The retest.
Years ago I tried in my tweeter caps CAST and VSF and played around and found that I like in series CAST followed by VSF.
After this test I will be ordering either another set of CAST on sale or RS series. The now used caps go into bedroom speakers. (of same value)
I was quite surprised at the time I choose the CAST followed by VSF over two CAST. |
Thanks for the pictures. I was going to suggest you use NOS Western electric stranded wire and the new Duelund match. It seems you already knew that! |
I asked my sellers of the used capacitors and they said that they never heard of Cocking machine like Audiodharma. So I hope I will have some good results with cocking. It will Thake like 1 month to do them all :-/ In the meantime I`m asking myself if the result will blown me away , maybe I should also burn the capacitors of my new Preamplifier the Audio Research Reference 6 ? Thake them out and burn properly on the Cable Cocker ;-) Just a thought. And I like soldering and make some test ;-) Audio Research Reference 6 capacitorsMy all XO - boardsXO-big-Midds |
You are on top of it for sure! Love to know more about the speakers and what amp drives them. |
Grannyrig thanks for your kind words! They do sound great and I'm happy with the results.
I do use the Path Audio resistors on midds in series. This is my most important resistor in my XO. All the rest are Millis Resistors and some leftovers of Duelund Cast resistors in Zobel networks. I have to also do some burning whole crossover with my audiodharma cable cocker at once after burning the capacitors separately. That's my plan during the holiday. |
Very impressed with your parts selection and I bet the speakers will sound fantastic based on the care you are taking on the crossover alone.
If if you need resistors I know a brand that is to resistors as Duelund is to capacitors. Path Audio resisters. Have you heard of them? |
thank you guys for your input.
I have on the Tweeter capacitor already one 0.01uF Duelund Silver foil as baypass. And also a 0.47uF Silvers on the midds. |
slowikpl Anything over 10 uF could take at least 200 hrs on the cable cooker and possibly more given the size of them. You might want to try the Duelund silver foil and wax and oil bypass on a tweeter cap for speakers for that last little bit of high end air. |
200 hours would be ideal although they sound very special by 100 hours for sure. I'm a hugh advocate of the Duelund CAST. After all these years of having them in my speaker's tweeter site and in my DAC (output coupling capacitors) I thoroughly appreciate their sonic impact in my system. They're a tremendous high quality product that I'd recommend wholeheartedly and without reservation. Worth every cent! Thanks Bill (Grannyring) for the recommendation years ago.
Charles |
Wow! You have a wonderful assortment. I have no experience with the cooker , but they need at least 100 hours in gear. 200 hours is even better. |
Hello all.
I have many duelund caps like:
50uF, 8.2uF, 6.8uF, 2.2uF Duelund CAST 40uF Duelund VSF copper
Also some 600V Duelund CAST :
4.7uF ,3.3uF , 2.2uF , 1.5uF , 1uF
Heave someone a piece of advice how long should I clock my Duelund's with my new Audiodharma Cable-Cocker anv.?
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Grannyring thanks I will email you later this weekend? Sunday and thanks again |
Volley, direct connection to the woofer is another great example of my general notion. Huge improvement. It does not matter how expensive the connector is, getting rid of it is so much better. Same for fuses, but many cannot stomach that:) I use on/off circuit breakers instead. |
Mikirob, I am not talking about removing the binding posts on speakers, though you should, but rather the amp! Every speaker will benefit! Email me and I can sed you pics! |
Grannyring I believe it on your binding posts. :) For me as well maybe the biggest improvement was removing a connection to the woofer with direct wiring. It was crazy how much was lost.
You got me thinking and over the holidays I am going to experiment in removing my cheap aluminum connectors that join woofer, midrange and tweeter with some Duelund Silver wire. I bet a big improvement!
I was reading Jeff's post on the new Duelund cap. Can someone clarify if this is his first Duelund CAST in electronics? I believe it is. I always wondered when he was going to get around to this.
He talks much about vintage caps but I have not found any vintage cap that can compete with Duelund except in the midrange and at great loss of dynamics.
When this thread started I was not a vintage guy at all. I had to admit loving the vintage tone though when I heard it. Duelund improved it in every way.
I do not think he should think of sound as vintage vs. Modern. Steen Duelund had concluded it was natural vs. Plastic. Vintage just used less plastic but not vintage magic.
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Grannyring,
thanks for the tip. I think I'll experiment on the Tekton Lores, but not mess with the DeVore 0/96 or Harbeth HL5s. Best, Rob
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I also use the Duelund wire in my tube amp mod with the Blue Cactus caps and resistors Jeff Day likes per his site.
Very nice! However the best mod to take is bypassing the speaker binding posts on my amp. Best sonic improvement I have heard to date with my latest amp project. Just think no more thick metal binding post or even thick metal connectors on the speaker cable. I inserted some Teflon bolts and nuts where the binding posts were and use them as a clamp to clamp together the bare speaker wire with output wires from the trannys that now exit the back of the amp. This was a very noticeable improvement!
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grannyring,
as you might remember I replaced the capacitors in my Coincident Dynamo 34SE with Arizona Green. Huge difference to the good in really every parameter. I have been thrilled for many months. I'm going to try the new Duelund as well. Best, Rob
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Also, Clarity TC film caps are wonderful in tube amp power supplies replacing electrolytic types. I have found you can use values of 1/3 the capacitance of the electrolytic caps they replace. More open sounding and extended compared to electros I have used in the past. Also better than the GE motor runs I have used in the past. More air, openness, and improved focus and overall refinement.
This is based on some recent mods on tube preamps and PP tube amps. |
Just an update for everybody. I purchased some Arizona capacitor blue cactus capacitors for use in a coupling position in my tube amps. I really like their tone and smoothness, this is just a very musical sounding capacitor. They cost me about $30 each, while not cheap they certainly are a great value in terms of overall performance. |
Halo Volleyguy1,
My Oppo 105 is amazing. I changed CPU's clock and power supply and I'm super happy with it. Oppo UHD is coming November i heard.
I just bought Clarity MR for the woofer and tweeter caps for center speaker.
Next I want to try CMR with Jupiter for tweeter and woofer cap for front L&R.
I feels Duelund is just too much money and I better save it for LG oled :)
Can someone give review for Clarity CMR ?
Thanks
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Hi Dan
How do you like the Oppo 105? I have the 95 and like it a lot. Great for the money!
Exactly how I feel about the Duelund RS.
I agree with Tony they are a no brainer and should be on any trial list. Then you can decide if you want to move up the expensive Duelund list. I have Duelund VSF, RS and CAST and all are great.
RS is my default go to cap... (which I just bought)
I have been cutting spending but still doing some and think if I want another set of CAST caps for the main system. Tweeter caps. 2.2 or 2uf. The VSF then go into bedroom speakers. I planned my own hand me down system. It was pre planned so I did not have to almost give away used caps.
So when/if I replace VSF with CAST the bedroom system gets new VSF so two improvements for money spent!
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Hi Dan
I agree with Erik I would go easy and much slower. :)
I would start with tweeter caps and getting a feel of the caps and what they will/can do for you.
My one amp I had to make changes to make more stable. I liked the sound of it a lot but was leary of it!. It caught fire once and had other problems.
My repair guy who builds tube amps recommended going from a cathode biased amp converting to fixed bias. (he did not like the power supply) He did that changed 4 coupling caps and one resistor. (one Jensen cap was arcing)
So he took out all the mates and installed 4 Solen caps.
Less change than you are talking about and I did not even recognize the amp!!!
I changed back in the Jupiter and Jensen leaving only Solen and I have a Duelund RS here not yet in. This is in a bedroom amp and all the caps I did not use in main system went in this amp. Jensen Copper Paper, Jupiter and VCap Cuft.
I am trying to judge just power supply change and one resistor and even that is a lot.
The changes you are talking about... Holy Cow! You will not know what did what!
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That's a lot of bypass for an MR.
Considering the costs, have you actually heard them ??
Personally, I'd bypass Clarity MR with copper foil caps and be very happy. I find the Mundorf SIO's to add a Disney like sheen or scintilation to the top end. Magico loves them. Me? Meh.
If you want the Mundorf SIO sound, just get Mundorf SIO's. If you are trying to be budget conscious, use something else as your base cap.
That's just my advice though, I"m tired and sick and none of it is coming out friendly like, sorry. :)
I really do think you should listen before you spend a lot of money and make up your own tastes.
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I am using the 90%/10% combo that a few people report it works well including Tony Gee, not bypassing.
The combi are clarity MR and Mundorf SIO.
Thanks
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Mundorf is sold more ore less by the uF:
uF x y = $$
but Clarity is
(uF * x) + 30 = $$
That is, for the MR line there is a $30 upcharge every time you add a Clarity cap. I don't see exactly which line of Clarity and voltage. Same for Mundorf.
Usually I try to keep a bypass cap to 1-2% or less to avoid things getting really wonky. With this combination it's especially important as Clarity that I've mentioned tend to have higher ESR than Mundorfs.
However, using multiple Clarity caps will greatly reduce the ESR, so the need to bypass them goes down a lot.
Best,
Erik
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Halo again,
When mixing caps in parallel to get the value wanted, are they any rules?
Here are some of my thoughts, based on the store's stock I only be able to get these combination:
12 UF:
CLARITY 4.7uf x 1 :4.7
CLARITY 3µF x 1 :3
CLARITY 2.2µF x 1 :2.2
MUNDOR 2.2µF x1 :2.2 = 12.1
50:
CLARITY- 20µF x 2 :40
CLARITY 5.6µF x 1 :5.6
MUNDORF 3.9µF x 1 :3.9
MUNDORF 0.47µF x 1 :0.47 =49.97
20.2:
CLARITY 15µF / 400VDC x 1
CLARITY 3.3µF / 400VDC x 1
MUNDORF 1.5µF / 1000V x 1
MUNDORF 0.47µF/ 1000V x 1
Are these okay? or do i need to use equal value?
Can someone comment?
Thanks
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I will experiment with the clarity MR and Mundorf SIO combo this time and next time I may go with Jupiter route.
I am not sure how good my speaker is but my friend who is a sound engineering and work in the audio industry, actually bought the lesser model JR149 after he listen to the mod version.
Thanks
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My point was really just to try to keep it all in balance. Have you tried SonicCraft for your Jupiters? It doesn’t make a lot of sense to spend $500 on a cap unless you are sure your tweeter is worth it. :) Mind you, some inexpensive tweeters are ridiculously good for the price. :) I"m about to do a 2-way Be tweeter which will give me the opportunity to experiment yet again with caps. :) Best, Erik |
Hi Erik,
I have mundorf MKP in the bass and 125uf value, others are auricap xo now. I have another pair coming so I want to try different caps, I want to go with almost the best :)
Sadly PCX does not have the Jupiter at this moment.
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@santodx5
Woah, take it easy! :) That's a lot of money to spend on upgrades. They won't give you different speakers you know.
If you are happy using the JR150's as a learning experience I'd consider series caps with the tweet and mid (if any) the first place to start. What do you have now?
I am a Clarity fanboy, but that's a lot of money you are proposing without having heard them.
Instead, I'd suggest start small, and see what you like. Try Mundorf MKP, Supreme and Clarity MRs in the tweeter. Which do you like best? There's only one way to find out. :)
Replace series resistors with Mills.
Maybe you'd like the Mundorf Supreme's. They add some Disney sparkle to the top end. The Mundorf MKP's are great bargains, have huge amounts of low level detail once broken in, but warmer.
You may really want to take this conversation over to the DIYaudio/multi-way forum, where you can post pics and ask many speaker designers and hackers about it.
Best,
Erik
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Halo All,
I am a newbie hobbyist. This thread has been an inspiration for me, I actually read from page 1, it took me 3 days:) Thank you all for the amazing info.
I am building an external cross over for JR150 speakers. My system consist of Oppo 105, 3 Quad 909 and 2 Quad 405, and Denon AV500n preamp for 7.1 system.
Can someone please give me suggestion about caps in the JR150’s crossover?
The value I need and my plan:
6uf, 7uf, 20.2uf: Clarity MR
12uf (tweeter): Jupiter copper wax or RS (both similar price)
50uf (bass): Clarity MR (Jupiter or RS will burn a hole)
125uf: Clarity MR
4 Inductors: Northcreek?(are they still open?) Goertz alpha core? Solen? WPIO?
3 Resistors: Path Audio
Will this combination give good synergy? I read in this thread the MR can be tweak with small value Mundorf SIO to enhance it even better. or should i use Vcap CuTF instead?
For the tweeter caps, which one do you think will suit my system better? RS or Jupiter? Which one will match the MR better?
I have never try any of these caps, for film cap I usually use auricap xo for my mod.
Hope someone can give me insight.
Thank you,
Dan
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@volleyguy1 I was being funny, but there are some out of control audiophiles in Vietnam who are crazy for Duelund. :)
Best,
Erik
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Oh Vietnam!
Likely a little costly in shipping. I am from Canada.
They might be collectors items though. I bet they will just sell of remaining stock of .01's? |
@volleyguy Well now that I know they are in such short supply, I'm putting them up on a Vietnamese auction site at 4x original prices. :)
Best,
Erik
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I will not being doing a test of the Duelund Silver bypass caps.
My understanding is Partsconnexion will not restock the larger sizes.
Unless Eric sells his. :) |
"Copper Minimal Resonance" |
Hacking at a Pass huh? :)
Hey, what do the letters stand for anyway? CMR?
Best,
Erik
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Parts Connexion should have them in early September. BTW yesterday I began testing CMR samples in my system, starting with CMR/400V in place of MR in two coupling applications in a Pass XP-25 phono stage. CMR is a big step up, even cold out of the box. ClarityCap OEM Sales |
@dgarretson Not bad at all, so long as they dont come with ittty bitty leads that makes them impossible to mount on a pcb. ;) I look forward to seeing them in stock. do you have any idea when?
Best,
Erik
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MR4.7uf/630V 50x50mm vs. CMR 40Lx60D MR4.7uf/400V 50x38D vs. CMR 50x38D MR10uf/630V 65x60D vs. CMR 65x60D MR10uf/400V 65x51D vs. CMR 40x60D |
@dgarretson
Fair enough. For comparison, what is the size of the new 4.7uF and 10uF caps at each voltage?
Your explanations would definitely explain my own findings. :) Guess I should stock up on small CM's for bypasses. :)
Best,
Erik |
Hi Erik, Madisound and Parts Connexion will have CMR & CSA in stock soon. I can provide free samples to substantiated manufacturers. I run an occasional group buy for hobbyists and smaller OEMs who need custom values or can’t justify factory MOQs. Since the surface area of the end spray increases with diameter, the benefit of coppering the ends is greatest with the higher value caps. This led us to shift catalogued aspect ratios toward larger diameters and shorter lengths. In turn the narrower metalized film stock employed further reduces ESR. The downside is that fatter caps may not fit in some applications. ClarityCap OEM Sales |
@volleyguy1 Any time there's oxidation there is the potential ( depends on material ) for it acting resistively or like a tiny diode. This can do a lot of things, including limiting the dynamic range at the low end. Musical decay will get cut off too soon. This is my own pet peeve. :)
Not all material that oxidizes has this issue though, I think copper for instance does not.
Best,
Erik |
@volleyguy1 Sorry I'm not quite ready to let go of them yet, though I should. I am unpacking and about to create a new listening room so I want to wait until I can re-evaluate the speakers they went into first. |
@dgarettson Dave, Great to know!! Would you mind posting this over at the DIYAudio milti-way forum? We’d love to have this info there too. :) I did notice the Clarity MR’s have a little higher ESR than I was expecting. I suspect a lot of the value in bypassing was there. If that problem is reduced, it’s going to be an amazing cap! :) Now, if my tweeter cap could be made smaller than a soda can, that would really be incredible. :) Any idea when our usual sources like Parts Connexion and Madisound may be stocking? How far along are you in the process? Are engineering samples available in usual values, or no? Best, Erik |
Hi Volleyguy1, Yes, I think some of what you think of as the "poly sound" is happening in the tin-zinc end spray. Our OEM evaluators of the preproduction versions consistently felt that the copper ends reduce treble glare and smearing, producing a more natural timbre. |
Hi Dave
Good to hear from you.
The new clarity cap you were saying reduces impedance and phase anomalies common in metalized film caps.
Is it these phase anamolies that I can hear in low cost metalized caps that make sounds that are not natural?
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Erik, The new ClarityCap CMR CopperConnect range will benefit even less from bypassing than MR. CMR has the MR series-wound construction and resonance treatments, with the addition of a copper litz lattice embedded in the end cap. This reduces impedance and phase anomalies across the conductive ends that (in traditional metalized film caps) result from oxidized grain boundaries in the tin-zinc end spray. This is a significant improvement. Regards, Dave
ClarityCap OEM Sales |
Hi Eric
Would you like to sell the .047's?
I have never heard the Clarity caps but they have a good reputation.
I do have quite a bit of experience with Jupiter Copper Foil.
I find bypassing is inconsistent as far as improvement so not at all shocked at your findings.
Thanks
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