Kubala-Sosna Cables..... I don't get it ?????

Lots of hype. Nice product but no better than a handful of similarly priced products. We heard the same crap when the HT Cyberlights, Cerious ceramic, and any PAD new releases are announced. All are for sale at low prices now that "the thrill is gone". Ignore the hype; it eventually dies down.

Maybe the cost. Maybe the zillion other cables flooding the mkt.

To answer a couple of your questions:

You're not missing anything - these really are phenomenol cables. A lot of people are indeed using these cables. Do a search here and you will see this for yourself. And no, these are not the flavor of the month for those of us who have had many in our system at once.

I had the pleasure of Joe Kubala visiting my home and we configured my system entirely with the K-S Emotion. Quite frankly I had never heard another system sound as good as this on that day. These cables brought life to the SoundLab speakers driven by the CAT JL-3 amps that caught me by surprise.

With all this said, shortly thereafter, I was also able to directly compare these ICs with Purist Dominus B and power cables to Dominus B and C in various links in my system. It comes down to a personal preference here. The K-S Emotion has a blacker background, and thus ultimately greater resolution on the top-end that the Dominus does not convey. But the Dominus brings on slightly greater dynamic contrasts, a greater foundation in the bass (never sounding boomy) and a portrayal of lower-midrange textures that is very evident in male voice and piano. These are not subtle differences. And these differences are consistent whether you compare the ICs or power cables. I have had the opportunity to hear the Dominus speaker cable but I understand this to be quite a phenomenol cable.

I am not a big fan of the word "synergy" but each of these two cable lines will benefit different systems and different links in each system. These are both at the top of the class and it truly comes down to personal preference.

A local audiophile (Jadem6) and I have been trying various combinations of the Dominus and Emotion in our systems and sometimes it is not simple as to which way to go. Both of these are excellent and each brings on a different focus to the music. You simply have to try them for yourself as there is absolutely no such thing as a best cable.

The new Purist Aqueous Anniversary could change much in the context of value. So you might want to investigate this as well.

John

Agree with John, these cables are the real deal and are not as much a secret as you'd think. I've just finished wiring virtually all of my system with Emotion ICs, PCs and speaker cable (only the outboard phono stage to go) and can only say that it's a pleasure to listen to music through this system--these cables let you forget about the equipment and get caught up in the music. I'm a little surprised at John saying that the bass textures with Dominus are better, as that's one of the (many) strong points about the Emotion line of cabling, I'm hearing far better bass weight, definition and textures now than I did in the past. Part of it could be I have a biamped system with an active crossover that enables me to boost the bass below 220 hz; and part could be that the Dominus is just that good too. Obviously, auditioning these and other cables in your system is a must, but these cables are in the top class of what I've heard out there and in my system, and they have pushed all the right buttons for me.

I recently auditioned the Emotion speaker cables in my system and thought they were very good cables. Although in my mostly tubed system they were too warm and dark sounding to better my Valhalla's. The emotion just seemed too closed in on the top for me and the bass fuller sounding than I prefer. I then compared to the Audio Magic Clairvoyant 4D speaker cables. In my system these provided some of the warmth and body to images that the Emotion does but without sounding restricted on top and too full in bass. The bass was slightly deeper than Valhalla but just as tight. The only thing that neither the could get close to Valhalla was the ulitmate transparency and air around images. In the end I changed my reference from Valhalla to the Clairvoyants due to the strengths of the Clairvoyants in my system. I could see though in another system one could prefer the Emotion cables.

Unfortunately Judge Judy has done it again to provide a response of zero value. I do not understand why such people post in these forums when all we get is a quick bashing. Quite honestly, this kind of 'contribution' to these forums gets old fast when a number of us are here to learn from the experiences of others.

The same thing with Judy continues on over and over and over with B&W speakers. Yes Judy, we know you have negative issues with products. What we do not know is what products you like. Without this knowledge, your comments here do nothing more than prove that you have nothing better to do than complain a lot. Is this really what this hobby is all about?

"Lots of hype."

Hype? From whom? This product has had a handful of discussions here, but hardly much if anything at all from the magazines .... and not at all the coverage like many other cables. So this claim of hype is, to use one of Judy's words, crap.

"Nice product but no better than a handful of similarly priced products."

We are not talking 'better'. This is not the point. There is no such thing as 'best' or 'better' in an overall cable standing. And yes, contrary to Judy's ignorance on the subject here, the K-S Emotion has some strenghts like no other cable I have tried in my system; and some of these cost significantly more. I have tried a lot of cables.....all described on A'gon posts over the years.

I stand by my comments above. There are real differences in a highly resolving system and we all owe it to ourself to try as many of these as we can and determine what works best for us.

John

Thanks, John....I just don't respond or take those comments into consideration. I appreciate the professional answers that others have given me here. Not every cable, speaker or piece of equipment is going to please everyone .... If you don't like it, don't buy it...but the continous bashing of by some people just wastes allot of time. I for one do not like NBS cables, my opinion, but I certainly don't jump in in every thread on NBS about why I don't like the cable just to prove my point as some do....especially when their answers have nothing to do with the original questions !!!!NBS makes great stuff....they just didn't work in MY SYSTEM !!!!! Judy 426 added nothing to this thread about the Kubala-Sosna cables....probably hasn't even listend to them...but we have an opinion....gotta love it.

Garebear don't jump to conclusions. I have heard them and alongside Stealth Indra they finished right where they belong. In a far distant second place. How do you like me now?
:-)

There are many good brands on the market today especially those from the "cottage" cable makers. There is no ideal cable and system matching is important. This thread simply hypes Kubala-Sosna. Other threads hype RSA, Pure Note, Bogdan, etc. Audiophiles will choose the best match at the price they want to spend.

What is MSRP for the Emotion ICs and speaker cable?

Thanks,
Tim

You hear lots-o-chat about the Emotion cables, which come with a heafty price tag (in many eyes.) I must chime in and go to bat for the (often in the shadows) K-S Fascination series of cables.

With the exception of recently upgrading my SC's to the Emotion series, I have been using the Fascination SC's & IC's for over a year and still am as dazzled with these, as the day I first hooked them up.

Often, while listening to my system with the Fascinations, I scratched my head wondering how there could be two more levels of K-S cables that best the Fascination series.

For those who find the Emotion's price tag to be unrealistically out of reach, I whole heartedly encourage you to try the Fascination cables.

I now can say from experience, though the Emotion took it to another level, the Fascination shares the family resemblance. They too are "that good."

I can say with all honesty that to date, changing my cabeling to the K-S Fascination series, made the largest noticable (positive) change to my system's performance, in comparrison to any other component change in nearly 10 years.

Maybe Judy hasn't heard the KS cables, but there is a lot of truth in Judy's post.

Many here go through cables like toilet paper, each time proclaming the "new" cables are soooo much better than their current cables. Then along comes a newly hyped cable and the last "better" cable goes up for sale being replaced by the latest "better" cable.

When Cerious cables came out I auditioned them after reading some of the hype here. They were good, but I didn't think they were better than the cables I currently own. When I posted my listening impressions some responded with the usual "deer in the highlights" look. "What? Are you out of your mind?"

Fast forward a couple of months. There seems to be more than a few Cerious cables up for sale here in such a short period of time. I've seen it happen over and over (and if you are paying attention, you have too).

And many of the same names frequently pop up on the cable merry-go-round. Nothing wrong with having fun and changing flavors, but it does get old hearing about the "latest, greatest world-beater" from the same ole equipment junkies.

Think about it. If the latest, greatest cable was really that much better than the previously hyped cable and the previously hyped cable was that much better than the one before it and so on .... then the cable that was sooooo incredible four generations ago, in reality, had to have really sucked!

I agree Mr. Fiddler. This is the first time that I have thought about changing cables in some time. If I am going to spend that much $$$ on certain cables, they better be good as they will be staying in my system for awhile.

k-s cables are very good cables...and i can only speak to the 'emotion' line, as i own 3 of the powercords.they are good today in my system and will be good tomorrow in my system. that doesn't mean that if 'acme cable company' comes out with what some responsible reviewers think is 'the best' powercord in the world that i wouldn't think about auditioning it to see if it is,indeed,'the best'.that it might be better does not in any way diminish the quality or potential benefit of the 'emotion' cable to anyone elses' system.this hobby/addiction is about the journey...not the destination.enjoy the ride....the reason the cables on your list 'are not popular' has to do with their price...not the quality..as i assure you if all audiophiles could afford the purist 'dominus' they probably would try it....they may not like it or others in that price range but they would try it...ps: to that list i would add the pranawire 'cosmos' cables...give alan kafton at audioexcellenceaz.com a mail ...you can try them free if you are interested in trying what are among a handful of audio cables that can be called 'the best'

Calloway, was there any significant burn-in time for your emotion power cords? I have three pairs on loan, so to speak, not sure I like everything about what I'm hearing so far.

Calloway,

"as i assure you if all audiophiles could afford the purist 'dominus' they probably would try it"

Just curious how you can speak with such authority as to "assure" us about anything. I can "assure" you that I can afford any cable on this page or on any page in the Cable Forum. The fact that I have no interest in trying PAD, KS, Pranawire, etc. to date has nothing to do with price, but everything to do with being satisfied with my system at the moment. Combine that with the fact that as I matured from childhood I learned that the lastest, greatest toy was ultimately no more enjoyable than the one before it, it was only new and different. The evidence was a closet full of toys seldom played with whenever something new came along.

I am happy for you that you enjoy the hobby as you do and if that involves changing components often ... then more power to you. But you can drop the snobbery down a notch or two. I don't think you can make such far-reaching and psychic statements of fact as to pretend to know what everyone's motivations are regarding cable choice. I am sure many here have various and sundry reasons why they don't try every "world-beater" cable that comes along. I know what my reasons are and they have nothing to do with money.

The truth to Judy's post is that there is hype to virtually everything here. Just look at how dead the ARC Ref2 Mk II is now that the Ref 3 is out. Or the incredible Tenor amps and Kharma speakers that we do not hear much about anymore now that the Dartzeel electronics and huge Von Schweikert speakers have taken the world by storm. And what happened to the Linn CD-12? The hype here is gone with the DCS and EMM products doing digital like none of us ever heard analog. And the list goes on.

The point of this thread was not about hype but whether or not the Kubala-Sosna cables were worth the effort to make a serious audition. And I think a number of people here have suggested to the poster of this thread that these cables are indeed worthy of this.

Garebear: Interesting that you mentioned NBS. I ran with these for over 5 years and enjoyed them immensely. But with the sound of my system going in new directions, they no longer sonically fit well with all the changes; there's simply too much of a good thing (midrange warmth) with them in my current system. In the future they just might work mighty fine again.

John

Gentlemen, perhaps you should pay attention to what has actually been written. The original poster asked three questions. 1) "Why aren't these cables more widely used by us audiophiles....???" 2)"Am I missing something ?????" 3)"Are they just the flavor of the month cable ????" I think his main question relates to the first question he asked. Why aren't these cables more widely used? I can think of a few reasons. 1) It's expensive 2) It's not widely distributed 3)It's relatively new on the market

That's pretty much what you missed as posters here have answered your third question, that is the cables are good cables that are worthy of more owners.

Oh and Calloway said "probably would try". So Fiddler, he did leave a bit of room for guys like you. But I agree with some of your points. I personally would love to try the cables, but swapping cables in and out are a hassle to me. And I'm cheap, so I would hate to even pay for shipping just to try them out. Of course, many here try out stuff by actually buying them and selling them for practically the same price later. I'm not much of a tester. I prefer to get something good and stick with it.

Personally, I think many audiophiles can be happy with many different gear choices and cable. When in doubt, popularity does help to sway you one way or another I think.

Answer #1, the company is two years old and building a dealer network. Expense could be an issue, but they have five lines, so I doubt it's that.

Answer #2, in my opinion yes, your missing something if you have not tried them.

Answer #3, I hope not.

I'm tired of having to re-cable because of advancements in cable technology. Remember ten years ago it was lamp cord or Monster Cable. These new companies are here because of a better understanding of how signals are transferred and how different materials affect the signal. Ten years ago recommending Teflon??? Why, so the eggs don't stick?

Sadly, as anything quickly developing (computers, Plasma TV, LED, HD...) advances change the bar. It looks like flavor of the month, if you choose to look at it like that. I prefer to think were moving forward, and finally hearing our electronics.

This may in the end not be what some are looking for in that they might not want to actually hear their equipment. K-S cables are very neutral and very revealing of what your equipment is doing. Valhalla broke long unobtainable barriers, but in reflection they had weaknesses. Did I chase the flavor of the month, yes if four years is too fast to turn over.

I personally love the K-S cables, and because they are so clean and neutral I can now hear other cables, and find a balance if I determine my system has weaknesses that can be augmented by a more colored cable. This is a break through in my mind...

jd

I tried the K-S emotions in my system with mixed results. Ultimatley, my stereovox reference were better IN MY SYSTEM. In my all-tubed system, the K-S was too laid back and rolled-off, and booooring - simple as that. Despite the clever name, I was not 'emotionally' involved in the music.

On the other hand, I found the power cord to be a nice 'balancer' in my system, running along-side the more open/revealing/faster Electraglide Epiphany X's. The K-S provided a bit more body and just a bit of warmth, without losing much in the way of information.

I know and trust JD and Jafox, and in their systems, to their ears, the K-S emotion line is a fine fit - just not my cup of tea. I suspect I would get similar sound IN MY SYSTEM from the much cheaper Cardas Golden Cross.

Oneprof - your thoughts? Did you try these on the Berning or AA Capitole??

they are pretty good but the upper end models are very $$$$$. they do work well with bat gear...

my personal fave is xlo signature2..i have tried a lot of ic's over the years and they are still my reference- very transparent with incredible resolution at the frequency extremes...

Artg is a good buddy but the reference to Cardas Golden Cross is just crazy. I know CGC very well as I owned a lot of it for a few years before I changed to all NBS Statement. Having to go back to CGC now, with its poor coverage at the frequency extremes, overly warm midrange and a mediocre resolution would be next to impossible. The CGC is one of the most colored cables on the planet. And this alone makes it almost the polar opposite of the K-S product line.

OK, John, maybe it was a bit extreme a comparison, a bit of hyperbole sometimes helps make a point.......

Well i just bought a pair of the imagination interconnects.They have not arrived yet.I will let it be known later how they sound.And hype; YES there is hype; But also cables do make a difference.Without some hype, we would have no products to buy.And some people do not know how to listen.Some only hear.I think the rep of this company is growing.

IMO: Kubala-Sosna builds quality products although one could argue about their prices I suppose. But, just like everything in this crazy sport, their products are system dependent. I understand that they might not be the best choice for an already laid-back system. In the right system they might be just the ticket.

My cables just arrived.Give me a week to listen and i will comment on them.A word, if i do not like them i will place them up for sale.

they are a limited bandwidth rolled off colored sounding cable. not at all tranparent to the source. some people might like how it sounds in their systems , but neutral they are not.

Define your interpretation of band width,and not at all transparent to the source please. I am not bashing you,just trying to gain information.And what components did you hook up to?

There in no such a thing as the best but there are always fanatics like Ebm.

I had some expirience in compare KS and Stealth.
Stealth Dream power cable is better than any KS.
But Elation interconnect was better than Indra in my system.
Speaker cables I use Elation, but didn't compare with Stealth.
Digital I have Varidig Sextet which is still warming up.
KS emotion digital was not good enough for me.
At the end Elation interconnect and speaker are trully reference cables.
Digital still searching...

Murataltuev...If you are searching for the best digital cable I would recommend giving a listen to the MIT Oracle MA-X. I have both the Sextet and the MIT and, in my room, it's not even close. I searched through many digital cables to get here (including the KS) and feel confident this is the best to my ears.

I work at a dealer that sells the KS Emotion cables, and compared to all other brands we sell, they are rolled off on the top, and not as open sounding, they lack low level detail compared to the others. they tend to round off and warm up the sound of the systems they are hooked to. in a brighter or thinner sounding system they can balance things out a bit, but they still sound colored to my ear. We cary ARC , wilson , Arye, Wadia, Belcanto , Atmasphere, Magnapan, Sonus Fabre, Vandersteen, just to name a few brands, so I have heard the KS with lots of different gear. If YOU like how they sound, then they are good cables, for you in your system.

Ok,i have been listening to my cables for a week or so.the transient response is smoothe as silk.This is a very quick cable.Musical attack is very well defined.There is a small bit of low end roll off,but nothing that you can not live with.Both mid range,and highs are well defined in the fore front.Only the extreme back ground presentation is found to be a little thin.Over all a very nice sounding cable considering this is the entry level offering in the K B line up.

I tried a whole system set up of KS Emotion cables sent to me by a dealer for demo.
I was not pleased with them. The highs were muted and everything sounded syrupy. My opinion is that they seem to be designed as a midrange cable, perhaps for systems that need to define that area.

After the dealer got them back and listeded to them he also agreed on my discription of the sound. He said they may have been defective and offered to send another set.

I cant see how cables could be defective, so I declined listening to them again.

I agree about Emotion.
But Elation is completely another story!
Emotion is muddy in compare with Elation!
Elations are very expensive, but I don't know better cables.
I compared interconnects with Echole, Odin, Indra and will compare soon with Argento SMREE.
Only power cable is not good. Odin and Argento are much better!

Any of you guys still using KS cables/cords? Moved on to a better brand?

Happy Listening!

I have one Elation (incl Furu-50 NCF connectors). I tested it only for transport/DAC. Elation is a little more interesting than the SR Atm X3, but the difference is in the nuances. I use JPS Aluminata for transport and SR Galileo for DAC, and it's much better.

STEALTH overpriced with 0 resale in USA don't buy them.

@jafant   I've tried so many cables, some uber expensive, over the years it makes my head spin. That's because when I get bored with my system cables are one of the first changes I make. That is, until I learned to put my money into better electronics! One of the best cables I owned was the Nordost Tyr2.  I now use Zavfino Fusion XLR interconnects and they do everything well.  A very clear, balanced, and well built cable from a small company that seems to know what they are doing.  The best part is that these cables are relatively inexpensive compared to some of the other top end cables I have tried and liked such as Cardas Clear, WireWorld Gold Eclipse, and Nordost Tyr2.  While I've never tried them, K-S cables have a great reputation.  I've heard them in systems much better than my own.  My advice to you is find a good solid performer that gets out of the way of the music and get off the cable merry-go-round.  Your money is better spent on upgrading source, electronics and music. 

@jafant I guess I am pretty late to the Kubala-Sosna party, but this past July I switched the speaker cables and interconnects in my system to that brand and am quite pleased.  I auditioned the Emotion, Sensation, Elation! and Realization lines, eventually settling on the Realization, which I found to give what I consider a nice organic sound.  They replaced my Kimber KS6065 speaker cables and some interconnects that a friend of mine makes.  I also auditioned Cardas Clear Beyond speaker cables but in the end the Realizations were more to my taste.

jc4659

Thank You for the Zavfino Fusio XLR suggestion. I concur about Cabling that simply allows the Music to play. Certainly, Cardas, Nordost and WW are all Top contenders.


Happy Listening!

reynolds853

Me as well, as I have not heard nor spent time with KS offerings.
I do not have local representation. Whom is your dealer/retailer ?

I have heard Cardas Clear Beyond. Can you elaborate on the sonic differences between Cardas and KS ?

I am looking for ultimate resolution (micro/macro dynamics) in Cables/cords without any sacrifice.

Happy Listening!