McIntosh is in so many high-end systems and there is a reason it sounds great, ultra reliable, people bash it, and I was one until I heard a system 10 years ago, I then owned it, like others the old passing on of myths from the 70's onward. It also looks good to boot. Does not mean one has to like it, but give them props, the USA made till today, and their gear last forever something I cannot say fr other gear I've owned with Caps going bad and other parts within 5 years needing a total rebuild. My MC 402 is still going strong after 16 years and I sent it back to McIntosh for a check-up a few resistors were replaced nothing else was needed.
I have seen some Interesting comments about Mcintosh lately
These comments come from here and a couple of other sites.
1.The only people that buy Mcintosh gear are one's that just don't listen.
2. Mcintosh is what rich people buy just like Mercedes Benz.
3. Mcintosh relies on generational buyers as a business plan.
4. Mcintosh is known for rebranding products and putting there name on it.
5. Mcintosh has great looks but uses cheap off the bin parts.
I can't think of another high-end company that have so many stereotypes about the brand. On the other hand I can't think of another audio company that has been in business as long.
1.The only people that buy Mcintosh gear are one's that just don't listen.
2. Mcintosh is what rich people buy just like Mercedes Benz.
3. Mcintosh relies on generational buyers as a business plan.
4. Mcintosh is known for rebranding products and putting there name on it.
5. Mcintosh has great looks but uses cheap off the bin parts.
I can't think of another high-end company that have so many stereotypes about the brand. On the other hand I can't think of another audio company that has been in business as long.
133 responses Add your response
"03-24-2016 3:34pm If you ask most people about "high end audio", they will usually associate that with "Bose". I know very few people who have even heard of McIntosh. When I mention the name, most people say it's a product from the company that makes the iPhone...." Yeah, I see what you're saying. You're saying if you ask ignorant people, people ignorant of high end audio. Well, duh! |
Casios are classic. Check out the Lum Tec 500, Hard to find one for sale, but check images, comes in PVD or Stainless. Limted edition only 200 made in each of the 3 series, 600 in total. Massive watch if you are going for looks has a reliable Seiko Automatic movement, more of a Divers watch for under the stream of great data you experience. |
Surfers don't need tide data if they're surfing because they're actually physically in the data stream and can see and feel the currents…I wear a watch while surfing to see what time it is, and to show off my cool watches when they're not hidden under my wetsuit sleeve. Note that you should never take McIntosh gear surfing as it is not waterproof (a thread specific addendum…you're welcome). |
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I had a pair of Mirage M3si and sounded best with my Krell FPB600. I would never consider using tube amps with Mirages.I wrote about my experience auditioning Mirage M5si’s with McIntosh 300w monoblocks. I assumed everyone understood that these are solid state. I’d also never dream of driving the Mirage M_si series with a tube amp either, what with their large enclosures with dual 4" ports, But those SS monoblocks? They sounded really nice with the M5si’s. |
I had a pair of Mirage M3si and sounded best with my Krell FPB600. I would never consider using tube amps with Mirages. Once I considered MC2301 but never a big fan of McIntosh. Sound is a bit too soft for my taste. With that said, the best I heard Thiel CS7.2 was with a full stack of McIntosh at Stereo Shop on Mass Ave in Arlington, MA. Stereo Shop was close to my office and LONG gone now. |
Skelton, I am sure there are many mac, rolex, and b&w owners who like their gear and are slight egomaniacs at best, I was just waxing philosophically on the primary motivation for most. How many times have you upgraded b&w speakers to the next one or two up the line? Its a pretty consistent outcome. |
Several years ago I was auditioning a pair of Mirage M5si's, 85-lb. 51" tall floorstanders. They sounded a bit anemic to me when driven by the big 250wpc Sunfire amp everybody was raving about. We even tried it in both Current and Voltage moves. No dice. Then the sales rep inserted a pair of 300w McIntosh mono blocks. Aaaah! There's the magic. They really made those Mirages stand up and sing, and the bass was to die for. I'm a bottom-feeder; I got the $2K Mirages that evening for $1K on closeout, and then sold my ADS L1090ii's to a co-worker for $675, for a total of $325 out-of-pocket. But if I could have afforded to take home those McIntosh monoblocks, I would have done that too. So there it is. I'm not rich enough to make a blatant display of wealth, and I have the knowledge and experience to discern the quality of audio gear. And yet, I had an experience where a McIntosh product owned the room. |
skelton, Such is the nature of the audiophile forum, you too will learn to chuckle at the cat fighting and snarkiness. McIntosh is not the only brand to polarize so, but it must be at the very top. You don't need others validation to enjoy your choices, just self confidence, which I'm sure you possess and will realize as soon as you get back from your drive and start listening to your rig. Enjoy |
I just joined this site a few days ago. The reason I did is because I wanted to learn as much as I can about audio equipment as it has become a passionate hobby of mine. How disappointed I am to see a string of posts such as this one. A few of those who posted had valid good information. The rest however, had zero value to me and was an insult to my sensibility. Really!!!!! Some of it was like a childish playground bully session. How is it of value to audio lovers to go off on watches and cars and slam products you probably have little or no knowledge of? Wouldn't it have been easier to post information intended to educate interested folks with the same passion instead of popping off and showing your ignorance? I'm sure my post will infuriate some but I don't care. I will not be aware of your replies because I won't be back on this string. As soon as I finish my 2 cents worth here, I'm going to shut down my MA-452 powering my B&W 802D 2's, choose which Rolex to wear, put the top down on my CLK-350 and go for a drive. It's a beautiful day here. Too bad I probably won't enjoy it because I have such s****y taste choosing such substandard products in all categories. Oh well, maybe I'm the ignorant one. Anyone want all of my crap for free? |
If the American people knew what I have done, they would hunt me down and kill me and audiophiles are getting harder to please. Hold on! the mic is on and we are live? Ok, please disregard this previous statement. This is not about building better sounding gear but rather establishing a better relationship with you. So what is wrong with McIntosh gear? |
We all hear differently. I have an mc275. I think it sounds fantastic and is well worth the money. I had audio research, my friend owns atma-sphere and it sounds great. For the money, the mc 275 is a great value. But to my ears, everything has to be right. Especially power tubes. Just tried shuggie treasures and they will not be my choice. I like the old vintage tung sols. Maybe it is just that this amp really likes vintage tubes. |
The "function worlds above other brands" is a silly statement, and patently untrue. Pateks and Rolexes are valuable (and relatively expensive) but not necessarily better at keeping time than many less precious mechanical watches, and McIntosh amps compete with far less costly things that are also well designed and sound astonishingly (and equally) good. Ever notice a Ball watch or Primaluna amp? An Oris, Jolida, or Vincent? Ever ride in a Mini turbo? Well, come on down! |
Not to sound hoity toity here because I'm now as poor as a church mouse but I have a pair of mc40 monoblocks, a C22 and an MX 130 processor,,, as well as a Rolex and. Patek Philippe. Comparing apples to oranges is fun but knowing what I know (having been in the jewelry business for my entire life) I'd say that McIntosh gear is between the Rolex and the Patek! They all last for ever when maintained and function worlds above other brands, respectively. |
i remember when i first learned how to post on the internet. but i digress, the plain truth is that anyone of us would jump at the chance of owning a mac tube amp. sure we know it might be not quite as refined as other high end units but at the end of the day...it'll do. i feel dirty for even replying to that op |
Funny comparing the accuracy of Rolex to Seiko. Expensive mechanical watches are not about ultimate accuracy. If it was, any old $69.95 Timex will do. A typical $10,000 mechanical watch will get as accurate as +- 4 seconds per day (if you are lucky) versus a couple of seconds per MONTH on let's say an entry level sub 1k TAG. Expensive mechanical watches are about craftsmanship and pride of ownership, which does not always mean snobby. McIntosh? Simple. The Harley Davidson of Audio. Not the fastest, not the most confortable, and far from the most reliable, or up to date with technology, and for some, retro outdated looks on the cheesy side. But nevertheless an icon of american history that keeps its value pretty well. McIntosh, Harley, take your pick! One makes noise, the other music, and depending on the machine, you might wonder which one makes which ;) |
@philkoan The next time you think about buying something hi-end at Mac prices, I urge you to consider Bryston gear, new or used. Everything Bryston sells comes with a 20 year transferable warranty. I once purchased an 18 year old Bryston .5B preamp that developed a problem in one channel. I shipped it off to Bryston's authorized service center on the other side of the country from me. Three weeks later it was returned to me, in a factory carton, at no charge. Not even shipping. I think anyone who purchases an old Mac tube amp will likely be happy with the way it sounds and will get a good resale on it should they choose to part with it. But I wouldn't touch anything Mac otherwise. Sorry to hear about your bad experience. |
Legumes are actually a very small group of tubers as they are not tubers at all, but peanuts themselves are a large group if each individual peanut is counted. I hope this clears up that issue. Also, tubes blow of course (had one in my hifi amp commit "tubicide" right in front of me…amp survived)…but more frighteningly I endured a SS amp blowing after a show killing an entire pile of pro bass speakers...I continue to be traumatized by that painful experience…and that was in 1978….*sniff*... |
wolf_garcia " ... to think otherwise is
to simply ignore what has to be the largest group of tubers, other than
potatoes and peanuts." I'm pretty sure a peanut is a legume and not a tuber. |
The "tube reliability" comments seem to ignore the world of tube guitar amps which have been the standard for most guitar players for generations. Do Jadis and VTL users spill beer on their amps, drive them to gigs in bouncy vans, or utilize a pair of 1953 vintage amps at 1000 seat concert venues (Julian Lage). I'll bet Fender buys more tubes in a month than all the hifi companies combined use in a year…I've owned and abused tube guitar amps since the 60s and can absolutely attest to the reliability and toughness of these things, and to think otherwise is to simply ignore what has to be the largest group of tubers, other than potatoes and peanuts. |
The reputation of McIntosh and B&W has extended to many Asian countries such as China, India and Vietnam. There are plenty of buyers who are willing to pay any price to own a McIntosh B&W system. In the future, US buyers will see even more "ridiculous" price increase for these two brand names. A canon 80mmm f/1.8 costs $370 while a f/1.2L is $2000. People always says the 1.2L is better but not 5 times better. It's not about many times better or how much an L lens should cost. It's about how many people are willing to pay the extra. You consider the McIntosh MC275 a piece of art and try to save dollar by dollar until you have enough money to buy it. It is not the case for many guys in China or India. for them, it just a matter of writing a check! The manager at a local store was nice enough to set up a multi processor system using 7.1.4 Focal Electra speakers to compare among Integra 80.6, Marantz 8802A, Onkyo PR-SC5530 and McIntosh MX160. It took me virtually no time to figure it out which processor I needed. Buy what you bank account allows and love what you have. Don't compare because you'll never know the true answer. |
I agree with your next to last sentence, NCKempfert, only the very well-heeled will be buying new Mac's in the future. Their pricing is getting out of hand for guys like me who are retired. The used market is all that holds any future for me. Look at their turntable as an example of ridiculous pricing, along with most of their other gear. I still love their amps & preamps, the looks, the re-sale value, and sound, but the pricing is another matter. |
As a current McIntosh owner in my late 20s, I have found the RIGHT pieces in the RIGHT combination to be one of the better values out there. Scoff if you like, but I am a fan. As so many have said, if it works for you, great - if you can't see the appeal, that's fine too. One thing I'll say - my wife is constantly ribbing me (half-seriously, by the way) that "there's really no difference between all of my 'stereo boxes' and the sound out of our computer speakers.. it's just LOUDER." The first time she walked into the room after I unboxed and hooked up my MA7000 Mc integrated, she looked, paused, and said, "well, it sure is pretty," before just as quickly leaving the room. I count that as a win. Even if it is visual approval from my wife - that has to say something, haha! Regardless, some of the pricing has gotten ridiculous. I was excited to see the introduction of the MB50, a streaming music player with balanced outputs and all. As a 'millennial' I am interested in getting into lossless streaming, etc. How better to do so than with McIntosh? But after seeing that this 8" wide box with two antennas on the back, weighing in at 10 lbs or so will retail for about $5,000.. are you kidding me? Let's not alienate the next generation of enthusiasts (me) with 1000% markups. For now, if I want to venture into streaming, I'll buy a Sonos unit and a halfway decent external DAC. |
I can't believe some of these people on this thread, just because they either can't afford something or they don't like something, they put simething down like its a piece of s$@t. A Rolex is worth much more than a seiko or citizen, just because you can't afford it, too bad. You sound like a guy that says a seiko or citizen is a piece of junk because he has a timex, why would you pay more! also I'm surprised you aren't putting down people who own Porsche's or Bugatti's, because a corolla can get you from a to b just as easy, so why spend the money for anything else? Porsche's will be in the shop more, much more expensive to maintain, but it is worth every penny compared to any Toyota. |
I saved for many years to get my Mcintosh system, I have had it now about six years, I went both ways solid and tubes, I love my system, oh and I am not rich by far, my newest car is a 1993, and truck is a 1969. If I were to do it again, I would get the same system, and I do know there is better stuff, but my stuff is Mcintosh. |
"Having no authorized dealer within arms reach I bought a new MC402 over the phone from an authorized McIntosh dealer. Maybe 5 years ago.Paid for it with a debt card and $125 to have it shipped..I sent in the warranty card info and Mac sent the card back along with a letter stating that" for it to qualify for factory warranty it has to be bought at the store,paid for along with sales tax and carried to my car,no exceptions"No internet or phone sales qualify for factory warranty.I called McIntosh and spoke with several different levels of flunkies and got no where.The dealership couldnt or would do anything for me at that time either..No huge deal I thought although I wasn't happy.A few months later the amp started having distortion on the right channel..Long story short I had to pay an independent repair service to fix the issue...This is what I call horrible customer service." missioncoonery: You should not blame McIntosh for not honoring warranty service but the online dealer who sold the MC402 to you. A McIntosh authorized dealer would never do that simply because they're not allowed to do so. Clearly, you weren't buying the MC402 from a McIntosh authorized dealer. You cannot buy a McIntosh, or many other brand names, amplifier even new from any dealer with discount price and ask manufacturer to honor a warranty term. |
Generalizations typically have their basis in fact somewhere, but not always. I’ll certainly go with #2. The Mac dealer in San Francisco, The House of Music, caters to the wealthy. A very close friend was their repair tech for over 10 years but left not long ago because he couldn’t deal with complete lack of scruples of the new owner. He told me that the newer Mac gear isn’t particularly durable and is often very difficult to properly service. Mac made their name on the fine tube gear they built way back when. That tube gear sounded very good then and still sounds that good today. But it’s not the ultra wealthy that buy the classic old Mac tube gear. Those buyers are mostly true audio enthusiasts who have the money to drop $4k on a tube amp. Here on Audiogon, that’s not all that high a price to pay for a top end tube amp. It’s a boatload more than *I* would spend, but that’s me. I’ve critically listened to a Mac C22 tube preamp and that’s a very, very fine piece of audiophile gear. Own one of those and you’ll be way happy. But did I buy one last year when I wanted to get into a high-end tube preamp? Nope. Way too expensive. Got me a VTA SP13, brand new built just for me with a phono board, for $1500. Ya can’t buy a Mac C22 for less than $4000 and more like $5000. My VTA SP13 sounds at least as good. I would certainly agree with #1 for those who are buying new Mac gear. They mostly get it to go with their ultra expensive home theatre systems. Here in the San Francisco area you can’t swing a dead cat without hitting an estate worth over $4 million. Home theatre setups in homes like that aren’t bought at Best Buy. They go to places like House of Music and drop Large Cash on the Best because when you have that much loot, you always buy The Best... As for #3, 4 and 5 - they just sound like sour grapes to me. |
I’m hoping when I get set up in Vancouver/Portland there are some good stations worthy of my MR78. FM radio is still a great way to learn of new artists and music. College stations are usually much better than commercial (the one in Northridge in the San Fernando Valley over the hill from Los Angeles has always been good), but I don’t know what the situation up North is. Gonna mount a rooftop antenna if it’s justified. The MPI 3 & 4 are handy even in a system without a tuner---the scope and other indicators are great diagnostic tools for channel separation, phase, etc., useful for cartridge alignment. |
I still think that McIntosh produces a good product. I would not have spent $6500 on the new MAC6700 receiver if I though it looked, or sounded sub-par. My reason for selling it was derived from the amp's "voicing", a pretty obvious, IMHO, tube sounding piece. So I sez to myself, "self? If you have something that sounds like a tube amp but isn't a tube amp, why not get the tube amp?" Made sense to me. The MC275 is one good looking piece of gear, very retro, very modern at the same time. I much preferred its sonics over the solid state receiver. (I've owned other Mc solid state, too.) Honestly? Being finally able to afford what I consider to be one of the benchmark brands was also one of my reasons. I wanted that glow, that look. I wanted ownership, the experience. Which I got. Now that I've owned it, enjoyed it, I've sold it. Then again, I've owned and sold/traded pretty much everything! |
In the very early 70’s I had a McIntosh C26 pre and 2100 power amp. Then Audio Research came to town, and their SP3 and D75 made the Mac’s sound decidedly average. Still beautiful to look at (to my taste), and probable STILL working fine, but nothing special sound wise. Of course, that was a long time ago. Brooks Berdan, a very critical and picky listener, took on the line, selling it alongside Jadis and VTL, Wilson and Vandersteen. Brooks didn’t carry a line just because he could make money on it---it also had to sound good to him. So I assume the current stuff does. |
ejr1953 - McIntosh is still at Magnolia. As I said, some select Best Buys now have high end Magnolia stores in them.. Only these higher level Magnolias have McIntosh and Sonus Faber. Maybe your store was not chosen for the higher level for some reason. Check out their website https://www.magnoliaav.com/products/audio/av-separates https://www.magnoliaav.com/products/audio/speakers I live in Boston. Try going to the McIntosh website and typing in the Boston area code - 02201. There is one real audio store (Natural Sound), a group of custom installers who specialize in home theater and "connect homes", and a bunch of Magnolias. http://www.mcintoshlabs.com/us/Dealers/Pages/DealerLocator.aspx I had a different experience in DC in the early '80s. I wanted to buy a turntable that Meyer Emco carried. I was in my late '20s and dressed like many academics of that time. i went to the store with my wife and we spent a hour trying to get somebody to talk to us. It was busy, but nobody had the courtesy to even acknowledge me. When I asked if somebody could help me, they just brushed me off. So, I took the money I had in my pocket and left. I ordered the turntable from a company in Florida. I hope your last paragraph was not aimed at me. I was just reporting the current corporate arrangements and my experience at one of the new Magnolias. My only "opinion" was that, at least in the store I was in, they were not really equipped to sell high end gear to knowledgeable buyers. I made absolutely no statement about the sound of McIntosh equipment. |
