I have not used my 2 cd players in over a year and i don't miss them. I have a krell kid ipod player, msb ilink and wadia i170 all ipod based. The real advantage is not having to search though hundreds of cd and wasting time on finding songs. On one ipod touch 32 GB i have over 3,000 itunes plus songs on it. On my other ipod i have apple lossless music only. My point when you lose your cd player and go to a music server, ipod etc. you can enjoy so much more music and thats what its really about.
Of course, if you have your CD's properly organized, finding them is not an issue. Personally, I don't know 3000 songs I want to hear on a regular basis so having that many songs stored on a server is pointless to me. At any given time, I have about 20 CD's in regular rotation and its not a problem getting my hands on them. If I just want to a have a bunch of songs playing in rotation, I pick a good station on Pandora or one of my favorite internet radio stations and play them through my squeezebox. This is a personal preference thing and there's no right or wrong. You must realize that there are many vinyl enthusiasts here whose listening routine is 180 degrees opposite of yours. Different strokes for different folks.
I do,especially when the quality of the Music is way better. I don't mind looking for a certain cd as I'm there hopefully to be transported musically somewhere else,especially with LPS.True enough different strokes for different folks. We have hundereds of thousands of cds and lps,where the sound just way superior,of course I still listen to my AM radio in my van. My cdp is a Bryston BCD-1 and she brought new life to my cds, and for LPs I use a Clearaudio champion II with a 1200 Allnic PH stage.Definately an improvent over AM or FM. I was thinking of trying out a BDA-1 dac and trying out a friends I-pod thru her and she what improvement she'll give out.I read a few reviews where the BDA-1 vastly improved the sound quality,that might be another option to get with the times. I'm after music quality first and not convenience,maybe I can have both,we'll see.
I listen to my 2 CDPs almost every day. One is for Redbook and one is for SACD. I've considered music servers, hooking up an iPod (all three of my kids have one). My house is fully wired for a gigabit backbone. But really don't have the desire for file based music.
At the core, I think it's because I work with computers all day every day. When I'm home relaxing and LISTENING TO THE MUSIC, I don't want to have anything to do with computers: ripping, downloading, cataloging, backing-up, etc.
Nope, I'm just not interested. Happy it's working out so well for you. No doubt it's the future of audio. Enjoy.
Cd players simply sound better. Great CD players sound way better. I have compared and thus far my player easily trumps the sound of computer based front ends. I like looking through my CD's and picking one also.
I am glad you enjoy your approach and many of us love our approach.
I DO! I have over 700 cd`s, and i`m still wanting at LEAST 150 MORE! I have a list that I carry with me every time I go to a CD store, which NOW in Chicago/Northwest IN. we recently lost the INFAMOUS Dicount Records. A chain that I have shopped at since 1985! Gone in summer 2008. SO NOW, I have Best Buy(which does NOT carry ⅔ of the cd`s that i`m looking for. And my local CD/record/tape store. It`s hard to find Sleeze Beezs or Roxy Blue at BB. And I don`t feel like paying the $50+ prices on flee bay. Know what I mean? So, IF my CD players WERE working, I would be listening to them right now. BUT, since I have played them so much, they all skip like crazy now. Someone on here said the Sony CD changers need to have the Laser RAILS re-lubed, However nobody here has showed me how to do it, or what kind of lub the changers need. Some people say that the WD-40 is NOT good for this, but some say to use White-Lithium grease. So I DON`T KNOW!
Jvc...just one look at your system pic leads me to believe that you're the perfect candidate for a computer-based system. Dude that stack of cd changers is out of control!
With a music server or ipod based system, you can get sound that is just as good as your favorite cd transport or player when combined with a good dac. I don't think some people realize this. When i say music server or ipod based system to someone they think back ground music. More and more audio company's are comming out with these types of server based/ipod players and they are getting better and better. In a few years i believe cd players will be the minority. This new way to liten to music opens so much more different type of music to the listener.
Everything will be on a memory chip in a few years. Have you seen the micro SD cards now? YIKES! So small you'd better not sneeze or else they'll blow away! Movies and music will be on them. Then likely we'll be forced to kiss the cdp goodbye, unless they don't sound good enough. But that will improve with time as with anything else. I can just see it now, reviewing a certain chip's sonics. CD's will then become nostalgia item like albums.
I have a Sonos music system and while it's great for convenience and extensive media exposure, it's not as good as a primo cdp. Neither is the Buffalo NAS which contains all my CD's ripped to it and can be played over the Sonos. They're both good, but not as good as a higher end cdp, i.e. the Ayon CD-3 I just reviewed. To me the difference is still enough to merit having a cdp. People think that all the other technology is walking away from cdp's. Not so, the disc players are upping their ante quite well. From budget to high end players they're sounding a LOT better than even five years ago. The bonus is that they're being made more and more with "Digital Input" function which allows the other sources to use the DAC of the cdp! Now that's a win/win for me.
03-07-09: Bobf Mavbe some of us still enjoy that part of the hobby like when we used to sift through albums.
Bingo Bob, this was my biggest dilemma importing all my cd's into my computer. While I am quite numb to it now, it felt very soulless 8 years ago, to be sitting in front of a computer screen, looking at a bunch of words in lines, trying to decide what to listen to. 2 weeks ago I moved a large portion of my cd's to shelves above my computer, and since doing so, I have listened to a lot of music outside of my normal playlists that I haven't listened to for a while, music I forgot I even had. It is nice to physically browse through your music and to know it is not upstairs in closed boxes, waiting for a hard drive failure to see the light again.
When you get over 10,000 songs in itunes, it takes some effort to keep them organized, and you can really get lost.
Sonically, lossless files to a DAC3 sounds great to me.
I have over 1300 CD's and enjoy looking through them to see what I can find, the fact that they are all in alphabetical order makes them very easy to find. I'm using an HK 7600 for transport through a PS audio DLIII into a Musical Fidelity tube stage, which seems to do the job just fine. When I need even more connection to the music I can tap into the 500 LPs.
I'll gladly pay shipping for any cd's and cd players you want out of your life. Seriously, I understand why your approach works for some but the idea of not being able to pick up a cd I've been curious about, bring it home, and listen to it without first saving it to iTunes isn't very intruiging.
Hey Cruz, they probably just play any old tunes like the old carousel Cd player on scramble or whatever and you just never know what will come up next. Definitely widens your exposure.Just doesn't help me with Classical-somehow I'm just not into shuffle play that much. I guess those of us who like Classical and jazz music, according to our taste and mood at the time, with higher quality reproduction, are the ones who need CD/SACD/HDCD players and of course one of these Berkeley audio DACs in the near future hopefully.
I have a Sooloos running it through an Alpha Dac. Once you get use to sitting in your chair and selecting songs, it would be very difficult to go back to to a CDP again.
. I bought a SqueezeBox and I love it. I really love the convenience of it. It sounds pretty good too. I like it so much that I'm thinking of pulling the trigger on it's big brother, a souped-up ultra-modded Transporter to see if it rivals a top-flight cd player. If course we all want the sound of the cd in its purest form...but if a hard drive/server based system can get me closer, I'd rather get rid of the cd player. I'm not getting rid of my player yet, but as soon as I find a server based system that is the sonic equal, the cd player will be gone in heartbeat and I won't look back. .
Personally, I think that my modified squeezebox feeding my Classe DAC-1 is much better than my Denon DVD-2900 doing the same. I find that the soundstage is clearer, deeper, wider...I also find that the bass has a bit more punch, which I hear improves even more if you upgrade the power supply.
In terms of browsing through CD's...I like using Squeeze-center. You know sometimes when you are listening to something and it reminds you of something else that you enjoy...it is so much easier to add a song to a playlist instead of getting up, finding a CD, putting it into the player and finally sitting back in your seat...only to then discover again that you don't like the rest of the CD...and have to repeat the process all over again.
The truth is that you would be very hard pressed to find a CDP that produces the same bit-perfect stream that a computer can. I think the death of the CDP will be when they are able to figure out the best way to convert the 1's and 0's of a computer into a signal that a DAC can read...either that or some type of device that skips the whole SPDIF thing...
Well every time I read posts like this about anything going obsolete, I like to post a link to an article, by a well known audio writer. I cannot find it right now. But this was a real serious article that even gave a time frame, that has come and gone several years ago. But basically it said 2 channel music will go by the wayside, in the same way the LP obsolete and dead. I have always wanted to see where this guy is these days, and send him the link to his article.
Obviously 2 channel is as strong as ever, and vinyl is far from obsolete. My guess is CD and players will be around for quite awhile.
Hello Synthfreek and all others. I DO have a Music Server it`s an ESCIENT MK2 in the same cabinet under the 4 Sony CD changers. That shows the album covers, artist names and track titles on my TV screen.
Davt how were you listing to your ipod? You can go with the wadia i170 ipod transport. Most people can't tell the difference between the wadia i170 ipod transport or a very good cd transport, playing the same music via a dac. The wadia i170 is only a couple of hundred of dollars and it sounds just as good as cd transports that cost thousands more. Just wait till other company come out with better ipod transports that have lower jitter control, power supplies, etc. I think company's have only just began to see the full potential of the ipod transport. I am waiting for someone to come out with a true highend ipod transport or player.
since my audio aero (phillips transport) gave up the ghost I've been using my old Cal Audio Icon for cds - do I really need more?
need to get a new player, but then I play vinyl 4 to 1 when home. I do have a wadia ipod transport hooked up to my home theatre setup - but all the stuff I loaded to my ipod was in mp3 mode
I'm looking to do vinyl drops on my analog front end - to get the best solution - but I'd probably do that at high res 88 or 96 khz - not sure if we are there yet, but will be
storage is cheap, most non audiophiles are fine with mp3 so manufacturers are not going to go big for us
anybody doing high res digital at home - I'd be interested in your solutions
As of about 1 year ago 150,000,000 iPods have been sold and last June hit 5 Billion music downloads, CD's are obsolete and CD players will fade away. Think film cameras, sure they won't go away completely but the landscape will change dramatically in favor of a fully digital distribution model. The only reason I buy CD's is access to the high resolution files to rip to my hard drive.
Unlike my CD player my server based system allows access a 9,000+ song library anywhere I have access to a wifi network on my iPod touch (which also serves as an iTunes remote control) and most of the lossless library is on a 160 GB iPod Classic for the gym, car, airplanes, etc. At home I have a USB dac on my main system, a Squeezebox in a bedroom system.
No need to be defensive of CD players or critical of server based systems, as always in this hobby, YMMV
VCR's are a bad example as most people who have used a Tivo or DVD will never go back except for access to their existing tapes. Records are a bit different as they offer something digital didn't when it was introduced and it may still be catching up. Tubes are another example of something that is obsolete in many ways but offers a sound that is embraced by audiophiles, myself included.
from Wikipedia:
Technical obsolescence: Videotapes making way for DVDs Technical obsolescence may occur when a new product or technology supersedes the old, and it becomes preferred to utilize the new technology in place of the old. Historical examples of superseding technologies causing obsolescence include CD-ROM over floppy disk which allowed for greater storage capacity and speed, DVD over VHS which allowed for greater quality and multimedia functions, or the telephone over the telegraph which allowed for audio transmission instead of coded electrical signals.
LPs are obsolete. There is a very small niche market - and this site is where you'll find it's defenders. But LPs are absolutely obsolete. So are tubes for most applications. Add VHS, cassette players, 8-tracks, BetaMax, Super8, & reel to reel, wax cylinders, music boxes, and pocket watches.
Don't flame me, I don't care if you love reel-to-reel or the obvious superiority of BetaMax over VHS. They are all obsolete and you're a hobbyist, not a sustainable market or the future of audio.
What is the future of audio? Well, not CDs. They will be obsolete soon enough. Not because of the sound, but because they are not secure. The winner will be encrypted music files due to extremely low cost for worldwide distribution and guaranteed revenue recognition.
Waynefia - save this link and send it to me in 5 years :)
"Eastein, you're splitting hairs. There is a difference between technical obsolescence and obsolescence."
Tvad, maybe, but while VHS still works, most would agree the industry and general public has moved from VHS to DVD and is now heading towards downloads and Blue Ray.
With the adoption rates for iPods, other digital players, and 5 Billion downloads from iTunes alone in a relatively short time span, the writing is on the wall for CD sales first becoming surpassed by digital downloads, then becoming a niche market like LP's.
Eastein 5 billion downloads from itunes thats amazing. I know i have downloaded over $500 worth of ituens plus myself this month, that tells you something right their. The future of music is in downloads and high end companys must realize this or they may not be around. Ask yourself this most of the highend audio companies think the ipod is just a device teenagers listen to music via headphones or background music. These teenagers will become future audiophiles one day. High end audio companies should come out with a true high end ipod player or transport ok the wadia i170 is a giant step and wadia has sold quite a bit of these gems. Krell i give them credit they have the kid, i have one and it's very good how good well it replaced my bel canto cd-2 in my second system. I think their is this misconception that ipod can't serve as your main 2 ch setup. I can think of the krell kid as the only true high end player out their and no i would not use the kid in my main 2 ch system however its smokes alot of the cd players out their cost 2x or 3x its price. We need companies to come out with real high end players. Not to change the subject but i bought my niece an ipod touch and she is only 4yrs old and she loves for me to download her fav music mostly hannah montana and the jonas brothers music. Yes their still be the dinosaur cd players out their but it will be on ebay. Yes i do think that their are great cd players out their but their will be a time when we are talking whats the best ipod player out their in the 5k to 10k budget. I did not start this trend to put down cd players or people who have them. I have a ml 390s and yes i love it, i was just trying to put my thoughts on where i would like the future to be.
I forgot to mention that itunes plays such a big role in how we get out music. I am so happy to see most of itunes have gone to itunes plus. Just think when itunes plus comes out with some sort of hd music downloads for your ipod now we are getting somewhere.
Usarmyvet91, yes, I have tried the wadia and have listened to it in other systems as well. Wonderful product. But it is not the same as my Naim CDX2. It is convenient, the attributes you speak of in your initial post were about convenience, not sound quality or musical experience. I pick my music carefully. I am also a fan of the old idea of a well produced "Album", not just a bunch of individually picked songs. I will say though that I rarely will listen to music as background noise, when I listen, that is usually all I am doing and I pick my music carefully from a know library I have put together, so convenience is not all that important. Other people have other tastes, that is fine to. But the Ipod has just not caught on in my system. Great idea though.
Well 3000 songs is hardly alot of music in these circles and in fact is somewhat of a starter collection so when you get to 1000, 3000, or 10,000 cd's in your collection and look at expense of storage, risk of potential loss of data and give up holding your "baby's" while enjoying the info that many cd's contain (via a magnifying glass) then get back to us. I have looked into it from a disability angle and would like to try but even my 800cd library seems expensive to really do right and I dont want to give up the interaction of playing music on my gear, atleast not yet as I assume its gonna dumb it all down a bit.
chadnliz 3,000 songs of itunes plus music on one ipod touch. I never said anything about my cd collection which is around 5k i have been importing that via wav and apple lossless.
One thing that downloaders only will in time miss? That is a real, tangible piece of property to own and value. Yes, you may be able to pull up a play list on an lcd screen but you invariably have nothing real, just virtual details on a screen locked inside some hard drive. People will over time miss not having something real. Today many don't care because the download ideology is just the thing to fill up a hard drives with music track/titles. FINE! enjoy, but you will likely find in time that you are going to miss something, more desirable for humans, something human consumers like, PRIDE OF OWNERSHIP, physical property to value and even display and talk about and share with family and friends as they may view your CD's, LP's or tape collection. Looking up a play list on a lcd screen just isn't the same.
Next since many download only tracks and not complete albums they miss out on the meaning of the artists' albums which often are a snapshot of the artist or group in time. Imagine say only downloading "Money" and "Us and Them" off Pink Floyd, Dark Side of the Moon. Imagine what the listener will miss by not having the whole album to listen to. Yes, one can and some do download whole albums but not as many as those who pick and choose only certain tracks.
If all your music is only on a hard drive and it fails you are left with a lot of mess to try to recreate the library you had on it. On top of that the time you needed to download anyways. Well if such effort floats your boat.
But trust me the CD, like the LP or tapes before will not fade way, too many people want a real product and too many will not be bothered to waste time just uploading and downloading music tracks.
To say Ipoda and the like are all crap shows you dont really know what can be done with this technology, it can be and often is fantastic, new download technology can even surpase what the redbook cd can do. Its more about the fact many dont want a "virtual" collection...........it has little to do with actual quality of reproduction. If I were to do a server, it would sound great and I know for a fact it can be killer but I would loose the physical connection with music and I fear I would start to sample and cherry pick tunes instead of listening and discovering new music. Yes call it what ever you want but I and others proudly show our collection of music, to loose that doesnt seem like something I am ready to do.
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