Take up drums at age 56?
I know this technically has nothing to do with high end audio but I know there are some drummers here that might be able to help me along here....or tell me to skip it altogether. And it does have to do with music.
I'm almost embarrassed to even post this. I'm 56. I have never played a musical instrument other than dabbling with a harmonica. I do not read music. I am certain that I'll never perform for anyone or play in a band.
But I've always wanted to play drums.
And now I have enough money to get a simple cheap used drum kit and I have a basement that is isolated enough to not bother the neighbors. (I actually have an acquaintance who refurbishes used drums who can probably hook me up).
So I have a couple of questions:
1) Can you teach yourself to play drums? Alone or with YouTube etc? Are actual lessons required? Can I skip the practice pad and start with a kit?
2) Is there any point? In other words, even if I were to learn to play are the drums the kind of instrument that you sit down and play for your own pleasure the way you would a guitar?
My realistic expectation is that I'd get a simple kit. Try to do something with it. Find that it is much harder to do than it looks, especially for a guy with two left feet. It sits in the basement for a while and then I sell it for a big loss but hopefully at least happy that I tried it.
Any other thoughts on the matter?
(If totally inappropriate for this site I have no problem removing the post.....especially if someone points me to a better site for the topic.)
I'm almost embarrassed to even post this. I'm 56. I have never played a musical instrument other than dabbling with a harmonica. I do not read music. I am certain that I'll never perform for anyone or play in a band.
But I've always wanted to play drums.
And now I have enough money to get a simple cheap used drum kit and I have a basement that is isolated enough to not bother the neighbors. (I actually have an acquaintance who refurbishes used drums who can probably hook me up).
So I have a couple of questions:
1) Can you teach yourself to play drums? Alone or with YouTube etc? Are actual lessons required? Can I skip the practice pad and start with a kit?
2) Is there any point? In other words, even if I were to learn to play are the drums the kind of instrument that you sit down and play for your own pleasure the way you would a guitar?
My realistic expectation is that I'd get a simple kit. Try to do something with it. Find that it is much harder to do than it looks, especially for a guy with two left feet. It sits in the basement for a while and then I sell it for a big loss but hopefully at least happy that I tried it.
Any other thoughts on the matter?
(If totally inappropriate for this site I have no problem removing the post.....especially if someone points me to a better site for the topic.)
111 responses Add your response
That's great to hear. It's important that we have interests that take our minds off all the bad stuff going on in the world. If you have any interest, you should check out some of the videos of orchestral snare drum playing. Really amazing control at whisper-quiet dynamics and insane rhythmic shifts. Like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-n3k64H0EA |
That pretty much describes me. I don't think I'll ever be good but I'm having a lot of fun. Also learning a LOT. About drumming and technique of course but also about music in general, as well as about a lot of great drummers. The thing that keeps me going is that at the level I'm at I am able to pick up most things if I stick to it and practice. There are a few things that my brain/body can't seem to master in the short term but even with those I feel like persistence would eventually work. |
I had forgotten about this thread. So here is an update. Much of it verifies the great advice I got here. For about the last 18 months I’ve been a member of Drumeo, a drum instruction web site. It is simply amazing. Set courses. Hundreds if not thousands of popular songs transcribed into notation that has a moving cursor as the song plays. Hundreds of drumless backing tracks. Can’t say enough about this site. So comprehensive. Lots of great teacher including a number of big names. Famularo. Bernard Purdie. etc. The regular staff teachers are excellent as well. All sessions have the music below the video with a moving cursor and metronome. I still have not taken an in-person lesson. I know it would be beneficial too. Last month I bought an acoustic kit. It was not a specific kit I was looking for but when it came up on Craig’s List is was too good to pass up. It is a Yamaha Stage Custom Birch set with a small bass drum. It was purchased by a professional drummer as a travel kit right before COVID hit. Of course gigs ended and he was out of work so he had to sell it. Came with everything but cymbals, even cymbal stands, etc. It was like new. In fact, the snare and some of the hardware were in unopened boxes. It is an intermediate level kit. I bought some intermediate level cymbals to go with it. It is in a storage room on the second floor under the eaves that we cleared out. It is a tight space but it works. I have moving blankets and acoustic foam on the walls. Two layers of rugs on the floor. I sold my e-kit to buy a few cymbals. I miss the convenience of it but did not have room for it. I am more limited in the times I can practice due to volume but my wife says she can go to the other end of the house and not be bothered so that’s good. Having said that, just in the last month I have learned more, faster, than I have in the previous 12 months. Ghost notes and subtle hi-hat work were just impossible (for me anyway) on the e-kit. Because of the greater ease of dynamics and more subtle techniques I’m enjoying myself way more and wanting to practice a lot more. I posted a thread a while back about exploring jazz music for the first time. I listened a good bit for about a year and appreciated it but did not really fall in love with it. However, with this acoustic kit I find myself drawn to jazz. That in turn is making me appreciate jazz music more. I don’t think playing jazz is going to be my goal but practicing it is definitely making me a better drummer. Sorry about the long post but part of the reason I’m enjoying this so much is all the advice I got here. (And yes, I have gotten a little OCD about tuning and cymbals etc. Already have a list of new drum heads I want!) As time goes by I may look into some low volume cymbals and mutes for the drums if I need to extend practice time when volume would be an issue. |
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Did you take any lessons? I mean last year it must have been difficult. Cause my son is into drums and while we were stuck at home he had his classes online (oh heavens luckily his set is can be connected with headphones). Anyway, I hope you succeeded. |
I've pretty much given up on Audiogon because of the heavy handed and arbitrary moderating but I wanted to come back to this thread to give an update since you guys are the ones who encouraged me to dabble in drums for the first time at age 56. I've been practicing at least an hour every day, usually closer to two either on the kit or on the practice pad. I bought the George Stone Stick Control book and I'm playing through it. Playing each of 24 exercises on a page for 1 minute each playing one page every day for one week. I signed up for a paid online drum course called Drumeo which is extremely well done and well thought out. Learning fills, beats, shuffles along with basic rudiments and limb independence exercises. All with the metronome most of the time. Working on some play-alongs. Can play through two rock/blues songs pretty accurately and reliably. Have a homemade PA system that I like better than headphones. (75w Onkyo home theater receiver, giant B&W powered (200w) subwoofer and a set of old Bose bookshelves.) With a little tuning it works great and obviously I can keep the volume where I want it. Enjoying this more than I thought I would. In fact, when I'm not practicing I'm watching how-to videos etc. Because of that I'm not spending much time with my hi-fi system, sadly. I still feel a little frustrated by the limitations of the e-kit. It just seems that no amount of tuning triggers and thresholds will get the subtlety out of the high hat and snare that I'm looking for. I might even pick up a real hi-hat and snare just to see. Anyway, thanks for the advice and encouragement. I'm having a lot of fun. I have no real plans to do anything with this but you never know. |
@n80, you've discovered the main failing of electronic drums, that of dynamic graduation. Don't worry about that for now, there's nothing to be done. Excellent advice from shadorne, the George Stone book is the standard. He also brought up the wrist, which is SO important. You can spot an untrained drummer a mile away by his use of the elbows as his "fulcrum" rather than his wrists. "Snapping" your wrist creates a much more "percussive" sound than playing from your elbow (the snare drum really "Pops!"), plus will allow you to play with less effort. Sure, you can raise your arm up high and slam it down to play louder, but snap your wrist just as the stick approaches the drumhead. It makes a huge difference in the sound produced: much more "attack", even if the SPL created is equivalent. While I'm here, a musical tip: Everybody learns by watching and listening to others, and some things we do, we do so without thinking of the "why". We play things simply because we have learned "That's how you're supposed to play". It wasn't until I heard Levon Helm's playing on the first two Band albums that I realized one doesn't have to do what every other drummer was doing in the late-60's: hitting a crash cymbal at the end of EVERY fill. Levon didn't unless doing so served a musical purpose, just one piece of musical wisdom I learned from The Master. I then noticed the same was true of my favorite studio drummers: Hal Blaine, Jim's Gordon and Keltner, Roger Hawkins (who plays a killer press roll, which he uses brilliantly), Al Jackson, Earl Palmer, other greats. The better the musicians, singers, and songwriters you are working with, the more they will notice and appreciate not just what you do play, but what you don't. The number one complaint about drummers is over-playing. Play in service to the song, the singer, and the other instruments, and you will be in demand. |
@shadorne : "Use a soft or gel practice pad - less rebound forces you to use better technique." It is interesting that you mention that because when I watch videos of these guys demonstrating various rudiments and how fast they can do them the practice pads they are using look and sound hard as a rock. Heck, I'm pretty fast too if I'm banging on a wooden desk top. Currently with this electric drum kit it is simple to remove the smallish snare unit from the rack and use it is a practice pad. It has a mylar head which feels less tight than real snares I have seen. I will look up the exercises you mention. I've got the Sound Brenner app on phone but the control unit on these electric drums have a great built in metronome which I use most of the time. One problem I'm having real difficulty with is that I can't get the snare settings right. In other words, each strike sounds about the same. It is hard to differentiate a ghost note, from an accent, from a regular strike. I've messed with the trigger and threshold settings but just can't get it right. I may have to post on the Alesis forums to see what others have done but it could just be the limitation of a cheap electric kit. I probably need to take lessons just so I can get some time on an acoustic set. |
I found George Stone Killer exercises with accents worked best for me. It forced my left to be the equal of the right. Accents helped me keep the hands relaxed and use the weight of the stick and rebound. Repetition creates muscle memory. Use a soft or gel practice pad - less rebound forces you to use better technique. I use Sound Brenner metronome app and play 100 bars at half a bar R handed and half a bar left handed, then repeat 100 with a full bar each hand, then 100 again one bar and a half each, and final two bars of 1/8 th notes for 100 bars. This is at a low metronome setting which is then increased by 5 bpm and the whole thing repeated again and so on and so forth - gradually increasing speed by 5 bpm until I feel tension or start mucking up. I alternate between playing evenly at various volume levels and between accent both the first and last notes played with each hand. STAY RELAXED Of course everyone is different. Also don’t underestimate how long it will take to get strength and strong nerve feeling in the left hand. We are talking years of work with several hours a day. I would say that starting with proper technique is essential - bad habits take time to correct and have a way of returning as soon as you are pushing hard. Hold the sticks like a bird in your hand - gentle pressure from index and thumb with the other fingers cradling your bird - barely touching and providing a spring-like counter balance to the rebound. Control is a combination of wrist and those other fingers. Snapping the wrist down and squeezing the other fingers can create powerful accents and a great rebound if you train to accept the stick rebound (relax hand as the tip hits the skin) |
@n80, I just recalled a piece of advice from an old master I read years ago: when going about your everyday life activities, use your weak hand instead of your strong one. Brushing your teeth, opening doors, cooking, even try writing with your lesser hand. Using it more will develop it's abilities, the same way your better hand developed. |
@n80, the way to strengthen your left hand is to lead with it. If you are practicing rudiments (do it on a practice pad, rather than sitting at your set), play the "R" parts with your left hand, the "L" with your right. Set your kit up backwards, forcing yourself to play left handed and footed. It will feel very awkward and you'll suck at it, but it will bring your left hand and foot closer to your right. Did you know that although Ringo set-up and played right handed, on his fills he led with his left hand? Weird! |
So I've had the kit for about a month now. 'Practicing' at least an hour a day on most weekdays and weekends when I'm in town. I'm practicing rudiments and limb independence exercises and working on some shuffles. Left hand still very lacking in precision and coordination compared to right. I can do a basic shuffle but wanted to learn the Purdie shuffle. It just sounds so cool. But I'm not getting anywhere close even when it is broken down by YouTube instructors. A bit too soon I think. But it is a long term goal. I've got a couple of simple retro style rock songs that I can play all the way through (JD McPherson). On one of them I saw the band live a few weeks ago and the drummer played it very different at the show than he does on the album. ******************** So now a question. I do most practice through the headphones but I've also got a computer audio system (two small ribbon speakers and a subwoofer with the amp in it.) I prefer this to the headphones when I can do it without disturbing anyone at home. It sounds okay but is obviously limited, but it was lying around so cost nothing. I have access to an old beat up pair of B&W towers with a huge subwoofer along with an integrated Yamaha home theater system. Any reason not to give those a try? The module on these drums has RCA output. I know a dedicated amp or PA would be better, but not ready to spend any money in that direction yet. Finally, how should I position such a system. On the drumming videos most drummers have a PA system behind them.....but I'm not performing for anyone so I would assume I'd just have it facing me? |
I understand. Get more control between your left and right hand with rudiments. IME, the coordination on the kit that comes first is right hand, left hand, right leg. Coordination of the high hat is next, so dont worry too much. And since you're a beginner, the instructor won't expect you to lay down a groove on the kit. He may start with hands only on high hat and snare... 1+2+3+4. Then add bass, etc. $25 hour is great. I think I paid $20 in 1972. |
@lowrider57 : "Didn't you say the music shop offers lessons?" Yes, $100 per month which is 4 lessons. Very reasonable in my opinion. I would like to be better at rudiments and overall feel for the kit before I do lessons. I'm nervous about not being able to do _anything_ the teacher asks me to do. Some simple kit exercises that require limb independence completely elude me. I know it sounds backwards but I'd like to be a little better before I take lessons. |
@10000_hz_legend : I've never messed with an acoustic set but I'm sure you are right. I really want one but it would be very impractical. I think I will set myself a goal that if I become reasonably proficient on the electric set that I will get a real one. @bdp24 : Thanks for that link. I would say that if I continue to practice most days it would still be a long time before I'd be able to play with anyone else. I noticed that the music store where I bought this kit has a bulletin board dedicated to people who want to get together and play. @larryi : With this being an electric kit I'm using headphones only so I have control over volume. Still have to be careful though. I'm not a big headphone fan so I may look into a cheap amp that I can lay at low volumes.....or high when no one is home. |
I have been playing the drums for 20 years. I have not all of the other responses in this thread, but I support you heavily and believe everyone should should contribute to the musical world. You are not choosing to pick up a hobby. You are choosing to be a part of something greater. Music is a language that speaks directly to the soul. Music is what brought all of us here to this forum, an effort to break down any and all of the barriers that separate us from the music we love. To be a player in that game is an honor and a thrill. Give it some time. You will see. As far as electric drums are concerned I find them great for practice, but they SIGNIFICANTLY lack the excitement and emotion of an acoustic kit. Not even the same ballpark. |
@jc Tiny breakthrough tonight. Got right arm, left arm and right foot doing different things and sustained it. So now I know that it is _possible_ for me. For a brief moment had all four doing different things: high hat, snare, kick and ride. That did not last long. Not to completely blame my gear but the (simulated) action of the high hat seems a bit lifeless and the pedal never feels just right. |
@shadorne, I have two Gretsch sets, one veneered with the no-longer-available Brazilian Walnut, the other wrapped in Black Diamond Pearl, my favorite vintage finish (hence the bdp of bdp24. The 24 refers to my preferred bass drum size, 24"). Great sounding drums, but it's time for me to downsize the collection. |
Update: I'm enjoying this. Practicing and playing for a couple of hours a day sometimes. Not spending enough time on rudiments though. Working on 'independence" exercises. That's where you work on getting your right arm to do different things from your right foot, etc. That is not going well and I have to slow it down to a crawl to get it right and even then don't get it right for long. I'll stick with it since its fun. But I'm not sure I'll ever conquer that issue. Although, I did finally get heel-and-toe downshifting at the racetrack and it is now second nature so there may be hope for me. It is fun to play along with music. I can turn the music up enough that I can't hear how awful I'm doing. |
Yup @n80, drums are loud! Useta drive my dad nuts; one day he came into my room when I was playing along with Charlie Watts on "Satisfaction" and told me "I said you could practice, not do this." One reason Gretsch are big in the South is they're made in South Carolina. Or at least they have been for awhile. Originally they were made in Brooklyn, New York. Lots of 50's-60's Jazz drummers played Gretsch, as did Levon Helm of The Band. Some guys who have endorsement deals with other drum companies play Gretsch in the studio, Jeff Porcaro (L.A. studios, Toto) for one. Their shell design is excellent, and they've always fitted their drums with die cast hoops. |
Thanks @bdp24 . I will keep that in mind. Noticed that a lot of the local blues bands in Mississippi used Gretsch. Maybe a coincidence, I don't know. However, this Alesis kit has mylar drum heads and steel cymbals and even though it is way quieter than an acoustic set, it can still be heard throughout the house, even now that I'm in the basement. They make 'mesh' heads that a quieter but I'm not spending any more money on this right now. So it would be a while before I could realistically bring an acoustic kit home. I like the convenience of this electric set....but would really like to go acoustic eventually. We'll have to see where this goes. Working on rudiments via YouTube. Struggling with some of the paradiddles and flams. I'll get them for a second or two then think about it and screw up. |
Thanks for the additional advice guys. Took my wife by the music store today to see if the kit was still there. It was. She looked at it and said "$450? I thought you said it was $800. You better get it so it doesn’t get sold." It is sitting in my living room right now. I feel a bit silly. I wish I could do an acoustic kit but the volume would just be so prohibitive. A couple of observations: 1) The sound quality through the headphones is uncanny. Each drum and cymbal actually sound located where they are. 2) The high hat is weird in terms of open vs closed strikes. Something isn’t quite right. It is not a malfunction; it is mentioned in a number of reviews. I’ll need to read the manual. 3) I’ve been practicing some basic rudiments. My left hand is a real problem. Not near the finesse and control of my right. That is going to take work. 4) I know a lot of this has to do with grip and fingering but the snare does not seem to have the rebound of a real snare. Doing single stroke rudiments the sticks do not rebound as briskly as I’d want. Could be all from lack of technique. We’ll see. The drum heads can be adjusted with a key. Not sure how tightly it is safe to adjust them though. Again, I need to find the manual and read it. 5) I need to do some reading about body position, arm position, throne position and snare position. I can already tell just doing rudiments that it is important but don’t think I have it quite right. |
@n80, allow me to offer one piece of advice: remember that the value of technical ability is nothing more than the ability to play with your limbs what you hear in your mind. Poorly-conceived drum parts perfectly-executed nonetheless constitutes poor drumming. There are a number of drummers known for having advanced technique whose parts in musical terms are not what I look for in a drummer. I won't mention any names, as any one of them may be a favorite of a participant in this thread ;-) . Conversely, there is a musician whose drumming in musical terms is amongst my favorites: Richard Manuel, pianist/singer of The Band. He plays drums on about half the songs on The Band's second s/t album, and his parts are absolutely amazing. Not just musically appropriate, but very imaginative, original, and unique. And drums were not (R.I.P.) even his first instrument! There is one drummer rarely mentioned whose playing is really, really special (even Buddy Rich loved him): John Barbata of The Turtles (and later Jefferson Airplane/Starship). Listen to his drumming on "Happy Together", "She'd Rather Be With Me", and "Elenore". For the technically-inclined, the drum parts are fairly difficult to execute. For the musically-inclined, they are not only absolutely brilliant, but also very exciting in a Keith Moon-kind of way. Here's another tip, this one from guitar virtuoso Danny Gatton: Danny, to his new drummer after the first set of the drummer's first live gig with Danny: "Hey, you know all that fancy sh*t you play?" The drummer to Danny: "Yeah." Danny: "Don't." |
@richopp Loved your story. And so true about proper form and strengthening the wrist while practicing rudiments. I was merely extrapolating the fingering concept forgetting that we're dealing with a beginning drummer. Fingering may be a non issue for him. My advice to the OP is to warm up with the rudiments, then practice and play the entire kit and have fun. What I did as a beginner was to have a friend teach me a basic rock beat that enabled me to jam to tunes right from the jump. And Rich, I forgot about the old expression "it's all in the wrist." |
Hi. This is about learning to play guitar. I came across a great teacher at age 61. I had wanted to play guitar since I was in my teens. Tried several times and got nowhere. One lucky thing was that I had bought a used Fender Strat with the idea of giving it to my son. The lessons were group lessons and at a very reasonable price. The Strat is easy to play - relatively - what I mean is that it is hard to play any guitar which is poorly set up or has other issues. Group lessons tend to hide mistakes yet encourage you to keep up. In the space of a month, I was able to play three chords. It was fantastic. Go for it man. It is 6 years later and I am able to do more, still not a wizard, but having fun. |
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I say definitely go for it! Our muscles and hand-eye coordination take a huge downturn once we hit 50 years of age, and this would probably do wonders at keeping your small muscle groups (as well as some large ones) fit and toned. It takes an amazing amount of strength and endurance to play for any length of time on a drum set and the music is an absolute plus! |
At the tender age of 70, I decided to take up the alto saxophone.For fun, something to do, and for the mental exercise against ageing, and so on. 3 years in, I am loving it and play in two 'community bands'Yes, of course it's harder than it looks. That goes for most things. But you should enjoy the journey. Take lessons, go to band camps in the summer, and just go for it.I know this is a drum thread but all those things go for most instruments. |
@richopp Great advice! Rudiments are indeed essential to achieve a high level and so is doing them precisely and properly and at first, very slowly. However, working on chops can be rather boring and therefore it is important that rudiments are just a part of a practice routine and warm up. The joy is in the music. Learning to groove is even more important than chops! A band will take a drummer that can groove over one that has amazing chops! Some of the greatest rock drummers learned by playing along to tracks and learning to groove/feel. |
@lowrider57 I was remiss in not mentioning fingers, but a beginner has to strengthen those wrists practicing rudiments first. You are totally correct that developed drummers require finger dexterity as well, but that seems WAY beyond a beginner's horizon. Mastering the simple rudiments will strengthen the wrists and then give the musician the opportunity to develop the fingers as they master the finer points you list. Learning to read drum charts will also help, but practicing rudiments from sheet music will clearly help with that part as well. I also agree that electronic drums are fine, but along with others, I suggest getting a regular kit--you can start with a practice pad and pair of 5A's. FYI, my brother and all learners back then used HUGE sticks...I doubt they make them anymore. (They were painful, as well, when he smacked his little brother, as siblings sometimes do.) I just remember the tips were huge and the shafts were almost twice as big as 5's are. Fun times! By the way, he drove the entire family nuts as he NEVER STOPPED banging on stuff. Probably why he was good at it as we have no natural musical talent in our family as far as I can tell, even though I play "at" several instruments, but only by myself as to spare others the mess. Cheers! |
GO FOR IT ! I watched my brother start at 50. He did however have a head start with 30 years of guitar with lessons and could read music . He now is exclusively drums and takes lessons, as he is OCD . He’s on his fourth kit after 10 years . He trades with Bentley’s Drum Shop in Fresno, Ca. I’ve attended clinics there with him . He’s drummed at the store with Carmine Appice , Vinnie Appice and Tommy Aldridge . He was big on a Yamaha and now has Tama . This last year Kenny Aranoff came , as well as the Tama rep. He used my brothers kit for the clinic . When Carmine came , he played later that night at a local small venue with Michael Shanker and my brother went with him . My brother plays well and has worked his ass off . Also having earned a Black Belt in his discipline, has helped his speed and timing immensely. But he drums mostly alone and for his own pleasure. He’s like a Soul Surfer in the way he approaches drumming . We grew up in a music filled house and were both SENT to piano lessons . Marc kept at it , and I learned to the PLAY STEREO fairly well 😝. You only live once as a human , so GO FOR IT !!! Peace , Mike B. |
I watched a few videos about the fulcrum and holding the sticks properly just now, and some were good, but they did not explain that the three fingers ( your middle finger to your pinky ) are not supposed to be snug on the stick. They are supposed to move up and down to make the stick go up and down along with your wrist moving up and down. I hope I'm not being too technical, but as a very technical drummer I want you to start out properly. Again, good luck and have fun. |
Definitely do it! I was unemployed after my business failed in 2001 so to keep sane while seeking work I did what I’d always wanted to do and took drum lessons (age 40 at the time). Bought an older Ludwig kit and some cymbals from my teacher, had a blast. Got it out of my system and sold off the kits but it was entirely worth it. My teacher, Jim Payne, had a great method, his site is funkydrummer.com it might be worth checking out. Good luck and be careful - you may do with cymbals on eBay what we do with gear on Audiogon, they are fun to collect and listen to! |
Lots of good advice. The consensus is no matter what your goal is and whichever type of drums you choose, learning the rudiments is key. I must take exception to the statement that "drumming is all in the wrist." All the great drummers know that for good technique drumming is in the fingers. Using proper fingering in addition to wrist movement is how to develop speed, control, and bounce. Watch the fingering of Buddy, Peart, Carl Palmer, etc. and you'll see how fast they are with minimal effort. |
