I think this is the exact store you used for Odin2 - correct? HIFI-DIY Store.
Different spellings give different stores.
Counterfeit Chinese Cables
I thought that I would write this for those who are curious about one of the many counterfeit Chinese interconnect cables that are available these days. I know that there have been threads about the subject before, and I was always curious because they seem to be such a bargain. I don't really recall much about what any members actually said about the performance of these counterfeit cables, and I didn't look back and do any research, but a couple of months ago there was a thread that came around to discussing the quality of Chinese made components, and oldhvymec said something that made sense to me.
He said that people that say that what they are making is junk should consider that much of what is in our gear, and a lot of our American brands are actually manufactured there. I decided shortly after that that I would take the chance on a set of interconnects, because I suspected that the interconnects going from my pre to my amp were the weak link and needed upgrading. The interconnects going from my DAC to my pre were Kimber Select which are very good, but the other set were LAT International (now defunct) which had cost $500.00 when new, but I had reason to believe they were lacking because I have one of their digital cables that turned out to be very poor sounding in comparison to others I own.
I decided on a one meter pair of counterfeit Nordost Odin interconnects for a total of $104.00 from Aliexpress. I received them a couple of weeks later. They appeared to be well made, and the locking fake WBT rca's were very impressive and are very tight.
First impressions after installing them were light, thin sound, lacking bass. Each couple of days brought improvements, but from the beginning I noticed that they were quieter. Now, weeks later, I can say that they are drastically better that the LAT's in every way. Detail and ambience are much better, but it's the focus and separation of instruments that is most noticeable.
I have no way of knowing if they are really a copy of the Nordost design, but I am impressed enough that I am going to try a counterfeit Nordost digital cable.
Obviously, this isn't a comparison that is useful to most, because there probably isn't anyone here using the LAT's, and everything is system dependent. I just wanted to relay my positive experience.
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fake MIC (made in China) cables are low quality copper, tin, with awful soldering etc. There are reputable brands from China such as Douk Audio. I believe some others also sell cables... Why go for made in China when you could go for made in Japan? Canare, Belden, Amphenol or just make your own cables! A custom set of cables can be made by a shop owner; real silver, get your jeweler to produce wire from silver bars. Then buy REAN connectors (balanced or RCAs) at just the right lengths. Choose the best type of insulation and cable jacket material. That’s what I did. |
I appreciate the information that you provided in your post. I was aware of some of it, and some of it was new to me. I believe that in many cases the materials used in the counterfeit cables are inferior. It may be that the reason many users find their performance t be better than expected is that they are using a similar geometry to that of the original (eg Nordost). I will admit that one of a set of fake Nordost RCA interconnects that I bought from Aliexpress went bad on me early on. In spite of that, I think that members should be aware that there are legitimate, well-built cables from Chinese manufacturers, and one of those is Xangsane. I bought a set of silver RCA interconnects on the advice of another member, and they are truly a high performing product for a reasonable price. There are a couple of others. They represent a good value for those of us who can't afford the premium American brands. |
@maxima95 at least I admit it and I only spent $20.00 how about you? Regretting it means I have morals and have remorse. Unlike you. And I do not care a thing about you. |
This was not originally a thread about the dangers of counterfeit merch. It was a thread about the unexpectedly high sound quality of certain obviously misbranded cables available on Ali Baba — Neardost, etc. And it was an interesting and informative thread at that. But then …. Well you know the rest. Not a troll, more a toad. Next thing I know, I’m stepping over the junkies in the streets in LA. And I live on the east coast, so that’s no mean feat. I do wonder, though, what is proper etiquette when one encounters junkies on the LA streets. Perhaps different rules apply out west. That would be good info to have prior to my next visit. |
"... All appliances in my home are Bosch, hand tools all Bosch, Snap-On and OTC. All audio equipment is from Europe and North America. ... " Who cares? " ... I will admit I spend $20.00 and bought one of these fake cables and regret it." Regretting it doesn't alter that fact that you are a hypocrite. |
@evank , Every. Single. Time. He trolls, gets angrier, starts cursing and damning people, recites BS talking points and then has the gall to ask the mods to come and close the thread when he doesn't get anywhere. Entirely projection on his part when it comes to "noise". Not even remotely original in his insults too. Like that of a 12 year old. All the best, |
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I rest my case regardless of if you regret it or not.
jerryg1233,411 posts @evank More than you, clearly. Love your vulgarity and @roxy54 make no disparaging remarks about your language. Guess it is the typical hypocrisy of people of questionable ethics and integrity. We cannot avoid all things from China (PRC), but I make an effort, unlike you. All appliances in my home are Bosch, hand tools all Bosch, Snap-On and OTC. All audio equipment is from Europe and North America. I will admit I spend $20.00 and bought one of these fake cables and regret it.
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Yes, much ado about nothing. Tempest in a teapot. Sturm und Drang. Angst in their pants. Brought to you by the usual suspects. How many times does this subject have to come up? The rest of the audio world (the other 98% who don't post and read this just for grins & giggles) goes about their merry way, grateful that they never contributed and instead, enjoy the fruits of their labor buying what they want. All the best, |
The entire premise of this discussion is comical. A thread about the danger of counterfeit entries into what is already a totally fraudulent industry. It reminds me of the scene in Monty Python's Life of Brian where women (who are actually men, aka. the Monty Python guys) dress up and act like men so they can get into the stoning. It's so absurd, it's funny! |
We’ll this thread tosses the credibility out the window for this site. Surprised @tammyholt or another admin has not killed this thread. If I were a cable manufacturer/advertiser of any stature I would demand that this thread be taken down due to the negative impact it has on legitimate companies that offer fair pricing on quality products. Not fake chit from China. Not saying there are not good legitimate cable manufacturers in China or even on the PRC owned sites like Aliexpress or Alibaba.
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Counterfeit cables news on KIMBER and CARDAS websites speaks volumes.These two are 100% all made in USA premium OEMs. and they have posted news of the POS build and illegal counterfeit fakes. Common denominator in both : - ALIBABA and ALIEXPRESS are all crap fakes , and everything shipped out of Hong Kong and China is a fake, These cheap build counterfeit fakes are produced with the cheapest materials and build quality they can get away with , ..go check out the KIMBER crap build example pics and the CARDAS last line reproduced here too. ( LOL) The poster child of what a buyer can actually get: see KIMBER pic about gently sanding a counterfeit fake silver KIMBER cable that reveals it to be just POS cheaply tinned cheap-as-you-can find-it hardware store crummy grade copper made to look like silver cables. https://kimber.com/counterfeits https://www.cardas.com/counterfeit
KIMBER COUNTERFEIT CABLES Some things to look out for when purchasing Kimber Kable online:
CARDAS Counterfeit CablesWe’re proud that Cardas cables retain high resale value, even years after their production. But unfortunately, some unscrupulous opportunists prey upon unsuspecting consumers by selling counterfeits of our cables. Some of these fakes are remarkably well done, visually, and even come in authentic looking packaging. Others barely try, slapping "Cardas" on cables that don’t look like anything we’ve ever made. This is a buyer-be-ware situation. Some buyers are able to return their counterfeit products for a refund. But most are left without recourse. How can I avoid counterfeits? Work at Cardas Audio for at least 10 years 😁. Our long-term employees can usually spot a fake about as fast as a mother can recognize her own child. Assuming you don’t work here (and statistically, you probably don’t), avoid sites like eBay and AliExpress. Every month we report dozens of obvious fakes using eBay’s reporting system, and nothing ever happens. Not a single post is removed, not a single seller is sanctioned. They just don’t care. AliExpress goes one further by having a broken reporting system. They pretend to have a mechanism for reporting counterfeits, but it is littered with dead links and buttons that can’t be clicked. they REALLY don’t care. More trustworthy sources of second hand gear are Audiogon in the US and Canuck Audio Mart in Canada. Fakes rarely show up on these sites, and when they do, they’re both quick to remove them. There are probably trustworthy audio-focused sites in other countries. If you know of one, send us a link. If it looks good to us, we’ll list it here. And of course, consider buying from a Cardas dealer. Many of our dealers take trade-ins, and might have pre-owned cables. Are some cables more counterfeited than others? Yes. The two most commonly counterfeited Cardas cables are Hexlink and Clear Light. Hexlink was a flagship cable from many years ago. There were many iterations, all using the word "Hexlink". It is, by far, the most faked cable. So much so that the majority of listings for Cardas Hexlink cables are fraudulent. The counterfeiters have produced more fake Hexlink than we ever made of the real thing. Clear Light is a more recent cable, and for whatever reason, is now quite commonly counterfeited. And whereas Hexlink fakes stand out (to us) like a sore thumb and can almost always be identified from pictures, Clear Light fakes are really well done (on the outside. Inside is garbage wire), including authentic looking packaging and documentation. Be very cautious when considering the purchase of any cable labeled as Hexlink or Clear Light. What sort of wire is inside counterfeit cables? Bad wire. We’ve taken apart many counterfeits, and what we find is just hardware-store wire, at best.
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@evank More than you, clearly. Love your vulgarity and @roxy54 make no disparaging remarks about your language. Guess it is the typical hypocrisy of people of questionable ethics and integrity. We cannot avoid all things from China (PRC), but I make an effort, unlike you. All appliances in my home are Bosch, hand tools all Bosch, Snap-On and OTC. All audio equipment is from Europe and North America. I will admit I spend $20.00 and bought one of these fake cables and regret it.
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I started out with Odin silver 2s, but now use a Odin gold pc on my cd transport and to my amp (all ordered from DIY HiFi- very good service, but ~ 3 weeks) then I decided to try Odin gold speaker cables, which were only available from Goltech, who has jerked me around for a couple weeks now, making excuses: ETA now Feb 19th Even though China took 'liberties' copying the name and wood blocks, they represent seriously good value. You just have to be willing to wait about a month for delivery to FL, probably a week shorter to the left coast |
This is a crazy thread but I’ll throw my 2 bits in. I think it’s wrong for companies — any companies — to pass off their work under someone else’s brand. It’s also wrong to buy that stuff because it just encourages more trademark infringement and devalues real goods by real brands. Never mind how it’s then used in secondary markets to rip off unsuspecting buyers. Just think of poor Jay getting hustled. ;-) But there are products on Ali Express that are real products under their own brand name that are well made and budget friendly. Haven’t bought any cables but have purchased really good linear power supplies. Chinese manufacturing is very high quality and in many cases the parts are equivalent to what other brands are selling. I have no problem buying those products but won’t spend my money on brand knock-offs. If you do, that’s your choice but won’t be mine. |
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Never as we do not own a TV. Can tell you do not care who made it, or chat child made it, or what conflict minerals were used to make it. Sold my wife’s Tesla once I researched conflict materials content. All about you and your cheap asses.
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@tweak1 I had just discovered what a difference that power cables make. I was happy with the emotiva cables, I didn't know they made that much of a difference. So I wanted to try some other different cables and I bought a wireworld stratus 7 which to seemed about on the same level as the emotiva's. So now because I read a post where someone bought a cable from aliexpress and basicly said the quality was good for a fake. So I ordered one. It takes forever it's still in China. |
Don't let the trolls get under your skin. They seem to not have anything better to do with their lack of knowledge. That said from day one Ive said it is wrong to have used the exact name, when something like NEARdost would have gotten the point across FYI Valhalla is probably a 10 yo design. Odin 2 'should' be much better, and still cheap. That's what Im using over darned expensive WireWorld speaker cables and XLR interconnects, and over a Pangea Premier XL coax cable (MSRP $169) but the Odin 2 coax was half that, so I tried it alone (and was thoroughly impressed) before I slowly replaced all my cables. |
I didn’t buy the cables to say to my friends" look at me I have 40,000-dollar cables". My friends know I can’t afford them and I’m not ashamed to say I can’t. I bought them because everyone said they sound great, and they do. I could care less who made them. I’m sure all the people posting against them have purchased years ago pirated movies off the street at one time or another. And if you say you never did your full of crap. |
The question is why would anyone knowingly buy a "fake" cable? They might claim curiosity or some might even believe they are able to copy the R&D of the cable makers. I think many want brand recognition most can’t afford a true "Valhalla" cable and fewer won’t pay the cost of admission for various reasons. I really don’t like to be put on the defensive from somebody I don’t know and who I suspect is an arrogant snob. So if you must know I have been buying emotiva power cords and have capped my budget to around $100 or less. I have ordered the fake nordost because somebody on this thread bought one and said the quality is decent. So not having much to lose it sounded like it was worth a try, I won’t be receiving it untill the end of the month so we will see. I don’t have a ton of money to spend but I’m always tweaking and upgrading because it’s fun and just part of the hobby. Getting a nordost fake or real does not give me bragging rights because nobody I know gives 2 shits or would know that a nordost power cord is a high end product. I live in a small rural town in N.H. by the Canadian border and I don’t know anybody that is an audio enthusiast. You my friend just sound like a troll. |
As a recent Mogami 3103 cable purchaser with an enjoyable mid-fi system using WiFi Auris Sabre DAC streamer, a serviced ‘80s pro audio solid state amp with lots of head room, a small REL sub and a pair of beautiful Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary speakers, I’ve enjoyed this thread :) Blessed only with average ears, I instantly heard an increase in current reaching the Lintons, as compared to Amazon 12 gauge wire. Wasn’t instantly all good, as the speakers lost some imaging until I reduced the gain coming into the vintage Crown amp from the DAC. |
@dayglow I was reading too much into what you wrote. Thanks for letting me know. No problem at all! |
@jetter Was not implying disrespect to Mogami cable users. Mogami was just an example could have mentioned Blue Jeans Cables ect. |
