My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!


So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.

Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.

Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?

Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.

 It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.

Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.

Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.

Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.

Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.

Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.

My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


128x128jays_audio_lab
Techno- Maybe the down sides of a speaker that cost $175k are few and far between. However the upsides are numerous and are the first to be noticed. This is a very early stage of evaluation.  It may take a while to find the flaws in a speaker of this caliber however insignificant they maybe. Sure a dealer will certainly help us see the great things they do but it up to us to agree or disagree. Mike seems like a well seasoned audiophile with a great deal of expertise and will be able to help get the best from this speaker.  Dealers like this are few a far between. Give it some time and see where this goes. We may even learn a thing or two. Personally I’m enjoying this new style. I appreciate Mike donating he time for us. Many dealers won’t give you the time of day. 
Carey1110,
 Listen to my three videos on page 302 of Alexx, M6 and GTA playing the same song, "Iron Hand."  It is obvious to anyone without bias (let a friend play all for you so you are blinded) that the clarity of the GTA reigns supreme.  Many people like what the M6 does, according to their taste.  I preferred the clarity and midrange neutrality of even the Alexx compared to the M6.  The honest truth is that the M6 is like your chosen wife/girlfriend who has obvious flaws in her looks compared to supermodels, but you love the combination of attributes she has.

I agree that Mike is sincere and helpful in many ways.  He makes his customers feel that they are best friends with their best interests at heart, a far cry from most pushy salesman out to try to sell the most expensive thing they can.
carey1110 you never seems to miss an appearance when the whole thing is just exposed...

It’s all marketing. It’s been showed naked even more with the latest yt videos and the retailer passing by ( yeah sure) pushing the Magicos  after they got destroyed by the viewers...

techno
So many things wrong with your last post. From poor grammar to incorrect facts. Should have stayed in school a little longer.
Returning to Wilson/Magico subject, I played those videos for some of my friends and as expected some preferred Wilson and others Magico. All women preferred Magico though appreciated Wilson too. M6 has very strong points. By the way, most preferred Gryphon to Boulder with Wilson, so I am in minority there.
@techno__dude 


The guy that cuts my yard has many varied opinions too and is also pretty certain there is a conspiracy to make him buy $175,000 Magicos. Is that you Paco and shouldn’t you be applying the pre-emergent right now?
So women chose magico...
according to what has been said, women have better hearing than men...hmm...
Is there a doctor in the house  that can explain this...uhem...
I’ll begin to extinguish the fire soon...I’ve been very vocal about the fact that I’m going to be moving up the ladder slowly when it comes to electronics and that I’m simply playing with the smaller (cheaper) offerings to satisfy the desire from those who want to hear this level of gear so they don’t feel left out.
With that said, my first component for the mágico lands in fort Lauderdale International Airport on Monday.
The msrp of this component is $83,000.... Yes it’s a source... Strap on your seat belt because sh!t is about to get REAL soon...I’m just sitting here eating nachos while i watch the discussion here...
Jay’s face = 😁

Oh, let me address the next criticism before it is said:
" oh wow Jay you had to spend $83,000 in a source to elevate the already expensive mágico speaker..."

Jay’s answer: " yes, i am about to turn up the boost on this 2000hp dodge viper. We’ve been driving around on low boost "
$83K dac ?..Not bad. If it is a dac.

Yes, I think most women will prefer Magico for the transparency and soaring quality. This does not necessarily mean that they hear better, they might hear differently and have different preferences. Well, women are not men, why should they hear the same ?
Then I would suggest top of the line Soulution separates, and then top Boulder to compare. Somehow, I don't believe that either Gryphon or D'Agostino would be perfect match with Magico. I can be wrong, so what ?
Female children have the best measured hearing response.  That doesn't mean that they understand what they hear.  I have witnessed old musicians who have a greater understanding of the complex sounds of music, and they point out things that young inexperienced musicians miss.  The midrange is where most of the melodic content is, so the old musicians still have good midrange perception even if they are deaf over 5 kHz.  I knew a young mastering engineer who worked with the renowned Bob Ludwig, and he said that the 73 year old Ludwig taught him a lot about what to listen for.
How could a 83 k source improve a speaker that is fundamentally flawed in sounding artificial and etched ?
Yes if anything it will make it more artificial sounding if in fact that is how you perceive the speakers to sound. I personally find the speakers to sound neutral without life and preferred the Wilson's but again that's my opinion.
You're correct...neutral without character is an accurate statement. 
You are hearing what is coming to them and not what isn't coming. I think you're the first person here who has actually made one accurate comment about the m6. 
With all of the colorations in an audio system (your room being the biggest one), I would think a neutral speaker would be an asset.
Issue is most people want the "easy" way out by finding colored speakers which isn’t wrong....it’s a different approach...
Most people are "scared" of trying revealing speakers because their room might stink like $h!t once they hear what their electronics really sound like...
Very few dare to buy ultra revealing speakers because they know it is not for the faint of heart.
Wasn’t that why many people criticized my Mephisto? Yes...i remember...ultra revealing..a wild child that won’t tolerate bs...
If you can rip a page from my book it should it " don't buy revealing stuff if you lose your head easily. ". 
I want a camaro zl1 or zl1 1le. The latter has my attention because it is a track oriented vehicle that comes with sticky tires and more aggressive suspension at the expense of a harsh ride. There are different options for a reason folks. 





Contradictory phrase--"neutral without life." The goal of high fidelity is neutrality--strive to create a likeness of the real thing without artificial colorations. The real thing IS life, but those who think "life" means flavoring and coloring the sound are entitled to whatever flavoring they like, but that is artificial.  Of Jay's and Steve's 3 videos of the Alexx, M6 and GTA speakers in my reposts on p 302, the GTA is the most neutral and lifelike. Of the 3 speakers, the M6 tonality is the warmest/darkest, which some people prefer.  After the next quarter million bucks is spent, the M6 videos will still display those characteristics, but the GTA with the modest Pass and Lampi tube dac will still be the champ for clarity/neutrality/life.
Why don’t we get serious here... Shall we ?
Here we go:

https://youtu.be/m6J11Uxqg04

Let the critics come out now...don’t hide behind the damn bushes now. I’m here waiting...silently.
Where is the shrillness? Where is the harshness ? Where is the sterile cold sound? Where is the lack of clarity?
Go ahead and write your essay real careful before you answer.
You might want to consult with your partner, friend, spouse, gf, or anyone else to be sure you are hearing correctly before you post. 
Still has that artificial sheen in the highs. The midrange doesn’t seem to push through.
Maybe it’s just the speakers that are not broken in. Idk 🤷🏼‍♂️
Lol. You can’t make your phone speaker sing buddy. I could bring the damn live presentation in my room and it won’t help you. You should try to invest in something else. 
It's hard to compare this recording with Soulution/Magico because tunes are very different. Besides, I like the Iron Hand tune.
I don't think that Magico's sound is artificial or edgy, but nor do I think it is neutral. They keep sounding lightweight though, for my taste. The sound got no power of delivery, not yet at least.

@riaa

Ahhh,  now I know why he's so critical of high end audio.  I take back my wanting to hear his system.
I have to say that some of the "harshest" critics of the high end (wilsons, magicos, big focals, etc, etc) tend to be people whose reference points have not been that "high".
For instance, i can totally understand if someone hates Magico or Wilson or any other high end brand as long as THEIR reference point is or has been "high" as well. I don’t quite get how someone can despise what is considered by most the "pinnacle" of audio when they have never played in that same arena or level.
You can’t hate on Ferrari unless you have owned a Lambo (this is just an example). How could you hate on Ferrari or Lambo if your fingers have never hugged the steering wheel of one of those beasts or let alone own one? What "qualified" experience do you have to completely "$hit" on supercars when you are pushing a Honda Civic? (please don’t take offense, i am only making a point).
I understand i am "public" and i have to roll with the punches, but could you all imagine if i decided to pick apart the systems of those who are harsh with ultra high end? I’d look like a total a$$... I’d be the prick.
That said, giving an opinion is great and yes in the end this is all about an opinion what we do here on this thread.
Just remember, there is a difference between an "opinion" or being "abrasive" to the point that you seem angry and are trying to justify what you own over what someone else has which doubles, triples, quadruples what you have invested on your rig.
This isn’t an attempt at trying to block opinions. On the contrary, this is an attempt at making sure that opinions are given instead of destructive criticism - which some people simply love to do.
Lastly, yes we all know that more money does not equal better performance all the time. Some of the best systems out there are costly because in order for you to get an extra 5% improvement in a system that pretty much has everything would cost a ton of more money. The more "up ladder" you go, the larger the amount of money needed to make a slight improvement.
Lets say you have a system that is a total of about $30,000 for everything and the amplifier in this rig is $3k and now you are about to buy an amp that is $10,000. The improvement this $30k system would experience is HUGE. 
In contrast, if you have a $300,000 system with the amplifier costing around $40k and you decide to replace it with a $60k amplifier, the improvement in this system won't be as drastic as the system that costs $30k (assuming both of these systems are properly designed systems of course). This is because that $300k system is nearing a point in which the room for improvement is not as big as the cheaper system. 
The law of diminishing returns is much larger in the ultra high end systems. It always has been and it will always be. 
My guess is the Magico M6 will go down in history of this thread as the never broken in speaker...

But we have a much bigger problem. We cannot give our honest opinion about a speaker without being ruthlessly responded to.

The M6 latest videos have showed an edgy, undynamic, midrange recessed and lacking bass omph sound. I am not the only one to have noticed this compared to the last Wilson and Focal setups.
I noticed both here and on yt that for folks who are mentioning bright or lacking bass or midrange, WC is telling them to do better than listening on their phone.

I don't think WC is trying to upset folks with those comments - what that tells me is that WC is not hearing that at all "in person".   And, keep in mind, WC loves bass, so if it was lacking bass, I'm sure we would hear about it from him. 

Dave
Jay, in your  discussions with Mike from Suncoast Audio, have you ever talked about the Taiko Audio SGM Extreme? Is this something you'd consider making part of your system? 
I am using Burson former top of the line dac and Grado RS-1 headphones for computer lstening, Wywires Silver USB cable and power cord. It is good enough to hear the differences and shortcomings.
Compared to Wilson Magico is so far very lightweight, lacking dynamics and real bass. It has other advantages, that is true.
In the last video midrange was definitely recessed, techno is right.
@whitecamaross 
@inna 

So, yesterday I just happened to be sitting at my computer when the new "Magico M6: We begin to get serious" video was released. I began listening to it immediately. It sounded bass shy and midrange heavy. Well, I went back to the video about 20 minutes later for some reason and found that somehow the sound was being limited, not sure if by YT or what. But when I listened to it a second time, it was very linear with great bass, midrange, and top end. Again, I'm not sure why that is happening, but it is.

As a matter of fact, it happened again today. I went to YT just now, because of Inna's comment, and played the video and again and found it to be bass shy and midrange heavy. I tried the video about three more times and boom, now it was playing correctly. So for those who heard lack luster sound please try it again. Maybe WC can explain it here.
This issue has been discussed by YouTube on several forums. The word is that when the video is being watched by many, the quality differs. They claim that the best time to watch videos is in the middle of the night in order to avoid heavy traffic. I can't say with certainty how true this is. 
I listened yesterday and again today to the 'Magico M6: We begin to get serious' and I don't hear what techno and inna are referring to. Everything top to bottom sounded fantastic. No recessed midrange or midrange heavy and the bass sounded just right. Also I read the YouTube responses thinking they would reflect what techno and inna were talking about but there were way more positive comments than negative. In fact out of 26 responses (excluding Jay's replies) I counted 14 positive / 3 negative / and 3 neutral (didn't say one way or the other).  

Music and audio systems are so subjective it's no wonder there is such a split on most every speaker, component, cable and isolation video that Jay presents.
This might not be the case, I don't know, but in my experience when burning in the equipment including cables bass settles last. But I would expect at least 500 hours for speakers to fully burn in.
Youtube quality varies, that's for sure, even in the middle of the night sometimes. But I ran direct and quick comparison between Magico and Wilson and that was around midnight I think. Well, we'll see what happens next, with new source, more hours on speakers and amps and maybe better quality recordings.
I understand, though, why so many people choose Wilson. 
The so-called law of diminishing return while real is also complicated. As an example, Jay's latest Wilson speakers are so much better that what he had before. Double or more the price ? More than worth it. $100k Boulder monoblocks compared to $60k Mephisto stereo ? Worth it for me, no doubt. But yes, you have to jump and spend a lot more for it to be worth it. $55k Soulution integrated compared to $18k Diablo ? I have no idea, they do sound different though.
When you play at this level, there is no more 4 digit components that make a huge contribution unless you're talking powercords, stands or xlr. Each component becomes 5 or 6 digits in order to make a significant impact on the presentation. Yes I'm not excited to say it but it does sting to watch your money fly out of your hands. 


@whitecamaross 

I just went in again and tried the video and I got amazing bass quality. It seems either I get thin sound or I get really good sound. I'm using a laptop and AKG K553 Pro headphones. Very easy to hear differences.

So, to others who felt that the sound wasn't that good, go back and try it again, at least one more time. Once you hear the track with solid bass, you know you are getting the full SQ from YT. Sounds very nice to me. Would like to be in the room though.
Could also be youtube settings....I know that not everyone realizes there are youtube settings...
WC.......I've been silently reading your thread which is very informative BTW, thank you.  How does the soundstage sound from M6 vs Alexx?
Very different approach to soundstage. The alexx has a huge soundstage that fills the room top to bottom. However, it is a taller speaker as well and the tweeter is also placed higher.
No matter what kind of recordings i played, the alexx always spoiled me with a huge sound.
The m6 is a different animal. It won’t play huge unless the supporting gear and recordings are telling it to do so.
You could stream Pandora with an iPhone into the Alexx and the sound will fill your room. Not so with the Magico M6.
Just last night, i was playing with my new toys and i got a much larger presentation with the m6 than what i have been getting since I got the speaker. This leads me to believe that my electronics need to certainly come up (we know I’m playing with cheaper components for now).
The m6 is just completely different than the Alexx. They couldn’t be more different.
Actually this reminds me of cars.
For instance, i just recently found out that to make 2,000 hp from a dodge viper costs over $50,000 dollars. Very few shops work on the viper and the turbos plus engine work is quite expensive. In contrast, you can make a nissan GTR push 1800-2000hp with far less money... See what I mean? We have 2 different platforms here and both take different money to make it faster. That’s the best analogy i can give for now.
I have the Wilson Sophia 2 and the soundstage is absolutely great.   I can only imagine what M6 or Alexx would create.
Assuming a perfect speaker placement setup.....how much does the electronics influence the soundstage such as going from Pass to the Solution's?   This question comes from a guy who hardly upgrades due to "money" of course but I do enjoy hearing other peoples journey in "climbing up the ladder" so to speak.
thanks,
David
The electronics influence the sound quite significantly. The improvement is not always proportional to the money spent though. It becomes a matter of knowing how to mix and match components and having a clear understanding of what you are looking for sonically speaking. 
Jay, I wonder if the always room-filling stage thrown by the Alexx is not a virtue but a form of homogenizing, and the different scaling of soundstage from the M6 is indicative of a more accurate, neutral, and revealing speaker?

That is one of the many things i am investigating. I want to pin point what each speaker does and what is really truthful or just added reverb, silibance, etc. We will soon find out what is going on. 
Unveil the VAC! Lift the curtain!

I’ll go further out on limb and predict VAC Statement 452 iQ Musicbloc stereo power amp.