My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!


So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.

Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.

Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?

Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.

 It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.

Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.

Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.

Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.

Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.

Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.

My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


jays_audio_lab
Just got done listening to the lampizator for 2 hours as a preamp and as a source. My impressions will be posted tonight.
in the meantime, I will leave you what the impressions from my wife of the lampizator:

1. More bass than the ref 10
2. More detail 

my thoughts to come later....
Achieving better sound in your room through proper use and placement of acoustical treatments is a personal choice....definitely not for everyone.
There is an art to deciding the ideal ratio of carpet to bare floor to have.  I enjoy playing my violin in a room with no carpet but a good amount of furniture.  A totally empty room with no carpet or furniture sounds too reverberant which actually darkens the sound because of the HF smearing from too many reflections.  A high ceiling always helps.  All size pianos sound muddy unless the ceiling is high.
We are all in agreement that the floor needs a carpet, back wall needs some and corners need bass traps. Im just not a fan of ceiling treatment, then the entire side wall is pretty much trrated etc. That’s when I feel like it just makes the presentation too laid back. 

Techno- you are probably right but I’m not there. Trust me the 30 min I heard yesterday was enough for me to hold back and check again today if what I heard was in fact the right thing. 
I should have mentioned that it is necessary to have back wall treatment with dipole speakers. Cause they shoot sound out the back.
To each his own with sound treatment, I guess. I'm not big myself on bass traps, unless the room loads up too much with a full range speaker. But come on, the back wall and the floor are 2 places that send the sound to all the wrong places. They should have some kind of dampening material (Ie: rug, tapestry, and whatnot).


Hey if your happy with reflections, more power to ya. I agree, that putting up some of those expensive sound soakers that are way overpriced can suck the sound out of the system. I had my Martin Logans refuse to sing properly till I got them in the right room. A little common sense goes a long way.
My feeling is the Lampi is back in the box, ready to ship back. Your silence maybe point to that direction.

Just a feeling. This is what I do when I evaluate gear and I’m pretty sure l am not keeping it.
A properly treated room will not sound dead. All room treatments don't absorb energy. Diffusion panels disperse mid range and treble energy and make for a more lively room and reduce echo.   I use ASC tube traps to reduce the reverberation (decay time) of excess low bass in my room. The traps are 'tunable'. One side of the traps absorb mid and high range frequencies and the other side reflect the mid and high frequencies. I have mine rotated to reflect the mid and highs back into the room. The result is a tighter bass and a lively mid range and top end.

WC,
I totally agree about the negative qualities of overtreated, dead rooms.  At a famous NY dealer, I heard a Wilson system in a moderate sized dead room.  Trying to A/B amps in that room, one amp produced a sound like thick mud and the other amp sounded like a little less thick mud.  But in his larger room with less carpet, a different Wilson system sounded respectable, enough to more easily hear the differences between the amps.  This dealer had spent millions of $ on remodeling, but that carpeted dead room was a complete waste.
Bass traps for the corners ,and with the rug..that should be about what you want.
Before I update on my thoughts on the dac, I wanted to say that I went to listen to some incredible equipment yesterday. I heard a full gryphon system with the $120,000 msb dac connected to it and it was just amazing. So clean, forceful and smooth with plenty of oomph. I really did not think I’d like the full gryphon set up as much as I did. However, the msb $120,000 dac was the most analog sounding dac I’ve ever heard. It was shocking to say the least. The one thing I can say is that I can’t for sure say HOW MUCH of the awesome sound was attributed to the dac or the gryphon components. Was it 60% dac and 40% gryphon? Hard to tell but it was a sublime experience. 

All that said, the biggest take away for me was that I realize I don’t like rooms that are overly done. This is why I realize that each time I go to listen to a different component at a store I feel it “relaxed and less lively” sounding. I get the feeling I’m probably the type that would like a room that is treated but that STILL has a little “lively feeling” to it. I want the music to still expand and spread without it being totally absorbed by all the room treatment. I’m not sure if you all can understand what’s im trying to say but essentially what I’m saying is that too much room treatment might not be my cup of tea. 


Techno,
FYI, I just woke up and wasn’t able to do critical listening last night. I don’t like doing any sort of analysis when I’m tired because as I had previously explained on this thread, your ears don’t work the same when you are tired. The same effect that happens to your eyes when you are tired ( blurry vision and constant rubbing of your eyes) is what your brain does with your hearing (shuts it down).
I will try to do some listening at some point today if I can (family duties).
You also mentioned that this was an amp thread and that im not doing that anymore. Did you forget I have the musical fidelity titan arriving next week or do you only choose to hear/read what you want?  I also stated a few weeks/months ago that the pool is getting shallower in terms of amplifiers that I want to try. Im
not sure where the disconnect is? 
I am guessing it takes him a little time to adjust to the new sound and compare with the Ref10.

Richer, fuller, 3d midrange, magical midrange, dense midrange, dense highs you can touch...is what we should get as impressions of the Lampi because of its tubes coloration.

maybe it just sucks and he is already planning returning the unit. Sometimes no review is what happens when someone does not want to offend the relation who sent an under performing piece of gear...
I am guessing this is a good sign as WC formulates his first impressions late night EST!
Long time Lampizator owner here. Currently have the Golden Gate 2 with the Pacific arriving in the next two weeks.  There are some good threads on the “What’s Best Audio Forum” regarding tube rolling with the Golden Gate and Pacific DACs.  The consensus for best tubes for the Pacific DAC are the KR Audio 5U4G (Ricardo Kron edition) rectifier and the KR Audio PX25 output tube. KR Audio just recently released a 242 Ricardo Kron edition output tube that could dethrone the PX25 if your system can manage the high output. If you find the 300Bs are a little too much of a good thing you may want to consider the PX25s.  With my Golden Gate 2 I prefer the KR Audio PX4 to the Elrog, KR Audio and Emission Lab 300Bs.  I have both the PX25s and 242s on order to determine what will work best in my system with the Pacific.
He doesnt change fuses. He wont change tubes. I kind of agree with him about testing and comparing the gear stock without upgrades...for objective comparaison ´s sake...

What I find unfortunate is that this thread used to be about what amp betters what amp. Now it is all politics...it’s all about synergy. That ´s whats happen when you become victim of your own popularity. Relations, dealers, resalers and contacts don’t want the readers to know the raw truth about how their products compares with the rest...because many of them are just priced too high... Someone then don’t want to offend relations...which is just normal when you think of it.

So , if the Lampi gets destroyed by the Lux or Esoteric, we shall never really know. What we will know instead is that it is not synergistic with the rest of the system because of bla bla bla...
WC, I know you said no tube rolling at this time, but I just want you to let you know that I got a huge improvement on my Big 7 after replacing the stock tubes with Takatsuki 300B's, KR 5U4G Lampizator Anniversary rectifier tube, and the stock fuse with the Synergistic Research Blue fuse.  It's truly amazing how much these tubes can impact the performance of the Lampi dac in terms of refinement, details, and dynamics.
It has two 300b and one 5u4G towards the front.
@mitch2
i would say you should stick to a pair of 600.8s. I just can’t lie, I simply don’t like pass labs as much as I once did before. There are so many better amps out here. I’ve said to try the simaudio 860a and Luxman 900u instead.
The xs300s are probably something magical though... that is an amp I must have at some point in my journey.

Lastly, if the lampizator Pacific DAC ends up with better synergy than my ref10, I’d be sure to post it here. I still believe the ref10 is oustanding but I did hear it with Rockport speakers and I did not like it. 
Okay, sorry to keep asking , but , what tube type if you know , about the other 2. I see 3 of them .One is the Rectifier Tube .It is 5U4G (in the front) what are the other 2 tubes ? Do they have a number on the ?.I think there was many different tube options when you order a Pacific. I was wanting to know which ones in this one .It just makes a difference if i know the tube model number like 300B , cause i know what a lot of them "sound like " so to speak.

WC, I have been considering Pass amps and remembered reading how much you liked the Pass Labs 250.8 and 350.5 when you wrote your OP back in 2016.  
I am interested in the 260.8 monos but also maybe the larger 350.8 stereo, or 600.8 monos so 
I am curious whether you still feel the Pass Labs amps are competitive after auditioning so many other fine amplifiers?   I am also curious whether you have considered moving up the Pass chain, to something like the XS300 monos?
I already know what will be written...

Midrange is so enchanting, so meaty , so organic. So 3D. Makes me think of the Mac 2301s... music has soul, music brings emotions...

Effect of tubes coloration in the chain. Something near can be achieved with an excellent vinyl rig.

viber, if it beats the Ref10 , it will be funny. If it don’t , its just WC married to this sota preamplifier.
Everything is stock on the dac. No tube rolling at this time.
It also has the preamp option with remote but this is a single ended only dac. I plan to use it as a preamp down the road to see how it sounds with the block audios.
as far as why I didn’t get the gold dac, well I was told it’s in a pain in the a$$ to keep it clean and it’s a  fingerprint magnet.   
I will give my initial thoughts later tonight for those of you who are interested in hearing my impressions.
I see that the Rectifier Tube is a 5U4G, but do you know what Tubes the other 2 are ?
Looks Great. BTW , I thought you might "Go for the Gold" :)
@mitch2 

agreed on the "thicker skin". Workin' on that.

@ricred1 

I think you are getting at system synergy. If so, I'd agree it is THE key, IMHO of course.

Hopefully 2019 will be less contentious here on the Gon'.
WC,
I suggest doing what bigddesign3 suggests--try the direct connection, bypassing the ref 10.  Hopefully you have enough gain.  My guess is you will enjoy the increased detail which comes from bypassing a line stage.  The reputed luxuriant smooth sound of the Lampizator should give you enough of that quality.  In any case, you can report on the system with and without the ref 10.
WC,The Lampizator looks quite large. So did you get the one with the remote control volume? And second, does it have XLR outputs to go to the ARC 10? If it does have remote control, that would mean that you could go directly to the Block Audios, and not use the ARC 10 for a look at a more direct connection and sound.
@ron17 
I think it’s time we all adapt a "thicker skin" approach.
I agree, after all.....its just a frickin stereo system.  
Lampizator pacific has been fired up and playing for the last 30 min. Impressions to come tonight for the first product of 2019. Stay tuned ! 
@ricred1

Wow....threatening to leave Agon because posters use the terms "better or worse". When posters on this thread use terms like that I roll my eyes and take it with a grain of salt, you should too.

I think it’s time we all adapt a "thicker skin" approach.
WC,

Didn't you just change tubes, due to a tube failure? Could that be the new better sound that you have now?
The new APL DSD-SR is said to be a MSB killer. 

The DSD-MR ( top of the line with tubes) is said to be the closest dac to analog vinyl available.
WC, congratulations on the Lampi!  I am loving my Big 7.  Boy, that Pacific sure is a beauty!  I can only imagine how much better it is than mine, especially with Takatsuki 300B's, which are simply stunning!  Very excited for you. 
The Lampizator was chosen by me based on my knowledge of the synergy that tubes and panels have. I also want to try a source that is a totally different presentation than the solid state dacs I’ve owned. So yes it was picked taking into account the rest of my system. I am a sucker for that 3D effect that tubes give you and that feeling should be enhanced even more with this dac. Again, this is my preliminary feeling but I won’t know until tomorrow night. 
I also feel like I’ve gotten to a good point with amplification for my Neolith. Sure there will be more amps for me to try but I’m not really rushing to try more and more. Instead, I’m looking at the rest of my set up in order to tweak the sound to my liking. The ref10/block audio se combo is brutal. It will throw a sound that you keep looking behind your head checking to see if you have surround sound speakers. Lastly, over the last 4 days, there is something that’s been happening to my system. It feels as if things are slowly starting to “click in place” better which has given me more and more enjoyment. That said, about a week ago I wasn’t getting this same effect. I felt as if things were dull or muffled. Now they don’t sound like that anymore. Maybe that’s my ref10 still going through a break in process? I have not turned off the block audios since I got them. They are left on even if no music is playing since they automatically switch to eco mode after a signal hasn’t been played for 15 minutes. 
Who knows what is happening but I’ve been quite impressed over the last few days with how things are just working together. 
@ricred1
You used the word "everyone", and I would disagree with that.  Especially since I also agree that it has to do with how the components compare in the system/room as a whole.  It's not an absolute - just because it's better in one system/room, might not mean it will be better in another system/room.  However, I think WC has done a great job identifying how components work better with certain systems and preferences, based upon the sonic attributes. 

It's your choice to stay or leave. 


Dave
@ricred1
I think everyone knows THAT , by know (component in your own system ) , but more often than not , you usually do NOT get a huge mismatch ..... that is just ... no good .
Most highly rated components don’t necessarily "Fall on Their Face".
It is pretty unusual to have something that is a mismatch or major disappointment, at this level.
It is still about a component being better or worse (in your own system), but you make it sound as if it could be a Total Dud .
Unfortunately everyone has their own beliefs. and their own setup..
Better or worse than what .. BTW?
I guess you just can’t take the pressure of everyone thinking that it is about a specific component being better or worse .
It IS ALL subjective . I guess if you can’t take that , and have to leave Audiogon, then you might need counseling , to understand why ... ?
I guess in the New Year it may be time for me to exit Audiogon. I left Facebook two years ago and don't miss it at all. Everyone still believes it's about a specific component being better or worse. It's about how a component sounds when inserted into a system. In one system the sound may be preferred and another it may not. In either situation it doesn't mean it's better or worse. 
Honestly, I'm excited, and it's not even a component (DAC) that I'm interested in for my system.    Looking forward to WC's thoughts.

Dave
WC,

I missed your post on your choice of the Pacific. Good God that thing is pretty. Shiny with tubes. Congrats.
@WCSS
It will.....It will. !!!!!..It will take time to break in .You MUST be patient ... PLEASE .
I am Damned excited that you actually are getting something that I would love to own and I HAVE owned .....well kinda...I had .the BIG 6 .
Besides the Czechs, (Block Audio) are right next door to Poland
( Lukasz Fikus of Lampizator).They should play nice together :)
I am going to go out on a limb and say that it will be similar to the ARC REF10,... in that it will be Damned hard to let go of .
Patience on Break In. Patience
If you want me to break it in for you, send it to me . I’ll take 2 weeks off of work and play with it the entire time. It already comes with some of the best tubes money can buy ( KRON KR45, or PX-4 ) SO.. i doubt very seriously that you would need to tube roll.
It also comes with Mundorf silver /gold solder and copper metal foil output or coupling caps (probably the Jupiter copper foil Paper and wax...THE BEST), which are same caps that I have put in my Granite Audio 864SR.
HELL YES !!! 

WC,

What does Mike from Suncoast Audio think of the 2 choices that you have it down to?


Sure seems like a tough choice. Isn't the MSB the only one that does MQA decoding? Tidal has MQA, and it might be something good (I've heard some say it's really freakin' good). Might be something good to have.