I have the VA Liszt. I find that they have an organic sound that is detailed but if you are looking for a highly resolving speaker, this isn't it. I listened to about 10 different speakers before I settled on these. They are very "musical" especially with instruments that can grate on you in the upper frequencies. I always test with violin music, jazz & vocals, symphonic orchestras and rock. It's difficult to find a speaker that can do it all well. If I had more money to spend and a larger room, the Joseph Audio Pearls and Rockport Atria's come to mind. They are very nice. |
There are new versions out there of the Beethoven Baby Grand and Grand. I don't remember hearing anything about them from reviewers or forum posters. I agree with @goose that the Liszt is a truly excellent speaker. I don't know if the revisions to the two Beethoven models were carried down or up the whole VA line. |
I have had several customers who have heard them at another dealer share their POV on the Beethoven Baby Grand and Grand. To say they were rave reviews understates the customers POV on them. They have new drivers that are flat and offer more detail while retaining the essential character of VA. It improves time alignment and gives a more unified presentation from what was already and very good speaker on that basis. I am hearing such good things I am seriously considering buying samples and taking on the line. |
I have owned the Haydn Grand and older Beethovens. I really liked them when I first heard them. They were really easy to listen to, but over time they were a little too warm and recessed for me, and frankly, rather boring compared to the Kefs, Thiels, and Harbeths I own now. I haven't listened to their higher end models, perhaps they have a little more "personality". They make beautiful speakers, they just weren't for me. |
Very well built, finish is amazing.
Wish I had the Beethoven grands.
On list of unaffordable items to buy |
I remember those speakers… they were very good.
“Can a speaker be on the warm side and still detailed?“
Yes… and importantly so can a system. In my view it should. If a system highlights the detail too much it becomes too analytical and takes the focus off the music and puts it on details. This topic has popped up elsewhere… but when you go to the symphony you are not immediately shocked my the amount of detail… it is all there, but not spotlighted.
It has taken me over forty years to finally get that balance right so the music comes first and the detail is there with appropriate emphasis and warm natural sounding. |
Well now, there is a little love. :-)
Same as big greg that they are not my go-to anymore. Really enjoying my LRS ride right now. Two totally different flavors. But I am having fun with the old Bach Grands. So much so that I might look into one of their bigger models. Almost went for the Mozarts years ago. No dealers near me carrying VA anymore.
Thanks for the replies |
I have Mahlers "upstairs" and love them. I knew nothing about them before i stumbled on this pair. With a little attention they are extraordinarily transparent. And have real bass extension. Can be very room / setup dependent and are finicky about being driven - they reveal what they are given, good or bad.
|
as to detail vs warm. never confuse an over-ly forward treble with detail. It just creams it at you, like SNL's version of closed captioning for that hearing impaired. real detail comes from resolution, a lack of maskng resonances, and a very low noise floor.
The "rising treble makes for details" school is why i hate so many MC cartridges and in fact speakers in general. yes I'm talking to you Sonus Faber.
|
I've got pairs of Bach and Mozart Grands. I got them for super cheap when Best Buy dropped them 10+ years ago. The Mozarts are currently serving as computer speakers on each side of my desk. Powered by a Creek 5350SE and an Audioquest Dragonfly DAC. This is a great setup. The small bass drivers lack punch and definition in big rooms and from a normal distance. This isn't a problem nearfield, though.
I was told that VA are designed to sound best in smaller, more solidly built rooms. That is what is most common in Europe. In my experience they are extremely room and placement sensitive. They can be very satisfying in the right situation and really bad in the wrong one. They're not neutral. |
The Baby Grand is a very fine loudspeaker.
Happy Listening! |
Just had another great session with the Bachs. Again, the imaging is fantastic. They will be staying downstairs for a while I think! Amazing little speakers IMO.
Thanks again |
Presently running Vienna Acoustics The Music speakers. A full sounding speaker with a tremendous sound stage. They do best in a big room several feet from the wall, and sure excel on female voices and jazz. A great sounding speaker, however it needs to be set up properly. |
The “Tweeter” store era VA’s beethovens found their way home where they reside in my ht room now, but for 10 years they were in the listening room, (read basement:). They have better resolution than the strauss and are awesome with jazz. The speaker is obviously tuned by ear instead of a mic and with the right music really makes magic, but they can’t play loud and the recessed midrange gets frustrating with some music. I missed the chance to land a pair of “the Music” for $11k locally because fellow owners told me my h360 wouldn’t have enough juice to drive them. ‘Shoulda tried. |
Hmmmm, yes I think the h360 probably would have done the trick. That's what I am using on the Bachs right now. Those 'the Music' look stunning. Would love to hear them! |
Yes, the HEGEL 360 would have done the trick, however the THE MUSICS like the juice. I am pushing 800 watts per chanel on mine and they love it. Too bad you missed that $11,000 deal. That was a bargain! |
How much more juice do the Musics need that their predecessor the Mahlers? While they can use it, I've driven mine with my prototype integrated amp that has less than 35 wpc (but unconditionally stable and very high peak current). In normal use i have two amps sitting right there that can be used as 60 wpc "kinda class A" stero (1) or 240wpc monos (2). I rarely go to the trouble of driving them as monos - i part because it complicate testing but also because the benefit is modest.
|
I have not had a pair of the Mahler so I cannot compare. All I know is that THE MUSIC speakers have a sensitivity of 91 and are 4 ohm. The owners manual specifies amps 50 to 500 watts are needed. Like any other descent speaker, as long as you pushing clean power they will take what ever you give them. I would be more afraid of low wattage, low current amps which could have a tendency to clip. |
actually then the mahlers are a tougher load 89 or 90 dB i believe.
thanks
a 91 dB speaker is not that difficult. the 4 ohms means it must be a real power amp, btu these are $25k speakers after all.
|
I have a set of Schonberg’s (as well as the matching Subson subwoofer) that I’ll probably never sell. I love the way the perform, look and how they take up very little floor space. I had a set in black years ago, but I now have a set in silver. If I could find another set in black, I’d buy them as well.
|
@big_greg I had the same reaction to the other models in the VA line up until I heard the Liszt. It's encouraging if they have made some design changes because I felt they were OK, but kind or boring. |
