Distortion using Node 2i as streamer with Denafrips Pontus Dac

Hello all,  I wanted to let everyone know that the hiss/distortion I was having has been resolved thanks to Alvin Chee’s help. It took a few weeks and a firmware update has corrected my issues. I am very pleased with the outcome. Many thanks Alvin for your genuine concern. 
Bill

Also, they make MQA DACs that can fully unfold MQA if that's your thing.  The Topping D90 MQA comes to mind.  Its $100 extra over the non-MQA version to add MQA compatibility. Mytek also makes MQA DACs. 

@larry5729
The problem was the DAC you purchased was subpar from the internal DAC in the bluesound. If I remember correctly from your previous posts, it was a Pro-ject DAC Box S2. Thats like saying a $300 turntable doesn't sound as good as the Bluesound Node 2i so obviously the Node is better than vinyl. You need a better DAC to realize the potential of a stand alone DAC.

I purchased a Node 2i from a dealer and was talked into adding a DAC.  I got it home and discovered the Node 2i sounded better without the DAC.  I for some reason felt MQA sounded better and by adding a DAC you give up the complete unfold of MQA.  Still wonder if I talked my ears into hearing MQA better than it was, as I know many of you do not see any difference with MQA.  When I added the DAC, it sounded thinner.  Think most underestimate the quality of the DAC inside the Node 2i.

Hey guys,

I should chime in to let you guys know that I am actively assisting @wgs57 to troubleshoot the issue. 

Statistically, the failure rate of the DENAFRIPS DACs is low. We ship hundreds of DACs monthly, the failure rate is less than 0.5%, i.e. 2 out of 500 DACs.

We don't rule out the DAC is faulty. We work with the owner to run through a few tests to identify the root cause before deciding the next course of action. Instead of jumping into the conclusion that the failure is on the DAC, of which, may wrongly diagnose and cost everybody more time and money unnecessarily. 

A classis example recently was, a customer received the Ares II notice annoying ground loop hum in the system. We run through a few tests by removing the earth cable, trying to break the loop but the hum persisted. We decisively (wrongfully too, sadly), ship a new Ares II to the customer. The new unit hum too. After a few more in depth rounds of troubleshooting with the customer, it turns out to be the subwoofer and AVR integrated in the stereo system was causing the audible hum at the loudspeakers. 

Nonetheless, please be sure that we are here to help. We standby our warranty and customer services. 

Many thanks.

Yours sincerely, 
Alvin Chee
Owner of https://www.vinshineaudio.com/

@wgs57   yes I did know there was no usb output on the Node 2i...I wish it had one though. Do some streamers have that feature? I am still very much new at this but I had assumed usb out was for computers, maybe tablets?

USB out streamers

https://www.allo.com/sparky/usbridge-signature-player.html $249

https://hifiheaven.net/shop/Cocktail-Audio-X45-High-Resolution-Audio-Player-and-DAC-Black?manufactur...
$2300

Thats not encouraging... 2 users of the denafrips dacs on this thread, both had different issues and then someone else mentions that its common?  In singapore?  No thanks

You’re not going to get any improvement when you buy expensive streamer unless you’re going to use built in DAC
you already have DAC

Wrong! But thanks for playing..........

I replaced a Node 2i with a Lumin U-1 mini and it was a very noticeable improvement. The Lumin is more natural sounding whereas the Node could be a little artificial and not nearly as involving.

Oz

It is not your Node 2 to be blamed. It’s your Denafrips DAC. They are known to have that issue you are describing 

If you do send it back I would recommend the Chord Qutest has been the biggest upgrade in my digital side. Flawless 

Have you tried the using the internal DAC to see it the distortion still appears?
If it does, then the streamer section itself is suspect... not compatibility with external DAC(s).
Try connecting with the analog/RCA output and see what happens.

In the Node settings there is clock trim adjustment. This will better the sync between Node to Dac.

I use a Bluesound node 2i with the Denafrips Ares ii as DAC.  They work great together.  Maybe it is your internet service.  What are you streaming?  Is it Tidal, Qobuz?  I would try downloading a high quality music file to a flashdrive.  Then put the flashdrive in the USB port of the Bluesound node 2i.  Play the music from the flashdrive.

I had an issue for over a year with the Pontus and Node 2i combo.  No issues with distortion, but I had frequent dropouts and skipping issues that I voiced here:
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/denafrips-dac-owner-impressions-feedback-general-discussion-q...

I enjoyed the sound of the Pontus as well as the simple interface controls for the Node so I put up with it. Alvin even sent me a new DSP board which sounded better but still had the issues of dropout.  But then a month ago I got a used Auralic Aries because I wanted to try a dedicated streamer without a DAC to use with the Pontus. This combo blew away the Node.  Effortless pinpoint imaging and deep and wide soundstage. The Auralic is great because it can output using usb, spdif and AES/EBU.  I tried each with a Curious usb, Snake River spdif and Audioquest AES cable, each bested the Node easily.  The simple Blusound app is still my favorite compared to Auralic's DS Lightning software which is a little clunky. But using Roon to stream gives it a lot fuller and smoother sound with the pinpoint imaging, alot of micro detail.  I prefer Blusound's interface over DS Lightning and Roon. I use a Macbook Air for the Roon core. Of course it might be sound in your system.

I didn't think there would be that much of a difference but there was. I'm curious how good it would sound now with the Aries G1 or G2 or a Lumin streamer. But it doesn't make sense that these streamers cost more than the Pontus, maybe if I ever upgrade to the Terminator DAC.  The Pontus is still a great sounding DAC.  Best of luck

Do you use the volume control on the BluOs app?

There are settings for audio fixed and variable plus EQ.

I'd recommend looking at Sonore's offerings. I have the Node 2 (gen 2) and when I switched to Sonore's entry-level microRendu the increase in fidelity was an obvious improvement. Their newly-released microRendu sells for a mere $400. Moving up in their line is supposed to be "better". I have no experience otherwise but it's a path you may want to explore. 

King Barbuda, yes I did know there was no usb output on the Node 2i...I wish it had one though. Do some streamers have that feature? I am still very much new at this but I had assumed usb out was for computers, maybe tablets? 

I am thinking about upgrading the streamer but I spent my budget on the Dac which was around $2,000 CAD. I do want to keep the Node 2i for the time being until I can afford something better. A few users have same some good recommendations but I may just go with the Roon Nucleus next year. 

Hmm, well I am trying to figure out the distortion I am getting. I don’t think it’s the Node 2i creating the issue. I am going to upgrade the firmware of the Pontus Dac and see what the results are. Alvin Chee of Vinshine is very helpful but his location is in Singapore and I am in Canada so I can’t just drop in for some help but he is offering lots of guidance over email which I will follow and provide feedback. I am sure we will get the problem resolved. 
Bill

I had a node 2i and felt it didn’t do any favors for the DAC I was using at the time. Really I’d get something a little better. 

You’re not going to get any improvement when you buy expensive streamer unless you’re going to use built in DAC 
you already have DAC 

I am sorry. Have the Bluesound Node 2i  as an input to my cable service which is connected to home router via a cat 5 cable. I stand corrected. 

Just in case this was overlooked, there is no USB output on the Node 2i. The USB port is an input for connecting a flash drive with music. There are only optical and spdif/coax outputs. 

I agree with Parker, don't think its the Node 2. Have mine connected to Tubadour DAC via my USB line from cable co. from DAC to Node via coax cable to integrated amp and use my iPad wirelessly with Tidal music apps.  Hole this helps. 

I run the Node2 as a streamer with my MHDT Orchid via digital optical cable and couldn’t be happier. I definitely don’t think your issue originated with the Node2.

Hi cd45123, I will definitely check out the two streamers you mention. Thank you for your advice. 
Bill

The other thing to consider is getting a better streamer to help with a good DAC like the Pontus. I think even a Zen mini or a Rendu would be a big step up from the node 2i

Excellent news! Hope it works out for you. Best.

My apologies, I don’t think I explained myself properly?

I tried various outputs from the Bluesound Node 2i to the Pontus.

1) My first try was the optical out of the Node 2i to the Pontus using a new optical cable and there was some very strong distortion after an hour of playback.
2) I tried another optical cable that I know is working and same problem.
3) I tried a very short coax cable, same problem.
4) I ordered a USB cable to use from my iMac using Roon and it starts off sounding excellent then after about 15 minutes I have a background white noise that overshadows the music.

UPDATE! Alvin Chee has sent me a firmware update that I will try and hopefully that will clear things up?

Bill

"If you have a Node 2i, why is there even a computer in the chain? Does not compute."

Wondering the same thing....

My question is this.

If you have a Node 2i, why is there even a computer in the chain? Does not compute.

Oz

Thank you for the link! I am rather discouraged as I spent over $2,000 CAD for the Pontus and I have not been able to enjoy the Dac at all as the problem occurred almost immediately. I will try to help Alvin diagnose the problem if I come to a happy ending. 
When it did work I was overwhelmed how wonderful it sounded. 

Bill

See Alvin Chee post(s) on the SH forum in this thread, in particular post #629 (March 9, 2020) where he mentions a software/firmware issue:

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/denafrips-dacs.897934/page-26

Apparently others have had similar problems with their DACs. I would suggest contacting their support.

If you don't get the noise while using a streamer service or with your OPPO then the issue is with your Mac.

My BluNode has run through 4 different DACs no problem.