I won my fantasy football league and have $4-5K burning a hole in my pocket. I am considering a new turntable to replace my OG Technics 1200 M3D. Is it possible to get one at this price point that can be the last one I'll ever want/need? Looking at 1200G because of the familiarity, but is it better to get one with easier future tonearm changes. I know audiophiles generally don't settle on anything forever, but I feel like a great turntable can do the job for years beyond most other equipment.
I would love to take home a GR and a G and compare them to the 1200 M3D. I need to find a local dealer who sells both.
@ronribbonsyour your turntable is not M3D like you posted many times by mistake, it’s MK 3D to be correct.
Any old Technics in SL1200 series will be blown away by new GR or G, no questions here, it’s a new coreless motor and tonearm, and completely new turntable (another level), your old mk3D was about $450 new 20 years ago , but SL1200G is $4000 !
Isn't the Technics 1500C a $1500.00 turntable? How is it anywhere close to the SL1200G @$4000.00? The 1500 C motor is not the same as the SL1200G motor, it is a much cheaper version and the tonearm certainly isn't made of magnesium.
All good info that I did not know since I am not a musician and don’t listen to classical music. I have never felt the need for, nor have I missed having a pitch control. Apparently, I’m not the only TT user who feels that way, otherwise Technics would not have bothered to produce the 1500C.
Pitch control on Technics is a great feature, a bonus. People like you might think it will harm something, but it’s not. You will find pitch control on all top class Japanese turntables (Denon, Victor .... ).
Also, if pitch control is that important, I’m left to wonder why it’s not a standard feature on all audiophile class turntables. In my musical world, pitch control is what Pete Townsend used to make sure his guitar hit his amp properly!
How many Direct Drive audiophile class turntables do you know, except for Technics today ?
Actually Technics made some great turntables without pitch control too (like my ex SP-10 mkII or SP-20 for example). My current reference Luxman PD-444 does not have a pitch control and I miss this option.
Anyway, Technics made 1500c not even in Japan, it’s cheaper simpler and affordable model. The pitch is on their Made in Japan $4k SL1200G (and on GAE too).
The 1500c looks nice, I just want to explain what is a pitch control and why it’s NOT only for DJs.
I demo'ed a 1200 years ago and didn't think it was particularly special. Neither did the customer who upgraded it.
Which 1200 did you audition? We're talking about NEW high-end turntables introduced in 2018, the name is SL1200G and the price is about $4k.
You are talking about something you auditioned years ago ? Customers upgraded what ? There is nothing to upgrade, for those who would like to get on the next level Technics made SP-10R for $10k just for the drive @jrussell88
I demo'ed a 1200 years ago and didn't think it was particularly special. Neither did the customer who upgraded it.
If you get the chance try any Roksan t/t. Original Xerxes is a steal on eBay. I'd even buy it unheard, as it's a no brainer, and if you decide to move on you can sell it for what you paid.
chakster All good info that I did not know since I am not a musician and don't listen to classical music. I have never felt the need for, nor have I missed having a pitch control. Apparently, I'm not the only TT user who feels that way, otherwise Technics would not have bothered to produce the 1500C. Also, if pitch control is that important, I'm left to wonder why it's not a standard feature on all audiophile class turntables. In my musical world, pitch control is what Pete Townsend used to make sure his guitar hit his amp properly!
Eric, don't know about another league? I've learned a fair amount from listening to folks like you and others. From experience I have learned (not always good) I attempt to get what I can afford and "try" to be done with it. That Zupreme is a nice headshell! I think I'm going to try the Achromat, not sure if I want to use the stock headshell or something else? For sure I will share the VDH combo. It probably won't all come together until mid to late Jan.
I recently upgraded to a Technics 1500C and It's definitely my forever TT. Everything there is to love about a Technics TT minus all the DJ foofaraws.
I'm afraid what you call "DJ foofaraws" is a Pitch Control and this feature is more than you can imagine. You must be a musician to understand what is the pitch and why it's critical. I'm sure Technics explained this recently too.
Some people don't understand why there is a pitch control on High-End turntables, for most of them pitch associated with DJ turntables only. In reality pitch control is an amazing feature for reference class turntables and critical listening sessions too! JVC/Victor engineers explained very well why there is a pitch control on TT-101 (for example):
"The pitch, "A" is standardized at 440Hz according to international standards, and is the standard for all western musical instruments. In other words, the tuning of all instruments of the orchestra is based on this pitch. But in reality, the basic tuning pitch of each orchestra differs due to the instrumentation and individual characteristics of each orchestra, as well as the personality of the conductor. The diagram shows such differences by orchestra. Most of the pitches range within +/- 6Hz of 400Hz. To reproduce these subtly different pitches, a quality turntable with highly accurate rotation is required. Another important requirement is the possibility of minute speed adjustment. If the speed of a turntable could be adjusted to the individual pitch used by an orchestra while at the same time remaining controlled by a quartz-locked servo system, the benefits of flexibility and precision would be significant from a musicological viewpoint. For this reason the TT-101 is equipped with built-in speed-control facilities which can adjust the pitch in 1Hz steps within a range of +/- 6Hz or 440Hz. The difference of pitches between master tape recorders and disc record cutting machines has been intentionally ignored before but now the speed of a record can be adjusted to match the original pitch of the orchestra, even if the master was recorded differently from the original performance. For example, a performance of the NHK Symphony Orchestra on the record can be adjusted to match the pitch of the same performance on a record by the London Symphony Orchestra, for the enjoyment of critical comparison." The "A" key of a piano in your home is usually tuned to 440Hz. When you practice the piano while playing back a record, you can adjust the pitch of the record, to be in perfect tune with your piano.
Happy hunting! It will definitely be worth waiting for.
As time goes by it will be ripe for upgrades such as an improved record mat and/or tonearm.
Regarding mats, I believe the late Art Dudley had it right, “The thick rubber record mat, unrepentantly gray, is simply the finest and best-sounding mat I've used. (I tried it on my Garrard 301, whose stock mat was shamed in the comparison.)” https://www.stereophile.com/content/luxman-pd-171-record-player No additional clamp or weight required.
Ammonite Audio and SoundSupports out of the UK offer several options of armboards for tonearm upgrades should you decide to take it further down the road.
I recently upgraded to a Technics 1500C and It's definitely my forever TT. Everything there is to love about a Technics TT minus all the DJ foofaraws. Rock solid at all three speeds with end of play arm lift, and sounds fantastic with a Ortofon 2M Bronze and Schiit Mani. It shares a lot of the same mechanics as the 1200 series for a lot less dinero. Use the $2800 you save to buy the stylus/cart of your dreams!
Before I got the Achromat, I tried the Herbie's mat. I felt that the Herbie's was an improvement over the stock rubber mat. Based on various recommendations I decided to try the Achromat. The result was a more detailed presentation than the Herbies and the stock mat. I did AB comparisons to the best of my ability and settled on the Achromat.
The first Achromat I received was warped and Music Direct was very cooperative in handling an exchange.
I use the stock headshell with a Hana SL and Pass XP-15.
I have a LP Gear Zupreme Headshell that I may use in the future with a different cartridge.
Jake, you are in a different league with the Van Den Hul cartridge and preamp. Let us know how you like the music.
Before the SL1200GAE (and later G) was announced for the fist time, a "forever Technics" was the SP-10mk3 (and cheaper mk2) with Technics EPA-100 mk2 (or cheaper EPA-100) tonearms.
I first tried a Herbie’s Way Excellent II mat, but felt that it colored the sound too much. So I tried a ~5mm acrylic mat that was sold by a fellow with a special recipe (no longer available, because the resin compounder no longer makes it, apparently), and I liked this a lot better. I then tried it on top the Herbie’s mat, and that sounded the best to me, and that is what I have been riding with ever since. I am not convinced that an ordinary acrylic mat wouldn’t do the same service, but I haven’t investigated that.
ericsch How are you liking that Achromat? i have heard good things in regards to the Achromat. How does it differentiate from the stock rubber mat? Are you using the stock headshell and what cartridge are you using? I ordered my 1200G, going with Van Den Hul DDT2 Special, with a VAN Den Hul Grail.
While I’m sure one can buy an even better tt, I think you’d have to spend a whole lot more money to do so. I run a 1200G that Ralph modified to fit a 12” Triplanar arm, and it is great sounding to my ears. I have never heard such pure, steady tonality from piano notes or organ pipes before from LP’s, which is a testament to it’s speed stability. And it plays very even-handedly across the frequency spectrum. It reveals plenty of information in a “whole” musical manner. For the money, it’s a great tt.
You will want to try better options for the platter mat, however. The supplied rubber one sucks, IME. I also prefer using a center weight and peripheral ring to seat the vinyl securely against the mat surface, so the cartridge induced vibrations can dissipate well.
I have a 1200 GAE. It is likely my forever table, and it is certainly worthy of fitting that bill for me. Previously I had a Roksan and an Origin Live, which were belt driven lovely tables, but persnickety. The Technics is rock solid.
I do wish Technics tweaked the aesthetics a bit as it does look like the classic 1200s from yesteryears.
Setup, stability, sonics, ruggedness of this unit are all superb.
If I were looking again I'd likely still be looking at Luxman and Technics. There's something valuable about their precision, no nonsense designs. I think it's really difficult to fault these newer Technics designs. They really do not do anything wrong, and they sound wonderful.
The 1200G is just really hard to beat. Many like the colored sound of a belt drive as I do from time to time. I still have my belt drive I listen to on occasion but I do 99 percent of my listening to the 1200G. It just has the drive that you would have to pay substantially more for in a belt drive, like upwards of 20K
Yeah, it's a forever turntable. I love my 1200G. I've had my 1200mk2 for 16 years and I can actually feel the improvement in the gimbal bearings. Just lifting the 1200G tonearm is noticeably different experience than the 1200mk2.
Cannot get over the DJ look of the technics. I don't find it to be as appealing. That's just me...although I have no doubt that it's a quality table. I'd say the Linn is more so a lifetime table in my eyes at least.
Mounting the new arm is very easy. The base simply sits next to the turntable. This new design seems too simple to be true. It is sheer genius and sounds better then the stock arm.
It is my forever turntable. I have the 1200GAE and it is killer. I did add a Integrityhifi Tru-Glider Pendulum Tonearm with no modifications needed. Now I will be using the Technics tone arm with a mono cartridge. On the try-glider arm I have a Top Wing Blue Dragon costing 3x the table. Yes, this is an end game turntable and upgradable.
How did you go about mounting and set up? Plus, how difficult was adding a second arm?
Very nice, indeed. Even your old mk3D will last for another 20 years, so you can imagine. Just stay with Technics, a new SL1200G or even old SP-10mk2 with EPA-100 tonearm in a custom plinth.
Looking at 1200G because of the familiarity, but is it better to get one with easier future tonearm changes.
Once you have the bottom cover off, three screws hold the arm board/tonearm assembly in place. I've installed Triplanar arms on this turntable and its simply fabulous.
It is my forever turntable. I have the 1200GAE and it is killer. I did add a Integrityhifi Tru-Glider Pendulum Tonearm with no modifications needed. Now I will be using the Technics tone arm with a mono cartridge. On the try-glider arm I have a Top Wing Blue Dragon costing 3x the table. Yes, this is an end game turntable and upgradable.
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