We Need A Separate Forum for Fuses

ptss - Definitely disappointing when (some) gents can’t remain focused on the positive aspects of a topic :(

+1

kosst_amojan
Your imagination makes more difference than any fuse. Some seem to like pouring crazy money into their imaginations. Drugs work better than fuses.

>>>>>So sayeth the Flashback Kid. Got them old flashback blues?

>>>>>I predict the other drug addict posts just about ....now! 😬 I can’t decide which would be better for you two. An intervention or a deprogrammer. 

And I didn’t predict the appropriate response is "not allowed". 😮

Gdhal
Why so surprised?
Did you really think that all the blarney on the "other" fuse thread went unheeded or unnoticed by the powers that be.

uberwaltz - Gdhal, Why so surprised? Did you really think that all the blarney on the "other" fuse thread went unheeded or unnoticed by the powers that be.

Well, one of my posts was simply stating today's current news event.... as in a famous comedian being found guilty..... no need - IMO - to delete what is already in the public domain.....hence my surprise  😥

uberwaltz - Gdhal, Why so surprised? Did you really think that all the blarney on the "other" fuse thread went unheeded or unnoticed by the powers that be.

Even more surprising - to me anyway - is how a post from kosst_amojan is deleted, yet a post by someone else who quotes the post by kosst_amojan remains.

I’m surprised you’re not surprised 🤗 😆

gdhal

Its simple really

Its just a huge conspiracy........

I didn’t do nothin’! 😬

I hate to judge too quickly but it appears the Naysayers and Pseudo Skeptics have settled on drugs and psychological effects as their final answer.

I hate to judge too quickly but it appears those who believe in and sell voodoo are acting out on their delusional tendencies by having to have the last word. 😆

Good one, spaceman! 👨‍🚀 What are you, like 15? You obviously don’t get it. I always get the last word. It’s the custom.

geoffkait - You obviously don’t get it. I always get the last word. It’s the custom.

One reason I’ve been in communication with Audiogon is to try and change - as in prevent - that though. 😁 Reminder: Withdrawal can be very painful 😩

I’m going to do something I don’t usually do and that’s help out the pseudo skeptics. There is such a thing as placebo effect, probably most applicable to medical applications rather than audio, but I give you that. There is such a thing as expectation bias, also. I’ll grant you that. And the variations like reverse expectation bias. However, those “psychological” effects can be relatively easily eliminated by careful testing. So, it’s illogical to use those effects to explain ALL positive results which is the standard pseudo skeptic line. i should also point out those “psychological effects” - placebo and expectation bias - are essentially tricks of the mind, or “psyching yourself out.” I.s., they are conscious effects!

As opposed to more interesting and more difficult to explain “psychological effects” evident in Peter Belt products like Silver Rainbow Foil and Cream Electret. Those two audio products operate on a different “psychological level” than placebo effect or expectation bias. They do affect the sound but not in the conventional sense, as they do not affect the audio signal anywhere, they are not dampers or RFI inhibitors, or have any affect on wiring or cabling anywhere in the room. Most importantly, the subconscious influence of the Peter Belt products, unlike placebo and expectation bias, can’t (repeat can’t) be eliminated by careful testing. They are subconscious and or physical. So they must be real. 

geoffkait

There is such a thing as placebo effect, probably most applicable to medical applications rather than audio, but I give you that. There is such a thing as expectation bias, also. I’ll grant you that ... those “psychological” effects can be relatively easily eliminated by careful testing

Absolutely 100 percent agreed. It is stunning that those who claim science is on their side don’t also agree.

So, it’s illogical to use those effects to explain ALL positive results which is the standard pseudo skeptic line.

It’s fair to question positive results. It’s even fair to question all of the positive results. But to reject all such reports based solely on belief and in the absence of any testing is just silly, and certainly not scientific. This is very basic science.

cleeds - It’s fair to question positive results.

Absolutely. This is why it behooves those who claim to hear an improvement when an ordinary fuse/wire is reversed to be honest with themselves and do a blind test (i.e. a test where ones ears are the only sensory organ involved). 👂

No, it does not behoove anyone to do any such thing. To behoove is to state that it is the responsibility or duty for a person to do something. That is flat out ridiculous on it's face.  No one owes you anything save for relating what they hear(d). 

If you doubt it, it is your responsibility to test it for yourself, which you consistently refuse to do. 

All the best,
Nonoise

cleeds - It’s fair to question positive results.

gdhal Absolutely. This is why it behooves those who claim to hear an improvement when an ordinary fuse/wire is reversed to be honest with themselves and do a blind test (i.e. a test where ones ears are the only sensory organ involved)

I think those reporting what they hear are being completely honest. They have no obligation to provide additional substantiation to you at all. You can continue to repeat your demands that others do such testing, but it's pretty clear they're not going to comply.  Of course, you're free to conduct your own tests. If you do, please share the protocol and results here. it could be part of what you call being honest.

There are those who think others "owe" them something. In your case, gdhal, you insist others owe you some kind of "proof" that you deem acceptable. It's odd that you think that way, rather than simply just use your judgment to dismiss claims you find dubious.

 

nonoise

To behoove is to state that it is the responsibility or duty for a person to do something. That is flat out ridiculous on it's face.  No one owes you anything save for relating what they hear(d).

If you doubt it, it is your responsibility to test it for yourself, which you consistently refuse to do.

Exactly. It is no more complicated than that. It is just such a puzzle that those who claim the mantel of science resist conducting themselves a valid test to substantiate their claims, or to even discuss here how such a test might be conducted. It's difficult for me to imagine it's for any reason other than to be argumentative.

^Well, I thought I made it clear that I'm not demanding anything (i.e. no one owes me any proof, etc.) to support the impossible. Hearing a difference when an ordinary fuse/wire is reversed falls into the category of impossible, by my definition. And, by your own statements, I don't need to submit any proof what-so-ever that it is in fact impossible.

Just pointing out that one should be honest *with themselves*. If you truly believe and are content with "I hear a difference" irrespective of anything else, then more power to you. Besides, it's your money.

Speaking of which..... 

@geoffkait

"I’m going to do something I don’t usually do and that’s help out the pseudo skeptics."

Holy crap Geoff, is it Backwards Day? Since you are being charitable with your knowledge today, can you please explain what is this "careful testing"? Is this the opposite of "reckless testing"? Does one need to conduct "careful testing" when evaluating products that,

"do affect the sound but not in the conventional sense, as they do not affect the audio signal anywhere"

There is obviously a lot involved with this audio stuff....

psychological effects
placebo effects
expectation bias
tricks of the mind
psyching yourself out
pseudo skeptic line
conscious effects
subconscious influences
physical effects

Will tomorrow’s lesson include metaphysical effects?
What if I just want to turn on my stereo and listen?

^Well, I thought I made it clear that I'm not demanding anything 

Then why state that it behooves someone to do so?

Hearing a difference when an ordinary fuse/wire is reversed falls into the category of impossible, by my definition

Good for you. We think otherwise.

And, by your own statements, I don't need to submit any proof what-so-ever that it is in fact impossible

Goose and gander. If you really believe that, then stop saying we have a duty to.

Just pointing out that one should be honest *with themselves*

That's flat out insulting and it's about time you stop with this moral high ground of yours, implying we're not being honest with ourselves. It's so passive-aggressive and possibly, a projection on your part.

All the best,
Nonoise

@nonoise 

Look, I'm truly sorry if my written replies offend you in any way.

Have you considered that "Ain't nobody messin' with you but you"?

@gdhal 

A troll is a troll is a troll.

I don't think, for a moment, that you over did things back in the days but just enjoy talking in circles, contradicting yourself, raising trolling to an art form.

All the best,
Nonoise

nonoise - A troll is a troll is a troll.

@geoffkait 

This is your queue.

You beat me to it, spaceman. 👨‍🚀

Yikes!
Talking of impossible.
My everyday paying job, you know as opposed to running round in ever decreasing circles here, involves doing the mathematically impossible every single minute of every single day.
Seriously.
Note I stated mathematically impossible.
Theory can sometimes be bent a little.
I will not bore anybody with the details but it is one reason I take a lot of this stuff with a very open mind.

gdhal

Well, I thought I made it clear that I'm not demanding anything

Huh? You have repeated numerous times statements such as this:

it behooves those who claim to hear an improvement when an ordinary fuse/wire is reversed to be honest with themselves and do a blind test

be·hoove bəˈho͞ov/verb formal ...

1. it is a duty or responsibility for someone to do something; it is incumbent on.

So perhaps it's time for you to by honest with yourself, gdhal.
 

@cleeds 

Look, I'm truly sorry if my written replies offend you in any way.

Have you considered that "Ain't nobody messin' with you but you"?

gdhal

@cleeds

Look, I’m truly sorry if my written replies offend you in any way.

Have you considered that "Ain’t nobody messin’ with you but you"?

Huh? I’m not the slightest bit offended by you. If offense was your objective, it’s unfortunate that you’ve been disappointed. Perhaps it’s time for you to be honest with yourself, gdhal.

cleeds - If offense was your objective, it's unfortunate that you've been disappointed.

@geoffkait 

This is your queue.

It's deja vu all over again. A specialty of trolls.

nonoise - It's deja vu all over again.

I've highly recommended Amy > Bob > Amy > Bob, however, Amy > CSNY  > Amy > CSNY is acceptable.

gdhal
cleeds - If offense was your objective, it's unfortunate that you've been disappointed.

@geoffkait

This is your queue

>>>>>Did someone hit you in the head with a queue stick, spaceman? 👨‍🚀

Somebody has really lost the plot big time here......
My head is spinning!

uberwaltz - Somebody has really lost the plot big time here......
My head is spinning!

That would be Geoff. Not only has he fallen completely out-of-queue, he missed the questions mitch2 has posed. 🤓

Well blow me.
Here was silly ol me thinking this was a fuse thread.....

I've highly recommended Amy > Bob > Amy > Bob, however, Amy > CSNY  > Amy > CSNY is acceptable. 

That would make as much sense as Bob > Carol > Ted > Alice.
Just another way to keep on trollin' mama.

All the best,
Nonoise

nonoise - That would make as much sense as Bob > Carol > Ted > Alice.

It makes more sense than your current listening criteria to verify after-market fuse worthiness, which is nothing more than "I hear a difference".

What more requirements does a buyer and user of an aftermarket fuse NEED than that they can hear a difference?
Even if it is a small difference then $60 to $200 is a very small price for a worthwhile tweak.
It is up to the individual if they feel it was worthwhile.
Sorry but I listen to music not science

uberwaltz - What more requirements does a buyer and user of an aftermarket fuse NEED than that they can hear a difference?

Nothing, unless you're not looking to be as honest with yourself as you could otherwise be.

uberwaltz - Sorry but I listen to music not science.

No apology necessary. Listening to music is more than many others have professed though. Good for you. Keep in mind I've offered you music, and I have yet to read/hear back from you.

nonoise - Why aren’t you trolling all the other threads on the above mentioned gear and having at it?

To begin with, I’m not trolling. In any case, if you consider my replies trolling, that is your business. Unfortunately, site "rules" do not allow me to respond adequately to your question. Suffice it to say, however, that the U.S. is a great place to visit in the summertime.

I thought trolls were self aware. My bad.

Yes, the U.S is a great place to visit. I've met people from other countries that love the U.S., during any season.

All the best,
Nonoise

I've used the Black SR fuses in most of my electronics for a year or two.

They aren't either a gift or snake oil, but somewhere in between.

Some sound improvement, but with 6 fuses in my amp, it's almost a grand to outfit it...not sure that the improvement was worth a grand in retrospect.

My amp blew a fuse...which one(s)?...I don't know...I can't see the filament in the SR fuses.

Wasn't willing to swap one fuse in and out to troubleshoot as I have to disconnect cables, pull the amp from the rack, take the bottom & top of my amp off to do that...and doing that 6 times or more, right...

So, I just replaced them all with clear glass fuses. The sound? Not as "organic" as with the SR fuses, perhaps, but not all that different.

I like the sound improvement of SR fuses, but the usability/practicality leaves a bit to be desired. 

I'll leave the SR fuses in the other equipment, but I won't be buying any more of them.

nonoise
Why aren’t you trolling all the other threads on the above mentioned gear and having at it?

Again with the troll card, is that all you have when you fuse "snake oil" BS get’s challenged.

And +1  kosst_amojan for your post.

Cheers George

+1

@kosst_amojan