For those who don’t believe in outlets making a difference and don’t believe in break in, try the Furutech GTX-D (R) NCF outlet!
146 responses Add your response
@bigtwin Said:
@lak Said: @bigtwin , @lak is correct. Just check the archives here on Agon and AA. I believe you will also find threads on SH forum as well as the AC forum. Them puppies need hundreds of hours of burn-in time. Why did you buy a Rhodium plated duplex outlet??? Failure to burn-in the outlet properly is just a waste of good money. And your listening test will be flawed, useless... Spend the extra money to have the outlet burned in or you will need to hook it up to a circuit that feeds a refrigerator or freezer for a least a month. If you just connect a load to the outlet of a couple of amps it may take 6 months to a year to burn in one outlet of the duplex if not longer. |
@jea48 Whatever so I will try one and we will see. She will be here for Christmas and we will take measurements and do blind tests. Have a good day. Doubtful in Texas. |
@jerryg123 said; Hubbell. Daughter-In-Law is an EE and said that should be fine, Hospital Grade.
Nickel plated brass contacts. More than likely will sound grainy. Highs may sound bright. not natural.
Straight Blade Devices, Receptacles, Duplex, Hospital ...
|
@secretguy I will and it’s none of your business. Nor is it your business to disparage others for their willingness to at least try these tweaks. If Igor Sikorsky or the Wright Brothers listened to people like you…. |
@agisthos agreed. Don’t use hospital grade plugs or outlets. Unless your system or you are on life support. @secretguy wasting money is a relative term. In example, if you own a low-fi or lower tier mid-fi system, you have paid very little or no attention to room acoustics, and/or your ability to hear and identify differences between components and cables isn’t yet developed, you may be wasting money if you’re buying cables, footers, outlets, vibration control devices, etc. But, for some of us here a finishing touch such as a high quality outlet and the improvement it brings in represents one of the best values in this hobby. You’re just not there yet. And that’s fine. |
Don’t use hospital grade outlets. They are designed for one important thing, to reject water corrosion due to constant everyday wet splashing from nurses cleaning and mopping hospital rooms. The best corrosion resistant plating is nickel (gold is actually best but generally too expensive for this application). Guess which is the worst sounding receptacle plating? Nickel. So those telling you to ‘just get hospital grade outlets’ really don’t understand the erroneous advice they are giving. They presume because it’s labelled ‘hospital grade’ this is a sign of quality or somehow makes it good for audio systems. Of course, if you do not believe power connector plating has any effect on sound quality then by all means treat yourself to the inferior sound they provide. |
@secretguy goofy topic…. The unfortunate truth is - everything matters. Especially when it comes to what’s powering your components. |
@secretguy what would transmission lines have to do with it? Transmission lines are a lot higher voltage, maybe you mean distribution lines. |
People who don't think the receptacle s make a difference will think I sm out in LA LA land when I say I changed the wire feed into my home from the city junction box to my panel from aluminum to copper. That was also a big difference not as much as the receptacle s but a difference. I did it because I was changing the service outlet to a two hundred amp service up from a one hundred amp service to be able to run my woodshop. So I decided to spend the extra on the copper tech cable while they were at it and I am glad I did. |
Lots of reasons to like Furutech you can read about here. Cost is $225. I doubt the delta in sound would justify the delta in price between that and the $3,100 Quantum Science outlet in my system. |
@mlapenta yes it is shocking the difference it makes. I ran a group of individual 20 amp circuits with the furutech plugs. All the same.length wire and all coming from the same.leg of the box. I look now and likely should have gotten hifi wire into the wall to run between the box And thr wall plugs. |
@willgolf No I have not tried them yet but the AC Outlets at the Wall is the Most Important Thing !😃 |
Sorry i never responded to this thread that I believe i started. I went with the very high end furutech outlet and ran it to a dedicated 20 amp circuit. The gain was enormous. I only have my “rig” and oiled tv on this outlet and circuit. It even made tv picture better. Clean power matters. Thanks all along the way |
| Post removed |
My experience with recptacle is similar to @retiredfarmer. These days I am all in with using Furutech receptacles for all high performance equipment including my AV and computer systems. Its not just for audio. The hospital spec is ANSI/UL 498 and CSA CAN/C22.2 No. 42-99, if you want to read it you will find the price to read is about $798. Turns out I have read it as I was involved with meeting UL/CSA as an engineer once upon a time. Here is a link to the UL summary. In addition, I have used the Hubble line of products in power projects such as generator and UPS's. I have also designed high performance power source for the DOD. What I learned is the weakest link always chokes the performance of a system. Which leads to the question what is good enough for you, but it is also a budget question. Check the design of the product you are looking at purchasing. Brass contacts are not going to perform as well as solid OFC. Brass contact will be a choke point if you use them in my opinion. |
@rick2000 -Did you consider the QSA jitterplug prior to buying the duplex outlet? |
The Quantum Science Audio Ultra Black-Red AC Outlets are by far the best I’ve ever tried period ! 😍😃 Not cheap but worth every penny though ! https://www.tweekgeek.com/quantum-science-audio-ultra-black-red-ac-receptacle/ |
I agree with you on an audiophile circuit breaker , using the audiophile forum I found this https://www.akikoaudio.com/en/products/570-05-akiko-audio-cylindric-fuse-cartridge-english . But I believe that this would mainly or possibly only useful if you have a dedicated line but at least the breakers are available at a reasonable cost . |
No, I can't cite a specific example but the same can be said for a duplex. Power is coming from the panel box which is noisy to your outlet. Again, I am not an engineer and no very little about electricity. Where is the source of the noise coming from? Just getting an upgraded outlet is not enough to me. BTW, QSA has upgraded circuit breakers in addition to upgraded outlets. The main attribute of an upgraded circuit breaker would be a cleaner quieter signal. |
I have SR Orange Duplexes and an InaKustic 3500PC and I still have noise. What really needs to happen is for the USA to have an audiophile circuit breaker. I am not an electrical engineer but to me, it would make sense to eliminate noise at the main panel. I have spent countless hours researching this to no avail. It seems Europe and Asia have approved Audio grade Circuit breakers. |
Thanks for the video @mjcmt, I find this stuff interesting from a standpoint of how marketing and audiophile lore, i.e., stories told (not around campfires but) around these forums, have shaped opinions and purchases made by "audiophiles" over the years. I am sitting here with three "audiophile" outlets, or AC receptacles, an older Porter Port, an Acme silver-plated outlet, and the Furutech GTX-D (G). Porter Ports were sold by Albert Porter and consisted of Hubbell outlets that were subjected to a cryogenic process. He originally used the 8300H outlets and later switched to the less expensive 5362W. Acme outlets have expanded to include a variety of styles including a heavy duty model. Common to all Acme outlets are their cryogenic treatment and silver-plated contacts, and a somewhat reasonable price for audiophile stuff. The purpose of an electrical outlet wrt a home audio system is to provide a connection so that electricity can be conducted from your home wiring to your audio equipment power cord. As with any audio connector, this requires a combination of a strong grip and good conductivity. The vast majority of these outlets use copper alloy (i.e., brass) contacts to provide the necessary combination of conductivity and strength. The PS Audio Power Port Classic AC Receptacle uses "15 coats of polished nickel over high-purity brass." The relatively lower strength of pure copper simply wouldn’t hold up to repeated plug/unplug cycles. However, the conductivity of brass is only about 27% of the conductivity of the ETP copper wiring in your wall, based on the IASC rating. Yes, there are several types of brass alloys, but even the most conductive is barely above 30% IASC. In addition, the nickel plating used by PS Audio is only about 24% as conductive as copper, vs. the silver plating used by Acme (106%), or even gold at 76% IACS. One way to look at this situation, which is similar to speaker and IC cables that use less conductive connectors, would be to say the path or area of the connector is much less than that of the intervening copper wiring so the connector should not have as much sonic influence. The audiophile outlook would probably be to say "everything matters", which brings us to the Furutech GTX outlet, which is able to use copper connectors because of a unique spring loading mechanism used to grip the plug blades without requiring repeated strain on the copper contacts themselves. I found this 2003 article from Stereophile where Art Dudley writes about the PS Audio Power Port Classic AC Receptacle. He concluded:
So the improvement was "subtle, yet very real." More campfire talk, IMO. I find it hard to believe that Art Dudley could pick out the difference between the PS Audio Power Port and other receptacles that are mostly the same except for the nickel plating (24% of IASC) used in the PS Audio receptacle. I have an easier time believing the Acme receptacle with silver plating and cryo treatment could possibly make a sonic difference as could the Furutech which uses copper base metal for the contacts. In summary, I agree with @mijostyn, the Hubbell 8300 provides excellent grip of the plug blades, which is one of the two most important jobs of the outlet (grip and conductivity). Only a few receptacles address the conductivity issue such as Furutech (and any others that use copper contacts), or Acme with their silver plating. Making something shiny (i.e., nickel or rhodium) does not make it more conductive. Look at the IASC rating of the metals used in your outlets (and your AC plugs) to assess conductivity. If I were in the market for outlets, I would probably purchase the Hubbell 8300 and be done. If I was willing to pay a little more, I would try Acme’s heavy duty outlet with thick silver plating, and which has been cryogenically treated. If I wanted to spend a lot more, I would use Furutech GTX (G) outlets, which are constructed using copper contacts. However, anything beyond the Hubble 8300 may simply be campfire talk - IMO of course. |
@lak I've learned that all burn in times must meet two criteria. First, it must be a minimum of one day past the return period, and second, it must be long enough that you can't remember what your system sounded like before and your ears hve become 100% accustomed to how the system sounds today & confirmation bias has been established. 🤣🤣🤣 |
Just to end this discussion (for me anyway), I will do my ultimate comparison. I have purchased 70 feet of Romex 10/2 Simpull wire and ordered Furutech GTX-D(R) Duplex Receptacle, FI-32M(R) Plug and 106-D-NFC Receptacle Cover. Now I know the 10/2 adds nothing to the party as 12/2 would provide all the current my system will ever need and the 20 amp breaker can draw, but I found Lowes was selling the 10/2 at a cheaper price than Home Depot was asking for 12/2 so I bought the heavier cable. I will be running the new line out of my mechanical room directly into my garage and up to my listening room. Meeting all code requirements along the way. When done I will be able to demo equipment on 15 amp vs 20 amp. Furutech vs $2 contractor plug, with and without power conditioiner in the loop. This will take about a week but I will make a full report for anyone interested. Open to suggestions on musical selections that may provice the best opportunity to hear the difference. Cheers.
|
I have some Porter Ports here, as well as some Acme Audio Labs Ag Silver Cryo receptacles and one Furutech GTX-D G receptacle. I suspect the differences are subtle and I don't really have a clear preference. As to Rhodium vs. Gold vs. Silver plating, I suspect any potential differences may be due to the level of finish on the plating (polishing?) and maybe also how the current is transferred across the boundary. Maybe the different platings impart a subtle sonic characteristic as some believe they do when used on speaker cable spades, etc. These platings were mostly used for corrosion resistance in the early days, like the tin coating you can still find on some wires and connectors. Other than silver, none of the other common plating materials conduct electricity anywhere near as well as copper, although gold comes closest at 76% IACS. |
Several friends and I use Synergistic Research duplexes. I prefer the blue, my friends have red and black (earlier/different) duplexes. I know that they consist of commercial/industrial grade and relatively inexpensive outlets. They are processed by SR as they say, with a million volts, either once or repeatedly to linearize the metal materials inside and coat them with a substance that includes graphene. They grip fine. My first SR red duplex KILLED my $40+ hospital grade Hubbles. I gave my friend an SR black duplex to replace a cheap dupex-he was overwhelmed at the difference. I have a relatively higher end system and his is very fine as well. I began my journey into duplexes about a decade ago. Sure, SR duplexes aren't cheap, but in three systems including mine, they are a bargain in sound quality improvement over standard duplexes. |
@audition__audio I wasn't trying to be sarcastic. I'm meant what I said. If the improvment in sound is as great as the many, many posters suggest, then I should be able to hear it. Still no one is addressing the elephant in the room. HOW does a wall plug improve the sound when it resides well in front of all the other equipment. HOW does Rhodium alter a sound wave? HOW does gold plating give the music a warmer tone? HOW does any plug increase the bass? Heck, I want to be a believer, but I'd like someone to explain HOW this is possible. I'm running a Hegel H590, Parasouond JC3+ phono pre, Rega P8, Acoustic Zen Crescendo Mark ll, all premium cables. |
I went to Albert Porter's site and there's no mention of any outlets anymore. All the best, |
As a person who works for a utility (currently in Finance, but with enough time on network design/engineering), why? I just don’t get this...
Hospital grade, fine. Clamping ability is great. If $20 makes you sleep better at night, so be it. The contact area of a 12/2 or 14/2 cable is your limiting factor, inside the outlet.
Add to that the clamping area of your neutral and hot on your breakers (smaller) and you’re looking at a choke point there. Most modern boxes aren’t rich in copper from the main to the buss legs. Your neutral and ground are commonly aluminum.
Service entry wire? Is almost entirely aluminum in the states since the 80s (I’m running utilities to my pole barn/pool house on Monday. It’s fed with aluminum, too.)
Show me on an OScope or with a good anechoic chamber measureable sonic changes, I’ll show you a corroded outlet or power cord.
I run $4 Leviton premium outlets from a local supply store. They’ve fed everything from the $120 Sherwood integrated I had in HS to the Gryphon I sold a few years back to the 452 I’m listening to now... Even if I change circuits to a non-home runned, noisy 15a, on a circuit the amp shares with other stuff, a well designated power supply filters it out. Spend the money on a new LP or new cartridge. Buy the $15 hospital grade outlet and move on. If you want to bring your outlet over to my office, we can dust off seven figures of metering equipment; if bet the farm that any 20A outlet fresh out of the box will sound identical...
My advice? Get something UL listed from a major company (Leviton, Legrand, etc.) with solid quality controls and a good reputation. I’d bank on solid EE principles over smoke and mirrors anyday.
Current is current. If it’s rated greater than your amp needs, you’re fine. |
bigtwin My point is that I conducted a hearing shootout and heard a difference , some equipment is easier to do a/b or a/b/c/d testing . Using an electrical box that holds 4 outlets made the experiment easy , I've done hearing experiments with fuses on a guitar amp and multiple power cords connected to my amplifier . As a retired Biomedical equipment technician I once thought that an outlet was just an outlet other than the Medical Grade outlets had a firmer grip and much heavier body , that a fuse was just a fuse and a power cord just needed to be the correct gauge and jacket . The only time extra filters were needed was when using EEG and EKG equipment . But as an audiophile I learned that differences can be heard with any change made, that doesn't mean that you need an outlet that is the most expensive , a fuse that cost more than a good bottle of Scotch or a power cord that cost as much as a used car to hear a difference or improvement . Gold plating and Rhodium over Silver plating does have a effect , subtle but there . So much of this one has to hear it to believe it , just I learned through trial and error. |
