No. Dark Matter rocks. Much better than the competition: plastic. LOL
Machina Dynamica New Dark Matter CD and Blu Ray tray treatment?
This is a set of adhesive-backed thin plastic pieces that one attaches to one’s transport or player disc tray. The disk rests on them during non-spin mode, but presumably don’t touch the applied thin pieces during playback mode. The company says the new Dark Matter pieces reduces background scattered light from reaching the photodetector, thereby improving performance.
Anyone tried this product? Please specify transport or player if you have and your impressions.
Anyone tried this product? Please specify transport or player if you have and your impressions.
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For a quick summary, since I have been instructed by carp not to be windy or hijacky :) The fact alone that Geoff is looking at possible effects on the audio signal is one that should be recognized. My review was going to turn to how even though Geoff does not have an in-room system he has an awareness of the possibilities in audio. As well even if Geoff has his own style of presenting, don't we all. Aren't we all looking to the explaining of audio in a way that makes sense to us? I like sticking closely to the fundamental forces and labs that support them as well as finding things that possibly have reached beyond what has been texted booked up till now. This is how I view Geoff. In my mind I have to separate what I read him saying, what I have studied and focus on what I am experiencing. In the end is what I experience and how I see it fitting into our listening lives in a positive way. Can you use NDM in a positive way? In my book you can. Will it work for everyone in a positive way? I have no problem with everyone in the hobby buying some and trying it for themselves. If NDM does something you needed done, good investment, if not then you will add to the experienced collective list. have a great weekend Michael Green |
Can we have pop quiz about obvious reasons? "I also sold a set of various color pens for coloring the CD, including the data side; that product has also been discontinued for obvious reasons."I am torn between "CDs are becoming irrelevant so market is shrinking" and "Staples stopped carrying them". The latest posts on botanics have been amusing. In fact, following this thread is, sort of, pleasant. Gold stars for geoffkait and celander. |
I have not. That is why, despite having doubts, I abstain from saying it does not work. I barely have any CD around (I keep two CDs and three SACDs, in case I ever want to check if my player still works) so it is all theoretical reading for me. Somehow, discussion about the properties of plants seems more reasonable and useful than coloring CDs so I have been following it with more interest. |
All this thread is interesting... I cannot try the NDM,because I dont use now a cd player... I had transfer all my cd in flac files et listen only to flac files...I keep the noise of the computer to reasonable level and the results are at my satisfaction... But all that is because on the many tweaks I implemented... I know now that tweaks are more important if you had vintage gear or medium hi fi gear than buying some other piece of mid-fi gear...Installing the room is more important and tweaks to the final results...It is my experience... Then I am interested by non orthodox tweaks...Very interesting OP and thread... |
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mahgister All this thread is interesting... I cannot try the NDM,because I dont use now a cd player... I had transfer all my cd in flac files et listen only to flac files...I keep the noise of the computer to reasonable level and the results are at my satisfaction... But all that is because on the many tweaks I implemented... >>>>One can’t help wondering, wouldn’t you have gotten better results if you had used NDM in your player when you transferred all your CDs to flac files? You would now be listening to music with better signal to noise ratio, no? |
Red-IR and violet-UV absorptive dyes are interesting, too. And these dyes have been around like forever. My last product was a dye. There are many ways to skin a cat. The whole point is to skin it. Otherwise, it’s just a lot of talk. There’s no substitute for signal to noise ratio. - old audiophile axiom |
I speculate one reason why a lot folks gave up on CD and moved to streaming or whatever is that they couldn’t get it right and gave up in frustration, that is if they even tried. Or they like the convenience or whatever of streaming or serving or whatever. I understand that. Untreated CDs played on untreated CD players generally sound thin, bland, compressed, metallic, wiry, irritating, remote, plastic, synthetic, two-dimensional, gloopy, generic, thumpy, hard, sour, rolled off, screechy and like paper mache. I’m not trying to set the world on fire. I just want to start a flame in a few hearts. |
GeoffKait you are right for the cd untreated.... I dont doubt that....This is the reason that I am interested in this thread.... I will install in the year to come a cd player for sure … I will try your NDM then....But for lowering the noise level I had my own stones and crystals connected grid on the computer and cables and gear and electrical house cables grid,hence "all is quiet on the western front"... |
I understand where you’re coming from but when I say signal to noise ratio I’m referring to the optical SNR and the downstream analog SNR which depends on it. By reducing background stray light in the CD transport you increase optical SNR. Of course, as you say, all sources of noise and distortion in the system should be controlled and minimized, too. The claimed SNR of 90 dB for CDs is achievable only if the system can handle it which, obviously, in most cases it can’t. That’s why the humble LP or cassette oft sound more dynamic than CD. As for the claimed Dynamic Range of 90 dB, many CDs are overly compressed so there goes your dynamic range spec down the tubes! |
You have to agree that a lot of what Geoff says , on this subject at least, does make sense. My NDM treated Pioneer DVD/SACD player does sound fuller and more musical all round. Now tbh my acquisition of a C.E.C belt drive CD transport sounds even better on Redbook CD and I wish I had some of the NDM left to try in this but alas it all went into the Pioneer and the Sony Discman. But I was suitably impressed enough to say that I will buy a pack from Geoff when I get round to it. |
michaelgreenaudio A few days ago I received my sample from Geoff and my responsibility is to find where I think the product might work the best and for who, looking for what. Geoff at this point is as high on my list as the company who sent us their $25,000.00 mono block amps. Wouldn’t it be totally cool if Geoff created the perfect CD tune? I think it would be anyway. Wouldn’t it be great if Geoff really was the smartest guy on campus? Wouldn’t it also be great if all Geoff has been trying to do is get us to relax a little, and we simply didn’t understand his sense of humor? Wouldn’t it be great if at the end of the day we realized we were all family? If so, I think some of us should still hold Geoff down and give him a serious torture tickling from time to time. Michael Green >>>>>>Apparently it takes longer than I would have guessed to get the answers to all of Michael’s questions, were they a foreboding of things to come? 😳 If finding answers was easy in this hobby we’d all have the best systems in the world. As I oft say, there are many reasons why getting to the bottom of almost anything in audio is not so simple. Aside from any sort of ulterior motivations folks might have, you know, perhaps professional rivalry, trolling, psychological predisposition, tweakaphobia, thou shall have no other gods before me syndrome, the nocebo effect, personal grudge, etc. and just looking at the obvious problems with testing ANY audio product - cable, CD player, speaker, CD tweak, iso stand, audio feet, etc. - The tests results will only be as good as the test system, whether there are mistakes in the system, e.g., Polarity issues, consciousness Directionality of Fuses and Cables, room treatment IQ, vibration isolation IQ, hearing skill/ability in distinguishing subtle differences, skill in hearing obvious differences, testing a number of times to establish confidence in results, don’t even have to mention time of day, weather, and many other factors that affect sound. Gonna raise me an army, some tough sons of bitches I’ll recruit my army from the orphanages I been to St. Herman’s church and I’ve said my religious vows I’ve sucked the milk out of a thousand cows |
I would like to know has anyone tried the NDM on a front loader WITH a cd mat like the Marigo crossbow? I would like to try the NDM but it does not look like the disc would clear the entrance of my Oppo BDP-205’s transport with the disc resting on the squares AND the mat atop the disc-(although once spinning the disc would probably clear the squares on the tray) |
+1 Michael but with out the tickling. I don't want to see what that would do to Geoff, he is kind of like, on the fence (of sanity that is) as it is. michaelgreenaudio A few days ago I received my sample from Geoff and my responsibility is to find where I think the product might work the best and for who, looking for what. Geoff at this point is as high on my list as the company who sent us their $25,000.00 mono block amps. Wouldn’t it be totally cool if Geoff created the perfect CD tune? I think it would be anyway. Wouldn’t it be great if Geoff really was the smartest guy on campus? Wouldn’t it also be great if all Geoff has been trying to do is get us to relax a little, and we simply didn’t understand his sense of humor? Wouldn’t it be great if at the end of the day we realized we were all family? Michael Green |
Here is my room hit list for Friday morning at AXPONA 2019: 16-Aster: Shelter Dan |
We can discuss cables here, if you want. In fact, I just affixed two NDM thingies to my DAC output IC’s going to my Teo Audio Liquid Pre passive preamp. Huge boost in inner detail and space from my ATC SCM20-2 active monitors.. I can’t wait to affix a few NDM thingies to my analog turntable platters.. |
A funny Harvard joke. A freshman from the South is walking around campus on his first day. A little bit lost he goes up to a Senior and asks him, “Can you tell me where the Student Union is at? The Harvard Senior, responds, “Here at Harvard we’re taught to never end a sentence with a preposition.” The freshman, rephrases his question, “In that case, can you tell me where the Student Union is at, a$$hat?” |