I guess I have to sell my Tekton Enzos

I think every loudspeaker designer feels that way about the evolution of their products. Some say so out loud in print, others keep it secret so as not to offend their customers.....

zsfphil,
If you think that it's marketing hype, then take it as such and ignore it. Keep your Enzos and be happy.

Slaughter is a pretty strong word,and if I was a Manufacturer I don't think I would ever use words like that.If I felt like I designed a better product than my previous one I would simply give the reasoning why.

I haven't heard or even seen any of the Enzo speakers but I did listen to the Pendragons a few yrs ago and wasn't that impressed.

I do like my DI's they are a completely different design though.

My favorite designer of all time going back to the first Amp of his which was the Threshold 400a and That Offcourse would be the one and only Nelson Pass.He has always had a certain humbleness that I think other Manufacturers could learn from. IMO.

Kenny.

I disregard any comment about slaughter/kills/blows away.
Any low level sales pitch like that eliminates any comment from any audiophile/reviewer/manufacturer in my opinion.

It smacks of lack of experience. Junior High School locker room talk.

I totally ignore anything anyone has to say after they throw out an asinine comment like that. They have zero credibility in my book.

You are correct, you would never hear a legitimate manufacturer making that comment about any of their products.

I said the original Enzo. The Enzo 2.7 is another animal entirety. This new speaker sounds fantastic and it's small. There is a need in my lineup for a small floorstander, and I do not see the the DI cannibalizing the Enzo 2.7. They are not similar to each other and one is more than twice as small.

There is 'no replacement for displacement' and in that spirit the DI is simply more of a really good thing when compared to the Enzo 2.7. 

Eric Alexander - audio designer

"Anyway, the Enzo was created years ago and has ABSOLUTELY ZERO to do with the Double Impact of today so everyone can rest easy. The DI’s absolutely slaughter the original Enzo! I created the original Enzo for one reason only... a viable alternative to the B&W 804. Nothing more... nothing less."

That quote was taken from the AudioGon DI thread. It's bad enough when competitors and internet trolls slam your product, but when the manufacturer does it I find that unacceptable.

Mcgrogan... respectfully, a personal ad hominem attack unleased at me isn't juvenile and irresponsible "Junior High School locker room talk" now is it? 

Eric Alexander - audio designer

Well, it's back to work for me. Feel free to continue to slam, snipe, take my words out of context, defame and slander me. Candidly, your criticism and skepticism simply moves me and motivates me to simply do more. Thanks!

Eric Alexander - audio designer

"They are not similar to each other and one is more than twice as small."

That's my point. You are comparing two totally  different speakers. In that context to say one slaughters the other is not reasonable.

"Same specs as the original Enzo with a bit more of a really good thing."

That was your response on the Tekton blog comparing the Enzo to the Enzo 2.7. So according to you the 2.7 "is a bit more of a really good thing" compared to the Enzo . So if the DI slaughters the Enzo and the 2.7 is only "a bit more of a good thing" then the DI should slaughter the 2.7 just a little bit less. I'm done.

I have the Enzo 2.7's, the DI's and now the Ulfberhts. Yes, the DI's do indeed kill the Enzo's. Listen to them side-by-side, and it's not even close.

I appreciate Eric's of Tekton being candid and also kind of getting caught up in the hype.  I have visited with him and he seems like the real deal. No pussy footing around things for him, no time to. But he seems very helpful and a good listener.  

Jeffery,

Thanks for putting all this in its proper context. Going up in scale simply delivers more authenticity and realism.

By the way... got the Bach - Goldberg Variations you recommended. Thanks! Through the Ulf’s Mahan Esfahani is the room with me. It’s captivating and down-right hypnotic when you relax and focus. I can hear the physical width of the harpsichord across the horizontal soundstage. The harpsichord has so much odd-order resonating harmonics contianed within I plan to demo it to everyone that drops in.

Eric

Mcgrogan... respectfully, a personal ad hominem attack unleased at me isn't juvenile and irresponsible "Junior High School locker room talk" now is it?

Eric Alexander

Alexander, re-read my post, it was not aimed directly at you.
It was a general statement about anyone who talks "foolishly" about audio.

Marketing buzz words like "Kills", Slays", "Slaughters", are simply ridiculous and absurd, and only target the simplest of minds.

There are lots of speaker designers that slow roll it. They come out with a new cross over or port design. Going to fix everything, right. Not sure whether it is from negative feedback or simply more time spent with their own speakers. 

It's okay for an owner of the speaker to say that, but it is inappropriate for the manufacturer of the speaker to do the same.

Just curious - Why is it inappropriate?
Some might say "I love that guy, he tells it like it is. He doesn't BS, he's a straight shooter..." 

And try to remember, it's just a stereo. 

I still look at all this gear that we talk about as just a means to a end,
Meaning the playback of music in my home for my enjoyment.

I quess I'm a music lover first and a Audiophile second.

I'm still looking for,measuring for and listening for that comb filtering that the Double Impacts are supposed to have but I still haven't found it yet.

Kenny.

missioncoonery,

"I think your full of yourself,You make midfi speakers and act like youve just built the wall and had Mexico pay for it..yep yep"

OMG 
That is really a good one my friend and even though we probably are never to agree on everything I must give you a pat on the back for that one,I was laughing so much I couldn't breathe for a couple of moments.

Kenny.

missioncoonery keeps outdoing himself.... keep it up... let's see how low it gets.

kalali,

You must remember he's the president and we are not.

I'm sorry I just couldn't resist that one.


Kenny.

I think your full of yourself,You make midfi speakers and act like youve just built the wall and had Mexico pay for it..yep yep

LOL!  Such disrespect for a legend (albeit in his own mind)  who obsoleted all other speakers! 

I appreciate candor and I see nothing wrong with how the manufacturer describes his own products. As long as it is truthful. The buzz on this site about the quality of sound coming from Tekton's lineup is impressive. It has me pondering a purchase and it is fun figuring which part of the lineup is most suited to my current set up and room.

Having been in this hobby for going of 40 years it is great to see where the industry is today. The bar has been moved upward. And it sounds as if Tekton has contributed to that movement and I am all for it. Especially with regard to value. I am done with the days of investing $$$$$ in audio when musical gems abound at reasonable prices. More power to the Tektons of the world. 

My 2 cents. 

@kdude66

If you are familiar with panels then you will know the sound of comb filtering. If you use a flanger or reverb on a guitar you will be familiar with the effect too.

It is hard to describe but comb filtering makes the sound seem to come from a wall of sound rather than a defined point and of course this would only happen in the upper treble with the Teckton DI design. It gives a bigger Soundstage. Large ribbons do this too.

Here is a demo - notice how the sound shrinks as comb filtering is removed (microphones close) and how it feels expansive (microphones apart). These effects are on recordings already but a speaker that naturally does this will add a bit of this characteristic to all music played through them.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6JK721OpLko

It is hard to judge but the distance of about 9 inches separation on the video is the sort of enhancement you might expect with the DI. It is a very pleasant enhancement and no surprises it is used a lot in music production!

Here is another example of how comb filtering effects drum sounds (in this case the sound is bouncing off the ceiling and combining with the direct sound to produce a comb filter) In fact any two devices recording the same sound or producing the same sound will produce these effects if they are physically separated a greater distance than the audio wavelengths concerned)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4qgmY8jIGi0

More examples of comb filtering - hopefully you now know what to listen for - it is certainly not always a bad sound - quite often it is desirable in pop/rock and electronic music. The faux stereo effect is perhaps the most impressive demo on the link below

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Zic2eNbxNmY

shadorne,

Now it has been a few yrs that I have owned 3 different sets of panel speakers so I understand completely what you are talking about.
I don't play guitar but I do play the piano.

Are you referring to upper treble frequency's above 10k.

Thank You for this information and you can beat I will be checking this out.

Kenny.

@kdude66

From about 4 to 15 KHz in the case of the tweeter. 4Khz is about 3 inches and 15KHz is about 1 inch in wavelength.

As an example imagine two tweeters spaced 6 inches apart. The combined reflected energy they give out will produce total cancellation at roughly 4KHZ, a reinforcement peak at 8Khz and a cancellation at 12Khz etc. The combined sound directly in front and equidistant from both tweeters will be the only signal in the room without these effects (the direct sound)

Generally what you hear is roughly 60% direct and 40% reflected if you sit in a farfield position and maybe 75% direct and 25% reflected in a nearfield situation.

Here is a plot showing the effect of 1 msec delay - equivalent to about 12 inch spacing of the drivers that produce the same signal.

http://digitalsoundandmusic.schwartzsound.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Figure-4.32-Comb-filtering-...

Basically comb filtering changes the timbre of the sound (often described as a thinner or hollow sound) as well as creating a wider Soundstage.

Interesting. When I switched my DAC from old NOS 226 DHT tubes to 101D DHT tubes and changed to a R2R discrete DAC set-up I told one customer that it was a 100% improvement.  He did not believe me either so I took one to his home and within the first 30 seconds he said about 40% improvement.  When the system (tubes) warmed up for 20 minutes he said yeah it is way better.  So don't discount the designers comments.  Happy Listening.

So taking this a step further... Eric told me the Ulfs are far superior in sound to the DI upgrades I have. I have a hard time believing anything could sound that much better after living with the DIs for a while. But I certainly believe Eric and I am upgrading to Ulfs because of it. But until the Ulfs arrive, I am THOROUGHLY enjoying the DIs!

Eric and Tekton,

If the DI slaughter the Enzo 2.7 can you please give an indication as how the Electron will sound in comparison to the DI?  Would one be wise to go for the DI if at all possible because the sound is that much better?

I said the original Enzo. The Enzo 2.7 is another animal entirety.

Above per Tekton Design.

Please be consistent, OP.  His statement was regarding the original Enzo [never the 2.7].

I understand where the OP and jmcgrogan2 are coming from. It's estimated there are 100,000 adjectives in the English language...if the best someone can do when trying to describe or compare something is to say it "kills", "slaughters" or "blows away", they're either not very smart or they actually are smart but are mailing it in anyway.   It's about more than just speakers, it's about whether we want to live in an Idiocracy or not.  

Along those same lines, the verb "lose" (opposite of "to find") is not spelled "loose", and the things on your car that help you stop are not called "breaks".   If you are unsure about the state of our country's intelligence, spend a few minutes shopping online for a pre-owned car, even at the high end.   It's not pretty.

"The limits of my language means the limits of my world." - Ludwig Wittgenstein
 

I've worked with Eric now for a while during the time he has been working on some speakers for me. Say what you will, but he is enthusiastic and he calls them as he sees them. He is not a politician and I consider that a good thing. Maybe slaughter was not the best term for a manufacturer to use, but the point is, he was not wrong. He could have sugar coated it I guess. Would that have been better. I want him to tell it to me as it is.

This thread makes me want to see how a pair of DI's compare to my Legacy Signature SE's at $7000 per pair.

I would touch any of his stuff.     What he should of said is.  There %3 better 
Or there %32 better  
Thanx.  Sorry if i bothered
Ya

It should of said,
I wouldn't touch any of his stuff 
Sorry again

twoch ... the phrase is "Should have said" .... but should of said reminds me of being 10 again, so thanks. :)

Seriously .... 32% better is an objective number. Slaughter is a subjective observation.

The man seems, at least to me, to be trying to make the point that his twice as expensive DI's are going to "slaughter" his half as expensive Enzos.

All too often, doubling the price gets little to no improvement in sound quality.

I have seen the word slaughter used in Car magazines when one car beats another by 2 seconds in a 120 second lap.

Perhaps Eric should elaborate on what "slaughter" is to him. That would be quite educational.

rsfphil,
Sorry, but I DO agree completely with you. 
While it may be true that the DI's are better, as the designer he should never be so indelicate with his comments.
Moreover, if they weren't better, why bring them to market?

Good luck in whatever you decide to do.
Larry

craigsub,

I used to own the focus se and I couldn't be happier with my DI's

Kenny.

I would caution potential Tekton buyers not to confuse Eric's personality with the quality of his speakers.

Before I purchased my DI's I did take exception to some of the claims he made for his speakers.  He certainly will speak his mind and at times and  this will turn some individuals off.

BUT,  when it comes to his speakers there is no doubt these are superb transducers.  I think he is the brightest independent thinker in speaker design right now.  This guy must work nonstop and it is hard to believe what he has done in the last few years! 

If I could buy new speakers right now and start over, I wold purchase my DI's all over again.  In basic black.  What a value!

I have a set if Paradigm Studio 100 Reference speakers presently. Has anyone here experienced the sound of both of these speakers?

Also, I was just wondering if the $300 upgrade on the DI's worthwhile?

@gnason  Which version do you have? I have heard the earlier versions, and to my ears the DIs 'kill' ... just to be idiomatically different : ) since so many here have the slaughterhouse blues. : )  

On a serious note, only you can decide...I'd give them a listen if you are able to or even better yet, bring them into your system to truly get a feel for whether they are your thing, or not.

I know of at least one member who was considering the Persona line and went with the level above the DIs, partly due to the overall cost savings since it was a multiple speaker purchase.

@craigsub If you search the 'Tekton Double Impacts' thread you will see that @mac48025 did replace his SEs with the DIs. There are others who have actively compared the Legacy lineup with DIs, with some finding that the Aeris is where things got real in terms of comparisons, for them. Might be helpful to reach out to those members. Best of luck.

Gnason 
I had the Studio 100 version 2s, S4 v.1, S4 v.2, and S2 v.3. Coming from the Studio 100 I think you would be more than pleased with the DIs. not even close. 

Two years ago, I acquired a passive pre-amp switch box for use in evaluating speakers under blind conditions. The two channel signal from a Marantz 7703 is fed into the passive pre-amp, with an "A" and "B" left/right signal then feeding an Axiom 1500-4 power amp. The power amp has 4 channels, and is a quiet, powerful, neutral amp. The passive preamp allows for level matching at the preamp level, and instant A/B switching between the speakers in question. All speaker evaluation is done under blind conditions. A direct comparison between the DI's and Legacy's is quite doable, blind, and without an agenda to necessarily pick a "winner", but rather to describe the relative characteristics of each speaker without knowing the identity of the speaker. I have an email into Eric to see if he is interested. 

craigsub,

I say go for it regardless of what kind of gear you have and let us know the outcome.

Best of luck to you,
Kenny.

James ... When you can point to a proper blind test that shows a deficiency from one properly designed, neutral amp to another, I will spend a lot more money.

I have done 100's of blind tests on amps, and have read 100's more. When the "blindfolds are on", I have yet to see or experience anyone reliably being able to tell the difference between amps.