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Turned Off My Subwoofer ... And My Speakers Sound Great

I’ve had a pair of JA Pulsars (non-Graphene) for a couple of years now, and have been using them with a subwoofer. Today, I noticed that my Pulsars sounded very different. There was an expansion of soundstaging, the bass was more articulate and robust (i.e., it had more weight to it), and the highs really sparkled.

This was somewhat different from the sound to which I had become accustomed, so I looked on the panel and discovered that the sub had been turned off. Apparently, my wife had been dusting around my listening room and had accidentally hit the off switch.

I am kind of befuddled by this because I thought use of the subwoofer was supposed to achieve those sonically pleasing effects. Apparently not in my case. Have any ’Goners had this happen? I’m really happy with the "new" sound sans subwoofer, but continue to wonder why that is. I mean by all objective measures, the sub should improve the sound, not detract from it. I just don’t get it.
rlb61
58 responses Add your response
turnbowm
353 posts
 
@rib61 - Looking at the Stereophile-measured FR of the JL Pulsars, the "knee" where the LF starts falling off is approximately 50-55Hz. This is a good starting point for setting the sub crossover. Then it’s just a matter of adjusting the sub’s gain/volume to provide the sound you’re looking for. The biggest mistake people make is setting the sub’s crossover too high, which mucks up the LF quality of the main speakers. Been there, done that with the result that you experienced.

I think that If you give the JL Audio E110 sub a fighting chance, it will reward you with a new and more enjoyable listening experience.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/joseph-audio-pulsar-loudspeaker-measurements
prof
3,473 posts
 
rlb61

As I said, I have a similar concern.   Most subwoofer users will say you should crossover fairly high, 80Hz being a typical recommendation.  Then, in passing those to a subwoofer that you can place optimally and/or DSP,  you get to refine the bass in the regions most affected by the room.

But speaker designers have worked hard on producing a certain character, and the Joseph speakers have this wonderful punchy, dense, "chewy" bass quality that I'd be loathe to give up.  Not sure I'd want to replace that character with whatever comes out of a subwoofer.

I also tried a REL-like set up using line level inputs, lower crossover points etc, just augmenting, and still couldn't get around the change of character in the sound of the main speakers when doing so.
rlb61 OP
789 posts
 
@prof One of the things of concern is the issue of losing the character of the Pulsars by using the sub. For example, I've been advised repeatedly by some audio industry bigwigs to plug the rear port of the Pulsars when using the subwoofer xover. Well, I’ve tried that and it destroyed totally the sound of the speaker that I loved when I heard it at audio shows without a sub. I COULD simply run the Pulsars full range with the sub (and not use the internal xover), thereby just emphasizing the lower end a bit. However, that sort of defeats the purpose of the sub in the first place. I really think the small size of the room, coupled with the GIK room treatments, result in bass overload when using the sub.

@turnbowm ... I had the xover at around 60 Hz, so I don’t think I was mucking up the LF.
allears4u
135 posts
 
Strangely the same thing happened to me (except for the wife part). Turned off sub for undisclosed reasons and everything sounded better. Especially gone was my OCD treatment of constantly adjusting the sub level due to each recordings emphasis (or switching between CD and Vinyl), plus, it never would blend in quite as seemlessly as I could have wished. I always heard the sub as a sub and hardly ever just let it slip into musical background. Had Sunfire, Velodyne, Polk, Monitor Audio, and others. Upgraded my speaker cables and jumpers(Tellurium Q Black II)  and rediscovered bass properly blended fitted without pronouncement in any recording. Still miss occasional inappropriate bass levels in some music genres. (Classical, dub step) Hard to blend sub with Klipsch LaScalas.
rlb61 OP
789 posts
 
@allears4u ... I can relate to the constant futzing around with the sub settings. Ugh!
bjesien
1,284 posts
 
I like to rattle the mailman’s dentures out.
mesch
3,481 posts
 
Given you have excellent speakers, known to sound 'bigger' regarding bass than their size might suggest, in such a small room I am not surprised at your experience. Many reasons have been aforementioned herein.  I think I would not trouble myself trying to integrate a sub into that room. 

avanti1960
1,476 posts
 
have you considered that the bass output of your pulsars has increased during extended break in while using the subwoofer letting them sound better without sub?
have you condidered that the same thing happened to your subwoofer causing them to dominate? 
improvement in bass output up to and beyond 200 hours of use is common.  
time to re evaluate and adjust.  

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