Worthy upgrade?


I recently upgraded my system to a McIntosh 9500 integrated and Sonus faber Serafinos. My sources are Innuos Zenith Mk 3 and VPI Prime with Valhalla tonearm cable and a Soundsmith Zephyr Mimic Star cartridge. Most of my cables are Nordost Heimdall 2, with an Audioquest Hurricane power cable to the integrated. My current speaker cables are Nordost Heimdall Frey 2.  

Now my question is whether a speaker cable upgrade would be crazy? In upgrading the speakers I thought a speaker cable upgrade was in order. I tried the Nordost Tyr 2.  I heard a significant improvement in the sound. But, is the upgrade ridiculous in terms of the rest of my system?

This may be a stupid question so please be gentle. 😎

thanks. 
 

Ken

kenrus

Very nice system.

Looking at your system and considering you have Nordost Frey 2 now... I would consider these appropriate. I don’t think I would do it. If you want greater detail I would upgrade your integrated amp. Macintosh are good in midrange and bass but lacking in detail. You have attempted to get more detail with the Nordost and Hurricane. I would save up to upgade the amp. 

I agree your speakers are deserving of better amplification. A Gryphon Diablo 300 will give you comparable dynamics without the detail-obscuring overt warmth. 

I had heimdall 2 cables when I owned SF Serafinos. Tried more expensive nordhost cables and Audioquest. Any difference I heard was negligible and not necessarily better. That’s just to my ears- many hear a “night and day” difference in cables, but my experience is that the differences are subtle. 

I would move away from a McIntosh integrated. Your speakers are great and although McIntosh and Sonus Faber generally sound good together I think you are missing the benefots of a separate amp and pre amp.  I had a McIntosh set up and moved away from it to tubes (Audio Research Ref160S and Ref6SE) and this was an astonishing improvement in overall sound quality.  I think you might need more detail for those speakers.  I have since moved to SS but your system deserves a better amp and pre amp.  Let us know how you make out.

I heard a significant improvement in the sound. But, is the upgrade ridiculous in terms of the rest of my system?
 

Given that the goal of an upgrade is to improve one’s system, if you can afford it, I don’t see why not. You already heard “significant” improvement. The only question I would have is: could I spend less money somewhere else in the system and obtain better performance? Keep in mind that the rest of your system will most likely change too overtime. That’s the nature of the game. My 2 cents: significant improvements are not usually easy to come, thread wisely. 

My 2 cents..The MacIntosh is your weakest link. Restaurants that make everything generally don’t do it all very well, separates is the way to go. Trying to prop up Mid-Fi with wires is subjective and can be an expensive rabbit hole. 
Cheers 

@kenrus 

What do you consider ‘significant’ as it relates to the Tyr 2 cables? What did you hear? What tech is different about them vs what you already have that would account for a difference (especially a significant one)? 

I don’t understand the engineering differences. The only thing I know is that the music cleared up with the Tyr. The Frey did a good job of presenting the music, but but with the Tyr the music seemed more transparent. I could more easily tell where the performers were located in the soundstage. 

 

Thank you for your help and good questions  

 

Ken


 

Spending $8K on cables is not the way to go. If you REALLY want to experiment, use the lending library at thecableco.com and look at other brands like Acoustic Zen. Their top of the range is $4K - the silver may help. I bought my AZ Hologram II used for $900 and I love them. 

Also look at brands that sell direct, and buy an $8K cable for $2K (generally speaking). All my IC's are Zavfino Fusion.

But maybe the Mac is the real issue. I learned the hard way that amp and speaker synergy is pretty much everything. Sources are much easier really.

You might also consider Silversmith Fidelium speaker cables.  When I added them to my system both my wife and I were astounded at the sound quality upgrade … far more than I had expected or even hoped for.  I am running a Rogue RP-7 tube preamp, Odyssey monobloc SS power amps, and Fyne F-702 speakers.  Worthy of consideration.

@kenrus 

I have found that my Amati G5’s play well with almost everything I’ve plugged them into. Currently I’m bouncing back and forth between a Hegel H390 integrated and PS Audio BHK Signature preamp and BHK300 mono blocks.  They both sound different, but they both sound very good. And as far as speaker cables, I’m using Audio Art’s AAC Statement e SC Cryo’s with Rhodium bananas. Are they the best out there, no, but I doubt I’ll be buying another pair of speaker cables. I’ll be changing my DAC first and then maybe my amplification.

All the best.

I learned the hard way that amp and speaker synergy is pretty much everything. Sources are much easier really.

Yup, amp, speakers and the room are 90% of a system’s sound quality. That and how the speakers are placed in the room.

 

 

 

 

The following is seen in another thread, as a Post from myself.

I moved on from Cables Only, to Signal Wire Type many years ago.

I then found away to experience Wires used in Cables that are extremely expensive.

The following is showing a Speaker Cable using PC Triple C Wire, which is for myself as a Wire Type proven to be a substantial improvement to an End Sound when this wire is used in a Signal Path.

A prudent watch on the Market will find 30'ft for half the cost of what is shown in the advert.

This is not the only PC Triple C Speaker Cable option. 

https://www.fromjapan.co.jp/japan/en/special/order/confirm/audio9:10004923/2_1/#

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Yes, a speaker cable upgrade would be crazy. If you already have a coat hanger or at least plain old 12-14AWG OFC, there is nothing you can buy on God's green Earth that will sound ANY different, at all. That's both an objective and subjective fact if there ever was one. Anyone here telling you different is not an audiophile and knows nothing about physics and science of sound. That, or they work for one of these snake oil cable companies that straight up lie to consumers about their product. Just OFC with no bells or whistles, that's the cream of the crop.

@squared80 stated " Anyone here telling you different is not an audiophile and knows nothing about physics and science of sound. " 

With my recommendation of a Wire Type that does not align with the recommendation from square80 for a wire type, I am obviously in the assessment of square80 fitting the description made above by the person.

I am certainly not the latter suggestion, being a Shill plant acting on behalf of Furukawa or any of the their customer base that selects their wire types for Cables Designs which are being produced.

Each to their own, mine being OCC Wire used as a wire in a Signal Path, superseded OFC Wire as the Signal Path Wire in my system over 10 years ago, probably near 15 years the exchanges commenced.

Approx’ 5 Years ago PC Triple C Wire used as the Signal Path Wire has been superseding OCC wire and also D.U.C.C Wire has been used in conjunction to replace OCC Wire as the Signal Path at certain interfaces.

Mitsubishi has an even higher purity wire recently produced than their D.U.C.C Wire, which I will one day have a try off.

What is for sure is that OFC Wire used in a Signal Path is a distant memory. 

Being an non savvy physicist - non savvy Acoustician, leaves myself in desperate need of help when dealing with how electricity is transferred through my system.

It does seem others should run for cover when I put a suggestion forward that I am of the notion is worthwhile investigating, I remain unapologetic for offering a suggestion.   

 Being a non Audiophile, well that a first, especially when sticking close to the origins of the words meaning, being:

The origin of the term “Audiophile” is Greek from “audio,” meaning sound, and “Philos” meaning lover. Technically, the translation would be “sound lover”

What has that got to with a design for a structure of a wire that is creating a wire that typically less than 0.001% oxygen.

Also Ironic that square80 - AKA Mr I know Everything About Wire Structures, Strangers Knowledge Levels and Strangers Motives, is to strongly suggests a specific design for a structure for a wire, but refers to any other choice made by a individual as being the execrable choice, well that is quite amusing laughlaughlaugh