In the middle of a pandemic, Stereophile reviews ~ $30K equipment
While the world is in the middle of a major economic event, the last two pieces of gear posted by Stereophile to their online site average $30K a piece.
Well, only the people who are very well off will have a 30k integrated unless a second mortgage is taken out. High end audio has always since my teen years been a hobby learning, observing and seeing where financially I fit in. Since I fall middle, middle class for income even a $1000.00 integrated is big money for me. I love music as much as any audiophile but cannot afford to change systems on a whim. This is where network music streaming is prime for people like me that cannot afford thousands of LPs. It is good Audiogon provides a service that offers quality moves for less than 5 years prior prices. I estimate, my guess only 10% of the world population would fork over 30k for an integrated. Unless there are more people that I realize with deep pockets.??
You're right in that mortality rates for other ailments are plumetting but the gruesome reason might not be the massaging of stats that has been reported.
It could also be that Coronavirus is getting to those unfortunate people first. It's well established that those with underlying conditions are at the greatest risk.
As nonoise posted above, we still don't know (or haven't been told yet) of the long term after effects of this disease.
Let's try to stay safe, at least until we have a whole load more of the facts. Should be interesting to see what the effects have been on those affected pro athletes once sports are back up and running.
I try to remember a few things that give context to the discussion. 1. By definition, most of us have failed to make it into the 1%, or even into the top 5%. We have no conception of their decision making process. 2. Their fortunes finance our equivalent of the space program, hence many of the incredible toys that trickledown to larger (if not mass) markets. 3. People are apparently buying the stuff—new and used—at these prices. Until they adjust their behavior the situation will sit. 4. Look for big changes everywhere by the holidays.
I'll never understand how some fall for the patently stupid propaganda. This is not some kind of flu. I remember when the naysayers were wetting themselves over the coverage and complaining about how the regular flu kills 40-70K people a year and only 38 have died so far. And that was around the month and a half mark. Look at it now and we're only in the 5th month.
When I had my surgery yesterday, one of the nurses told me a friend of hers was on vacation, skiing in Italy when it all started, and he caught the virus over there. He went through the pneumonia stages and survived that and now he's experiencing the minor blood clotting and has to have some of his fingers amputated.
It attacks most of your organs, not just the lungs. It hits people in different ways. One patient back east went through eight blood transfusions as it kept destroying all his red blood cells.
Some people who have survived need two different types of inhalers to keep breathing. One is a healthy, 33 year old journalist who used to jog regularly. Just last week it was floated that this may end up being endemic like HIV and be with us forever.
Geoffkait, do you always fall for propaganda? Go to the CDC's web site for data. You should also note that the mortality rate from heart attacks and cancer have dropped dramatically. Headlines-Corona virus cures cancer and heart attacks! Hospitals are pigs. Everyone who dies in a hospital now dies from Corona virus. They think they can get more money this way. A 30K dollar integrated amp is a total non started regardless of any circumstance.
Well if you can afford a $125,000 watch that's nice .I hardly ever wear a watch and when I do my $150 Sieko serves me fine.I also drive a 2006 Honda Accord which I don't gave to worry about getting scratched when I park it.I do have a stereo system that cost me 10k and have alot of vintage audio equipment, plus albums and cds ,that fill my townhouse. I like reading the replies on this site .I consider myself somewhat knowledgeable about audio equipment having been into it for over 50 years.From the days that if you spent $1,000 you got state of the art equipment. BUT I'm not a millionaire so ,I enjoy what I got and read magazines and sites like this to Float my Boat.The Coronavirus has nothing what so ever to do with audio equipment.
As Jello Biafra (of Dead kennedy's fame) once sang "Kill Kill Kill Kill Kill The Poor" ... well, looks like CV-19 and dumb-ass politicians are doing that for us. Also, in a much earlier posting, someone grumbled about "people who wear $10,000 watches don't do so just for the time" (or something like that). I must take exception to such a slanderous and malicious slur ... my watch cost $125000 (a bog-standard Audemars Piguet, nothing special) and it tells the time quite nicely thank you!
In Virginia 77% of all COVID-19 deaths are people 70 and over. So, you could say for everyone else COVID-19 is pretty much like a bad case of the flu. Agree, disagree?
I see our very own resident 'critic' could not resist chiming in and calling the writers of the review names and making personal attacks... instead of criticizing the work. after all, no one can refute the pontifications of the person with the absolute best system (and best ears and brain) on this site.
valid comments about the gear... no problem. Valid comments critiquing the review... no problem. Calling names and belittling others... ugly
On the secondary topic of the pandemic, Americans are venturing out this weekend traveling to parks, traveling to relatives, traveling to beaches. Maybe you’ll see them. Bubus Americanus?
WOW ! I might be new to this forum discussion but didn't a lot of us never thought that we would EVER be able to afford the gear we now treasure at home thank's to the grace of Audiogon & U.S. Audio Mart ! How did we hear about these products ? Stereophile , Absolute Sound and the like didn't we ? We all thought who would pay $200 for a .5 meter interconnect 30 years ago ? Now that may be in our systems ......and doesn't today's new technology filter down with time ! A computer use to cost thousand of dollars and now for $300 you can get a laptop better than one that cost $1,000 5 years ago ! Let's all take a chill pill during these stressful and trying times and reflect on how fortunate we all are ,pray for those in harm's way and sit back, stay calm and listen to music !
Except for some disapproving judgment implied by you I see no connection between the world’s economic events and Stereophile’s reviews of expensive audio equipment. Reviewing expensive audio equipment is Stereophile’s raison d’être in every economic environment.
This subject (equipment costs) has come up many time here. In my very humbled opinion, I see nothing wrong with very expensive equipment being reviewed. Actually, to me, it is absolutely necessary for expensive equipment to be reviewed.
If a company or person takes the time to do the research, engineer, design, construct, market and sell a piece of equipment, and places a high price on it, that is that person's or company's right. nothing is forcing us to purchase it. At least not yet.
This is the same for automobiles, trucks, airplanes (private), watches, you name it. There is a low end, mid level and high end for just about anything. And (shouldn't start a sentence with and), there will always be people out there that have issues with something at one of those levels.
The very high end crowd has issues with low end equipment being reviewed. "Why is that here?". The very low or mid level crowd has issues with stupidly expensive equipment being reviewed. Again, "why is that here?".
Sometimes it is fun and educational to read about very expensive equipment. Trickle down technology does indeed happen in this industry.
What I have problems with are reviewers that make up their own language and I can't figure out what they are saying. Or reviewing stupidly expensive equipment and saying that it is a bargain. Or only reviewing stupidly expensive stuff.
Don't get me wrong, if you have serious money, you have to spend it on something. So, people with high end stuff, like private jets, yachts, cars, watches, homes, etc. you go! That stuff has to be reviewed somewhere.
But regardless of whether it is reviewed, how many of us have purchased expensive equipment or cars without test driving it first? Even used cars (this could be a very serious mistake without seeing it up close). If a nearby dealer won't let me take a piece home for in-home demo, then I have a serious problem purchasing it from them. In my home, in my system is the only real test. But, I do understand that this can't happen for everyone.
Now, if you heard up close the 30k equipment and thought it was junk or not close to what the reviewer stated, then I think your opinion counts to a larger degree. If, however, you haven't, then that is another matter altogether.
Most of our families, friends, associates, etc. would think we were absolutely nuts if they knew how much you paid for each piece, and, they wouldn't sit still long enough for you to explain it to them and your reasoning. Tell the truth here. To them, we are the nutty elitist. And to some degree, they are correct. To them, the level of music enjoyment we desire is crazy. They probably listen to music as background music only, while doing something else, and couldn't care less about sound stage, etc.
Also, with regards to the virus issue, This is not like a cold or the flu. Virus' are getting much nastier. They are evolving to harder to detect and treat. People have lost jobs, livelyhood, family members, lives. This is no joke. And as is many other cases, there are "know it alls" out there that as we used to say, "couldn't program a VCR back in the day", but their scientific opinion is supposed to matter.
There's an old saying, "your right to smoke ends at my nose".
I for one, am not trying to catch this virus. I don't want to be a statistic. So, I'm not taking any chances and I don't associate with people that do. What are they going to say if they inadvertently give it to you? I'm sorry, nope, they won't even know they did it, and they, nor your family will be able to see you. People dying all alone in a hospital room??? that is really sad.
Back to topic. If I had the money for an Audio Research REF 10 pre-amp, I would definitely get one, and I wouldn't tell anyone how much I paid for it, because they would think I was crazy.
The politicization of the Covid-19 pandemic is astonishing...right wing nonsense, a "dumb and dumber" presidential embarrassment, and whining about your rights (you have no "right" to harm others) when clearly staying safe by avoiding crowds and wearing masks worked, and lowered new cases dramatically...so what do you do? Cave to the whiners and the cases go up...enjoy that crowded bar and get ready for that crowded hospital, 'cause that's where you're headed.
Yeah, I saw those pictures of crowds in Brooklyn, in Central Park and other places in NYC. Level of brain power and solidarity are incredible. What kind of music would you play to them ?
Maybe when health care workers walk off the job people will get the message that this is not a joke?
geoffkait21,956 posts05-21-2020 11:42amMD VA FL CT statistics for today look bad already and it’s not even lunchtime. Shut the cave door and back to pigmy country!
If you believe this, then you are miss-allocating your funds. $20K is not bare-bones, unless you are wasting a ton of money of audio jewellery and not things that will really make a difference, like speakers, room acoustics, a tolerable source and amp.
The reality of manufacturing high-end gear. Who’s able to buy and who cannot, if the buyers are the upper 10% with that kind of disposable income that they will build for. In this great hobby early day a normal Joe could afford to but gear, now if your a family of 2 kids or 3 kids, paying for their education and all the rest, car notes, etc. and you make $60,000-$80,000 a year do you think that family is going to say let’s buy a $20,000 audio system, which is bare-bones today, no they buy a streaming Sonus, sign up to a streaming service and stream music to their Sonus speakers.
I know of no one besides a hand full of audio friends who buy high-audio gear. In my family and inlaws that number 125 and counting no one has an audio system of any quality. All in one system and perhaps made a few hundred dollars for it, or old receivers, etc, No interest. The younger ones stream only and use their phones.
Now with the cost of living the middle classes shrinking, who are they building gear for well those who have the money to blow where the middle class does not they got families to raise.
So $20,000 preamps and other gear in reviews are called a bargain. If you look today the items that are marketed are for the very rich for the most part, then towards the lower middle class, discounts store for everything thrive while quality stores go out of business. It’s what people can afford and for 99% it’s not the audio gear, it that 65" TV for $1,000 or less.
Reading the audio reviews is just to pass time when you are talking $15,000 and up for speakers, preamps, and amps, not to mention cables and power cords that can cost as much as a new car. Point is someone is buying enough of them to keep those companies afloat, and folks it not the USA buyers its overseas. Many USA companies would not survive selling audio gear only to America, the survive from overseas sales where most of their sales are. What we are seeing is what is selling and what the manufacturers are designed for.
Stereophile means nothing, nor does any Danish audio company really except Gryphon. But this subject touches on some social fundamentals. Quarter of the working people sit at home doing non-essential work that only increases the cost of everything and facilitates the further development of the surveillance state. They often get paid quite well. For what and by whom ? And essential workers without whom things would fall apart quickly are having quite a different reality, including very often but not always low pay and high risk of getting infected. They also became the reservoir of the infection along with some other groups. Yeah, I saw those pictures of crowds in Brooklyn, in Central Park and other places in NYC. Level of brain power and solidarity are incredible. What kind of music would you play to them ?
roberjerman Borresen? A bit late to the game! Magico’s first speaker was a stand-mount that cost $29K/pair! Years ago! And it was on the cover of TAS, where Jonathan Valin gave it a drool-worthy review!
>>>>Is there anything Valin didn’t give a drool-worthy review to?
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