@audiofound I have heard both the int250 and Diablo 300 but not in the same system. What would you say is the sonic difference?
After years of separates, I'm going integrated. Anyone else do the same?
I'm rethinking my listening room. I want my audio rack to be more minimalist vs lots of boxes, wires, and clutter. I know separates, in general, will sound better. However, at the level of my system, I'm not certain the difference would be as apparent. In the grand scheme of things of Audiophilia, my level of components are mid-fi at best (BHK Pre, First Watt J2, Elac PPA-2 phono, Pro-ject s2 Dac, ZU Omen Defs)
I'm favoring one of the Luxman Class A's (I know Luxman is getting out of the Class A business. The only way I would favor a built-in Dac is if it were upgradable like McIntosh or Accuphase. I'm guessing a Luxman or Mac built-in phono would sound just as good as to what I have now (Elac PPA-2).
So the question is, who else has gone to integrated? Do you regret the move or are you glad you did?
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I have used separates for many years but like you approx. 6 months ago I sold most of it and purchased a Luxman 509x and I'm over the moon with it. I have a Bada CD player, Garrard 301, Elac Miracord 90, Line Magnetic DAC LM-32, Bluesound Vault and Tannoy Glenairs. The system never sounded better. Now I just listen to music, the critic has left the room. BTW the phono stage in the Luxman is fantastic. Good luck with your search. |
I auditioned 7 different high end integrated amps before settling on my Pass Labs int 250. Other amps I auditioned are the Hegel H590, Gryphon Diablo 300, Moon 340ix, Luxman 509X, VAC 170i, and Naim Supernait 3. They ALL sounded outstanding. But my ears really liked the int 250, with my system. My other components include...Harbeth Super HL+ 40th Anniversary speakers, MSB Discrete DAC Dual Power Supply, Roon Nucleus lifetime license, Focal Stellia headphones, Naim Uniti Atom Headphone Edition headphone amp, streamer, music player. I'm extremely happy with my system. It fits my needs and application perfectly. Very sweet sounding system from top to bottom. |
@rick2000 at $50K plus I would hope.
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I gave up on separates. You must have the correct cables, you must have the correct tubes and to get synergy with all the components was so much fun. (Sarcasm). Then, the system must be running for a half an hour before it sounded it’s best. Plus for me using all Schiit gear, You have to reach the back of each unit to find the power switch, and they have so few features. So I went with an integrated from a brand I used to know, Parasound. The Hint 6. 160 wpc. Built in dac, phono, headphone amp and analog bass management for a sub. Plus a lot of other features, but the sonics are quite good. Recently I found out it made Stereophile’s recommended list for 2020. |
I got so sick of the merry-go-round that I bought a Accuphase E600 years ago. It's pleasant to listen to and I don't crank tunes loud any longer. My dog is old, my wife and I are in our mid 50's. I lost the ambition to chase the perfect sound, I like my Accuphase integrated, CDP and tuner and I'm just rolling with it. When I got into the hobby at the age of 14, I never imagined I'd have what I have now. That said, I'm surprised at how good some of the gear I had sounded early on. Most notably, NAD. There was also a time when I had to recover from Rotel separates with a Rogue Cronus Magnum that was like being cured from a disease. If I could cure the audio world of a disease, it would be Rotel. |
My Sansui AU 7700 is integrated if the switch is "on" and separated if the switch is "off"... my repairman and all reviews said that the pre-amp section is very good, but anyway i am curious to try it one day with a tube pre-amp Berning Zotl..... 😁😊 Pure curiosity! I dont need to upgrade but reading all about the Berining ZOTL many years ago made me curious....
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I am about go with the Rogue Audio Pharaoh II integrated to replace my Rogue RP-1 preamp and McIntosh MC2120–I am the Mc’s original owner since 1980 and had it refurbed about ten years ago. I’m driving Fyne Audio F702s from Apple Lossless and a NAD C568, via a Schiit Bifrost 2 DAC. The speakers sound great but not quite as good as at the dealer’s, where it they were driven by a 250+ watt amp. They really “open up” at moderately high volume, so I think a bit more power would be helpful. The soundstage is wonderful in terms of depth and lateral dispersion, and I am actually hearing things in well- known pieces that I did. It hear in my earlier system—NAD C356BEE driving Infinity Modulus satellites (with EMIT tweeter) with a sub. Also, one less piece of equipment, and a bit less expensive, with the Pharaoh II at 250 wpc vs their DragoN at 300 wpc. Once I make the move, I’ll give a report. |
One other integrated to consider is the Aesthetix Mimas integrated. You can add a phono card and a DAC card but they are both optional. When I bought mine I compared, in my system, Hegel 360, Luxman 590, Ayre AX-5/20, Ayre EX-8. I almost bought the EX-8 as I liked that one the best until I heard the Mimas. It’s extremely musical with great dynamics and a very detailed midrange. I have the DAC card in mine and will be adding the phono card next. Overall the best integrated I’ve heard. I had Aesthetix separates for many years as well as a balanced pair of Quicksilver V4's with a Calypso preamp before going with an integrated amp. First the Ayre AX-7e and then the Mimas. All great sounding products but I find the Mimas a great fit in my current system. Also, unlike some the products suggested, Aesthetix gear is easily serviced in the US should any issues arise. I would not go back to separates for any reason now. If you have a dealer who will let you try it in your system I would recommend it. Good Luck! |
I am sure that I'll be going for integrated in about 10 years when I think I would lose much of my hearing capability. Also, for convenience and space. No vinyls, no CDs, strictly digital streaming. I don't think I can handle adjusting VTF, ... on my turntables any more by then. I might go for all in one system (except for speakers). |
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Riviera Audio Labs Levante Hybrid Review https://www.6moons.com/audioreview_articles/riviera-levante/ |
OP: I want my audio rack to be more minimalist vs lots of boxes, wires, and clutter. In that direction, I've a music server and a DAC/preamp box on one stand, 2 active floor-stander speakers....done. Digital cable from server to DAC, XLR from DAC to speakers.....done. I cannot simply any further and still be in the game. |
There is nothing wrong with integrateds, it takes the guess work out of matching a preamp to power amp and eliminates some cabling. The only thing is you need to buy one that don't share the same power supply unless that power supply is way over-built. As such I couldn't find one that could deliver the goods like my separates but as far as sound quality they are there, |
This is more complicated than it appears for me. I got a nice integrated with a 12AX7 in the phono stage. I have had fun playing with different tubes to tailor the sound. I also still have my tube preamp and amp. The Pre and amp also allow me to tube roll and try different amps with the preamp and then there is the question of what cable to use and how it will affect the sound. These are quite close in tonality and inner detail, spaciousness etc but the slight nod goes to the separates. If Only had the integrated I'd not miss anything but knowing the other set is slightly better is an annoyance. heh. Audiophile neurosis. Guess I'll keep both depending on my mood and the speakers. |
"If you wish to retire your Pass power amp (if you had it) at 1/3 price, I will take it. Let me know please." I've been down this road. I had an Aleph 5 that I still kick myself for selling. I doubt I'll ever part with the XA-60.5s. I'm not one to keep gear when I've made a decision to move on, but those mono blocks will be an exception. "Whatever you do we all cheer for you." I appreciate this sentiment and share it. There a many paths to striving for audio nirvana. |
My first amp was a Marantz 1060 that I bought in 1972. After that I had separates from HK, McIntosh, Apt, Luxman, Adcom and several more until last year. Moving into a new house the clutter of separates had a SAF of 0.00. And while the audiophile in me really wanted a Luxman or Mark Levinson 5805, cost overruns on the house meant compromising my turntable budget or my amp. After much research, hand wringing, and reality checking, I pulled the trigger on a Marantz PM7000N. I have no regrets. What I saved easily covered my VPI Prime Scout and Hana SH. There's very little the PM7000 cannot do, and for my listening a solid 60-80 eatts is adequate. Do I still dream about that Mark Levinson? Sure. But the bottom line is the simplicity and value of integrated amps across the board is unbeatable. |
I started with an integrated years ago then decided to try separates to make a change and experiment a little. Well, that lasted about 2 years then back to an integrated (Luxman). I think that's going to be it for me. My set up is very simple---not a lot of cables to mess with either. Spend the extra money and get a good, high quality integrated and you'll have it for many, many years.Enjoy and good luck! |
Did he recommend or say anything about the INT 250? If out of Pass Labs, there are many other high quality integrateds that may provide the body and weight while retaining the refinement and detail. Vitus RI-101mk2 or one of the Class A options may be a contender. Costly though. One would never know until he listens to the gear in the system. |
I explored moving from my Pass XP-22 and XA-60.5s to the INT 60. (I also have the XP-17 phono stage.) So, I reached out to Kent @Pass for his thoughts. (I've know him for a quite while.) He basically said it could be viable but in terms of sonic bliss, body and weight the integrated wouldn't match those separates. So, I decided to keep 'em separated. I think, like most of this stuff, it really depends on the room, your speakers and the rest of your gear. However if I were just starting out, I would go the integrated route and build around it. We can debate whether they equal separates in terms of sonics, but they can certainly be more economical. |
