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Hi-Fi Fuses - SNAKE OIL? - or something in it?

There's a lot of chatter about the benefits of those high prices gold plated fuses with silver conductor etc. etc. all over the web and the consensus ranges from FANTASTIC!!! to much more subtle observations.

It makes sense to me, epseically in light of spending lots of $$$ on good power cables, that having a skinny piece of aluminum conductor in a glass tube (i.e. a cheap fuse), in the power loop would be detrimental to the performance of the components.

I decided to revamp my DIY power supply I'd built for the Cambridge Audio 640p phono stage and DACmagic in order to test this out - and since it's a DIY project there is no UL Certification to void.

First, I bypassed the fuse link completely to confirm there would be an improvement and give me the best benchmark to compare against - YEP - BIG DIFFERENCE - much more this, that and the other :-)

So then I started looking for hi-fi fuses - WOW!!! - talk about pricey.

Two fuses for the power supply was going to cost $120+ AND I thought I'd probably have to buy a better quality fuse block to make the most of those fuses.

Then a moment of enlightenment - most power supplies and conditioners are protected by pushbutton breakers and not fuses.

I found breakers of the required current rating and installed them into the power supply. I imediately noticed that there was no deteriation in fidelity when compared to the same unit with the fuse link bypassed - GREAT!.

On reflection, the fuses I had in place were rated at 3 amps - so they use a pretty thin fuse wire in them. If I had used a fuse of a higher rating, i.e. it uses a thicker conductor, then I believe that there would be less of a difference between the fused and bypassed implementations

SO - do the expensive fuses work?

Well the empirical evidence out there would suggest they do
- I do know the cheap fuses are not good!

I know bypassing them does improve the sound - a lot in my case
- BUT THAT'S NOT SAFE FOR ONGOING USE

I know breakers work as good as bypassing the fuse
- BUT MESSING WITH A POWER SUPPLY VOIDS UL CERTIFICATION - NOT GOOD!
- FYI a couple of licensed technicians I know WILL NOT change the design of a power supply at all.

I believe the amount of benefit is related to the fuse rating
- but don't go replacing 3 amp fuses with a 20 amp fuse - that's not safe either.

Whilst looking for fuses I discovered AMR Gold fuses priced at $20/fuse.

Now that's definately more affordable than most others at 3-4 times their price.

One supplier I know of in the US is Avatar Aacoustics

If you have had experience with quality fuses please share - especially if they are "modestly priced" i.e. $20-$30 per fuse. And please provide a source :-)

Also, can anypne confirm that Slow blow fuses are better than regular?

And Remember - IF YOU AIN'T LICENCED - GET A TECHNICIAN!

Many Thanks
williewonka
220 responses Add your response
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
Mapman - Interesting - but it appears you need lots of them - speakers, fuses, caps, power supply...

It would cost a fortune to cover a complete system.

I also think the amount of improvement is relative to the quality of the components you are using, since it appears that the chips enhance electron flow. If you use high quality components and cables this is already at a premium, but improvements may still be attainable.

My own experience with upgrading cables on more budget components (i.e. a considerable improvement in fidelity), would suggest to me that using these chips on them might yield similar improvements.

However, I prefer to trust in good old physics, so right now, until the science is explained, I'll give it a pass :-)
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,198 posts
 
No doubt make sure the power is good first. Then worry about fuses later if one must, once the rest of the major items in the house is in order. Unless one notices a problem with the sound that might be traceable to a bad fuse perhaps. Personally, I loose no sleep over fuses once things are tuned in well and to my satisfaction, but hey a tweak is a tweak. Jusr make sure the primary fuse function (protecting the gear from power surges) is in place properly as well.

Also, for some real entertainment, check out the fuse chip thread that has been actively going on here for awhile. Those guys, being worked into a frenzy by the king of sci fi tweaks, GEoffkait, have come up with some real creative places to stick their fuse chips despite it seeming that noone there seems to know how the darn things work :^)
roxy54's avatar
roxy54
7,982 posts
 
Willewonka,
Yes, I have found that although the fuses make a small positive difference, the wall outlet made an amazing difference. I am so convinced, that today, even though I can barely afford it, I ordered a Cablepro Revelation power strip, because I know now that my $10 cheapie must be holding back my system like my generic outlet was. I just can't state it strongly enough...get a high quality wall outlet, and you will not regret it. If you do regret it, call me a jerk.
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
Krell_man and Roxy54 - I have also found that good outlets make for MUCH better performance!

I use Pass and Seymour MRI grade outlets at $26/outlet - used for ancillary equipment in MRI installations

I don't know how they compare with the Afterburner, but they grip like a vice and use very high quality non-ferrous materials.

Don't think they want the MRI ripping the things out of the wall due to impurities :-)

They work extremely well!

So many products - so little cash/time :-)
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
Mapman...
My only question would be why is it that a more expensive fuse is needed to do better over what you started with? There may be some other very well constructed generall purpose fuses available that are NOT marketed to audiophiles that might also do a better job

You are absolutely correct - my problem was , looking at a little glass tube with caps on the end, how does one know if it will do better? - how many brands at $10/fuse does one try?

I went with breakers as an experiment to see if it would perform well - they did - so I thought I'd post my findings ( more for the DIYers out there) and at the same time request others feedback on their experience with fuses.

If you know of a $10 fuse you've has success with, that performs well, please post the brand here - I know I, and all the other members would appreciate having this info.

I for one would much rather spend $10/ fuse over $20/fuse - providing it performs well.

Many thanks.
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,198 posts
 
Willie,

Congrats on a very well thought out and practical approach for exploring these waters!

My only question would be why is it that a more expensive fuse is needed to do better over what you started with? There may be some other very well constructed generall purpose fuses available that are NOT marketed to audiophiles that might also do a better job. They might be a better design or perhaps just be in better condition to start than what you have. If it were me, I would want to know how a good say $10 fuse works in comparison to the benchmark of no fuse you tried before dropping the big bucks on an "audiophile" fuse. Unless the money does not matter?

Just saying....
krell_man
827 posts
 

WillieWonka,

I have to agree with everything that John (Roxy54) said since I use both the Afterburner outlets and the AMR Gold fuses in my system too. I do have Synergistic Research SR-20 fuses in my amp's rail position, but only because AMR doesn't make 15 Amp Fast Blow fuses.

Chuck
jmcgrogan2's avatar
jmcgrogan2
6,346 posts
 
04-09-13: Williewonka
A sense of humour keeps us sane, especially in this "hobby" :-)

Absolutely....though my sanity is still very questionable! ;)
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
Jmcgrogan2 - thanks for the kind words - I aim to amuse - sometimes :-)

Didn't want to get into "the fog clearing" or "my ears going through a miraculous transition!" and my all time favourite "the veil has been lifted" - I gotta try wearing that veil someday:-)

Maybe I've created another "hi-fi hyperbole" I can hear it now...

the component exhibited a certain this and that, and lots of the other - highly recommended.

WOW- already used in Levy03's post - thanks for that :-)

A sense of humour keeps us sane, especially in this "hobby" :-)

Keep on truckin'
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
"You pay your money and take your chances" true.
People will always have varying results with products.I use the SR Quantum fuses in my amplifier and line stage and there`s a clear improvement in sound compared to the stock fuses.In my experience these premium fuses are a worthwhile and cost effective change.
Regards,
palasr
526 posts
 
I've tried some of the Synergistic SR fuses in both my amp and phono stage. I think the improvement falls into the 'decent' category (it certainly is noticeable, but not earth shattering), but I wouldn't buy them again. While the fuse in the power amp has worked fine, the 500mA slow blow rated fuse for the phono stage lasted a day before it opened; the uprated 800mA replacement didn't last more than four days before it too opened; I don't have the heart to attempt yet another replacement from Chris VH. My generic, stock 500mA fuse has been in there for at least three years without incident. Hence, I would have to agree with some of the above posters that have criticized tolerance, rating and quality control in these devices. So, as with anything in audio, you pay your money and take your chances.
williewonka OP
3,075 posts
 
Jfrech - breakers also come in a variety of prices...
- thermal $10-30
- thermal/magnetic $40+++

I choose a name brand thermal for $15, because the market is flooded with the "not-so-good product" from - guess where :-)

The nice thing about breakers
- fix the problem that tripped it, then press button to reset
- not - pay another $??? to "Company X"

Unfortunately, fuses are still the cheapest manufacturing solution - so its unlikely breakers will be adopted in components any time soon.

I'm pretty sure good fuses are used throughout the industry, after all, company's like McIntosh have reputations to protect.

The problem is, if a fuse should blow due to a power surge or some other anomaly - what do you replace it with?

The hi-fi fuses offer a good timely solution - until the replacements from the manufacturer arrive :-)

However, if you are into creating your own DIY products, then a breaker is a viable alternative to the fuse that will not degrade the performance.
syntax's avatar
syntax
2,193 posts
 
I bought a few for my Lamm ML2.1 (forgot the price, but they were expensive, something about $30,--/piece or even more ?). They broke after a short time. I went back to original fuses and never had that problem again.
levy03
442 posts
 
i literally laughed out loud when i started reading about fuses on PS Audio's forum a couple years back. thought these people were nuts. then i read a few well respected member chime in with positive feedback. decided what the hell...i spend that much out drinking on a good night.

got the hi-fi supreme fuses for my PWT and PWD. i laughed again after ordering them....thought for sure it was a waste of money.

fast forward after delivery/install.....i started grinning!!

haven't tried them in anything else and doubt i will... but for the PWT/PWD....they worked like a charm.

didn't notice improvements in this or that....but the other really stood out and shined!
jmcgrogan2's avatar
jmcgrogan2
6,346 posts
 
YEP - BIG DIFFERENCE - much more this, that and the other :-)

LOL!! With a writing prose like that, I'm sure one of the glossy rags will be in touch with you very soon. :)
mofimadness's avatar
mofimadness
4,982 posts
 
I have been using Acme Audio Labs fuses for several years now. I have compared them to my Furutech and HiFi Tuning fuses and heard absolutely no difference. There was a noticeable difference between any of these and the stock fuses, but not between each other.

The Acme Audio Labs fuses used to run $12 each, they are now $16 each and have some type of damping material on them now.

Highly recommended!

http://www.acmeaudiolabs.com/products.htm
jfrech's avatar
jfrech
1,816 posts
 
I thought it was interesting u compared breakers to fuses. Breakers can't cost that much, and it they sound better why not. Goes to show u that some improvements are still needed...

By the way, how much was the breaker u bought? I bet less than the fuse!
roxy54's avatar
roxy54
7,982 posts
 
I bought 2 of the AMR fuses from Avatar, and they work as advertised. Overall improvement in detail and smoothness, especially in the midrange. If however you are looking for a quantum leap in system performance, get an Afterburner 8 wall outlet from Avatar. It makes a far more dramatic difference, and for $80.00, I can't think of anything that would make a similar improvement.
Post removed 
jea48
4,425 posts
 
Check the archives lots of threads on the subject matter.

I read a post a while back, can't remember which forum, where a guy sent a piece of audio equipment in for repair that was still under warranty. The repair center noticed the fuse/s and voided the warranty.

So you might want to do a search on that too.
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