Do the Focal's have Beryllium tweeters? I have heard the 761 with Paradigm Persona 9H (791 was preamp and DAC)..It was a bit fatiguing to me.
Pulled the trigger on a Moon 861! Hope it pairs well on my Focals
Well, I pulled the trigger and ordered a Moon 861 amp! I am very excited! It will be coming next week. I have a pair of focal Sopra n1 speakers that I'll be using on it. I've never heard them paired before. I heard a moon audio 761 on dynaudio towers and so that's what turned me on to The Moon North collection.
I'm feeling a little bit nervous. Hopefully it pairs really good with good synergy with the focals. Has anyone ever heard the moon north gear on Focals before?
I think you bought a great amplifier. I’ve had a chance to hear the 761 and 861 and owned sim products in the past. I suspect you will find you will have enough power for any speakers, and that the sim audio will not color the music in any way, instead any coloration will come from the preamp and speakers. Congratulations |
The MacIntosh preamp may have the balancing effect you are hoping for. Tell us what happens. Don't forget that a new solid state amp typically starts out very trebly and then softens over the first 100 to 200 hours. I know this, but I just can't help but draw conclusions when I put a new amp in my system, even after knowing this for decades. I get all upset... then it settles down. This happened to me recently... and it settled down so much, it was as if it was a completely different amp. |
@fastfreight yeah, you’re right. I’ve heard Focal on Macintosh which is supposed to be warm and even on that some recordings sounded bright. It really depends on the recording in my opinion. I find that with my Luxman 595, guitar music will sound a bit hard to listen to after a while because it’s recorded with a lot of treble in my opinion. But other music like classical, jazz, and reggae, the brightness of the focals turn to pure magic
Just to note I haven’t got my new amp yet talking about the Luxman that I currently use which is a great amp to. I’ll be keeping it as a extra |
@dman777 it sounded bright because your speakers have a more present presentation to their mid treble and upper treble. So combine that with records that may be mixed and mastered bright and yes some stuff will sound bright it is not an annoying brightness as it isn't peaky but a gradual uplift in their balance beyond lower treble. |
I've had the Moon North on Focal beryllium (Kanta, Sopra, and Utopia) and it's a great match. The Moon is never harsh and everything is controlled well. Warmer than I expected. I have not tried your pre. I've only run with Moon North 891. My friends that don't like Focal beryllium were not run out of the room with only two setups: the Moon North, and Classe Delta power/pre. Everything is smooth and well balanced and never offensive. |
Mac does have a mellow sound, but there’s only so much they can overcome. A few years back, I listened to a lovely system that was all new Macintosh equipment and the newest B&W 80? Speakers. No matter where I sat, no matter how I readjusted the speakers, they hurt my ears at levels in the 75-80 db range. |
Simaudio Moon electronics are clear and transparent. Pair them with very revealing speakers and a front end that’s not on the same level and you’re in a world of trouble. |
My speaker is like a Beryllium based speaker, the Yamaha NS5000 (the child of the Be Original Gangster, so to speak). It uses Zylon for the drivers, and it is as detailed as Be. After hearing the 761 I wanted to get it to pair it with the NS5000, because that would be something special. Great detail but no harshness and also lots of power. I would have rotated the CODA #16 amp and the 761/861 between my 2 system. Luckily, I am tapped out $$ wise and went with a cheaper amp (good enough for now). |
@audphile1 Have you heard the North collection? I haven't heard the previous models but I was told that the previous models were clear and transparent while the North more colored and warm (when compared to the previous models). |
I just got it hooked up to my McIntosh C12000 preamp and the Eversolo z8 streamer/dac. I have to say, compare to my Luxman 595 class A amp it sounds thin. My luxman 595, although on the bright side, sounded way fuller and even more holographic. Compared to the what I heard in the audio store (McIntosh C12000 preamp, DynAudio Contour Legacy towers and the DAC from Moon streamer(not sure if it was the 891 or 791) there is hardly any bass at all. |
Typically the sound will change a lot... being less trebly and more natural... often takes a lot more than 100 hours. I'm not sure why, but many companies are shy about documenting the long burn in... even through it is required. My Audio Research gear took 600 hours to stabilize and even after that there was very slight improvements over the next 400. I burned in three of the same amps... and it followed exactly the same pattern. I’d run it 24 x 7 for a couple weeks. |
So far I have about 10 hours on it. I am starting to hear the beauty come out of it which is really nice. One thing that bothers me, though, is.... currently I have just the Eversolo Z8 DAC on it. I have the McIntosh disconnected while I burn 100 hours (in about 2 weeks). I have the Eversolo at 70% volume and I feel like it's not as loud as I would like it to be. I can go to 80% but it gets a bit to boomy and tiny bit muddy. For instance, my Luxman 595 is super loud at 60% volume, I can't go louder without blowing the speakers. Will the Moon amp also get louder as the hours burn in? |
So, you are using your DAC straight into the amp... that is the issue. It is the input to your amp that determines the volume you get out. Your preamp should provide the input voltage (I think that is the parameter). An amp does not vary its amplification... that is what the preamp does... unless your are using your DAC as a preamp as w'll (unlikely to sound great). Should sound great with lots of volume when you put your Mac back in. |
@dman777 matter of sensitivity and gain matching. Don’t worry about it for now. Break it in first. Changing an amplifier is a major impact on the system. It’s got to be matched with speakers as well as with upstream components and room. Don’t exclude the possibility that you will need to readjust speaker placement. But don’t do anything at all until you have a minimum of 200hrs on it or you will be chasing ghosts. |
I am using balanced inputs from the Eversolo to the Moon Audio amp. Would that mean I am using the Eversolo as a preamp? I use the Eversolo app to stream music from my phone bluetooth. Is that ok that I have this particular setup or would could there be a mismatch in voltage with the amp that would cause the amp stress? |
@dman777 yes. Bluetooth is a noisy and low resolution method of sending music to your DAC. You’ve invested significantly in your components. Get a proper streamer and connect it to the DAC using a good USB cable. Don’t use Bluetooth man. It sucks. |
Question, please: On old recordings where volume is lower (like Ministry Everydays Halloween) I have my McIntosh preamp at 75%. If I had a wifi streamer .... would I lose that extra volume the cell phone gives and have even less volume? |
Looking at your setup, you have at least two problem areas. 1. You are using your cell phone to stream to your dac via Bluetooth. This type of interface is completely out of place in your system. Solution: Option one - you need to get a streamer. Even something basic like a Lumin U2 Mini, Aurender N150 or something else in this category should do fine to start with. Connect the streamer to dac using USB cable. Ditch the Bluetooth dude. Forget about Bluetooth. Option two - get a better dac witj a built in streamer card. Use Roon or Tidal connect or Qobuz connect. Do not use airplay or Bluetooth. You literally wasted your money on 861 and the rest of your system if you carry on with Bluetooth streaming. Come on man. Let us know your budget and we can make a recommendation |
+1 Exactly. I have to say the same stuff... hopefully differently. 1) is the big problem. The second is reducing the fidelity. 1) There are two ways to do streaming with your Streamer / DAC. One is to "catch" the streaming service on your phone and then to send it to your DAC by some terrible sounding method like bluetooth. This is the wrong and vastly inferior way to do it. You want to be using the Eversolo app to control your Z8. In the Eversolo app (for your phone), you log on to Qobuz or Tidal... Hmm, I missed it, what service are you using? You should use Qobuz or Tidal. The give away is that there is a hookup problem is that you should not have a volume control on your phone in the loop. 2) Your Streamer / DAC budget consumer and you have high end Preamp, amp and speakers. This is a gross mismatch. You must choose wisely but and appropriate investment is that Streamer (individulal box)cost = DAC (cost) = Preamp = Amp. If this ratio is way out of whack then the sound quality you are getting is going to be very inferior. If you want you can get a Stream / DAC combo, but then it should be in the ballpark investment level of combined preamp and amp. |
G….his DAC has no network card. You can’t control it with the eversolo app. Let’s get the OP to respond with his budget on new digital front end. |
dman77 - You have the top of the line Simaudio Amyp. For a simple two box solution, you might consider pairing it with one of their North Pre/DAC/Streamers, either the 791 ($16k) or the 891 ($25k) and sell/trade the other gear. Their Sim Mind software provides a really easy way to stream from bluethooth to Qobuz (I'm testing Tidal out now). I have the lower level Sims (330A/390) running to Magico A3s. The Magicos have Be tweeters and its no problem. Good luck! |