I had a van den Hul MC One Special (2nd from the bottom of the line) for about 2500 hours and the stylus lasted until is completely wore out and sounded consistent the entire time I had it.
VPI just took over distribution of them and were a pleasure to deal with and were very accommodative because of the overseas shipping issues were able to do a replacement instead of a factory remanufacture. I live nearby their factory and they actually set it up.
I've also heard good things about the Frog, although you're getting into pretty expensive territory. Make sure you have a well matched phono stage. |
Chakster, that may true in Japan but how do you know the importer, knowing their audience reports it at 10 Hz. You don't because it does not say. You can call the importer and ask I suppose. MC cartridges keep their compliance down so the cartridges principle resonance frequency is above the audio range. The lighter the effective mass of the moving system the higher you can run the compliance. Dynavector makes a great cartridge and the XV-1t has the lightest moving mass of the line with it's cross shaped metal armature vs the square one their other cartridges use. It has a longish cantilever and tracks at 1.8 to 2 grams. The most compliant MCs I know of are the Van den Huls at around 18 um/mN and they track at between 1.3 and 1.5 grams. They have a short cantilever and use a light plastic cross shaped armature, a much lower effective mass. I find it highly unlikely the XV-1t has a compliance of 20 um/nM at 10 Hz considering its effective mass and tracking force. |
My 40 year old Supex, Shure, Audio Technica, Stanton, Signet and Grace cartridges still work like new, except of course for stylus wear. Unfortunately, the actual stylus diamond just disappeared from my Yamaha MC9. I reset everything on my turntable more than once before I figured that out.
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The van den Hul cartridges are known for their hight degree of variable quality. The inespensive one are usally pretty good. The expensive ones it's a crap shoot. If you get a good one they are execptional. However, if you get one that is not good they are horrible (collasped cantilever. stylus falling off the cantilever,motor assembly not straight on the half body) and gobs of glue all over the place. |
The Defects that the OP has referred to are to be found in Cartridges.
Not all Cartridges will have suffered from the conditions being referred to, but there is always a possibility that there are Few Individuals who have had a unsatisfactory experience with a Cartridge, when it comes to it maintaining a Good Condition.
What matters from that point on,
is whether it was a experience when the Cartridge was a relatively New Model with little use, or whether it was a Long Term owned Cartridge with a long life of usage behind it.
The next thing that matters is how the Cartridge Owner felt they had been dealt with when reporting their discovered defect to a Supplier.
If the OP were to make a list of Cartridges that have their attention ?
A Google Search should show up Cartridge Owners experiences with possible reporting on any reliability issues to be seen.
In some cases, there will be a clear description of how the
Cartridge Owner felt about how they were supported when reporting their experience back to a supplier.
I have adopted this method to learn about a few Cartridge Brands.
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Chakster, how do you know that any manufacturer’s compliance rating is at 10 or 100 Hz. It usually does not say. Certainly the math is done at 10 Hz RF = 159 divided by the square root of Mass X Compliance. So it makes more sense to report it at 10 Hz. You assume that just because a cartridge comes from Japan that it is automatically reported at 100 Hz. Yes, and basically this all you need to know. You will never find a Japanese cartridge designer who will use 10Hz, maybe there are an exception, but 99,9% of the Japanese designers always use 100Hz. Keep it as a cultural thing, it’s JAPAN, not USA
I do not own a Dynavector.
I owned 3 different Dynavector LOMC and over 60 different Japanese cartridges (new and old) of all types. So I have some personal experience. Moving magnet cartridges tend to be more compliant than moving coil cartridges because their moving mass tends to be lower. I have an Audio Technica VM95ML It’s compliance is listed as 7 um/mH at 100Hz. That would make it 14 um/mN at 10 Hz. This AT is less compliant than the Dynavector? Some MM (MP) carts like Nagaoka are low compliance, cheap Ortofon Concorde and OM are also very low compliance cartridges and they are MM. Yes. Dynavector KARAT is higher compliance than some modern MM.
Obviously it would help if the manufacturers would specify specifically how the compliance was measured.
All manufacturers (except for Japanese) are using 10Hz to measure Dynamic compliance (All American and European manufacturers). Japan is always 100Hz, this is rule №1 Dynavector compliance is just like ZYX (12-15cu @ 100Hz). And when I asked ZYX via US distributor it was confirmed. They think it’s not good to measure a cartridge using 10Hz, so they are using 100Hz instead for safety reason! It was like a quest for me 7 years ago to figure out how and why it's 100Hz and how to convert it back to 10Hz. |
I used a Lyra Clavis for decades, without problems...I finally changed it, thinking it couldn't possibly still working 100%, not because it had failed, only then to damage it with my poor handling!!
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Chakster, how do you know that any manufacturer's compliance rating is at 10 or 100 Hz. It usually does not say. Certainly the math is done at 10 Hz RF = 159 divided by the square root of Mass X Compliance. So it makes more sense to report it at 10 Hz. You assume that just because a cartridge comes from Japan that it is automatically reported at 100 Hz.
I do not use the math. I stick to lighter tonearms than add mass as needed by actually measuring the resonance frequency. The variables are poorly controlled so to be accurate there is no other way. Go ahead and put an XV-1t in a 12 gram arm and tell us what happens. If there are any owners of XV-1t's out there tell us what arm you use it in. I do not own a Dynavector. But, the arms I have seen the XV-1t in would squash a cartridge with a compliance of 20 um/mN at 10 Hz, unless they have been poorly matched. I suppose stranger things have happened.
Moving magnet cartridges tend to be more compliant than moving coil cartridges because their moving mass tends to be lower. I have an Audio Technica VM95ML It's compliance is listed as 7 um/mH at 100Hz. That would make it 14 um/mN at 10 Hz. This AT is less compliant than the Dynavector? It is less compliant than most MM cartridges probably because it is a dual magnet design. More mass requires a higher compliance to keep the resonance peak of the cartridge up out of the audio band. Obviously it would help if the manufacturers would specify specifically how the compliance was measured. |
I heard something recently about stylus longevity. My dealer said in passing that he was glad he sold me a Koetsu, because some clients had experienced excessive wear on some other expensive cartridges. This may be for any number of reasons, like not cleaning records, etc. But my experience with Koetsu is very good in this respect: minimal wear at 1000 hours.
I note also that Soundsmith puts their money behind their mouth with retipping. You could do worse. |
I'm using a 20+ year old Lyra Cclavis D.C. The ONLY problem I ever had was a worn stylus. Not worn out, just worn. The stylus and cantilever were replaced a couple of years ago by Soundsmith. I'm still satisfied with the cartridge. I have a Lyra Skala that I intend to install one of these days. |
Excuse me chakster. The top 4 cartridges in the Dynavetor line have a compliance of 10 um/mN. That is most definitely at the low end of the scale. Better with heavier arms. It’s a common mistake @mijostyn Japanese manufacturers measure dynamic compliance at 100Hz, not 10Hz as you expect! Dynavector is not a low compliance cartridge, to convert compliance from 100Hz (Japanese system) to 10Hz you have to multiply it on 1.7 at least. It’s been discussed before on another forum: "On to the information contained in the response from Dynavector, 100 Hz is not the normal 10 Hz used for compliance testing and there are notations about this on the cartridge database indicating that the compliance might be as much as twice as high at the normal 10 Hz test frequency." I own Dynavector cartridges. What I have now is 17D2 mkII (dynamic compliance 15 @ 100Hz) BUT at 10Hz it’s nearly 26 cu and this is definitely not a low compliance, you know that Grado MI is 30cu and it’s high compliance. For this reason you can see Dynavector KARAT on Well Tempered Lab tonearms. @zavato V15’s and Infinity black widows Not the best cartridge and average lightmass tonearm (fragile). Denon DA-401 tonearm is much better, as for the cartridges you can try low impedance (low output) MM like Pickering XLZ-7500 designed for MC phono stage (or MM phono stage with high gain), or even with SUT or Headamp. Spectacular cartridge with user replaceable Stereohedron stylus, the best model (top of the line, expensive). Low impedance MM are unique. Expert stylus in UK can service them. Regarding some very nice MM look for SONY XL-50 with Boron Pipe cantilever, this is a high compliance cartridge. Jico replacement available for this model, but original is superior. |
V15’s and Infinity black widows |
Excuse me chakster. The top 4 cartridges in the Dynavetor line have a compliance of 10 um/mN. That is most definitely at the low end of the scale. Better with heavier arms.
The most compliant cartridge in the line is the Karat 17X which is 15 um/mN. That is medium. The DV 20X2 i2 12um/mN on the border.
Koetsu's are very low at 5 um/mN. These are for use on a fork lift. Your favorite V15 is a high compliance cartridge 30 um/mN. Most people use these with a coat hanger. |
Do you think your next cartridge must be your last cartridge?
Why?
With advanced stylus profile like MR you can use a brand new cartridge for 2000 hrs according to the manufacturer. It's too much time if you're not playing records everyday.
Then you can just buy something else. Do not try to find an MC cartridge that will last forever, especially those new MC.
If you're so concerned about stylus wear or suspension condition then buy an MM cartridge and spare styli - this is the best you can do.
Did you every try a good MM or MI ? If you want something user friendly then look for a cartridge with user replaceable stylus, but get the best MM/MI if you want superb quality.
P.S. I want to correct a previous poster, Dynavector are NOT for heavy tonearms. Actually, Dynavector LOMC cartridges are high-ish compliance, they are great (Karat series for example) for mid mass tonearms.
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Personally, I would value proxmity to Soundsmith pretty high. It would able me to hear all levels and properly choose. Everyone has different values....I think Soundsmith cartridges are extremely good..especially the top of the range
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Indeed- I’ve known for quite some time that Peekskill was not far away- as is a dealers that I’ve been doing business with for 30 years and whom I implicitly trust. Thus proximity to Peekskill is not a determining factor for me. It’s just a potential convenience |
wolfie, I think it is your ears not the cartridges.
Soundsmith is not his best bet if he does not like the cartridges. He is obviously quite aware he lives near them and Peter Ledermann is not a god. Joe Grado was a god. Edgar Villchur was a god.
If the cartridge has a warranty and you are dealing with a good dealer you have nothing to worry about. If a cartridge is defective is some way it will manifest very quickly. In the case of the missing stylus it took 4 months. If nothing happens in a year nothing is going to happen unless the cartridge was damaged in some way. Match the cartridge to your arm and get the one you like. Dynavector makes a great cartridge if you have an arm on the heavy side. |
I have 18 ADC carts, 1963-1983, still tip top.
1962 Empire 880P. Perfect.
1958 and 1960 GE carts. Perfect.
1963-2001 15 Shure carts. Perfect.
Ortofon? 2 bad ones last 5 years. 4 bad AT styli.
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What MC said. If you are local to Soundsmith, Peter is your BEST BET, bar none. |
I had a brand new Ortofon come to me wired wrong, but quickly replaced....had a few Grados with no complaints...a Koetsu with good service...In the old days, I had an ADC XLM, and Sonus Blue both fail quickly. I’ve heard bad news about Vandenhul... Most brand names are pretty good now.
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You're near Ledermann? What the heck are you doing here???!
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I'm not sure you can characterize cartridge makes by reliability. All the good cartridges have a warranty but, warranty service depends on the performance of the dealer and importer or company. I was worried with the disappearing stylus that they would say it was obvious damage caused by me and soak me for a replacement fee. Didn't happen. Not even close. I have probably purchased 20 or so records from them, but this was the first cartridge I ever bought from them and they immediately sent me a new one without making me return the broken one first. Consequently, if they have it I will get it from them (Elusive Disc) knowing I don't have to worry about defective items.
I would be more worried about getting a cartridge that worked well with my arm, tracked well and had a neutral character. |
@tablejockey
I have looked at the Soundsmith lineup. Their shop is a short drive from my home- |
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@pbnaudio
hi Peter- on a Linn Ekos 2 arm.
Ideally, I would not spend over $2,000
thanks |
@tablejockey
when it’s time, I simply want to avoid those brands that seem more trouble-prone
Also- I am aware that Mr. Carr is here from time to time and that Lyra has a sterling after sales reputation |
Whats your Budget like and what are you going to mount the cartridge on ?
Have had many Lyra Cartridges they are excellent, Clear Audio, Excellent too. Dynavector superb as well. Look into ZYX too they sound fantastic. There literally are so many great MC cartridges available today.
Good Listening
Peter
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Based on your post, you're overthinking it.
All brands have a bad experience or two from users. Most brands will have some degree of warranty to cover unexpected failure. |
I have never had a problem with Lyra cartridges. The out-of-the-box quality, based on alignment of the cantilever and stylus, has been flawless, and I've never had problems with the cantilever tilting in one direction over time. While some may be concerned with the exposed position of the stylus and cantilever of Lyra cartridges, I actually prefer this type of cartridge because it makes alignment and cleaning much easier. I know a number of people with Koetsu cartridges and I have never heard of problems with that brand.
Almost of the problems I've heard about cartridges involve accidents and user error. I've heard from several people about problems they had with particularly delicate cartridges when cleaning with those sticky gel pads that one is suppose to put the stylus into and then lift the tonearm out of the gel. I've heard of several instances where the cantilever was left in the pad.
Aside from such damage, I think premature cartridge failure is a fairly rare occurrence. |
Zavato, I think cartridges as a whole are pretty reliable. As far as problems are concerned I would get the cartridge from a reputable dealer and company that will stand by their products.
Having just lost lost a stylus off a Clearaudio Charisma, a $2000 MM cartridge with the cantilever and stylus of the Goldfinger I can say that Elusive Disc and the importer Musical Surroundings performed splendidly sending a new replacement based just on the USB microscope pictures I sent them. They also sent me a shipping label to return the bad one. You can't possibly ask for more.
I shy away from cottage MC makers as the support tends to be limited.
Stay with the major manufacturers and you should be fine. As for Lyra there response to problems is brisk. Jonathan Carr, Lyra's designer frequently posts here. I would have no problem buying one of his cartridges. I have not heard of any problems with Dynavector. They are sold by Upscale Audio, Music direct and the Cable Company. I would check reviews and see if they is a "Best" performer in this group. I have had so much great experience with Elusive Disc I intend to stay with them for the products they carry. Unfortunately, they do not carry Dynavector. |
