Jazz for aficionados

Back to 73" with the great Larry Young, on his own this time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bq1wI-A9eSI

acman3,

Whoa, Larry Young?  Who?  Never heard of the guy and now I'm scrambling to find a copy of this. 

Thank you!

Bob

The Frogman:

BBC News just reported that many items from the Duke Ellington estate are being auctioned off in NYC.   Includes Clothing and Music scores.  His piano is expected to go for a cool million.   Better hurry!

Cheers

Alex, thank you for the introduction to Ganelin Trio. I agree with your description; impressive musicians. I previously commented that "free jazz" sometimes is no more than bs masquerading as jazz; these players definitely do not fall into that category. Impressive interplay and musical intuition; all with a uniquely and subtle ethnic (non-American) slant, as it should be. In its way, very soulful. I’m sure it doesn’t come as a surprise that I don’t feel that fusion is a dead end at all; and the notion is, as you say, only a theory. If the discussion continues I think you may reconsider. You pose a very interesting question. I will offer some thoughts when I have more time.

Acman3, great clips all; thanks.  I've been a fan of Makowics for some time; very interesting player.  Larry Young; monster player.  This has been one of my all time favorite records; amazing lineup:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLOL4BdmfT02hjS1WELDBOEr4Nk37kqI7O&v=vJ3c3kj2t_A

Fast forward to 1973 (again):

Yet another Miles alum in one of the most interesting fusion projects of that period:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kkS6puZXfhU

Duke's piano:

Thanks for the heads up.  I think I'll pass; I already have Basie's and my wife would kill me since I'm holding out for Cecil Taylor's.  I think you'll like this:

Cecil Taylor in 1973:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RSv0uR-uupU

Larry Young:

I have the CD UNITY.  I never thought of it as Fusion.  Just goes to show that maybe I don't know fusion when i hear it. :)

Cheers

It's not fusion; I was yanking your chain.  But, you still don't know fusion when you hear it; obviously.  So, you didn't pan Taylor, does this mean you actually like it?  There might be hope yet 😕

The name for the day is Trilok Gurtu; he is a very interesting individual who has collaborated with a number of master jazz musicians. Without a doubt, he is one of the most innovative percussionist around; not only that, but he can work in a lot of different grooves; here he is with his own trio. I don't know what this gal is singing, but I like it.


            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtI91wVr6vs



"The Magic of Drums" with Airto Moreira, and Trilok; and this is just the beginning of what Trilok can do.



            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISj_X-qgyj8




Enjoy the music.


               

1974:

The genre is really hitting its stride about now.  Dave Liebman and Lookout Farm release what is one of the greatest records in the genre.  Liebman is probably the most soulful of all the post-Coltrane tenor players.  Miles alum as well as of the great band with Elvin Jones in which he was paired with fellow tenor player Steve Grossman.  Imo, anyone who doesn't think this is jazz (fused or not) needs professional help (I'm booked up):

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=svDy-H0O90M

With Chick Corea and Herbie Hancock dominating the piano scene in the genre, Steve Khun was a somewhat lesser known player; but highly inventive.  Steve Swallow on bass and the great Jack DeJohnette on drums.  One of the first recordings which would define the label ECM's "house sound":

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PL18yhXvkVdCDkFoebEdbRjFBsyy9riS5L&params=OAFIAVgD&v=ngYi7G...

"Soul" comes in different flavors and to try to define it strictly based on one's inevitably limited palette and frame of reference is foolish.  John Abercrombie is an interesting player in that his music can sound intellectual, but has its own brand of deep soulfulness.  Unique guitar sound:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLiddD2xaVE9NXE73cEAcdsh9SUkaBQlAd&params=EAEYATgBSAFYA2ILNU5tN...

Frogman, you've touched my 'weak spot' which is ECM and which is most of my jazz collection. ECM mostly records innovative and creative musicians, but vast portion of my heart leans towards Carla Bley that mostly appears on WATT label which is again part of ECM. Almost all of my personal records of Carla Bley have her signature taken during her live performances 

Rok, who does this remind you of?


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bF5yqfaYVw



Enjoy the music.

***** I don't know what this gal is singing, but I like it.*****

Don't feel bad, she probably doesn't know either.

***** Rok, who does this remind you of? *****

Bits of a lot of people, but I am too senile to remember who.  Nice rap.

I listened to all the posted 'tunes' from everyone.  I have decided that,
As Chief of Unwashed Jazz Police, I hereby place all of you under arrest for impersonating Jazz Aficionados.

I am reminded of a scene from the remake of 'Tinker, Tailor, Solider, Spy'.   The Soviets capture this British Spy and 'interrogate' him by strapping him in a chair and placing headphones on his head.  No beatings, no pulling fingernails, no truth serum,  no threats.

When they took the phones off, he told them everything he even thought he knew.  
According to the CIA, The KGB did buy a lot of Fusion.  Just saying.

Cheers

Carlos Santana is one of my favorite artists, and when I mentioned him before, I was trying to establish the mood of the early seventies by naming other artists in different genres who were popular. I know when I visited some of my other friends who were jazz aficionados, they also had the latest "Carlos Santana". Here's another Santana I like a lot;


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_YsoCDrnH4


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrWqli5cq1E



Enjoy the music.

Rok, I forgot, you never met Miles aunt Corine.


Enjoy the music.

Now the 70's are really coming back to me; Jazz, what's that? How about this;

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ouMaLRth-s


            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CV3Al6CdmUQ



Git down Charley Brown



          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihDYK12WMG4



Enjoy the music

If you guys insist on straying off the R-Word, at least have a little fun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_LN3XEcnw

Cheers

During the 70's, there was no "you-tube" to help you decide what records to buy,consequently, you depended on music reviews, or recommendations from other people; the music reviews could explain how I got all these ECM records.

I had gotten tired of buying "crappy" records I didn't like by known artists even; it was a real crap shoot, because you couldn't take records back. That's when I began going with what I had heard, or the most consistent artist. Santana was certainly consistent, and sometime he included known jazz artists, like Alice Coltrane, but today I'm more in the mood for something more current by Santana; like "Blues For Salvador".


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xxr3-CBams&list=PL5wKk_oSFx1VL0aYDSHiOSOSRtQikam9Y&index=2



  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVeFsfOwCa8&list=PL5wKk_oSFx1VL0aYDSHiOSOSRtQikam9Y&index=5



Santana was a heck of a lot more consistent than jazz at that time; I had spent too much money for saying WTF after the first cut.



Enjoy the music.

Rok, I don't know about the mambo, but I'm sure ready for the "Lambada". Maybe a little bit of both.


  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwoK0u52Tw4


I think I got spring fever.



Enjoy the music

O-10:

Today I Received the Donald Byrd replacement set.  much better packing this time.   Also the Grant Green / Sonny Clark set,   Marvis Staples' "We'll Never Turn Back" that was posted by The Frogman, and Ellington's "Latin America Suite".   Will report later.

Cheers

It seems that I was into everything except jazz in the 70's; apparently "Shadowfax" is another group I was into.


      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQY0rA5W574



      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AMyjWL81_c




What say you about this music?



Enjoy the music.

Hard to keep up with the scintillating discussion here, so if you’ll pardon this potential non-sequitur, I thought I’d add a little more fuel to the fusion fire (lest it peter out). Frogman might enjoy this if no one else (though I hope others do). Give a listen to two Andy Summers recordings that possibly qualify as good "fusion"...(or not).

Green Chimneys - The Music of Thelonius Monk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53jApHNHKdM&list=PLPysN17izwa2L03L9h3XUYbltlzpQVPM9

Andy Summers - Peggy’s Blue Skylight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53jApHNHKdM&list=PLPysN17izwa2L03L9h3XUYbltlzpQVPM9

Shadowfax:

Liked them both.  I think I had some of this on LP back in the day.  I used to give all the LPs I was not too fond of to friends when I PCS'd.

The images were not even necessary, the music stood on its own merit.

And you accuse me of living in the past!  I had all but forgotten these guys.

Cheers

Rok, while you were listening, I was reading about Carlos Santana and Leon Thomas; very interesting story.



      http://www.freeform.org/music/jazzsupreme/leon.thomas/santana.html





        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qp3jDl2t1kw



Enjoy the music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uy31fe40Rg4&list=RDuy31fe40Rg4#t=370

Listen to all the tracks.  This is great stuff.  Great video and audio.   Check Gene Harris at 0:50 on "Things Ain't What They Used To BE".  He sits like a choir boy, hands on knees while Morrison is soloing, then he nods his head and then breaks into this big smile.  I love that stuff.

Cheers

Rok, I want the low down on whatever you've finished listening to.


Enjoy the music.

You guys are killing me!  I've been working 10-12 hours a day for the past couple of months.  I come home, land here, listen to music and go to bed.  Geez, o10 cost me almost 45 minutes with one post. (Trilok Girtu)

Thank you all.  I've been listening to all the recent clips; found some new stuff I need to buy and visited some old friends, (Cecil Taylor). 

Saw these guys at around this time, they started the gig like they'd been rehearsing for days.  It was off the charts and the first time I was lucky enough to hear Bill Summers. 

Herbie Hancock, Spank a Lee

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWgrzmF-34Q

-- Bob

***** Rok, I want the low down on whatever you've finished listening to.*****

I played  Mavis Staples first.  It's hard to listen to Jazz while watching the game, thought this one would be easier.

One of the few CDs I have purchased in recent memory that was totally unsatisfactory.   I hate it.  This woman needs to enter the 21st century.   She is still whining about picking cotton.  Good grief.  Not that she has ever been within 100 miles of a cotton field.

"Down in Mississippi where I was born" a line from the opening track.  But, wiki says she was born in Chicago.   She is self absorbed.  It's all about her.  She sings a lot of traditional songs, but she sings them as if they are HER life story.  Not the story of a people.

Hard to get into songs that insinuate that Katrina was the fault  of white people.  I guess primitive uneducated people think white folks have unlimited power.   They control nature.  I think that's the preserve of The Good Lord.  They should be praying The Lord does not send Katrina 2.0 to finish them off.

Well recorded, but the effort was wasted of this claptrap.  I recommend this strictly for Kool-Aid drinkers.

Cheers

Sorry for the rant, but I take all things Mississippi personally.

BTW, were any white folks affected by Katrina?  I know, Bay St Louis, Mississippi, where Katrina made landfall was completely destroyed.  Nothing left.   Nothing.  No one seems to be aware of that.   Guess they didn't whine loud enough.

Ghosthouse and jzzmusician, thanks for the clips.  I enjoyed the Andy Summers clips and I always enjoyed his work with The Police.  I look forward to more clips from you.

jzzmusician, I love that Herbie Hancock clip.  I posted that very clip about two years ago (!); thanks for bringing it back and for keeping the timeline.  Two years ago, I seem to recall that the only response it got from the clu......ahem....purists, was a comment about Herbie's shoes.  Personally, I dig Bennie Maupin's suspenders the best 😊.  Maupin is one of the funkiest saxophone players ever; deserving of more recognition.  

I must say that I find it very ironic, but not surprising, that the entire genre "fusion" is being panned by some, yet what is being posted is newer Santana with its cheesy synth sounds and formulaic compositional and production values, and New Age (!!) Shadowfax (!!!!).  Seriously?  To each his own I guess; no point arguing about it.  Importantly, as I knew was the case and contrary to recent assertion, there is much more than zero interest in fusion.  

Ray Brown:  good jazz players.  But, geez, how many times does a person need to hear those same tunes.  What are these guys saying that hasn't been said a thousand times before?  My definition of (and to quote our resident New Age aficionado) "stereotypical jazz".  I am left with the question, why?

1975 next.

*****   But, geez, how many times does a person need to hear those same tunes.  What are these guys saying that hasn't been said a thousand times before?  *****

Strange comments from a Classical player.  Remember it the next time you play Mozart, or Beethoven, or Bach, or............    well you get the drift.

Cheers

Rok, this is what went out of Scott AFB when the Tsunami hit in the Indian ocean.


        http://www.af.mil/News/ArticleDisplay/tabid/223/Article/135288/amc-aircraft-people-support-tsunami-r...


I couldn't care less what Mavis Staples is talking about, but it wasn't Katrina, it was the Aftermath in New Orleans. I was stationed at Scott in the reserves as a "loadmaster", I know what a C5A can carry; Scott was 2 hours from New Orleans. Lewis Armstrong International was dry, no problem landing a C5A.


    This occurred eight months before the "Katrina" disaster. The Indian Ocean is half way around the world from Scott AFB, and New Orleans was two hours flight time from Scott. While the city was flooded, Louis Armstrong International remained dry and able to receive air traffic. C5A's are really huge aircraft, and just one flight complete with food, water, hospital staff, and rescue personnel, plus the ability to coordinate all military resources in that area; would have solved New Orleans problems, and all it took was one phone call from the White House.





  KATRINA TIMELINE
By ThinkProgress on Sep 6, 2005 at 11:53 pm

Sunday, August 28
APPROXIMATELY 30,000 EVACUEES GATHER AT SUPERDOME WITH ROUGHLY 36 HOURS WORTH OF FOOD [Times-Picayune]


Monday, August 29
— KATRINA MAKES LANDFALL AS A CATEGORY 4 HURRICANE [CNN]

7:30 AM CDT — BUSH ADMINISTRATION NOTIFIED OF THE LEVEE BREACH: The administration finds out that a levee in New Orleans was breached. On this day, 28 “government agencies, from local Louisiana parishes to the White House, [reported that] that New Orleans levees” were breached. [AP]

11:13 AM CDT – WHITE HOUSE CIRCULATES INTERNAL MEMO ABOUT LEVEE BREACH: “Flooding is significant throughout the region and a levee in New Orleans has reportedly been breached sending 6-8 feet of water throughout the 9th ward area of the city.” [AP]

8PM CDT — GOV. BLANCO AGAIN REQUESTS ASSISTANCE FROM BUSH: “Mr. President, we need your help. We need everything you’ve got.” [Newsweek]

LATE PM — BUSH GOES TO BED WITHOUT ACTING ON BLANCO’S REQUESTS

Tuesday, August 30

U.S.S. BATAAN SITS OFF SHORE, VIRTUALLY UNUSED: “The USS Bataan, a 844-foot ship designed to dispatch Marines in amphibious assaults, has helicopters, doctors, hospital beds, food and water. It also can make its own water, up to 100,000 gallons a day. And it just happened to be in the Gulf of Mexico when Katrina came roaring ashore. The Bataan rode out the storm and then followed it toward shore, awaiting relief orders. Helicopter pilots flying from its deck were some of the first to begin plucking stranded New Orleans residents. But now the Bataan’s hospital facilities, including six operating rooms and beds for 600 patients, are empty.” [Chicago Tribune]

Wednesday, August 31

SUPERDOME; CONDITIONS DETERIORATE: “A 2-year-old girl slept in a pool of urine. Crack vials littered a restroom. Blood stained the walls next to vending machines smashed by teenagers. ‘We pee on the floor. We are like animals,’ said Taffany Smith, 25, as she cradled her 3-week-old son, Terry. … By Wednesday, it had degenerated into horror. … At least two people, including a child, have been raped. At least three people have died, including one man who jumped 50 feet to his death, saying he had nothing left to live for. There is no sanitation. The stench is overwhelming.”" [Los Angeles Times, 9/1/05]


3,000 STRANDED AT CONVENTION CENTER WITHOUT FOOD OR WATER: “With 3,000 or more evacuees stranded at the convention center — and with no apparent contingency plan or authority to deal with them — collecting a body was no one’s priority. … Some had been at the convention center since Tuesday morning but had received no food, water or instructions.” [Times-Picayune


      They remembered all of those resources that were directed out of Scott Air Force Base, Ill, for people half way around the world in the Indian Ocean; but they forgot they had them for the citizens of New Orleans, which was only two hours flight time from Scott.

Rok, you have a very poor memory, SANTANA is not fusion, nor was that intended to represent FUSION, I like Santana, and Shadowfax better than some fusion OK. (or maybe it is fusion, ask Frogman)


Enjoy the music.

****Strange comments from a Classical player. Remember it the next time you play Mozart, or Beethoven, or Bach, or............ well you get the drift.****

Actually, Rok, it’s not a strange comment at all. It’s a comment heard often among players and would be heard even more often if ALL that classical players were to play were music from one period; one of the reasons for musical diversity in orchestras’ programming. What makes the difference is that orchestras program not just Mozart, Beethoven and Bach, but also Stravinsky, Bartok, Schoengerg, Lutoslowski, Adams.......well, you get the drift.

What perhaps I wasn't clear about and what I meant with ****what are those guys saying that hasn't been said a thousand times before?**** is that it's not just the tune choice but how they are being played.  Of course, its always possible to play a very familiar tune and a new and unexpected way.  In that sense, Kleiber's Beethoven's 5th is completely different from Klemperer's.

Czarivey, glad you enjoyed those clips.  ECM is a fantastic label with some of the best production standards.  Amazing catalogue of well recorded and very interesting music.  More to come.

@frogman
As requested..
A link to Andy’s very good "Earth + Sky". Unfortunately not the entire album - something of a playlist mix - but you can tell the tracks that are from E+S by the album cover. I hold Andy’s post-Police solo work in high regard. Piece by piece collecting a good bit of that portion of his ’oeuvre’.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28plEPacLZs&list=PL8F0DF9DDF60D2980

Unlike Green Chimneys and Peggy’s Blue Skylight, that are interpretations of music by Monk and Mingus, respectively, the compositions on E+S are Summers own.

By the way, I certainly agree with your favorable opinion of the ECM label...as you say, interesting music and typically very well recorded - great sonics. My first experience with ECM was a Ralph Towner LP I borrowed from the local library years ago. Knew nothing about him or the label at the time. Fortuitous. My buying habits lean mainly to CDs but I enjoy looking for good condition, used ECM vinyl.

Hope you enjoy Earth + Sky.

I never knew the political chain of RESPONSIBILITY ran directly from the 9th ward to the white House.

Now, we all know the local politicians were stupid, criminal and totally incompetent.  But, the locals knew that when they voted them in office.  They were good at being liberal pawns and good for blasting conservatives on TV, and fooling the poor folks in New Orleans into thinking they were working for them,  but totally useless in a crisis.

Where were the cops and the firemen and the local emergency personnel. Right, It was every man for himself.  It was, and is, a very CORRUPT city.

Who told all these people to go to the Super-dome?   What provisions were made there?  Why weren't they evacuated before the storm hit?   Where was the Governor and the Louisiana National Guard?   Natural disasters are right up their alley.

Katrina didn't just fall out of the sky one clear and beautiful day.  Everyone had plenty of warning.  Every forecast listed New Orleans as a possible target.  What did the local 'leaders' do to prepare?   They put ten school buses on 'standby'!!!!  You may now laugh or cry.

Some real facts:
New Orleans is still 10 feet below sea level.
The Gulf Of Mexico is still there
Hurricanes still form every year
Katrina made landfall in Mississippi as a cat 3 storm, it just slapped New Orleans on the way to Mississippi.

If a cat 5 storm hits New Orleans head on, there will be no more New Orleans.  When that happens, all the locals can do is hope a Republican is in the White House, so they will have someone to blame.

BTW, It seems as if Local politics have taken a new direction since the people realized how they were played.  Good For Them.

Cheers

Rok your first allegiance is to the Constitution of the United States, not to some criminal politicians in high price suits in Washington who no more respect the constitution than they do you and me. While crack addicts, and heroin addicts are addicted to dope, those politicians are addicted to MONEY, and whether you believe it or not "freeway Rickey" would be free if he had paid his dues to the people he was suppose to pay them to, and that's just a grain of sand on a huge mountain.

Who paid for Scott AFB and every plane on it? Who paid for the USS Bataan? Who Paid your salary while you were in the military? How much benefit did those citizens of New Orleans get out of the taxes they paid, and their ancestors paid. Those people paid for the USS Bataan, and they were entitled to benefit from it's use, as well as everything else that belongs to "Citizens of the United States of America"

The people where the Tsunami hit were not even citizens of this country; what entitled them to the benefits they received? Rok, your allegiance is not to criminals in expensive suits but to the United States Constitution.

This country as you believe it to be, has not existed since Charley Chan was a government officer. (Frogman, I know Charley Chan is fiction, but the fact that government agencies functioned like they were suppose to function is the point I'm trying to get across, please don't post that "Charley Chan is fiction)


I, Rok_____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).


Think about the oath of allegiance and what is the first thing you defend.

Don’t worry, I am well aware that CC was fiction. Besides, your statement contains other far more important fiction to comment on. I’m staying out of this one for now, so please leave me out of it. For the time being, I’d much rather post about fusion than fiction; 1975 is burning a whole in my iPad ☺️

Frogman, you can not throw a rock, and say you want to avoid a fight; please point out the fiction in what I said, because I believed every word to be the gospel truth, or I would not have said it.


Enjoy the music.

O-10, I have no doubt that you believe every word and that you would not have said it otherwise.  I keep hoping that you will understand that it is always you that throws the first rock.  Try not throwing the first rock and you'll see how nicely everyone can get along.  😘

1975:

Fusion being what it is highlights what I think can be a subtle but still important distinction between the players: those that came to fusion mainly from the rock side of things and those that came to it from the jazz side.  To my ears Jeff Beck, besides being a rock guitar God, is the most credible in fusion of all the other rock players who went to the genre.  Amazing player with a very wide range of expression and what a tone!  Classic record:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLkCed3Lm7kme8h_-86GoEsZMNGV3bDxVh&v=LzJ2WA-ubMM

The Brecker Brothers release their debut album as a band.  Consummate musicians who would be very influential in the evolution of the playing styles on their respective instruments.  Coltrane inspired tenor playing and Miles infused electric trumpet playing in very interesting compositions:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MX3YpPpBydE

The next two records and two of my favorites from 1975 demonstrate how the lines between jazz and fusion, attempts at designation in general, can get blurred.  I'm really torn about what to call them, besides simply really good music.  I think they are unequivocally jazz, but also capture the spirit of the new genre: 

Pat Metheny releases his debut solo record with the great Jaco Pastorius on electric bass:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eciUMTPmzm0

One of of my favorite unsung trumpet players:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hSAeK1zJOfc

Ramsey Lewis-

We have all heard the thingy -- "A Face That Only A Mother Could Love"..

In the same vein, We can now add -- "Music That Only A Musician Could Love".

Cheers

Pat Metheny:

Slammed by Marsalis in the same sentence in which he slammed Miles.

Coming from Wynton, it cannot be ignored.

Cheers

The Brecker Brothers:

Virtuosic Funk ?   Loved it.  And they have managed to avoid the dreaded Wrath of Wynton.

Cheers

Jeff Beck:

Great ROCK guitarist.  The best ever.

Cheers

Guys,
I, too defend the U.S. Constitution at all costs. This is the only thing that separates us from the Communist! Hint: we do have many communist in our USA.

Now, back to the Jazz discussion at hand;
why did Marsalis slam Miles and Pat? Over what subject matter?