@riaa, Just a point of clarification regarding Luxman's change in distribution. Their US pricing was significantly reduced since Luxman setup Luxman US and assumed responsibility for their own distribution. So the previous distributor was not at fault for having higher pricing, rather that Luxman was able to lower their US price structure by eliminating a level in their distribution process. Similar distribution changes have been made by many audio companies in recent years, but not all have lowered their prices to reflect their lowered costs as Luxman did and should be commended for. Now back to your regularly scheduled programming...
My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
20,890 responses
whitecamaross - good power conditioner shoot out, I plan to do the same with the multiple power conditioners we currently have. A point to note, the power supplied to each house usually has different conditions and variations (RF & EMI contamination, power sags, etc.) and different conditioners might work better in each individual case. Bottom line - we should try each conditioner to determine what works best in our particular home. The conditioner that provides the best results might be a different model for each of us - due to each of us having different needs because the power supplied to our house might have different issues. |
WC after listening to your latest shootout have to say nothing really moved me. Maybe it was the song you picked but yes could hear slight differences but nothing was foot tapping good like it was when you had the Audiomica cables in the system. A few pages back I asked you what you prefer in a system? Accuracy? Bass? Transparency? Top end openness? Or musicality? For me personally I want musicality and after buying (I presume) some of the Audiomica cables you auditioned I have to say I now can listen for 5 -7 hrs at a time without fatigue and just in plain bliss. I know I've thanked you before but once again THANK you! So please consider bringing back the Audiomica cables to your stable and see if your feet start to tap with the music. Stay safe all. |
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Failed experiment with cardas clear audio beyond speaker cables.. my gryphon colloseum makes a massive humming noise through the speakers when using cardas clear beyond speaker cables. I damn near had a heart attack here when I made the cable swap. You can't even hear music because the hum is louder than any music.I thought it was the ref 6se at first that was doing that (bad tube etc) but nope. If i use the Merrill audio Speaker cables I don’t have any issue at all. This is a first for me but after Speaking to a friend of mine who knows audio really well, he said this speaker cable does not have compatibility with gryphon and Wilson audio. That said, the cardas speaker cables work just fine with my luxman amp. Ugh...... |
WC the length of your videos is just fine... I like that they are able to contrast fairly different aspects of a recording. Besides, some of your videos are longer, while some are pretty compact... "Vive la difference!" While ADD is a recognized problem in society, we can't always reduce matters to the common minium denominator.
G. |
Yes, there is certainly an issue with the speaker cable. I have the amp plugged into the wall and when I plug in both Speaker cables , humming starts and I don't even have any xlr connected to it...this leads me to believe that there is a ground issue inside the cable. Something inside the cable isn't making contact correctly. |
A single luxman 900u is already gluing me to my seat...once again, the intoxicating effect has started.... Guys, this is just entirely too good to be true. WHAT AN INCREDIBLE power amp. With a drink in my hand right now, I can say that I can easily sell each and every single amp I’ve owned to INCLUDE pass labs xs300, dan Momentum m400s, constellation, gryphon and many others and just keep this luxman. This is STILL the only amp that NEVER EVER makes me miss any other amp I’ve owned. As I listen to Kenny loggins ,"Meet me halfway", I realize that this is exactly what the gryphon vs luxman really is. This is essentially Drago vs Rocky Balboa. Drago: big, muscular, tall, monstrous, powerful Rocky: composed, focused, not huge, not as powerful, but has such a HUGE HEART and is determined to beat anyone that stands in front of him. Relentless. Drago= Gryphon Rocky = luxman |
1250am and I can’t get off the couch... Alright, it is officially going to be a huge race now. I am going to buy the very best cables (xlr, pc, sp, etc) and bring the luxman combo to heights that have never EVER been done. I will go ALL OUT the way I never did in the past. You all are about to be shocked at what what I’m going to accomplish with it. If you are a luxman 900u doubter, I’m about to erase those doubts soon and if you are a luxman 900u die hard fan, sit back and enjoy what’s about to come. Good night. PS. One single 900u drives the hell out of my Sasha DAW with tremendous bottom end control . |
Ok people, Help me diagnose the problem: When using Gryphon with cardas clear audio beyond speaker cables and nothing else connected to the amp, I get bad humming on the left speaker with the amp just on... (Right speaker is fine). However, if I use my merill Audio speaker cables, i have zero issues of any kind. When I repeat the same exercise above but with my Dynaudio speaker, I get zero hum of any kind regardless of what speaker cable I issue. Zero issues. Thoughts? Again, ive tried the gryphon with the Dynaudio and the cardas and I have zero issues and with Wilson I can use the Merrill speaker cables with no issues but as soon as I use the cardas, humming begins. That said, I have used my luxman amp , cardas clear and Wilson and no humming occurs...it seems to only happen when Wilson, cardas and gryphon are used together... |
WC, while the Cardas site doesn’t provide specs for the inductance and capacitance of the Clear Beyond speaker cables, I found here that inductance is 0.01 uH/foot, which is extraordinarily low, and capacitance is 446 pF/foot, which is fairly high. Also, Stereophile’s measurements of the DAW indicate that the phase angle of its impedance reaches its most extreme value (in the direction of being capacitive) at 57 Hz, very close to 60 Hz. Just a guess, but I would speculate that the high capacitance of the cable plus the very capacitive nature of the DAW near 60 Hz, coupled with the lack of significant inductance in the cable that might mitigate the effects of the speaker’s capacitance on the amp, are making the Gryphon unhappy. BTW, in saying this I’m inferring from your posts that the hum occurs not only when nothing is connected to the Gryphon’s inputs, but also when a powered up preamp is connected. Leaving an amp’s inputs unconnected is not always a meaningful test. Best regards, -- Al |
Hello WC, have you tried to invert the audiosignal connection? I.E. feed the Clear beyond connected to the right Griffin output into the lecft speaker and viceversa? Does the problem change speaker? Have you also tried to plug the Griffin amp into a different dedicated AC circuit? Any change? Regardless, you might find assistance with the respective manufacturers. To contact the Cardas Technician: Cardas Audio Saluti, Guido |
HiI unplugged everything from my room, turned off the ac, even turned off the led lights in my room and went ahead and used a cheater plug too and the humming is still there. I suspect that I'm having compatibility issues when using Gryphon, cardas and Wilson together. I'm not sure why this is happening and haven't ever experienced this before. I suspect these cables just don't do well with my rig but this is strange that i keep hearing buzzing even with everything unplugged and nothing connected. |
The Luxman M-900u is the solid state amplifier for tubes lovers that do not desire tubes anymore in their rig. Some very high end audiophiles have sold their tube amps and replaced it with the Lux. The Lux gives a very meaty sound that is intoxicating. That midrange richness and slight warmth is for sure a great match with the Focal Scala Evos. I experience those Lux ‘s magic qualities in my setup everyday. And it is with what is considered ( in ultra high end audiophile standard) a « modest » preamplifier which is the Mac C-47... I can only imagine how great it could be if I would get the C-900u matching pre. |
Ok so food for thought guys: PURE CLASS A AMPS PLUS CARDAS CLEAR BEYOND SPEAKER CABLES PLUS WILSON AUDIO SPEAKERS = does not work. Wilson audio has resistors that don’t get along with whatever cardas is doing with their cables when you use a class a amp which is notorious for having monster power draw with a huge transformer. If you are going to use cardas clear beyond with Wilson, stay away from class a amps. |
Hello WC, have you corroboration from some source that there is an inherent/known problem with Wilson + Cardas + Griffin? Or is it your own hypothesis only? Have you considered some further troubleshooting? * Move completely speaker wire from left output into left speaker to right output into right speaker and viceversa. Does the hum move to the other side? * Leave amp side the same, but move the left speaker connection to the right speaker and viceversa. Has the problem moved? * Leave speaker side same, but invert amp side connection... Move ritht amp connection to left side and viceversa. Has problem moved? * have you verified that speaker wire positive/negative polarity is not inverted speaker side or amp side? * have you tried to flip around the speaker wire.... That is connect the end currently plugged into the amp into the speaker, and viceversa? Does problem go away, moves, or otherwise changes? * Have you tried a different power cord on the Griffin? What is the Griffin plugged into... Denali or wall outlet?
Yes, there might be a problem with the particular combination of amp, speaker wires, and speakers, but with what you have written about it this far, it might be a little premature to draw definite conclusions on the origin of the grounding hum. Saluti, Guido
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I'm with Guido on this one. If it's the cables, then both left and right should have issues. Try switching left/right speaker cables to see if the problem remains on the left side or if it travels to the right side. If it travels to the right side, then it's one bad speaker cable. If it stays on the left side, then you can start looking at other things. Dave |
Hi, Spoke to cardas today. They are aware that some amplifiers don't get along with cardas cables. He named NAIM, SPECTRAL. He acknowledged that this isn't the first time he's heard of this but that it has to do with the voltage regulation of the amplifier design. According to him, some amps aren't designed this way so they tend to react this way when there's a huge amount of copper connected to it like what cardas does. In conclusion, there's no compatibility with Wilson , gryphon and cardas. My amp works perfectly with Dynaudio and cardas though so the amp isn't the issue. |
I’m using cardas with my luxman and Wilson and there’s zero issues. Sounds excellent. My Gryphon will continue to be here since I have other speaker cables and plan to buy Odin 2 speaker cables or maybe buy audiomica Consequence speaker cables? Not sure yet. Odin 2 Speaker cables is the long term plan after this chaotic thing passes. As far as cardas announcing on their website that their cables might have compatibility issues, they wouldn't do it because neither do other manufacturers. For instance, Wireworld Platinum 8 Speaker cables don't work with luxman 900u and magico. They make the luxman 900u go into protection mode so yep... These things exist people and I'm letting you all see them here :). |
Whitecamaroos: I would like a brief clarification due to curiosity please. I thought you settled on the Focals over the Wilson Sasha DAW as a result of a prior video shootout where the Focals were your preferred choice. Yet, of late, you feature the Wilsons prominently ignoring the Focals (which i assume you still own). I expected the Wilsons to have been up for sale by now and removed from the room. Thanks in advance for your response. |
Hi, I expected the same but I had a local buyer for my focals and I needed to free up some money to move into the luxman stuff I have. Speaking of luxman, I now have the luxman c900u plus an integrated that I'll disclose on my next video. :) And I also bought another power conditioner which will go toe to toe vs the Denali. Gotta keep moving ! |
WCSS, That is really troubling that any high dollar speaker cable would cause the m900 to experience a fault condition and go into protection. Where did u see this happen? What is the capacitance per foot? Perhaps the RLC recipe on the cable in conjunction with the speakers crossover network creates ultra high inrush current or an oscillation that trips the Luxman into over current protection. I’d love to see the schematic or talk to Luxman to see what conditions must be met for the amp to go into protection. I am using Transparent Audio Super Speaker 5th gen between my m900 and Dynaudio Confidence 50. Maybe I really ought to try other cables to see if I can get a boost on power delivery. It feels like something is constricted and not freely flowing in the bass area. My Pass INT 250 was a more synergistic match giving the feeling of wide open on tap power. Perhaps I’ve been barking up the wrong tree ( power cables ) and need to play with speaker cables. |
Awesome WC. Love your attitude and agree we all keep on learning. I am pretty shocked about Cardas sc incompatibility w Gryphon or vice versa, whichever way. Did not realize certain speaker cables could be nonstarters with certain amps. Major ouch. Glad you are enjoying the Luxmans again. Are there certain speaker lines (or specs) that you would NOT recommend the 900u with, in stereo or mono? I believe I have read a post or two warning against certain pairings w the 900u. Take care there everyone. |
@WCSS Some people think no power conditioner is best. A while back I experimented with a few conditioners and found them restricting in one way or another. I haven't had the pleasure of trying highly praised models like the Denali though....Since you seemed to enjoy the Nordost line of cables have you ever thought of trying their Qbase distribution strip? From Nordost's website: "The essence of the QBASE-Mark II concept is a straight-line AC distribution path, combined with star-earthed topology for connection to a clean ground. By eliminating any form of in-line filtering or active circuitry we maintain the lowest possible AC supply impedance, while a tiny lift in the earth impedance of all but one of the output sockets routes the signal grounds directly to the center of the star and the clean earth terminal." I have used one for years and have experienced no restrictive issues of any kind. The idea (as probably with most AC devices) is to use you best cable to power the Qbase giving the benefit / flavor of that cable to everything plugged into the unit. It would be interesting to throw this type of unit in the mix of power conditioners for comparison.....conditioner shootout! Keep up the good work, very interesting. |
WC, how bad is the hum? Does the music come through, just with an overlay of hum? Is it low freq hum or higher freq buzz? Does it happen with the Denali and also if plugged into the wall without the Denali? This is certainly unsatisfactory and disappointing, but the answers might help solve the problem. It could be a ground problem with that combination of components, so the Nordost QBase is a great idea. Just for sound quality alone, I am curious to see how the QBase compares with the Denali. |
A theory - Cardas cables are mostly constructed using their special litz wire. It looks like bare copper wire, but it actually has an enamel coating (which acts like a normal insulation such as teflon or pvc). The Clear Beyond has an enormous amount of these litz strands. It could be that the termination during manufacturing was not perfect and one or more of these litz conductors were not properly tinned and making a loose or "cold-solder" type of connection at the spade/banana. When this happens, you will definitely get humm/buzz. It could be that some amplifiers are more sensitive to this than others. |
My experience with the 900's is very different. I get to listen to them through Wilsons/Nordost and nothing about them compare's remotely to the D'Agustino Momentums. The Momentums are vastly...Let me say again, VASTLY superior in every single way and should be for the difference in what you pay. |
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