Thanks.
Seeking advice on Speakers that create an intimate 2 channel listening experience
So the past month I started a couple of threads on speaker choice on AVS forum (One asked for Powered/Active floor standing Speaker choices and another one around non-active FS speakers for a tube amp I was looking at).
But I've come to realize this was the wrong tact, got lots of flack much deserved and wanted to try to solicit the advice/opinions on this forum which I just discovered.
Short background...Hunkered down in a suburb just outside NYC now for the past 3-4 months, I started to get the itch for a dedicated 2 channel stereo Turntable setup in our living room in May. After much research and twists and turns and immediate upgraditis, as some know on here from other posts, I've finally settled in and now own a Rega Planar 10 Turntable. I also own a Sutherland phono --20/20 with LPS and that's staying. Right now the phono preamp is hooked up direct to a pair of ELAC ARF51 floorstanding speakers (all drivers powered by built in AB amps) which I like a lot BUT ITS HERE THAT I WANT MORE. Btw, I love the ELAC design of mounting the tweeter concentric in the mid driver -- makes sense to me. I kinda wish ELAC would take the same design and make a reference speaker but thats for another day.
So to swap out the ELACs, I will obviously need an amp, but I will figure that out later and want to focus on getting the right speakers for me for what I want. So what do I want?
1. Floorstanders. Close to full range as possible. No subs.
2. Looks count since in my main living room.
3. Speakers that prioritize Imaging Imaging Imaging. That disappear in the room creating an intimate but 3D listening experience. Clean (Accurate) warm sound. No distortion. I would easily sacrifice low end for untiring highs and warm mids I don't listen to metal or hiphop anymore so I don't need loudness, more like lounge experience if that makes sense. Apologize if I got the adjectives wrong but its personal description of what I'm seeking.
4. Price Point - -$10k-25k. Room is 22x18 with 25 foot ceiling
I would like to audition/demo before I buy and since I live in the Tri-State area it should be possible. But I'm finding that obviously difficult to do right now. I listened to a pair of Salk speakers but didn't love them. And have an appt with the Audio Doctor in NJ in two weeks.
Thanks in advance.
But I've come to realize this was the wrong tact, got lots of flack much deserved and wanted to try to solicit the advice/opinions on this forum which I just discovered.
Short background...Hunkered down in a suburb just outside NYC now for the past 3-4 months, I started to get the itch for a dedicated 2 channel stereo Turntable setup in our living room in May. After much research and twists and turns and immediate upgraditis, as some know on here from other posts, I've finally settled in and now own a Rega Planar 10 Turntable. I also own a Sutherland phono --20/20 with LPS and that's staying. Right now the phono preamp is hooked up direct to a pair of ELAC ARF51 floorstanding speakers (all drivers powered by built in AB amps) which I like a lot BUT ITS HERE THAT I WANT MORE. Btw, I love the ELAC design of mounting the tweeter concentric in the mid driver -- makes sense to me. I kinda wish ELAC would take the same design and make a reference speaker but thats for another day.
So to swap out the ELACs, I will obviously need an amp, but I will figure that out later and want to focus on getting the right speakers for me for what I want. So what do I want?
1. Floorstanders. Close to full range as possible. No subs.
2. Looks count since in my main living room.
3. Speakers that prioritize Imaging Imaging Imaging. That disappear in the room creating an intimate but 3D listening experience. Clean (Accurate) warm sound. No distortion. I would easily sacrifice low end for untiring highs and warm mids I don't listen to metal or hiphop anymore so I don't need loudness, more like lounge experience if that makes sense. Apologize if I got the adjectives wrong but its personal description of what I'm seeking.
4. Price Point - -$10k-25k. Room is 22x18 with 25 foot ceiling
I would like to audition/demo before I buy and since I live in the Tri-State area it should be possible. But I'm finding that obviously difficult to do right now. I listened to a pair of Salk speakers but didn't love them. And have an appt with the Audio Doctor in NJ in two weeks.
Thanks in advance.
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Project complete. (room treatments next) Thanks everyone! Hope the pics come through.. https://photos.app.goo.gl/BFAQLGEo4UmknMZm6 |
https://www.facebook.com/groups/theaudiophileman/permalink/605142006858839/ Probable the best imaging loudspeakers on earth! |
i like that look. has an old school feel, but can work in any decor. i have audio note an-es in poplar burl - the rest of the house is very contemporary, so they stand out in a very cool way. i also love harbeths, so nice job - you listened to your heart. i had a similar experience from the moment i first listened to audio notes - they relaxed me. |
UPDATE I made my decision, drank the BBC Kool aid, and purchased the Harbeth 40.2 Annie’s, all in with the TonTrager stands. At the proverbial end of the day, for me, I just really felt such an emotional soothing connection when demo’img it with my records that I didn’t get from most of the others. Very musical, warm, engaging and so natural sounding, the 3 drivers really do come off sounding like one big driver they are so seamless. Voices are the best I heard and the bass is very musical, not that one note blurr. No shrill at loud volumes, non-fatiguing and not analytical which I internally associate with being cold. Heavy metal not my thing but for soft rock, folk, blues, jazz where the vocals are front and center its smooth as silk. On the downside, to my eyes they are not aesthetically pleasing as speakers are designed these days,, and not anything I would have thought of getting but they are seriously HUMONGOUS in person, these are not satellite speakers as I tend to think of that design. And they definitely don’t image as well as the other floorstanders, so that was major compromise for me, but close your eyes its not such a big deal. Well all adventures must come to an end. I learned a lot and it was a fun but an overwhelming 2 months. And a huge thanks to the key peeps who reached out on this forum and guided me along, keeping me straight -- I tend to be impulsive which is not a healthy trait in this hobby. Will see how things go, but at least I made some new friends. And of course I’ll leave the door open in the sense that if I can demo future speakers in my room against the Harbeths I certainly will. But for the near term I’ll let contentment settle in.... |
+1 on Focal Sopra. I have not heard all models but those that I’ve heard has been great. Their Kanta 3 is also good at around $13k. Another brand to try is Fyne with Fyne F701 for about $12k or the F1 which may cost from $24k up to $30k. I’ve heard the F701 and it images great! I have also listened to some cheaper models and they were very good for their price. https://stereo-magazine.com/review/fyne-audio-f1-10-review |
So the other night I put on Springsteen The Ghost of Tom Joad. Several of these like Highway 29 are pretty much just Bruce sitting there playing his string guitar. The sound is exactly that, as if Bruce is right there in the room. Could hardly be more intimate. Then I put on Doug MacLeod, Exactly Like This. Same thing, very intimate, like he's right there. Right size, right everything. Nancy Bryan, Lay Me Down, holy smokes! Not all of them are small and intimate, but the ones that are wow, never heard better. So what are these speakers that create such a wonderully intimate 2 channel listening experience? Tekton Moabs. Just get em. |
Two more to consider: Avalon Acoustics- A close friend of mine has the Indra Diamond, which is above your budget I believe, but the Eidolan is not. These are really beautiful - probably need some power to drive however. Acoustic Zen - I have the Adagio Jr. in my second system, and love then. That’s way under your budget, and not a floorstander, but the Crescendo II is just under the top of your budget. |
Focal Sopra 1 and 2 are fantastic, and Ensemble Ondiva - these blew me away at Munich HiFi 2019. If you are looking for an intimate speaker it may not get better than these at any price. They are not floorstanders however, they fill a room and are really big (in sound) for monitors. Highly recommend giving them a try! |
@helomech Funny you should ask. Actually yesterday I visited Dave, the Audio Doctor in Jersey city at his crazy modern museum of audiophile systems. He had been shut down since March and just recently reopened. I listened to the top of the line Golden Ear towers, the gorgeous Legacy Aerus and a little known speaker from Long Island the Alta audio titanium Hesta. There were many others I wanted to hear such as the Paradigm Persona 9h and the kef ref 5 and blade but he just wasn’t operating full throttle yet so I promised to return. The Triton Reference were full bodied but not refined enough. Reminded me too much of Def tech. The Aerus were physically gorgeous but way too much base for me. It was intense. The Alta Hesta were a game changer. They defined imaging + transparency/clarity = massive 3D soundstage. I loved them but worry too much about the dipole in my living room. My first visit that day was to Verdant Audio in lower Jersey City overlooking WTC Freedom Tower and their AvanteGarde XD Passive. My first horn loaded system and the mids and highs draw you in like no speaker I’ve ever heard. Female vocals were captivating. And an absolutely gorgeous modern piece of art. Overwhelming. |
@jhills. Thanks I hope one day to acquire a top of the line pair of Maggies or Quads for my man cave. Right now there are way too many variables to make it happen in our main living room, but I appreciate your candor. I did get to hear the 1.7s earlier this week at a Wilson dealer in NYC and the sound was pleasant. |
I may be a little late to the game to add any meaningful advice, but incase You haven't made a decision yet..... Regarding the Quads and the Maggies, I, over the years, have owned and immensely enjoyed both. For 20 years I had as my primary speakers in three different homes a pair of Quad ESL 63s. Along with these speakers, I was continually trying other speakers. By comparison, I found that the earlier Magnapans sounded a bit thin and nearly every box speaker, compared with the Quads, lacked the breath taking realness through the vocals and mids. The Quad ESL actually favor a slightly bright wall behind them. In their first home, there was a very large window behind covered only with light sheer drapes and were about 36" from the wall behind and a little over 2' from the side walls. They sounded incredible. I only sold in Lue of a small set of dynamic speakers when work moved me into a much smaller living environment. I have been disillusioned by the new Quads, both by their manufacturing being moved to China and by their horrid record of reliability. My old ESL 63s had served without fail or fault for 20+ years and were still going strong when I sold them. A good or re-furbished pair of the Quad ESL 63s may be a good choice. Now retired and back into a larger home (listening room approx. 14'Wx27'L and 10'H) I decided to try a pair of the newer Maggie 1.7s and fell in love. Unlike the early Maggies that, to me, sounded a bit thin, the new .7 Quasi Ribbon models (.7. 1.7i, 3.7i) sound not only detailed with a large stage, but also sound full and musically engaging. My 1.7s are about 46" from the wall behind, but you could get by with 3' as long as you have a set of heavy drapes that can be pulled across your large window, when listening and a carpet or throw rug in front of ea. speaker. They do require a bit of experimenting with distance apart and toe in but when finally getting their set up tweaked, I don't believe there is anything at anywhere near their respective cost, that is as musically. engaging....Jim |
I own Triton One speakers. With both vinyl (Technics 1200MK2) and CD (Marantz) I can close my eyes, I have no idea where the speakers are situated, and I can point to the instruments in the orchestra. Amazing soundstage. Supposedly the Triton One R is a bit of a step up, at $6,000 a pair. I listen through an old Sony receiver, which I am about to replace with a Rogue Audio Sphinx V3 ($1,595). My research says Rogue Audio amps and Triron One speakers sound lovely together. You could spend a lot less than you are thinking, and be very happy. |
I will spare you description because at your budget, you'd be less than diligent if you didn't listen to your choices in person. So without explanation, except I have been impressed with each. Each will deliver many of the goods you have listed as important to you. They are listed by price, not by my preference: All are dynamic speakers: Kef Blade 2 @25k Totem Element Metal V2 $15.5 Focal Sopra #3 12k |
I love my bi-amped Khorns, bought them new in 1978. I use a Mac 250 transistor amp for the bass (transistors are better for bass) and I swap between 4 different tube amps, (2 single ended, 2 push-pull) for the mid/highs. You will need an electronic crossover. I use a Crown VFX2a, works perfectly. You said you want speakers that disappear into the room. My set up will do it. There is no better sound in the world than a properly powered pair of Klipchhorns. Both single ended and push-pull tube amps work well. Overall, I prefer single ended. Lastly, you have the perfect room for this setup. Large area, tall ceilings. Good luck. Enjoy! |
