Congrats Rebbi!!! I think John should let you take a pair of the big ones then you can start another awesome thread.
Ohm Walsh Micro Talls: who's actually heard 'em?
Hi,
I'd love to hear the impressions of people who've actually spent some time with these speakers to share their sense of their plusses and minuses. Mapman here on Audiogon is a big fan, and has shared lots on them, but I'm wondering who else might be familiar with them.
I'd love to hear the impressions of people who've actually spent some time with these speakers to share their sense of their plusses and minuses. Mapman here on Audiogon is a big fan, and has shared lots on them, but I'm wondering who else might be familiar with them.
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Mapman, Yeah, I agree, about pianos sounding terrific on the Ohms. I have some Diana Krall with well recorded piano that the Ohms reproduce extremely well. Zkzpb8, Thanks! And happy new year to you, too. I'll let everybody know what I decide about the drivers. What's a little confusing is that there are a couple of added variables in the mix, now. First, the amount of break in time that one pair of drivers has had over the other. Second, John mentioned (and I think it's correct) that speaker placement for the new drivers may be different than for the older ones. By the way, my impression is that what he's essentially done is to provide the kind of high frequency boost that some of the larger Ohm models provide via a switch, but that the Micro's do not. Jwtrace, Great.... maybe John will just comp me on the upgrade to the 100-S3's! LOL! For all the publicity, that is! OH, and check this out: I put the Arro's up on Audiogon, and they sold within about 5 hours! Even better, they sold to someone local who picked them up in Austin and paid cash. I was so dreading having to pack them up, especially because the plinths that the spikes go into attach to the bottoms of the speakers with something like Blu-Tac, and you can damage the finish when you try to detach the plinths. So not having to deal with the hassle of shipping was a blessing. Mapman... By the way, the fellow who bought the Arro's was replacing a pair of Dynaudio Audience 52's, I believe. He was driving them with a Naim Nait amp, which I've heard is what Totem uses at show demos for electronics, so it should sound wonderful. He was very pleased! |
Mapman, I think you were the person who recommended the Charles Dutoit recording of Holst's Planets. I was listening to a bit of it tonight on the Micro Walsh Talls and wow.... I was so taken in by the sense of concert hall space... golly! :-) And James Taylor's voice on October Road was also beautifully rendered in space. And Buena Vista Social Club.... My, oh my.... Okay I'll stop babbling now... |
I have BVSC. I'll have to give it a fresh spin. Replacing the old Carver pre-amp with the new Audio Research Sp-16 has really taken many CDs I've listened to recently to a higher and most musical level more in line with some of the very high end systems I have heard recently! The sp-16 was a major improvement out of the box but seems to have opened up even further of late. The paperwork that came with it indicated it takes several hundred hours to open up fully. Wow! |
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Good golly!.... There's certainly a sense of glee when you sit down with some music you haven't heard in awhile, plunk it on the 'table with your new equipment, and are blown away by what you hear. So it was today when I came across a copy (unopened... how'd that happen??) of the Nick Of Time LP by Bonnie Raitt. Cry On My Shoulder, a song I like a lot anyway and hadn't heard in years, sounded amazing, just amazing, through the Ohm's. It's not so much a matter of this sounds just like live music (although Bonnie's voice did sound awfully good) but more like, ah, so THIS is what the engineer was getting at! Electronic keyboards floated delicately out IN FRONT of the speakers, with Bonnie centered and set back between the speakers. I was pretty mesmerized. Okay, let me know when you start getting sick of these gushy posts, but I'm really loving these speakers. :-D |
Rebbi, You really should get hold of Lindsey Buckingham's cd "Under The Skin" and play the track called "Show You How" (then play the rest of the cd, it's terrific). The Ohms create a sense of space filled by individual voices that will undoubtedly get you "gleeful"! Marty Disclaimer: This isn't audiophile style reproduction (it's clearly processed sound), but it will make you smile. |
Look for titles on the Mapleshade Label. http://www.mapleshaderecords.com/main/aboutus.php My understanding is most if not all of these are produced using a simple two channel process that lends itself optimally to enabling near-point source omnidirectional designs like the Ohms or Morrisons in particular to produce a lifelike reproduction of the soundstage. I have the title "Preachin the Blues" on this label and it works quite well. I also have Lindsey Buckingham's "Out of the Cradle" CD and that also is quite good. |
DOFP was conceived mainly to demonstrate sound quality of a new recording system at the time. I didn't realize how good the sound really was either until I played both CD and vinyl copies to review recently. Check my review here on Agon of DOFP and a couple other Moodies recordings mostly of lesser sound quality. |
If you want to experience the non pareil imaging and soundstaging that the Walshs are capable of, you need only purchase and listen to any of the many excellent Mercury Living Presence reissue CDs. While I have Reference Recordings, RCA Living Stereo, Everest Ultra-anolog and Chesky CDs that sound excellent on the Walshs, the Mercurys are consistently in a class by themselves. |
The first piece on this CD is a good demonstration of how well the Ohm's can reproduce the sounds of a pipe organ. http://www.hbdirect.com/album_detail.php?pid=30724 |
Mapman, I spoke to John at Ohm the other day to let him know that I'd sold the Totems and would be deciding down the road which set of drivers to keep. Since you'd asked awhile ago what John did to the modified drivers, I asked him, and he said, Boosted the the treble response a bit, or words to that effect. My neurotic side is bugged by this a little: if the Ohm's are known for their neutrality, is my pair somehow now less neutral? Or is it a matter of how they play in my particular room? Anyway, that's craziness! But I will be interested to see how they sound by comparison when I put the original drivers back in. As for trading up to the 100-S3's, John told me that the only real difference is that the bigger speaks will play four times louder and go 1/2 an octave deeper than the MWT's. John said the usual deal is to give 100% trade in value within the first 6 months of ownership if someone wants to trade up the line. I'll see... :-) |
The switches on the Walsh 5's essentially allow +/- 3db adjustments in four ranges: low bass, mid bass, midrange and treble. These are for purpose of adjusting the response to room acoustics or personal hearing preference. Sounds like the new drivers are more or less like tipping up the treble using the switches on the 5's. I do this on my right Ohm 5 but not my left to help adjust for the crazy acoustics of my L shaped room. That's the main reason I got the 5's instead of the 300's. Unfortunately, Ohm does not offer these adjustments on the smaller models these days (they used to years ago ). Decisions, decisions. |
Reb, If it were me, I would try to get by with the standard drivers and use tip-in, tip-out of the tweeter to get the desired effect. I think you indicated at one point prior to getting the tweaked drivers that this had worked to some extent. If the tweaked drivers still sound better to you over an extended audition duration, then go with them. Just my opinion..... |
This really has been an interesting treat to read all this on the Ohms. I had the old conventional Ohm Model "L" which I recently had the latest upgraded woofers from John Stroben. I inherited them from my brother who bought them in 1977. Even now they are unmatched bookshelf speakers. The new woofers cost $250....worth every dime! John also sent the new port tuning accessories with them. If you find an old pair of Model "L"'s buy them and put the new woofers in them. Anyway, I have the Ohm Walsh 200 MkII. I run them off my Denon 3805 AVR and Cambridge Audio 640c v.2. After 4 years with them I've concluded that they are the most livable darn speakers. The Walsh's aren't meant to be the imaging champs....its about easy listening and omni present and smoooooooth sound. I sometimes wonderlust and think maybe the grass is greener somewhere else but I'd miss the Ohms...I know I would. So when I get my Wharfedale Evo2 10's arrive next week, I'll put them up on stands next to my Ohms and I'll choose the speaker I'm in the mood for that day. Besides, if I want to change something, I could always try different cables, cords, etc with the Ohms. I've done this a couple of times and improved the sound. Silver RCA cables did a beautiful job on my Ohms. And when I wanted more bass, I went with top-of-the-line Monster Cable speaker cable...that tightened the bass up significantly but lost some transparency. You just have to play with it...and enjoy the process. |
Rebbi, A lot depends on your preferred listening level, the room size, the specific amp in question, full range vs subs, etc, etc, etc. FWIW - PrimaLuna 7 monos with KT66 output tubes make about 60ish wpc. With subs, this is more than adequate to produce pretty loud music in my largish room. Full range, I'd want more. I use SS amps producing 200wpc and, although they are louder, the speakers sound more dynamic with tubes (I think. I haven't switched back to the ss amps to verify this observation. It may also be partly/mostly break- in.) Bottom line, more power allows more flexibility, but the speakers are definitely amp sensitive, so take any generalization with a healthy dose of salt. For full range operation I'd try to stay north of 100 wpc tubed and double that for ss. Just a very rough rule of thumb. Marty |
My Musical Fidelity A3CR is about 120w/ch into 8 ohm and almost double into 4 and does fine with the 100 S3s in my rooms that fall within the max room size recommendation for 100s. I can also say that all the 100 s3 and larger drivers love lots of power and current, the more the merrier. I had them on a Carver 360w/ch amp prior and neither 100s or larger 5 drivers ever winced being driven to very high SPLs. I've also ran the 100s to great effect and without issue using an 80W/ch Tandberg 2080. This was not enough for the larger 5's though IMO in that the dynamics suffered, though they were still perhaps undergoing break-in at the time. Switching to the Audio Research sp16 tube pre-amp recently also resulted in a major improvement in overall dynamics, both large scale and micro. The improvement in microdynamics and transients in particular was much greater than any I noticed with various amps. Others report and I tend to believe that in general the more power and current you throw at the Ohms, the better the dynamics overall become. |
Marty and Mapman, Thanks a lot for the feedback. I am tempted by John's offer of an upgrade to the 100's at full trade-in value on the Micros. I would certainly never drive them as loud as they can go... My listening room is only about 12' by 16' with an 8 foot ceiling. But the deeper bass is tempting! But what about my amp?? The Unico puts out 80 w/channel into 8 ohms. And that is solid state in the power section. But how so you know If that's enough "juice?". :-) |
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The 100s will probably work as good or better than the micros with your amp, but you may well be tempted to go with a bigger amp at some point to realize a real benefit. Another thing to consider and maybe ask John S. about is that the micros are recommended for near field listening in any room size on the OHM site and the larger Walshes are recommended for general listening in various size rooms. That's because the larger OHMS are just bigger and CAN go louder for listening further away when feasible in a larger room, but for more nearfield listening in a room your size, there will not be much if any difference with a larger model I suspect. USing the Musical Fidelity A3CR (120w/ch) I've had my big OHM 5's in the 12X12 room where the 100's are currently. There was no real benefit with the larger OHMs. When I had the 100's in the larger room where the 5's are, there was....mainly the low end had more weight and balance and was more fulfilling at higher SPLS. Other than that the 100s sounded very much like the 5's overall. I suspect the same would be true in your case with the 100s compared to the Micros. |
Yes, you've basically expressed my thoughts on this. When John told me that the 100s could play "four times as loud" as the Micros, I actually laughed out loud, because in my room, the Micros can play louder than I can stand! :-) That said, as far as "nearfield" listening goes, my room configuration makes it impossible for me to sit more than 10-11 feet away from the speakers, maximum. |
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Rebbi, I didn't realize you are using the Unico with your Ohms. Great amp! I really, REALLY wish I would not have sold mine. That amp is amazingly subtle; it doesn't 'wow' the listener in the first five minutes, but after listening for extended periods of time, its virtues can really seduce you. Very solid construction, very robust... and makes any speaker i've connected to it so smooth and liquid sounding. Very good choice. Based on your (and everyone else's) description of the Ohms, bet it's a match made in heaven. |
Hi, loose, Yeah, the Unico really is a honey: it's beautiful, built like the proverbial tank, and sounds very nice. I lucked out here when I got it here on Audiogon for a very good price... The seller even included two other sets of tubes, although I haven't yet gotten into "tube rolling" as of yet. I'd seen it well reviewed on the Net and grabbed it fast. I've only owned one other amp in my life: a very old PS Audio integrated that I sold here on A'gon. So I'm not well equipped to comment learnedly on its "sound," except to say that it sounds good to me. |
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01-14-09: Rebbi Winegasman, Good to hear! And you are happy with how the tube amp drives the speaks? There had been talk here earlier that the Ohms preferred SS gear. Actually, I don't think speakers can prefer anything; only we can. I have no idea how they sound with SS because I don't have an SS amp. I have a 35wpc tube integrated that I like a lot, so that's what I'm using. My ears are probably too dense to appreciate sound the way an audiophile's ears can appreciate sound, but, yea, the Ohms sound wonderful with my amp, in my room, at this time. As I said, the system fills the room with palpable sound -- including engaging bass -- and does it with the volume gain at no more than 1 o'clock -- after that, my ears start to bleed. But that may just be me. |