cost incurred by adding a preamp and the additional cabling, but if that is not an issue, the preamp can indeed add a lot of benefits. |
WC, I listened to the preamp / no preamp shootout, again, through another system of mine, and the conclusions were the same for me. No preamp : greater, more articulate attack, of both the piano playing and singing, a more natural decay of the instruments, within the space, and just a much cleaner presentation overall. The preamp robbed me of what is on the recording ( by comparison ), by adding things of it’s own. I understand, and respect, the preference thing, and that some folks like the preamp in the system. I do not notice any edginess or hardness, dac to amp, but, I hear, added color, added bloom ( warmth ), and smearing, of the piano and voice, with a loss of information, using the preamp in the system. The added bloom and warmth, might be preferred, for a very " hard, and terribly recorded ", piece of music, but I found this recording, to be quite natural and smooth sounding, all on it’s own. It is interesting, that I actually listen to a lot of music that is far from state of the art, recording wise ( stuff like Jethro Tull, as an example ), but I still prefer the details, and the timing / attack, of the musicianship, passively, than with the addition of a preamp, and an extra set of cables. My ears like what I like. Be safe, everyone...... |
You can use a $17,000 preamp to remove some info and give you a more organic warmer sound. Or you could do a bunch of way cheaper things to increase information and musicality. Here are some of these things: 1. Change all fuses to Synergistic Orange fuses.....this will give you more organic sound and more information. 2. Get your cables off the floor using cardboard, wood or other cheap means. This will give you more organic sound and information. 3. Put cheap felt around your midrange and tweeter to reduce diffraction and purify the sound....this will give you less bright, more focused and more organic sound and information. 4. Get some serious feet......you can tune the sound of your system just using various footers.....to increase resolution and warmth. 5. Get off the grid using low distortion sine wave inverters run off batteries. Way better sound.....way less harsh and more organic and better space, etc. 6. Get some inexpensive AC tweaks like ADD-Powr Electraclear, Hifidelity cable MC-05, and Akiko Audio triple AC enhancer. Mo betta sound. 7. Mass damp the top of equipment. You can use 15lb. stepping stones on top of towels or other material....do not put hard materials directly on cases....you want damped weight. This can give better dynamics and warmer sound. 8. I am sure there are tons of other things too.....including finding a speaker cable with the detail of your Odin but more musical....you might find one that is so much less money than the Odin that you can sell the Odin and buy the other cable and lose no money....However, this might require a search of esoteric gear....not just main stream Audiophile press conservative expensive products. So, you can spend $17,000 to make your system more "musical" or you can spend maybe $3K to DRAMATICALLY increase resolution and increase musicality. Which do you choose? Of course, you can do neither or both. It is a free will zone. You can lead a horse to water.....you know the rest. |
Tonight is the very first time I can honestly say I have the focal scala beating my Sasha Daw. I spent about 2 hours measuring every single corner of the speaker and to be sure it's exactly the same distance throughout the room and then I placed them on top of the same 2x4s I used on the Sasha and I'm doing 100% nordost cables with the exception being the powercord on the colloseum where I'm using the audioquest dragon and I have zero brightness of any kind even at club levels. No brightness or edginess. I'm now wondering if maybe the focals broke in or am I simply hearing the dividends of the hours I've spent positioning them? I don't know what it is but they are simply sounding the very best I've ever heard them since I've owned them.. |
I heard the preamp/no preamp comparison. The preamp adds veiling and distortion. It is irrelevant to discuss image size, warmth. The recording itself is murky with the piano submerged in a cave under water. The voice has more immediacy without preamp. It will be a good move to ditch both dynamic speakers in favor of the ML 15a or CLX. Midrange will be more revealing and natural. The Be tweeter on the Focal may have more accuracy than the flawed curved stat panel which rolls off HF, but the midrange contains most of the music. Then you will be ready for the most important shootout of all--ML vs GTA vs Sanders. The Sanders flat panel stat is a better design than ML. You can't lose with the 30 day trial. |
True, but you made a big backwards move by spending big bucks on a veiled tube preamp. Dump the ARC when you can. Any of those speakers--ML, GTA, Sanders--are keepers and should be not treated as disposable toys. Although you had the ML 15a years ago, your ancillary equipment has greatly improved, so I am sure you will appreciate them for a long time. |
I am also having fun with focals and Sasha DAW. I mean , I am playing with speakers that most people would love to have as their own. I'm not playing with best buy stuff... If I make a move, it is because I want to try something different but this doesn't mean that different will be equivalent to better. |
Guys, he is a toy dumper/changer. That is his game. Let him buy and sell many toys. The Martin Logan has ordinary caps, resistors and coils in the signal path, transformer mounted by steel bolt, etc. Never be state of the art. Everything is imperfect. Sanders is not a tweaker, so things could be done better and you have to sit with your head in a vise to listen to those speakers.....GTA speakers.....now those are keepers.....no xover on the mids.....simple good parts on the tweet.....servo open baffle bass...yes, way, way better than these box thangs. However, you could felt the front of the Focal, remove the xover from the speaker and upgrade all its parts and you would have way, way mo info......also remove the binding posts, as well. But, rich people are generally not tweakers...they just buy and sell equipment. It is fun. However, I would rather build a system for serious transparency and keep tweaking it. To each his own. I wish everyone good health.....joy and love are always present. "Most people would love to have as their own".......well, I doubt that. We are all different. I would never want one of those speakers. Hey, I bet I would like a combo of Lii full range speakers with subs better than either of your speakers. You could use the Lii Crystal 10 inch mounted in the air by its magnet with no baffle so it rolls off at 300hz by itself and under it mount the 15 inch driver on an open baffle and use a super coil to cross it over at 300Hz....then use subs under 50hz. Would be incredible. The 10 inchers are $1000 the pair and the 15 inchers are $400 the pair....both speakers are around 98db so no padding necessary. You need to do a search on these speakers....these things are incredible for the money and just plain incredible....Try the Decware forum and the full range forum on Audiocircle for more info....check out the speakers here: https://www.lii-audio.com/ You can also buy the Crystal 10 in its cabinet delivered to your door for $3000 the pair. Flat to 30hz in room. I hope Lii sends a pair of these to get reviewed.......these speakers will cause a mass selling of expensive speakers....even a pair of their 8 inch full range speakers ($200 the pair for drivers only.....you make the cabinet) will put to shame all those $2000 a pair speakers out there. Let the revolution begin! |
We are now going into our 8th year of production at GT Audio Works and most of our customers who have our speakers certainly did their fair share of auditioning before deciding on our speakers. Ricevs is correct in his statement that the GT’s do not utilize a Crossover on the crucial main panel of the speaker. Any crossover despite its cost will add time shift, delay issues, rob amplifier power and most importantly will absolutely cause a loss of transparency. Even Aylsavox uses a crossover on their six figure speakers. It has taken a insurmountable amount of research and development to develop a planar Magnetic driver that is mechanically tuned to achieve a very favorable frequency response without the use of a crossover which is essentially a Band-Aid to achieve a desired frequency response. I am presently unaware of any other planar speaker that forgoes the use of a crossover on its main planar panel. Additionally, all other planar designs and electro stats do not utilize the type of proprietary membrane that the GT Speakers use in order to eliminate distortion when the music is cranked up at very high levels. Stay tuned as the new Reference 3 speakers will be released in the next few months - with even improved musicality and dynamics. |
I for one come here to read W/C's thread which I have followed from the beginning. For those of you who do not agree with his methods or personna there is a simple solution; either scroll past or better yet start your own thread instead of relentlessly criticizing. The same goes for the dealers or manufacturers who unabashedly promote their goods here; there are more appropriate venues, either your own thread or support Audiogon by purchasing an ad. This thread was a chronicle of one man's journey and his conclusions. Please show some respect especially in these difficult times and take your unwanted and negative comments elsewhere. Thank you |
What is "unwanted" by some is "appreciated" by others. Many posts that can appear negative were done by people actually trying to help....with suggestions and information that they either think or have direct knowledge of. If we just read this thread and all of us only posted...."oh that is great, I cannot wait to see what else you do"......then who really learns anything? Yes, some of us are really passionate about what we know and even more passionate about helping others. When I made comments about the speaker A/B being flawed....he actually listened (after first reacting) and then took hours to properly set up his speakers....so he learned from my "feedback". We are all brothers to each other....and we are all parents to each other. Parents want their children to be happy and do things that are beneficial to the child and everyone. It is called learning and teaching. We are all teachers and we are all students. We also like drama. So, if there is no tension....there is no fun and no learning......boring it would be. We don't need to fight but we can be passionate in our helpfulness and without having to defend ourselves This time on earth is a reflection time. What can we do better? Where have we been holding ourselves back? How can we be better humans? Yes, learning how to appreciate everyone is key....but also giving feedback (as the parent) to help our children be happier. I have repeated several things in this thread thinking maybe they will eventually be heard. One of the things I am learning is to realize when to stop saying things I have already said......ie.....just let it go. Some people are ready to hear things at this time and some are not. We all value different things. What do you value? Please, follow your heart. I am your child and you are mine. Thank you for helping me be a better person. |
@shannere +++++++3 @ricevs What is "unwanted" by some is "appreciated" by others.Yes, I am sure they are appreciated by viber. Honestly, on this planet you two and a couple of others come off as out of control envious of WC. Do you actually think that your contributions to this thread can be considered contributions? Why is it that in all these years neither of you has started one thread. Rhetorical question, its because you are rightly worried that no one would care enough to post to it? |
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Shanerre +6. What I sincerely wish is that the sanctimonious know-it-alls would actually recognize when the OP calls them out by name and asks them to stop. Just go read OPs last post for an example. Or any of the countless other examples of OP sometimes subtly and other times brute force directly asking the offenders to knock it off. It’s a pattern that has recurred ad infinitum over these 190+ pages. Eventually, thankfully, the perpetrators tend to finally get it for awhile, but sadly, and all too often, only for awhile.... |
envy is an ugly thing. it’s quite evident when one uses the term “rich people”. it’s the new mantra for those that feel that life is unfair bc we are not all on the same economic playing field. no more politics. let the man continue. it’s a very interesting to hear unbiased impressions of different gear. FWIW |
I learned with experience that in high end audio, less is better. So yes, a driver design without a crossover is always more transparent. It has to be well made and implemented. I also don’t like the complicated electronics in the ML 15A ´s signal path. For me, that will always be a deal breaker. My vote is for GT Audio. |
Buzzwords like the negatives of complicated electronics in crossovers is merely one factor. The theoretical ideal speaker uses lowest mass drivers tightly controlled by either electrostatic stators or ribbon magnets. If the designer can use the least intrusive electronic crossover, that is great. But look at the total package. The inherently superior electrostatic transducer, even handicapped by flawed electronics, may still come out ahead. The trouble is that except for the flat panel Sanders, other stats with their curved panels are flawed. I like the purist approach of GTA. But theory may not correlate exactly with reality, so that's why the GTA and Sanders should be compared patiently. |
This week I plan to shoot a video of the focal vs Sasha Daw round #2. I now have both placed where they need to be and I will level match both. The song will be the same song from my last video since I think it came out very good plus remember I can’t be playing any song on YouTube because of copyrights. They take down videos of songs that aren’t allowed to play in your videos. |
Chazzzy007 - I never ever said in any of my posts how great the GT speakers are- I simply described the technology involved and what one should anticipate to expect if they had the chance to audition them. Last time I looked I wasn’t in Russia or North Korea and I am not restricted to my freedom of speech. Specifically this blog in part dealt with the type of loudspeakers white Camarro SS was using and I have every right to interject how the GT speakers could affect his evaluations with respect to the amplifiers and equipment that were chosen to be reviewed. We have had several members of this forum audition the speakers as a result of this blog and that is all I desire to have as many on this blog and elsewhere audition the speakers and let those individuals give their assessments of the speakers. In a court of law yes I am a biased witness. But anyone else who auditioned the speakers is not considered biased. |
I live in the central NJ area and, and while my schedule is always a challenge - I would like to audition these speakers with a friend or two. Please either PM me or post possible opportunities once this pandemic subsides. Speaking of this pandemic - I’m a chemical engineer with extensive experience in the pharmaceutical industry. This virus will be with us for a while - like past summer in a significant way. I believe media reports of a peek in 2 - 3 weeks are more "political" than medially / factually accurate (and I sincerely hope I’m wrong). Self isolation will slow the spread but not stop it. Only a vaccine will stop it’s spread and unless a miracle occurs, we’re at the absolute minimum a year away from that. Remember the AID’s virus and how long it too for industry to create effective treatments - even with the FDA removing many public health and safety restrictions and protocols - in the interest in expediting things? Developing a vaccine to this virus is unfortunately similar in many respects. Sorry if I’ve derailed things - everyone please use good judgement, be prudent and stay safe. And - it certainly is a unique opportunity to enjoy music that stirs our senses and arouses our souls! |
@faxer, Chazzzy007 - I never ever said in any of my posts how great the GT speakers are- I simply described the technology involved and what one should anticipate to expect if they had the chance to audition them. Ah I believe you did. Here are a few quotes you made on this thread about your speakers. My customer Bill had the Revel Salons 2’s in his room to compare to his GT Audioworks- He is also good friends with the owner of American Audiophile in Lynbrook, NY All I can say it was a joke - The GT’s were a million times more transparent, dynamic and 3 dimensional. Jay I really Wished you got to hear the Pass XS Amps and Preamp Altogether on the GT Audio Works speaker at Capital Audiofest this weekend. You have truly never heard how incredible this gear is until you listen to them on the GT Speakers. Here is the first review from Stereophile - which basically said the sound was spectacular and relaxing and can compete with anything out there cost no object. I previously sent some posts and videos regarding the GT Audioworks speakers as Jay visited our exhibit at Axpona. The speakers have the latest upgraded drivers and sound even better when Jay had heard them at Axpona. You truly have to hear this speaker in person I know the videos only give you somewhat of an idea of what the speaker can do. You have to experience the dynamics transparency and virtual reality that this speaker exhibits. Stay tuned as the new Reference 3 speakers will be released in the next few months - with even improved musicality and dynamics faxer Of course you have every right to post in this open forum, however you being a manufacturer of these speakers it is evident your goal on this thread is to educate potential buyers and promote sales. Chazzzy007 had every right to call you out for it. |
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Chazzzy007 - you do not speak for a vast majority of the members who are on this blog. In fact I can tell you that many members of this blog as a result of my input have in fact been turned on to a Company that gives audiophiles the most value for their money. In fact White Camarro SS actually visited us at the last Axpona as a result of the posts and the information that we had given to everyone about the speakers. I do not tell you how to conduct your business and in all fairness you should not be telling me how to conduct my business. All I am doing is letting people decide for themselves to listen to the speakers and decide for themselves. |