Thanks for the update and recommendation.
Impressions of the Re-issued Genalex Gold Lion U77/GZ34 Rectifier Tube
First some qualifications. I only have ears to judge. I have little knowledge of circuit design etc. But I have spent about 15 yrs putting a very good system together which I would be happy to show to anyone. I have also learned that synergy is the key to success in putting together the magic that we all are looking for. I am not totally new to tubes. But if my system sounds good, I generally leave it alone. Okay, so that's not completely accurate... I leave it alone longer than many others. My point is that I have not all the different GZ34 tubes. But I have some. I tried SS as recommended. (Weber Copper cap) It sounded awful to me and my wife.
My system is listed in my profile. The amp is a Bob Latino VTA ST-70 with all upgrades offered. Bob built the amp in "09. I didn't realized the importance of a good rectifier tube until I got the Genalex Gold Lion. I've had this in a little less than a week. First impression.....WOW!!. The attack of the plucked strings on SRV's "Tin Pan Alley" was fantastic. Extremely sharp. Plenty of air. I was spell bound. But I wasn't expecting what came next. the bass kicked in and was at least an octave or more deeper than it was the previous day when I listened to it with a different rectifier tube.(Sovtek) It hit me in the chest more than it has ever done. I have fought hard to get the adequate amount of bass in my room for years. The room is 5000 cu ft which is a lot to fill. So this is welcomed. If you have a bass heavy system it may not be your cup of tea unless you can tame it. AAMOF, I turned back my sub last night. I've never done that before.
At first I thought my new cartridge (Zyx 4D) may be playing a big part since it digs out more bass than my previous cartridge. Its been in the system about 6-8 weeks. However, putting on a CD showed the same tendencies as what I had heard on vinyl, though maybe not to the same extent.
I am very happy with the Genalex GL GZ34. The price is $40 which puts it at the top price for the re-issued GZ34's. I had a GL in the amp before which had a very short life span
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/genalex-gl-gz-34-rectifier-did-i-just-get-a-bad-one-five-mont...
However I suspect it may have been due to a weak tube being cryoed and used in a demanding amp. This one is not cryoed and was hand picked by Jim McShane. The sound is good enough that I would be willing to buy a new tube each year because the sound is that good. Certainly I hope that isn't the case. However, Jim (& I) believe that a good GZ34 should handle the ST-70, though that has been pointed out as the short coming of this amp. However, I got at least 3 yrs out of the original GZ34 tube. Maybe I'll get a good life from this one. Like the previous one, I will enjoy it while it lasts. Its a winner.
My system is listed in my profile. The amp is a Bob Latino VTA ST-70 with all upgrades offered. Bob built the amp in "09. I didn't realized the importance of a good rectifier tube until I got the Genalex Gold Lion. I've had this in a little less than a week. First impression.....WOW!!. The attack of the plucked strings on SRV's "Tin Pan Alley" was fantastic. Extremely sharp. Plenty of air. I was spell bound. But I wasn't expecting what came next. the bass kicked in and was at least an octave or more deeper than it was the previous day when I listened to it with a different rectifier tube.(Sovtek) It hit me in the chest more than it has ever done. I have fought hard to get the adequate amount of bass in my room for years. The room is 5000 cu ft which is a lot to fill. So this is welcomed. If you have a bass heavy system it may not be your cup of tea unless you can tame it. AAMOF, I turned back my sub last night. I've never done that before.
At first I thought my new cartridge (Zyx 4D) may be playing a big part since it digs out more bass than my previous cartridge. Its been in the system about 6-8 weeks. However, putting on a CD showed the same tendencies as what I had heard on vinyl, though maybe not to the same extent.
I am very happy with the Genalex GL GZ34. The price is $40 which puts it at the top price for the re-issued GZ34's. I had a GL in the amp before which had a very short life span
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/genalex-gl-gz-34-rectifier-did-i-just-get-a-bad-one-five-mont...
However I suspect it may have been due to a weak tube being cryoed and used in a demanding amp. This one is not cryoed and was hand picked by Jim McShane. The sound is good enough that I would be willing to buy a new tube each year because the sound is that good. Certainly I hope that isn't the case. However, Jim (& I) believe that a good GZ34 should handle the ST-70, though that has been pointed out as the short coming of this amp. However, I got at least 3 yrs out of the original GZ34 tube. Maybe I'll get a good life from this one. Like the previous one, I will enjoy it while it lasts. Its a winner.
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wolf_garcia Cryoed tubes don't perform any better than other tubes, don't necessarily last longer, and the myth that extreme freezing and thawing of grid screens and tiny wires improves anything is sales propaganda that's not based on reality.Do you base this opinion on actual measurements? If so, will you please share some data with us? |
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Hi artemus, I've been using the same Mullard IEC old stock rectifier in my st-70 for the last 10 years or so, and I am not shy about using the unit. I would think you can probably score a good old stock tube from any of regularly named suppliers. They are not that expensive relatively speaking. Good luck. George |
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For the record I had two ‘52 Sylvania Badboys and one ‘42 Tung Sol rectifier tube in my pure tube headphone amp. All were cryo’d by Cryopro. Great sound. Long life. I was one of the very first to employ a cryo lab on a regular basis and also one of the first to employ a humble home freezer for the same purpose. That was about 20 years ago. You’d probably be shocked if I told you what things I’ve had cryod or frozen over the years. Please, no angry emails 😡 demanding that the home freezer isn’t cold enough. |
@jetter +1 the Gold Lion KT77 was really a revelation for me. I was having some issues with tube failure so with my last quad paid a bit more for better quality at Upscale Audio. I've had that quad running 14 months now without a hiccup and I listen 6 or more hours per day. Highly recommend that tube to anyone! |
The Mullard 5AR4 rectifier sounds best among what I’ve tried. Next up is JJ, but they’re incredibly fragile. So many Shuguang tubes excel, both sonically and in terms of reliability. While I’ve found their 5AR4 rugged, the sound falls a far bit back from the JJ, unfortunately. Sovtek tubes, as usual, sound BAD. Glad to see you here, Marty, my old friend! Hope all is well |
Deep freezing is an unnatural and frankly tawdry thing to do to your poor little tubes. I was warned against those years ago from people who've had them fail, so I avoid previously frozen tubes and only use fresh, un tainted tubes. Some do arrive in the mail kind of cold but I can't avoid that. I have a JJ 5Y3 (came with my Dennis Had Fire Bottle amp) and didn't know it was fragile but I'll consider myself warned, and the large cool looking Shu Guang 234B seems to work OK (gets points for "best looking" rectifier tube often in tube beauty pageants, and I put a tiny "Miss China" sash on mine which also helps by damping microphonics a little), but so far the GL U77/U34 seems to sound best in this SEP amp. I'm going to try an old Mullard though…I mean…how can I not? |
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Maybe I should have bought a cryoed GL U77 as mine failed after around 4 months (warranty ran out dammit)! It was the source of the sudden appearence of very low frequency hum in my subs, only remedied after taking my entire rig apart and checking every possible ground connection before swapping out all my tubes until I got to the rectifier. A hastle, but fixed with a barely used 274B that sounds fabulous. And how does freezing tighten tolerance? Wait…I don’t want an answer as it would only confuse me. |
I have a pair of these Genalex GL GZ34 (aka 5AR4) rectifiers in my PrimaLuna Dialogue Premium PreAmp along with some Genalex GL 12AU7s and a pair of Mazda CIFTE 12AU7s... This combination along with a McIntosh MC152 Amp and a pair of Martin Logan ESLs are very sweet... "In space no one can hear your cryo tubes scream." ;^) |
I know that this is an old post but in case someone still reads it (like me) I have to ask this: cyro freezes everything in the tube and then comes back to a normal temperature. So then the tube goes into its circuit and gets heated. So can someone who is better trained than me (which is about 99% of the people out there) tell me just how they can say for sure that the cyro is working? Did anyone hear the tube before the cryo and then the same tube after? If so, how does the cryo rearrange the molecular structure and keep it the same once the tube heats up for the heat will affect the molecular structure the same as the extreme cold, will it not? When NASA does their cyro on the parts they use, are those parts exposed to very high heat over and over again such as a tube in a circuit or are they a "one and done" application? Curious as to thoughts / explanations...and thanks... ZK |
We'll never know. @geoffkait doesn't hang in the forum anymore (as far as we know.) |
You guys are so mean. A little humillity about the subject on both sides might be in order. I'm willing to concede to either side with some relevent data. I never saw a technical explaination for or against cryo treatment. Everything said was hearsay and anecdotal and none of it convincing either way. Give me the physics please. After all heating steel and quenching quickly adds strength why is it so hard to believe that something you may not happen to know might happen in the other direction. Approaching absolute zero transforms many materials into super conducting states. Cryo is far colder than -40 F. Cryo is closer to AbZero than -40 F BTW When I say say heating steel I'm not talking about leaving it in your barn over the summer. I wish @geoffait would come back I want to hit him up for some of those Nasa tubes 😉 |
Ok so I asked Mr. Google and he said, according to the article link, that cryo treament can help certain things. Vacuum tubes is probably not one of them Cryo takes materials down to at least -190 C. No barns in the US go down that low. Cryo treating actually realigns the crystaline structure of steel and other materials. Untreated steel has a variety of steel crystal configurations. Cryo literaly squeezes everything down to one uniform, the most stable, crystaline configuration. This improves strength and electrical conduction. It is assumed that this happenes in other materials but the engineer did not go to deep into that. Ok so with a single material cold can be good, everything changes together, no worries. However....tubes are assemblages of several different parts made up of several different materials each with their own physical properties. All of these components are bonded together with various tolerences. If you freeze an assemblage like this everything freezes with differing rates and results. Now try to thaw it out....again with differing results. So this complicated assemblage now at operating temperature may not be bonded together the same way any more. It is no longer really at the same spec as when manufactured. Makes sense to me! This guy did offer some hope. His idea was that after cryo only the strong survive. Stuff that warms up and is no longer in spec fails relatively quickly so that only superior tubes live on. I think that opens the door for another question though. What if the thing that cryo breaks is the thing that makes the tube sing? Remember when the tornado swept up Dorothy's house? The old bat was still flying. Now you guys stop fighting😃
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My experience with the Gold Lion reissues have been uniformly good. I have a number of their tube types but have not tried their GZ34. Thanks, based on some of the good commentary above, I'll give it a try. IMHO and experience, the best place to purchase any Gold Lion tube is from Jim McShane. He always goes the extra yard in his pre-sorting and testing. For example he tests for low noise at no extra charge unlike most of the competition. |
yep, old post here i advise all who ask that when it comes to gz34/5ar4’s it is really best to stick with old stock uk/dutch ones, and then usa ones, even if one has to pay up for them the old world ones are exceptionally well built and last a loooonnnnggggg time... and because when rectifiers fail, the failure can hurt the device it is powering, so replacing a blown rectifier is often not as simple as just plugging in a new one into the socket... playing with modern rectifier tubes with lower reliability has hidden costs that can sometimes be rather high |
I have been told this before and will heartily agree. The fact is that many things were built much better before built in obsolescence became the byword for mfgs. However, the problem is the $150+ for the NOS tubes.The GL was $40. But I understand the problems it can cause. At the time I was using a Bob Latino ST-70 which is hard on rectifier tubes. Also I was surprised at how much a rectifier tube could have on the amp itself. This was the shock to me..And it lasted longer than others Anyway, I now have a NOS Matsushita (Japanese Mullard). but the amp is a backup now. Great sounding amp. |
Hi guys, I have a fully modded Modwright Oppo UDP 20w with Modwrighr PS 9.0 psu. They shipped with Sovtek 5ar4 the first one blew within a week blowing a fuse in my power conditioner. The second one blew 5 months later blowing the fuse in the psu. I'm new to tube world so flying blind a lot. Upon research I found some supliers with pointers on subbing out tubes and which models do what. audiotubes.com is the most comprehesive list of tubes and descriptions and comparisons. Thanks for the Jime McShane tip The first substitute fo the 5ar4 was a Tung Sol gz34. which offered a significant improvement over Sovtek (Sovetek from the Russian root word meaning "is crap") . Picked up a NOS Mazda (phillips) 5r4gys which changed everything for the better. Wow! Just seeing the new tube was a treat. It had an obvious look and feel of a quality object. Amazing what a good rectifier tube can do. |
Here is an unfortunate warning abou another vendor Doug's Tubes. I ordered a couple of overpriced cheap vacuum tubes for an amp. I found some other choices but failed to cancel order before they got to me. They arrived with several other boxes and I opened them.
I found several other reviews of the same character on other sites Buy Beware! |
I can kinda see where he's coming from. Some people have been known to pull a switcheroo and send similar looking but very used tubes back after requesting a return. And changing your mind after you ordered simply because you got some tubes cheaper somewhere else isn't exactly going to endear you to the vendor, so a 15% fee for his time and trouble doean't seem all that unreasoable.. just sayin' |
