I can run a speaker run as usual to each speaker and then from 1st set of left channel speaker just run from + to + and - to - negative of second set of speakers so I am running a long jumper. And do the same for right channel of course. This should give me a parallel wiring and now amp will be pushing 4ohms..
I need to finish my 2nd pair of OLAs with the final network (Rev2 Original Large Advent Crossover by Pete Basel).
My original pair with Auricap XO electrolytic replacements and 22AWG stranded ohno internal wire (double runs to woofer) are sublime on 10” stands and the painted black grill baffles in place 👍
Its very dynamic...again just different and understandably not a 1 size (should) fits all.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Well only as of 2 yrs ago, was I aware of this double stack thing at my tech's house, has a double room with 14 ft ceilings for his stacked AR3's, it worked, but again, I longggg ago left behind that paper cone midwoofer sound.
It is dynamic, but with baggage. I only want,~~ DEMAND~~~ pure 100% neutrality. My Seas Thors were pure neutral, but with a 87db (IF THAT!!) sens, made them sadly ineffective = inefficient vs a WBer's 95db. (which is too high for my needs)
Again both tech geeks love their vintage stacks. Neither would have zero interest in WBers. each his own I guess.
Ishkabible, are you stacking one speaker on top of another?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Yes this is a new fad. Works great
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Don't listen to the audiophile BS that is spewed here by the ones that say vintage speakers cant compare to modern technology. its nothing but lies.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I know 2 tech geeks, both stack vintage The 1 stacked Acoustic Research AR3;s, he LOVED the sound. Not bad, pretty giood actually, But can not compete with my stacked highend WBers, So yes it is true a few old Vintage like AR3's, Advent (maybe) but surely the old Philips 3 way 476's witha midrange are very acceptable as quality sound.
As much as i adored my old philps 475 2 ways witha 8 inch woofer and a superior tweeter, it was no match for the Seas Thors. If I had double stacked the 475's, maybe it would have beena better sound.. But then had i doubale stacked the thors, agaain, it would blow away the Old Philips,. A few vintage speakers are indeed superior to many modern speakers, This I agree. But its not awalys the case.
My WBers will blow awasy any and every vintage for alot less money.\ Good vintage speakers now over hard to find and prices are going up.
and oh the iother Tech geek stacks Philips witha 10 inch woofer and the same tweeter as in the 475 he also stacks Radio Shak Nova 7's,.
He loves both. They sound ok, and impressive. But I'm looking for more db sensitivity. Old vinatage like all xover speakers uffer from low db sens. Now thats a fact.
I have a stacked set of 1974 Large Advents that I love the sound. I had the pleasure of knowing a design engineer at the Advent company and he told me to remove the foam inserts and fill with a certain amount of insulation, He also showed me how to re-inforce the cabinet inside with supports that really cut down the resonance inside them. I rebuilt the crossovers with quality parts along with the correct foam surrounds.
I have listened to a lot of $5000 pair modern speakers and my Advents beat the living tar out of them. When people hear my system they cant believe my 40 year plus speakers sound that good.
If you do it correctly vintage speakers can sound really good and you don't need to spend thousands of $$$$ to get good sounding speakers.
Don't listen to the audiophile BS that is spewed here by the ones that say vintage speakers cant compare to modern technology. its nothing but lies.
About ten years ago I took my set of Large Advents (purchased in 1976 when then they first came out) to Van L Speakerworks and John not only re-coned my woofers but upgraded my internal wiring and cross-overs. They are not in my main system-I use them in my basement to play music when I am working out, hooked up to a vintage Sansui Receiver. It is a mistake imho to dismiss these speakers as outdated mid-fi. Granted, mine have been modded slightly but they sound awfully good and compare favorably to many modern era well-regarded speakers I have heard. The liveliness/snap/dynamics associated with rock'n'roll drums and the depth of the midrange is pretty exceptional. One of my favorite CD's to play while working out is The Ass Ponys' "Some Stupid with a Flare Gun" and on which the first and second songs contain some great snare drum/tom-tom sounds. The punch is exceptional through the Advents.
OK, here's to your original question. Yes, you can make a single run of speaker wire to each speaker and then add jumpers to go from the + of that speaker to the + of the stacked speaker, same for minus terminals (actually Advents labeled their terminals 8 ohm and 0 ohm IIRC). That is the appropriate way to do it. The reason I suggested running 14 gauge wire is that I assumed you were making a single run and using jumpers. I would make the jumpers out of high quality speaker wire (14 gauge is fine) and terminate the ends with spades. If you are going to experiment with turning the top speakers around make sure that your jumpers are long enough. I would also suggest terminating the end of the long wire run with spades at the speaker end. I realize that this next point is outside the scope of your question but I would seriously consider replacing the speaker terminals in your amp with good quality 5-way binding posts. On most amps this isn't too difficult.
If people agreed with you and were ecstatic about your stacked double Advents, your attitude would be different for sure. Sometimes you have to take a few hits along the way, but this is part of posting here. You can always ask the administrators to remove your post ( I have in the past ). Remember, this hifi thing brings out the best, and the worst in people, although, no one is intentionally being mean, just being honest. It is never personal, these opinions of ours, based on our own experiences. YMMV. Enjoy ! MrD.
When I was younger and determined to spend only a fixed amount on an audio system I tried rigs like the OP is suggesting. My chief priority was the budget/cost. I was quite confident, but delusional about the potential of such systems. They are fun, but essentially one does not get superior results, just more of the mediocre performance, which is interpreted as vastly superior. The mistake that is then made is thinking that somehow it has leaped into the territory of big gun setups. It hasn't. We don't know the chief motivator for such a setup, but when someone makes a comment that they can achieve better sound than higher priced rigs, often the wallet for whatever reason rules the agenda.
DIY line source type (stacked, double) setups are fun. But, there is a big price paid in terms of overall cleanness, quality/precision of the soundstage, focus on the center image, L/R channel separation, potential comb filtering, and tightness of bass, etc. Basically, while it yields more macrodynamic impact it messes up a lot. As long as the OP realizes that he is giving up some characteristics associated with better sound, who cares? He can mess around with the rig as much as possible. I did lots of experimental rigs and I am very glad I did, as it taught me so much about the potentials and pitfalls of systems.
Our man here may be a System Builder, such as myself. Perhaps he loves recombining gear to see what results. The variety is what fascinates and gratifies me. So, ishkabibil, if you are drawn by curiosity, have at it. But, know this, despite your strong protestations, you will not be moving toward higher quality sound overall. That simply takes better gear and methods - and yes, much more money than such persons may be willing to spend. If they do not hear better gear in their home it is doubtful they will ever be convinced of the efficacy of moving up from others explaining it to them. :)
My point was taken incorrectly. My point was that Henry Kloss designed the finest speaker he could in those days given what he had to work with. It was a GREAT speaker for the times. The issue I am raising is that technology has come a long way since the 1970's--especially in the area of audio--NOT "high-end" audio--just audio. Inexpensive speakers reproduce music more accurately today than many way expensive speakers did back then.
Example: I love driving my '66 Corvette, but my '07 Corolla is a better car. Not prettier, not cooler, not faster, not anything but a better, safer vehicle. Technology has improved the daily transportation vehicle immensely.
While Advent's were good in the day, Fulton 100's were MUCH better in the same time frame and delivered as much bass as was recorded without adding anything. My Fender American Strat sounds nice out of my Fender Hot Rod Deluxe; my Fender Squire Bass, not so much. My Sunn Scepter (1970) and Gretsch 6120 (1957) had a unique sound as well, but not the same as the Fender/Fender sound or even the modern Squire with a couple of Sunn dual-15" cabs and a 200S or Model T head.
My point was that you could enjoy more accurately reproduced sound by going to speakers that have benefited from advances that Mr. Kloss, as good as he was, did not employ as they were not invented at the time he did the Advents.
Look, if you love the Advents you are going to use them. My point remains that you might enjoy the music more if you tried something that incorporates advances in sound reproduction. I don't play the Sunn stuff anymore--I LOVE IT, but at 50+ years old, caps and other electrolytic parts have not benefited from time served and are not reliable. If you have replaced the older electronics in the Advent crossover--changes it, but that's another discussion--and are happy with them, use them. I just wish that you would give more advanced technology a chance--you might be surprised at how reasonable the costs are and how much more accurate the music sounds.
I ran stacked Advents (literally stacked vertically with woofers on bottom) for several years first using a Marantz 2325 then an Adcom GFA 555. They sounded very good overall but had their plusses and minuses. In true budget fashion I built 8" stands out of plywood and concrete blocks to get the bottom speakers off the floor and that helped tighten up the bass. I upgraded to Mirage M3si's which were a big improvement but I still sort of miss those Advents. I love crustycoot1's post. Don't be afraid to experiment with placement and orientation. I never thought of turning the top speaker backwards!. Ironically I upgraded to bipole speakers. This is the kind of project that makes this hobby fun. BTW, you should run at least 14 gauge wire for your main run. Use spade or other connectors at the amp if you have to. Those speakers are going to draw a lot of current.
I experimented with double Advents ( slightly raised off the floor, top pair inverted, and did the same with other speakers as well ), and although " nice ", they are bettered today by a plethora of modern slim towers by Polk, Infinity, Klipsch, Elac, and so many more. More efficient magnet structures, lighter, faster woofer materials, and so on. Not meaning to sound negative, but the Advents are a " yesterday " speaker. Save money and go listen to some newer stuff. YMMV. Enjoy ! MrD.
I remember a day spent with stacked pairs of Large Advents in 1974 at a friend's home where we played them one facing back toward his brick wall, and one firing direct sound forward (the top one). Created a quasi-dipole effect that was captivating. Listened to "Dark Side" and John McLaughlin's "My Goal's Beyond" with great pleasure, especially the McLaughlin. This was with a Phase Linear 400 and an SAE preamp/EQ. Can't recall the phono setup.
I had stacked Advents in my store, then took them home over an extended weekend. On some material they were magical...on others, not so much. Definitely worth a try though!
Yeah, sorry, Lord knows how I got that wrong, especially since I actually went through this recently with my subs. Series 16, parallel 4. Dang. And I had my coffee, can't even use that excuse. Sorry!
@Miller........That is a series wiring which I don't want......
I believe my original post is correct likewise I can run run two wires for each channel from amp but my Carver M200t has those cheap flex terminals that expose minimum gauge see through so I cannot fit two speaker runs per channel as the post is compromised by this design.
@millercarbon : You've got it wrong! Parallel wiring reduces combined impedance to half - two 8 ohm speakers become a 4 ohm load. As the OP stated. Series connection of two 8 ohm speakers doubles the impedance - 16 ohms is the result. This I don't recommend because it will ruin the amplifier's ability to damp the 16 ohm pair! Stick with parallel!
Actually the way you describe it, if I'm reading you right, sounds like parallel which if they are 8 ohm speakers will yield a 16 ohm load. If when you visualize the wire and the terminals it looks like a ladder, that is parallel.
To get a 4 ohm load from two 8 ohm speakers, wire in series. Wire from the amp + goes to first speaker +, then from first speaker - to second speaker +, then from second speaker - all the way back to the amp -.
You must have a verified phone number and physical address in order to post in the Audiogon Forums. Please return to Audiogon.com and complete this step. If you have any questions please contact Support.
