Cartridge Opinions - Sorry

There are a great sounding cartridges mentioned in the thread, but the price/performance of the Hana line is tough to beat.  That’s why they sell so many of them while garnishing many positive reviews.  The Hana assembly line is shared by far more expensive cartridges - seasoned experience and expertise.  

Dear chakster, your skeptical attitude against retips is curious.
First thing is the fact that no manufacturer use their own cantilevers
and styli. Those are produced by big Japanese jewel companies. 
The same apply for repair services. That is to say that retipers
use the same cantiler/styli combos. This part is then glued in the
so called ''joint pipe''. The aluminum part in which cantilever is
glued on which coils are fastened and in which tension wire is
fastened. Together those are moving parts by which one try 
to reduce the moving mass.  Preferably by reducing the coil
wire. To glue the cantilever/stylus combo in the joint pipe is
not ''rocket science''. Why should whatever manufacturer do this
better than an experienced retipper? 

Dear Raul, My point is that questions about ''all carts'' make no
sense. This in contradistinction with particular cartridges. You
own the most carts among us while your capability is to judge
their quality. We all profited from your contributions about 
specific carts. I bought all MM carts which you recommeded 
despite the fact that I prefer MC carts. So, to use you own argument,
we can learn from your knowledge about specific carts. However
this does not apply for your many disputes. 

I fail to understand the purpose of ranking components by value. I see often contentious posts:
Cartridge vs cartridge setup
Cartridge vs cartridge+tonearm

Everything in the audio chain matters.
Do cartridges sound different? Yes
Is a subpar cartridge audible? Yes
Do tonearms affect the sound? Yes
Does platter surfaces affect the sound? Yes
Does platter material affect the sound? Yes
Does....Yes.... you get the picture

The entire audio chain matters. With the exception of those who buy pretty, most of us do a cost/benefit or more specificity a price/performance analysis to evaluate components as 99.9% of us have budgetary constraints (limited bank accounts). When we elevate our audio chains, we look at affordable upticks and address bottlenecks (weak links). If, for example, I continuously upgrade my audio chain with the exception of speakers, it’s likely that my speakers will become my weakest link.

We each have unique audio chains with various strengths/weakness links. Other than starting arguments, what’s the purpose of ranking? Since when does “this is better than that” trump the importance of maximum audio performance by maximizing audio chain components?

Forgive me if I’m reading this wrong, it may be that good to great cartridge setups commonly exists, in @atmasphere experience of “optimum” cartridge setup by others is rare. When you think about a stylus in the groove, is a very minuscule stylus/diamond tilt audible? Absolutely!

What complicates setup is that less than perfect stylus to cantilever mating is common, and occasionally the cantilever is less than perfectly mounted. Most will align using the cartridge body which doesn’t address this less than perfect mating/mounting. From the side, I surmise that few mount it to the ideal 92degrees or to whatever one seems ideal. I also surmise that few check the accuracy of stylus to cantilever mating. Now granted there are a few talented experienced folk that can reach optimization by ear, but many/most have not experienced “optimum”. @atmasphere seems to be alluding that there’s much more performance that can be wrung out of your existing cartridge if it is not yet optimized.

Dear @nandric : "  disputes about not relevant details. "

Well certainly is not relevant to you but the subject ( " detail." ) to put the tonearm importance above the cartridge in LP analog rig is more relevant for some of us that what you can think.

In this kind of " disputes "/discussions always are learning audio information shared for the people involved that helps any one to improve his audio knowledge levels and for me one forums target is this precisely: learn.

Only an opinion.

R.

I

 the Denon 103 is a pretty nice cartridge for the money.

It is. Lots of nice comments from our customers.

Second the suggestion of a Hana cartridge.

And a third. One of my employees uses this cartridge- tracks anything.

There is no sense in question about ''all carts''. The most members
have experience with limited number of carts. Except Raul, J. Carr
and perhaps ''the well infomed memer from (Dutch) New Zeeland''.
Problem with Raul is that he get seduced in disputes about not
relevant details. So the question asked is answered with own
experiece and preference by individual members. Those are
worthless because there is no consensus about anything. 
Better is to ask questions about particular cartridges. Then only
those who know the cart can answer the question based on their
own experience. 

I wound up getting a Hana ML and a Feickert protractor so I can do my own setups = freedom to experiment with other cartridges as the opportunities come up.

I only have about 5 hours on the cartridge but I'm happy with it. This is my first microline & the one thing I've noticed  is how quiet it is. Surface noise seems dramatically reduced. I'm not sure if this is because of the microline or if my previous 30 year cartridges had worn styli and dried out suspensions that accentuated noise?

Thanks for all the replies.

Second the suggestion of a Hana cartridge.  I have a Hana EL in my Technics 1200G and it sounds great.  Personally, I dislike the Ortofon Black but lots of people think it is wonderful.  If you want more for more, I think the Audio-Technica AT-ART9XI would be an excellent choice for around $1200.  (All this based on arm/cartridge compatibility, of course!)

https://www.stereophile.com/phonocartridges/507allaerts/index.html

As an added bonus, If you scroll down at the end of this link Raul provide, there is a collection of cartridge links/reviews of reasonably priced now vintage cartridges.

Thanks again Raul

@rauliruegas,

Oh my gosh, those are some turntable setups!
https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/3080#&gid=1&pid=6

Do you use any vacuum tube gear in your system?

Now I'm beginning to understand why you are so passionate about anything to do with turntables...

Are you an expert in all things turntable? I don't know, but you're pretty darn close.

Btw, @mijostyn : that guess what? came because the Allaerts was mounted in the SME series models that you and your expert tonearm friend degraded in the tonearm/other thread.

Here from my virtual system: https://ucarecdn.audiogon.com/82eb629a-abc2-4fab-881a-7dcd95a12dbc/-/autorotate/yes/

There were mounted: the Colibri, Koetsu RSP, Ortofon MC 7500 and the Allaerts in great tonearms,.

R.

Dear @mijostyn : he did not but I do. Here you can read the M.Fremer review with the Allaerts cartridge I lended to him for that review:

https://www.stereophile.com/phonocartridges/507allaerts/index.html

and guess what? here is mounted in my SME IV and in " nude body " fashion did it by my self:

https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/3080#&gid=1&pid=6

now I own the F1 as you can read in my system information.

R.

Cleeds, I was joking. That cartridge costs $20,000.00 therefor it must be the best cartridge made right?:) I doubt I'll ever get close to one. Go to his sight and read the specs. If I told you you wouldn't believe me. 
I think Mike Lavigne has a Jan Allaerts cartridge. Not sure which one. 

As for my opinion on this subject, the differences between most well made cartridges are relative to the flowery descriptions I see, minor.
The most obvious is output and dynamic range. Next is tonal balance. Some cartridges lean a little bright others a little bass heavy. Ralph is right. As long as a cartridge is tracking everything you throw at it, any preference is personal. MC cartridges in particular are vastly over priced and many do not represent a good value. Take a look at the Nagaoka MP500. Here is a cartridge for $800.00 with a fine line stylus, a boron cantilever and great reviews. I would bet it is a better rock and roll cartridge than most MCs. Soundsmith and Grado both make excellent reasonably price cartridges. The Kiseki Purple Heart is just as good as cartridges costing $10K  Price is absolutely no indication of quality when it comes down to MC cartridges once you get to a certain level of quality. The Ortofon Quintet Black S, the Clearaudio Essence and the Van Den Hull DDT-2 are excellent examples of cartridges using the best modern tech and materials at reasonable prices. After this it becomes purely a matter of taste, ego and tonearms. We have some fabulous tonearms on the market now but that is another subject.

 the Denon 103 is a pretty nice cartridge for the money.  Its not perfect but it does many things very well sounding very natural on the right tonearm.

There are many MM cartridge for nearly the same price with much better overall sound quality of any tonearm. 

The price of Denon is not the end, because there must be a SUT or MC phono stage to handle LOMC and super heavy tonearm. So the actual price is Denon + SUT or MC Phono. In this combination it is not cheap at all. 

mijostyn

... If you want a good cartridge you have to get yourself a Jan Jallaerts MC2 Formula 1. It easily out performs any cartridge ever made ...

Will you please tell us what makes this phono cartridge so outstanding? What pickup arm have you used it in?

 the Denon 103 is a pretty nice cartridge for the money.  Its not perfect but it does many things very well sounding very natural on the right tonearm.

Firstly, it is rookie and not roockie.

So this is a relevant statement to this thread? Not at all.

And just what are those very good reasons rauliruegas.
First of all everything you have said is anecdotal. Ralph's opinion of how the Grado sounded is also anecdotal. His opinion on how a tonearm should be set up is not. Tonearms and cartridges are very simple devices. I bet even you could design a moving coil cartridge if you put your mind to it. If you want a good cartridge you have to get yourself a Jan Jallaerts MC2 Formula 1. It easily out performs any cartridge ever made but you'd better have a very quiet phono stage. I can easily make the Formula 1 sound awful. Just put it in the wrong tonearm and set it up like most casual users. I am sure the Grado sounds better in Ralph's Triplanar set up as well as I know Ralph can. From what I have read so for I would rather have Ralph set up my turntable than you. 
You are always entitled to your opinions. I just wish you wouldn't try to shove them down everyone else throat's. It seems you have been a bit more forceful lately. What is stressing you out?

A proper alignment required for all cartridges and tonearms, this fact is not the reason to buy an inferior MC or MM with Conical or Elliptical profiles with very short life span, just because some think that they are easier in adjustment/alignment. Even if the cost for such cartridge is cheaper the re-tip will cost extra and it an elliptical tip can't be used for longed than 600hrs max. 

It is very easy to setup a cartridge with advanced profile if a tonearm is not junk, the alignment process is the same as with elliptical. Personally i have never noticed any difference in alignment of any profile (i tried many). I just don't understand all that hype about Hana cartridges made by Excel Sound for low price. 

A difficulties in alignment advanced stylus profile is a myth. 
The real problem is MC cartridge re-tipping! 

With your rig, I would stay away from anything with a Shibata or microline stylus.  They require spot on alignment and longer (lower tracking error) arms.  The Hana 'E' (for elliptical) H (High Output) is a screaming deal.  Forgiving stylus profile, high output eliminates MC preamp or transformer and additional cable complexity. At $475, you still get the MC goodness and detail that, as good as they are, an Ortofon 2M Bronze or Black can't quite deliver. 

@tyray. You wrote this in your post:" I have a question for you. And this is not for arguments sake. I’m just curious.

When a blank piece of vinyl is cut at the factory, in your opinion which is more important. The cartridge/stylus making the grooves or the tone arm?"

Given your last post to me it is clear that what I suspected was true. You had no intention of being non argumentative and that post was ’BS’, the exact opposite was correct given your follow up post. Additionally, as Ralph pointed out to you it is a lacquer that is cut at the factory not a ’blank piece of vinyl’. You didn’t like my reply, and now you think you can come here and try and belittle my question to you...which still stands...how is your question relevant?
I have a great suggestion to you in the meantime, please put me on your ignore list, as I am doing for you. Have a nice day.

Dear @luisma31 : well " angry " was my thougth not that you told me, sorry for this.

R.

And Raul if you are "admitting" that wasn't the intention I understand so no worriesYou have a good day

That's not accurate Raul, angry is not the word of how I felt, more like "surprised" and "attacked for no obvious reason", if your opinion to my post was purely technical fine, you obviously have a lot of experience, I am here to learn not to argue with people.But instead your opinion and reply about a post non directly related to you was with these words "I was even more stupid than (somebody else)"The original post was removed because I reported you to the moderatorsBut I can't be angry to people that just do online rantingNow, why you reacted to my harmless post validating someone else's I can just think for some reason it bothers you when someone validates @atmasphere points of view, he could be wrong or he could be right as far as I know but from a user like you I would expect more civility.So yes you are correct you stated your opinion but you are leaving out the part where you name people stupid just because.

Dear @tyray : That was a second post to him. Look in any internet forum you can be interested any one can post his opinion and in my first post to him that's what I did it but then he was angry because I posted my opinion and he claim to me that he did not asked to me.

So, I posted my answer to him that at the end every word is true even if seems as a bulling that in reality was niot the intention.

R.

When i have been in a recording studio as a pro studio player, not once did I see the boom moving around any type of axis to follow what the mic was doing (Yikes).

Hey davey boy,

Of course a boom doesn’t move around to follow a axis in a recording studio. You’ve completely taken what I wrote and twisted it to fit your bullsh*t to talk down to someone you don’t agree with.

Dear @luisma31 : As I already told you you just don't understand about and that's why you posted a wrong question because loading of a cartridge is not because its output level but because its internal electric characteristics and the phono stage ones.

It does not matters who whom addresses your question. Your knowledge levels are extremely low.

I don't care if you are friend of him that does not changes your wrong question and your comment " all the rigth answers " where exist no answer in the post.

R.

Raul,

I also like luisa31 have read your post here on gone for quite some time and have enjoyed them and they have always have been respectful. Why now are you being so mean to others? I would have never suspected you for being a bully?

@tyray I fail to see the relevance of the question in your last post?

Hey daveyf,

What a snarky post. I try real hard to always have a civil conversation here and somehow I think you feel as if you think you are better or somehow more knowledgeable than some others here on this thread.

The cutting tool that is mounted on the end of the arm on a cutting lathe at the time of the lacquer mastering is not a cartridge/stylus.

This statement is complete and utter bullsh*t. There’re many types of styli used in a lathe cutter head. There also are drive coils which act in a similar fashion as a cartridge.

But if you are asking if that cutter is more important than the arm to which it is attached to, i would say again.. no.

No stylus, no drive coils, no cutting head, no master, no commercial record period.

Firstly, it is rookie and not roockie.

This is where you’ve pissed me off the most. You taking issue with Rauls impeccable english writing skills. Your subliminal bigotry is not wanted, welcome nor needed here.

This is the second time on this thread that someone has mistakenly made comments about Raul’s english writing skills on this thread. Raul does not and I repeat does not use a translation tool to communicate here. If he did those of us who know, that a internet translation tool really screws up the translation. What you see is actually Raul’s very good grasp of american styled english. I would not doubt if Raul not only speaks english, but french, portuguese and italian also. It’s a damn pity the most americans only speak one language, even though we supposedly have the best schools. Go figure.

my Blackbird has built in micrometer to adjust VTA, easy, precise, wonderful,

but, the cartridge is fixed directly to the long carbon arm. Azimuth adjustment by rotating the carbon tube a speck in it’s snug rear housing, tighten with set screw.

The SOB’s put the set screw on the bottom, what misery to get it right, the worst design feature. As azimuth is critically important, many a curse was issued, I should learn Russian to curse in their language.

elliottbnewcombjr

Thanks Elliot, I think the differences between a detachable headshell w/ tonearm and one piece tonearms are are good to know.

@rauliruegas  What 'facts' have you given that the cartridge is more important in the hierarchy than the tonearm? It has been shown by Origin Live and others that the hierarchy is tonearm first and cartridge second. You don't believe this to be the case, but that is far from a 'fact'.

Dear @unreceivedogma : I love those Abbe Lane and Jean Luc exquisite LPs and the Monroe picture just Wow !

and the ones here are something to own and listen it:

https://www.theaudioatticvinylsundays.com/albums

Congratulations !.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

@daveyf  : In that specific regards it's and is what his posts showed. It does not matters that he is a " long standding manufacturer " that has no truly relationship with the subject here.

He can be an expert in what he manufacture and this is not under discussion.

Btw, "  Are you such an 'expert' in analog reproduction .. "". I never said that and the subject issue here is about the importance in tonearm and cartridge and nothing more. I gave many facts that are the foundation of my non-expert opinion and your and his arguments showed nothing about.

Which the problem, no one is expert in all and each audio subjects and certainly you and he are not in the thread issue. Again, at least what you showed here but he showed too in other thread about tonearms too.

The people that like to speak a lot like him will tend a higher probability to make mistakes and he is talking and talking. His last post is an example of those.

R.

Dear @atmasphere : " its a tricky arm to get the adjustments right. "

why is that?, I can’t remember to have any single trouble to set up many of the cartridges I owned with.

" that something was off with the Benz; it could simply be that it had a compliance value that in tandem with its weight and the resulting mechanical resonance, it simply was not going to be able to strut its stuff where the Koetsu did..""

Way wrong. Almost any of the Benz Micro are spot on with the MMT inside the ideal frequency resonance range and the Koetsu is out of that ideal range ! ! !.

R.

@rauliruegas  You posted this:  " Problem is that that gentleman is really a " roockie " in that specific issue but he think as his followers is an expert and is far away from there., like it or not all of them unfortunatelly(sic)  are wrong."  Firstly, it is rookie and not roockie. The gentleman you are referring to has not responded to the comment, but I think it is very insulting of you to state such a comment! Are you such an 'expert' in analog reproduction that you believe that a long standing manufacturer and hobbyist warrants this kind of reply? If I am one of his followers, perhaps that is because I have been in this hobby for many decades and happen to know that his points are 100% correct when it comes to this aspect.OTOH, I'm no expert, certainly not like you seem to think you are!!!!! 

@rauliruegas,

Yes, you’re right the  Linn K9, like the Linn Basik was made by Audio Technica, rebadged with a subsequent price hike.
I think Rega did something similarly naughty with one of their MM cartridges.

The K9 was the one with the superglue trick. Sorry for any confusion. I later replaced it with the one that featured the Allen screw, the Linn K18.

There’s an image of it here where you can see how the Allen screw is supposed to hold it together better.

https://www.lencoheaven.net/forum/index.php?topic=18115.0

Amazingly the Linn K18 also appears to be based upon the Audio Technica AT 95E!



@atmasphere,

It’s important to get setup right but don’t get too obsessive. There will always be the odd opera torture track that will give most arm/cart combos hiccups.

’There had better not be! I’ve yet to run into such a track- my system breezes through everything effortlessly.’


Impressive stuff!

I remember experienced reviewers writing that Carmina Burana was one such ’torture track’.

Me, I used to get slight jitters playing the sole Maria Callas LP in my collection at decent volumes on my LP12.

Would it still track ok? Was the volume too high, or too low? Would the speakers cope, etc? Fabulous for testing dynamics and system headroom though.

Thanks again for sharing your considerable knowledge with us.

But doesn’t all the magic happen in the (LIVE) recording venue of the studio? The position, location and placements of (booms) mics, musicians, room sound treatments, the experience level of a competent recording engineer ect?

Am I wrong to notice not only the science of a recording but the ART form as well? I think there is a bit more that goes INTO a recording than what you say above.

I agree with this 100%! But it really isn't anything relevant to this debate.

When a blank piece of vinyl is cut at the factory, in your opinion which is more important. The cartridge/stylus making the grooves or the tone arm?

There really isn't an arm- and you don't cut vinyl- you cut a lacquer. My Westerex 3D is as good an example as any, as a cutter head its a mechanical transducer built into an articulated mount- but its one assembly- I don't know of a setup that allows a different transducer in the mechanism- they can't be seperated. There isn't an arm because the mount drives the cutter across the lacquer with a worm drive. My cutter deals with warp (which had better be pretty minuscule in a lacquer) using a device called a 'track ball' which allows me to set the groove depth. So this really doesn't hold up in this debate either.

It's important to get setup right but don't get too obsessive. There will always be the odd opera torture track that will give most arm/cart combos hiccups.

There had better not be! I've yet to run into such a track- my system breezes through everything effortlessly.

I would have to say that I disagree with this. There is a huge difference between my Benz Micro and my Koetsu Onyx. On well engineered recordings, it’s not really close. There is an audible difference between them and my Koetsu Rosewood Signature.

Now, I suppose you could say that I don’t have the Benz "set up" properly.

I have a Sumiko MMT arm in a VPI HW MK IV table. Do those components allow for the adjustments needed to "set up" properly, which in my 40 years of experience has simply meant to use that protractor-looking thingy and follow the instructions of each manufacturer, then fiddle until it sounds the best that I can make them?

@unreceivedogma I've owned the MMT; its a tricky arm to get the adjustments right. And yes, its a good bet that something was off with the Benz; it could simply be that it had a compliance value that in tandem with its weight and the resulting mechanical resonance, it simply was not going to be able to strut its stuff where the Koetsu did. If you're dealing with that, you can set the tracking pressure and VTA till the cows come home and the cartridge still won't track right!


The problem we're dealing with here is that the groove is ***microscopic***, so tiny adjustments have an enormous effect on how the cartridge makes distortion. By 'tiny' I do mean at or near microscopic. Most arms simply do not have the necessary provisions to do this right- you can get the basic stuff like tracking pressure and maybe even overhang, but the nuances are where this really makes a difference. Look up above in my post here- I've quoted someone who has come to accept that some records 'will give most arm/cart combos hiccups.' This might be the case- but its a good sign also that something is amiss- and the most likely culprit is the arm not the cartridge unless the cartridge is actually damaged or its suspension is shot. I can list a good number of arm issues that can cause mistracking, and it really doesn't matter which cartridge you have.

IOW, if the arm isn't doing its job, expect mistracking. Obviously the converse is also true, if the arm ***is*** doing its job, then the cartridge will track effortlessly. When its effortless, that is when you will find that the cartridge (as long as its in good condition) plays a far less significant role in this.

Dear @cd318 : That K9 was manufactured by AT.

Btw, easy and with no risk at all you can fix any removable stylus cartridge using a good scotch tape like. The tension of the tape will help that resonances down there change its frequency hopping out of the range are disturbing more.

Don't use that drop of glue. Btw, I did it many many years ago with one of my ADC Astrion and when I wanted to change the stylus that was a little " trouble " or even if you want to put on sale the cartridge.

R.

Dear @unreceivedogma : You are rigth about. Problem is that that gentleman is really a " roockie " in that specific issue but he think as his followers is an expert and is far away from there., like it or not all of them unfortunatelly  are wrong.

They  have to learn as you learned and as many other audiophiles do it each single day, my self including.

Of course that with your Premier MMT tonearm you can make all the adjustment need it for any cartridge. That’s even today a very good tonearm design builded by Jelco under Sumiko specs and characteristics and quality level required by.


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

atmasphere :
"The big deal you’re going to find is that if the tonearm properly tracks the cartridge, then the choice of cartridge is far less important than people make it out. By ’properly track’ I mean that no matter what is in the grooves, the music is always relaxed and well-defined, no hint of stress or breakup; almost as if you were listening to tape."

I would have to say that I disagree with this. There is a huge difference between my Benz Micro and my Koetsu Onyx. On well engineered recordings, it’s not really close. There is an audible difference between them and my Koetsu Rosewood Signature.

Now, I suppose you could say that I don’t have the Benz "set up" properly.

I have a Sumiko MMT arm in a VPI HW MK IV table. Do those components allow for the adjustments needed to "set up" properly, which in my 40 years of experience has simply meant to use that protractor-looking thingy and follow the instructions of each manufacturer, then fiddle until it sounds the best that I can make them?

Thank you, ML

@cd318 there are many vintage MM and MI with fixed stylus holder assembly: Denon DL-107, ADC TRX series, Technics EPS100 and P100 series, SONY XL-50 ... There is a screw to tighten up removable stylus to the cartridge body. 

Audio-Technica cartridges designed even better without that screw and a plastic stylus holder never fell apart and it sits firmly on AT-ML170 for example. 

@chakster,

Good points. Yes, overhang simply has to be right. It hurts to think of that diamond not finding the best way through that spiral groove.

One thing that still puzzles me is the notion that the perceived sonic difference between moving magnet and moving coil designs was largely down to the better structural integrity of the latter with its non-removable stylus?

Is there any truth in this?

Since a lot of people use the Ortofon (blue and red) mm cartridges I wondered whether anyone had used that old trick of applying the tiniest drop of superglue to help further secure the plastic stylus assembly to the cartridge body?  

Since you could still easily break off the assembly when it was eventually time to replace the stylus, it might be something worth considering. Perhaps even moreso with a used cartridge.

I think it was something first suggested by UK reviewer, the king of tweaks himself, Jimmy Hughes.

The notion seemed to gain further credibility when Linn brought out their K9 cartridge which featured a tiny Allen bolt on the front of the cartridge to secure the removable assembly (Linn had a thing for the the letter 'k' and its profile looked like Doctor Who's electronic dog). 

Linn claimed that it helped with tracking and also resulted in a reduction in surface noise - and I tended to agree with them.

But that was over 15 years ago and perhaps today's moving magnet designs are better built.

I’m sure we all do but some are easier than others. The times I used to wish my decks had a detachable headshell like my first Rega 3 did. Of course they didn’t because we were told detachable was very bad.

But was it really?

No, they are not better

With the Rega there wasn’t much need to manoeuvre. The square bodied Nagoaka cart was fairly straightforward to align and the mirror check revealed no issues either.

Overhang must be spot on.

I remember having a couple of protractors for alignment and some were easier to use than others. I knew that with a 2 point protractor that the inner alignment point was critical to get right because of potential end of side tracking issues.

I use Dr. Feickert NG for all tonearms/cartridges.

I never found arm height to make difference so I kept to the recommended advice of keeping the arm parallel to the top-plate/platter.

Negative VTA can be problematic, positive VTA isn’t a problem.
If you have Rega TT with Rega tonearm then you may find the VTA is negative and you can’t fix it, you can only add something between a cartridge and tonearm (or thicker mat).

It’s important to get setup right but don’t get too obsessive. There will always be the odd opera torture track that will give most arm/cart combos hiccups.

I do not have yet anything like that on any tonearm/cartridge I’m suing now (no miss tracking). The Hi-Fi News TEST LP is the best test for cartridge suspension and tracking abilities. 

I do remember certain Shure cartridges being renowned for their tracking abilities. Perhaps it might be worth finding out what carts classical stations such as BBC Radio 3 used to employ in the days before they switched to digital.

Almost any good high compliance cartridge can do the same. The Grace LEVEL II for example, and it’s much better than any Shure. But Grace is a Japanese cartridge, you guys remember American cartridges only (and how they were advertised) @cd318

@tyray I fail to see the relevance of the question in your last post? 
The cutting tool that is mounted on the end of the arm on a cutting lathe at the time of the lacquer mastering is not a cartridge/stylus. But if you are asking if that cutter is more important than the arm to which it is attached to, i would say again.. no. If the arm that is directing the cutter is at all problematic, there goes the accuracy of the cut. 

@chakster,

'And I assume we know how to align and adjust a cartridge/tonearm.'


I'm sure we all do but some are easier than others. The times I used to wish my decks had a detachable headshell like my first Rega 3 did. Of course they didn't because we were told detachable was very bad. 

But was it really?

With the Rega there wasn't much need to manoeuvre. The square bodied Nagoaka cart was fairly straightforward to align and the mirror check revealed no issues either. 

I remember having a couple of protractors for alignment and some were easier to use than others. I knew that with a 2 point protractor that the inner alignment point was critical to get right because of potential end of side tracking  issues.

The Ittok on the Linn was fairly easy to adjust for height but it was not so easy to try out other arms on the LP12 because of the need for a specifically cut armboard. Besides we were regularly told that the Ittok was the best arm in the world (until the Ekos) so there was little incentive to bother.

I never found arm height to make difference so I kept to the recommended advice of keeping the arm parallel to the top-plate/platter.

It's important to get setup right but don't get too obsessive. There will always be the odd opera torture track that will give most arm/cart combos hiccups.  

Perhaps it's time some brave soul out there tried out a multi cartridge tracking group test. Unsurprisingly the hi-fi press never bothered as the findings may have not been to their or their readers liking.

I do remember certain Shure cartridges being renowned for their tracking abilities. Perhaps it might be worth finding out what carts classical stations such as BBC Radio 3 used to employ in the days before they switched to digital.

Tracking and record care would have been vital to them as they then had one of the most impressive vinyl libraries in the world. 

tyray164 posts:23pm

"And I also think that Azimuth can only be adjusted on the headshell itself and not the tonearm, whether the headshell is removable or nonremovable. Thanks R!"

my Blackbird has built in micrometer to adjust VTA, easy, precise, wonderful,

but, the cartridge is fixed directly to the long carbon arm. Azimuth adjustment by rotating the carbon tube a speck in it’s snug rear housing, tighten with set screw.

The SOB’s put the set screw on the bottom, what misery to get it right, the worst design feature. As azimuth is critically important, many a curse was issued, I should learn Russian to curse in their language.

Everyone who has many different cartridges and tonearms know very well what is more important (if tonearm and cartridge are matched together). And I assume we know how to align and adjust a cartridge/tonearm. Enough said.

daveyf,

I have a question for you. And this is not for arguments sake. I'm just curious.

When a blank piece of vinyl is cut at the factory, in your opinion which is more important. The cartridge/stylus making the grooves or the tone arm?

Thanks 

Firstly, i want to say that I still agree with Ralph 100%. The arm is more important than the cartridge. IME, that is a FACT.
Secondly, tyrays analogy to the boom and microphone is a false analogy when it comes to tonearm and cartridge, like Ralph alluded to above. 
When i have been in a recording studio as a pro studio player, not once did I see the boom moving around any type of axis to follow what the mic was doing (Yikes). The boom had to remain in place, and in fact the goal was for it to be as stationary and stable as possible. Sure there are numerous other pieces of gear in play while the recording is going on, so what? This analogy is false.
Lastly, I have to say that I also think that Raul likes to argue for the sake of arguing, I have never once seen him admit that he could possibly be in error! The snippet that cd318 posted from the Origin Live website says a lot, even though I'm sure Raul will dispute that also!!!