I recently upgraded my Class D amp in my main system from older Bel Canto ref1000m IcePower based (already quite excellent) to a more recent Hypex-based design. Being an engineer myself always with an eye on new legit technical innovations that can move things forward, I was considering the various GaN options as well, including AGD amps I heard in another A’goner’s system, but did not find exactly what I was looking for yet with GaN (based on features more so than sound alone), so tried the Hypex-based product and it is not leaving anytime soon. Meanwhile, will wait to see what else new comes out in next few years, GaN and otherwise, and see what happens then. Several Purifi-based products were also given strong consideration.
Class D Amplification Announcement
After 60 some odd years of disappointment, Class D has finally arrived. As per The Absolute Sound’s Jonathan Valin, the Borrenson-designed Aavik P-580 amp “is the first Class D amplifier I can recommend without the usual reservations. …the P-580 does not have the usual digital-like upper-mid/lower-treble glare or brick wall-like top-octave cut-off that Class D amps of the past have evinced.”
Past designers of Class D and audiophiles, rejoice; Michael Borrenson has finally realized the potential of Class D.
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The Aavik integrated amp mentioned had my interest...very nice..until I saw the price. Not happening for me anytime soon. Top notch sound, at least to meet my requirements, need not cost that much these days thanks to widespread related advances in technology. Were I to take a plunge like that, I would expect support beyond the norm at a minimum to help insure the investment. An unbiased shootout with the competition to maybe help justify the cost would be interesting. But it looks like a boutique type product at least for American consumers and that alone will draw some interest. Especially when everything else prior is purposefully labeled a "disappointment" by the OP. |
Fantastic advice from Atmasphere re making one’s recordings “to know what’s right and what isn’t”. I would include and stress increased attendance to live performances. In that advice is the simple reality that there IS a “right”…..certainly within a narrower spectrum of variability (for various reasons) than that which I hear among many different audio systems, all claimed to be right (“accurate”). |
The sound of a high rez two channel system sounds nothing like live music Three possibilities: -The ‘high rez’ system is not assembled well; it is not well balanced. -Recordings being played are not very good. -The listener is not familiar with the sound of live music. ——— The idea that there can be a high rez system (def: revealing of the recording) that is not well-balanced is, if anything, a contradiction in terms. The qualifier ‘well balanced’ is so vague as to be essentially useless. There is no universal definition as to what constitutes a good recording, other than that it sounds good. The idea that a good recording is supposed to simulate a live performance is simply false for the vast majority of recordings. Whether or not the listener is familiar with the sound of live music (I am) is simply not relevant- neither the recordings nor the equipment is designed to simulate a live performance. Which is as it should be. How much of the music that is consumed these days is comprised of acoustic instruments on a stage, recorded ‘live’? Virtually zero.
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Big +1. Listen to Donald Fagan’s Kamakiriad or Morph the Cat — they were clearly recorded in a studio with absolutely no pretense of sounding at all like live music, so if a system makes them sound “live” it’s manipulating the crap out of the recording and is highly inaccurate. But, as I said earlier, different strokes… |
I do not believe the majority of " audiophiles " know how to listen to music, and are listening to the things that do not correspond to live, unamplified musical performances. Buying an amplifier, to make Nils Lofgren’s guitar ( from Keith Don’t Go, Live ) " sound " a better way....a different way, in tone, in stage location, all from a source that was recorded ( it is done regularly by most ). Music has several key components....rhythm, texture, dynamics, pitch, form and timbre. Admittedly, I have a musical background, and learned about music. I listen to recorded music a particular way, and my low cost system ( compared to others here ), delivers the goods, that pleases me and engages me. |
“…so if a system makes them sound “live” it’s manipulating the crap out of the recording and is highly inaccurate.” I’m reminded of Yes’ album, Close To The Edge. Not the greatest recording, but it very nicely gets the job done. When Rick Wakeman’s church organ comes in, are we meant to believe we’ve been transported to a cathedral? Thankfully, the recording engineer didn’t waste any effort trying to make it sound that way. |
**** The idea that there can be a high rez system (def: revealing of the recording) that is not well-balanced is, if anything, a contradiction in terms. **** Wrong! Most audiophiles with systems that have aspirations of being truly “High End” (high rez) have systems that sound distinctly different from each other. IOW, they are each balanced differently. So, by extension, it can be said that some (most?) are not balanced well. Some are, and it is these that can best reproduce a great recording of live acoustic, or minimally amplified music really well. It is also those systems that can reproduce “Kamakiriad” or “Close to the Edge” with sound closest to what the engineer/producer intended; IOW, sound closest to what is actually on the recording. That sound may not be to the listener’s liking, but it will be closest to what is actually there. **** Whether or not the listener is familiar with the sound of live music (I am) is simply not relevant- neither the recordings nor the equipment is designed to simulate a live performance. **** Wrong on both counts. Telling, the use of the word “designed” in reference to recordings. Many recordings strive to simulate the sound of the performance as it sounded live. Likewise, many of the best audio equipment designers have as their goal getting as close as possible to the sound of live. Just ask them if you get a chance. **** How much of the music that is consumed these days is comprised of acoustic instruments on a stage, recorded ‘live’? Virtually zero.**** With respect, you should get out more often 😊 Cheers.
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Of course it has arrived and not a minute too soon. If this is not announced they won't be able to sell any new boxes. They're going to have to start sending out to some interested parties a test amp so that they can be sampled and thus the good word can be spread. This time they mean it, get ready folks to finally toss out your class A and Class AB amps. |
@phd Ha! You're feeding into the hype! Class A and Class AB will never be obsolete in the second-hand market. Sometimes I wonder if it's not wiser to score a Denon/Yamaha/Pioneer/Onkyo/NAD amp for $100 on the used market and pair that with sufficiently good speakers and call it a day. I might be diverting the conversation towards budget gear and vintage gear. But I would love a comparison between a vintage A/B amp and a cheap China amp using class D. To me the high end is clouded in a veneer of romanticism and craftsmanship. For example people who buy expensive tube amplifiers are not interested in getting the best performance metrics. They're looking for a unique experience. This may explain why some audiophiles have several different amps/speakers/turntables and DACs for different experiences. It's just nice to switch it up. |
I'll only say that if I was searching in the sub $3K integrated category I haven't heard anything that touches the new Technics g700m2. You can drop it into a reference system and call it whatever class of amp you want. I played with the NAD M33 for a while, found it sterile, and moved on. I've also got stuff from Gold Note, Naim, McGary, Backert Labs and Linear Tube Audio in the house and the Technics is no joke on a par. Is presentation different? Sure. But I'll be damned if it isn't difficult to pick a winner. |
@mervo "The LAPC and JENO circuits are real tech." YES! I was playing with the LAPC last night. It's pretty impressive. |
@badgerdms agree on the NAD stuff being sterile. I have had a couple and ended up either selling them or sending them to University with one of my kids. The Cambridge EVO series peaks my interest but at that price I can get the Simaudio ACE and have a nice kit for the garage.
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Okay, okay. I think I may have found a limitation to my cheap-ass class D China amp (Tripath T2024 chip with only 10W of power). And it took me some time because I was mostly listening to my regular music, which is soft rock and acoustic. The amp sounds very nice to me, just warm enough not to be sterile. It’s also more detailed than the previously owned Yamaha RN402. Yoshimatsu: Symphony No 4 is the album which punched me in the gut. I have to crank the volume up to 80% to fill the room. And I feel like I’m still missing a dynamic punch. Is this a limitation of my amp or my speakers (Closer Acoustics Ogy + Rel T5x sub)?
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I've just ordered a Hifimediy TK2050 amplifier board. Check it out. Tripath sound with power!!! You need to add a power supply, input and output terminals, and of course a box (a piece of wood works). There are huge threads about it on diyaudio.com where you can find all build informations. That thing has great components throughout and even has speaker protection relays built-in. I can't wait to build mine!
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