I’m not familiar with one- combing those capabilities in one bad and doing it well would be a tall order indeed. The closest device I know of (since you stated R2R) would be from Bricasti Design- not sure of the gain/pre design. Retail on this starts at $16K new.
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This is a pretty tough ask as most R2R DACs tend to be just DACs. The only thing I can think of is the Gustard R26, but it’s well below your price target and not sure if the preamp section is fully balanced or Class A. Is there a reason you want/need everything in one box? Quality aside, it’s obviously also extremely limiting in options. |
@designsfx thanks for the suggestion on the Bricasti. I don’t feel like pushing it past 10k for now, but, will look to try/ land something used. @soix , looks like there are some rave reviews on the gustard’s (what a bizarre name) streamer+r2r dac sound quality, but, the preamp section is lackluster, it seems.
@pavel_dosko , I am of the belief that a integrated streamer+dac+preamp unit eliminating unnecessary cabling and non-merging of different design ethos’ from different manufacturers can churn out better in execution. I experience it in my multichannel rig....just looking to try that out in my 2 channel rig with some competent manufacturer. Indeed, it is never a good idea to throw any high power amp sections in the same chassis and that needs to be separate. |
@deep_333 Do you need to have non-digital inputs? If not, then I recommend a used dCS Lina Network DAC. This DAC streams directly from Ethernet and local NAS. The DAC architecture is their “Ring DAC” which is similar to R2R, although not “Non Over Sampling” (if that’s what you want in an R2R DAC). It can be run directly to Amp(s) by using the Mosaic control software’s volume control. The output is true balanced. Not sure the output is class A, but I know it sounds fantastic. Yes, I own one and I’ve stopped looking for something better. |
@rockrider Non-digital inputs not needed (turntable is sitting in storage)...Not sure what this "Ring dac' is and will need to read up a bit. Eitherway, I need such a piece to add more class A-ish liquidyy gooey lushness to atleast one of my existing power amps.
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I’m sorry, but at your $10k price level I completely disagree with this logic even leaving out the fact that you’re not gonna find the unicorn you’re looking for in one box unless you’re willing to relax at least one or two of your stated requirements. @pavel_dosko is absolutely correct that you should be looking at separates, and I’m sure others here will agree. What you say about built-in synergy and eliminating cables makes some sense but only up to a point and you’ve way passed that point. You won’t find what you’re looking for because it doesn’t yet exist so might as well resolve yourself that you’re gonna need at least two if not three boxes. Time to face facts and reality man. Don’t mean to be harsh here, just maybe a voice of reason FWIW. |
@soix This manufacturer called Gustard (that you suggested) has gotten 2/3rds of the way there with the integrated streamer+ R2R dac for 1650 USD (8350 under budget). But, all of a sudden, integrating a higher quality class A preamp into that unit would suddenly never fit under or equal to 10k? My budget is too weak for that to happen somehow? Tell me about that fact and reality a bit more.... (we are talking about a class A preamp, not a power amp). |
You mentioned a turn table- what pre will you be using with that? There’s a little more going on when combining these features into a single unit- basically a trade off in the approach to attenuation. Personally I’ve never cared for driving an amp from a dac but I’ve read many posts/threads where others have preferred doing so. In my experience it boils down to the level of sound quality and performance one could expect from a unit trying to perform multiple functions vs separate components dedicated to a single function and doing it very well. With $10K to work with I would imagine you could acquire a very good dac/streamer and separate preamp that would outperform a single device that combines those functions. |
Okay, it’s clear to me now that you don’t know what you’re doing. First, many if not most good preamps operate in Class A, so just stop with that. Second, you won’t find any R2R DACs incorporating a good streamer, so stop with that. Last, if you combine a good and fully-balanced preamp with the Gustard, its streaming section will be a big bottleneck to performance compared to the likes of an Innuos, Lumin, Aurender, etc. that you should be looking at, so stop with that. I’ve had enough here. I’m out. Good luck with this mess guys. Or maybe someone else can finally get through to him here. |
To allocate a budget of $10K for a specific Audio Device that is seemingly not a commonly offered configuration, where DAC - Pre and Streamer are found under the hood does present a risk, that has been identified by the contributors. There does not seem to be much on offer as a Product in the allocation of budget to be considered. Then there is the buying blind aspect, how does the end user experience the device prior to purchase. This can prove to be a woeful experience. The general guidance is to steer away from the One Box Wonder and go to Products designed for be very capable and supplied as separate devices. The trade of is more cases, more cables and power supplies. The positives are demo's will be found, and used items is an option to keep the end set up close to budget. This is not a recommendation, but the Product in the Link, might have some of the set up incorporated that you are investigating. |
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@soix Lol, I asked you why 8350 extra wouldn't be feasible enough to throw in a better line stage. But, since your logic faltered there, you started the barking instead You thought barking your way out would buy you all your immense street cred back with the forum dudes. Here's a review...bow wow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_YWaOc7nhU&t=633s
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Per one online reviewer who has actually used the Gustard: To put it short and simple, Gustard R26 is a mighty fine-sounding product and an even mightier value once you consider everything it brings to the table. It’s not only great for the money, it’s just great in absolute terms. If it carried the name of some famed manufacturer and was priced at $3000, it would still get glowing five-star reviews in mainstream media.
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@jetter yeah, I think I might pull the trigger on this Gustard. I like the British audiophile's reviews (His description of sound signatures lines up with what I've heard on stuff i trialed). If it sounds better than my current denafrips Hermes/Venus combo, I might get rid of the latter...The only con might be losing Vinshine audio/Denafrips support. |
You are a little early to the party, but the idea of a CD, streamer, DAC and preamp all in one is the future of HiFi. Digital will get better and better while getting cheaper and cheaper. It will also get smaller and lighter. . For now you are looking at $27K for this Playback Designs MPS8. In 5 years it will be a dinosaur and replaced by something around $2700 or so superior product. |
@auroravengeance , Hmm..maybe i should relax the R2R constraint and try out the Esoteric (they don't seem to mess around with build quality). On the same note, it appears to be its very own unique architecture. |
@deep_333 You can try TEAC UD-701N as well. Same architecture as the Esoteric but less than half the price. Esoteric and TEAC are basically the same company. |
@auroravengeance , thanks for the suggestion on the Teac as well! |
I believe this is along the lines of what you’ve asked for. |
