Combining 2 channel audio and home theatre

Your partially right you should get an integrated with a built in streamer and take the left and right outputs of the receiver into the integrated creating a much purer way to derive the best possible performance outof your main loudspeakers

Thanks for the reply! 
Built in streamer as in like, the ones with spotify streaming from the phone? What are the available options out there? 

But even if i go that way, it'll be a wireless streaming and reduce the audio quality right? Anyway i. could play the master audio's from Tidal? 

@audiotroy Okay i've found a few Integrated Amp's with built in streamer that supports tidal. Thanks for the suggestion! i'll definitely consider this. 

But how about my first step? if i just connect a 2 channel Power Amp to my AVR, will it have a noticeable good difference in the audio quality? Since, through this method, i’ll be giving a good quality dedicated power amp to power my L/R rather than the low grade ones from my AVR. Basically, through this method i’ll be turning my AVR into a pre amp. I'm just confused that if the pre amp function in Denon AVR is good enough and match that of an Integrated stereo amp? 

and one more question, adding an integrated amp or a Power amp brings major difference in the audio quality? that leads to my previous question, is the preamp function in an AVR as good as the ones from an Integrated stereo amp. 

Sorry for asking too much questions, I'm pretty new to this. 

Not sure of your budget but my dealer carries the Gato DIA-250 S integrated. Excellent DAC's w/digital inputs. 250wpc 8 ohms and 500 wpc into 4 ohms.. Has HT passthrough. $3500.

That is a very capable AVR, perhaps others are not looking it up

https://usa.denon.com/en-us/shop/receivers/avrx3700h#divSubscribe

As for a dedicated amp(s), separates being better, come on, in a dedicated listening system, in a bigger space, bigger home theater, yes, but that darn good AVR in your space is plenty good enough IMO.

Considering both 5.1 and 2 channel (I do a heck of a lot of this, every day, for many years, using my Sony AVR, blu-ray; cable; youTube; netflix; amazon prime; hulu; viki; music shows Voice/X Factor/Songland/ occasionally streaming Pandora while doing something else ... Sound of my small Home Theater is very important. Both 5.1 and 2 channel. I also have dedicated 2 channel system elsewhere, that's dedicated separates.

You need to improve the speakers, add center, rear surround, and self-powered sub.

Your speakers are efficient, however they dip down to 4 and occasionally 2 ohms, which can be difficult for some amps.

IF you have enough volume, and no obvious distortion, and no weirdness from the AVR, then the Denon is dealing with the 4/2 ohm load.

A. add a center channel speaker (definitely needed for 5.1, off for 2 channel).

Any surround coding records/separates designated sounds for the center channel output. Those sounds DO NOT exist in front l/r, thus a center channel speaker is imperative. I love this very compact Bose center, easy to locate just below the image

https://www.ebay.com/i/233696110070?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&am...

B. Add small rear surround speakers. In a small room, I have used small speakers on their backs, shooting up, using the space between the back of the sofa and wall behind like a horn. There's no real bass, small ones decent efficiency will do. Again, any surround mode, these frequencies/sounds DO NOT exist in the front, center, or sub channels.

C. add a self powered sub to your nice but small bass limited front l/r speakers. And hook the sub up so that it is still working in 2 channel mode which can be tricky.

Self-Powered Sub will accomplish 3 things:

1. take the low bass signals away from the amp, the self powered sub will amplify those frequencies (adjustable crossover needed somewhere, typically in the sub)

2. take the low bass requirement away from the front l/r speakers, so they don't distort trying to make low bass.

3. Their mids and highs will sound terrific when not in a self-made cloud of not so great low bass.

Surprisingly, MUCH Video sounds better in 2 channel mode, even though the cable box/AVR chooses to use a surround mode. Learn how to go from dolby 5.1 to 2 channel to compare, stay there or back to dolby 5.1

IF it was a bigger room, I would either change your main speakers, or add a stereo pair of front firing directional self powered subs, to preserve bass directionality, especially 2 channel.

if i just connect a 2 channel Power Amp to my AVR, will it have a noticeable good difference in the audio quality?

A high quality integrated amp with HT bypass or power amp definitely will be an improvement, but for the budget of $700, I doubt you can find one with noticeable good difference in the audio quality.

Your Triangle BRO3 is not that hard to drive, for two channel playback, the Denon AVR should be able to do the job well. My suggestion is spend your money on room treatment or add a 2nd subwoofer to improve bass response.

´´ NAD D3045 Hybrid Digital DAC amplifier ´´ is in your price range.
I think you do not need the pre amp section of an integrated amp.
Tidal uses ´´ Leedh Processing ´´ and it is better with amplifier only.
You Denon AV  ´´ pre out ´´ will be connected to  the amp.´´  input ´´only.

Room treatment is half of the sound. 

Adding a separate stereo amp would likely help, but the Denon’s preamp section will continue to be a significant bottleneck to achieving better 2-channel performance as long as it’s in the signal path.  Period.  Preamps matter!!!  The easiest, most cost-effective way to do this would be to get a good integrated amp.  Something like a used NuPrime IDA-8 would be a nice step up in performance from your AVR, and it also has a good onboard DAC so all you’d need would be a streamer.  A used Bluesound Node 2i would suffice nicely without costing very much.  Just one option, and best of luck. 

I have found a way to do this. Makes a world of difference. Have a 3.2 setup, which is conducive for my listening setup. For now. 
Focal Sopras front L and R are connected to my Luxman 509x. Center sopra is connected to a Peachtree amp500. My streaming source is a Aurender A10 which is connected to the Luxman. REL 212SE x 2 are connected to the Luxman via high level inputs. LFE inputs from the REL are connected to my Marantz SR 7010 subwoofer outputs. My Marantz then acts as my preamp only. And needless to say, the LCR channels are connected to the pre-outs of the Marantz and the respective inputs on the Luxman and Peachtree. When I wanna watch TV/HT, I use the Luxman’s HT bypass switch. It’s called ‘seperate’ on the Luxman remote. Other manufacturers call it HT bypass, Direct Input, Mains in, etc. And switch it off so I can stream music from the Aurender through the Luxman for 2-channel only. 
It would essentially be the same setup for a 5.1, but with more speakers and separate amps to drive them, all connected to the AV receiver or Pre-pro for HT use, and simply switching the HT bypass switch back to off for only 2-channel listening. This way, as someone mentioned, I’m not dependent on my Marantz preamp for my 2-channel listening, but rather on my Aurender’s...If you want to expand your soundstage by using subwoofers for both HT and 2-channel listening, options are limited. For me the RELs make perfect sense here, because of separate high-level and LFE inputs. Best of both worlds I suppose.. Sorry if my description is a bit confusing.. 

Mass.market surround sound receivers haveway too much stuff going on for too low a price
 And all.of that circuitry impacts resolution

 is not that the denon cant drive the dpeakers it is that a more dedicated two chanel piece will.sound way better 

Wesell.most integratedhard to beat the nad for agreat built in streamer

Dave and troy
Audio intellect
Nad, nuprime deelers

Keep it seperate, sound will suffer. Jmo. I have a totally different set up for watching movies. My hifi Is completely independent from the surround sound/home theater etc. Dedicated 2 channel hifi with no subs. If speakers can’t go low enough on their own, then imo they should be replaced with a competant pair.

+1 on the integrated amp with HT bypass as the best approach. It’s just the $700.00 budget that is a problem. Ideally, you’d like to get Tidal from a device that can be shared between the AVR and the amp...Node 2i or older 2 can work, but that’s half or more of your budget. A Rega Elix-R would be a nice choice, but is way over the limit. A used Rotel A-12?  Really, enjoy what you have until budget permits you to get the gear you want, or an anonymous benefactor gives you a gift of a discarded amp. 

Hello,
This is a very big problem with home theater audiofiles. Most of these ideas are correct especially the preamp/ or integrated amp with a home theater bypass. This lets you have the best of both worlds plus you get to use your existing speakers with your two channel and home theater like I do. Your main problem is your budget because you need a more modern integrated or preamp/ amp combo that has this feature so you do not mess up the components you have. You can mess up your AVR and speakers just plugging your AVR into a two channel system if it is not done properly. The setup I have is the Emotiva 2channel preamp $750 used with your choice of amp. You can use the DAC in your AVR for now but upgrade to a stand alone DAC later. Do not use their amps for music unless you like a sterile sound. Very good for home theater with DSP. You can get a nice amp for $200-$250. You see the dilemma. You are about $250 to $350 short with interconnects. My opinion. Save up some more. Get the Emotiva differential linear preamp and a used amp of your choice. If you can get an amp that is fully balanced you will really hear the difference. Bottom line, you need a home theater bypass on the two channel system or buy the Denon x3600h  $1000 with 4K video or x3700h $1200 8k video then you will need to find an amp that complements your speakers. These two AVRs are the cheapest avrs that let you reassign the front two amps and add a two channel amp with no problems. BTW please do not buy a preamp or integrated amp with a streamer unless you are laying out $3000 or more.  You will be very disappointed. AVRs with streaming is fine. If you decide to go along this route with a DAC or streaming built in go with a Hegel product. Sorry for the length of this post. I don’t want you damaging your system or wasting your money especially when every dollar counts. 

Hello,
I apologize, I just saw you have the correct AVR. You just need to reassign the front amps on the AVR or turn them off in the setup menu. Get a nice used amp. 10 years old or less so the CAPs are still good. I say look at shiit audio for new amps. Stay away from tubes because you might get ground loop hum since you are using your Denon as a preamp and AVRs usually do not have a ground plug on the EIC plug in the back of the AVR. Very high bang for your buck. Or an older two channel Marantz amp which will blend nicely with your Denon AVR since they share a sound signature.  Try to get close to 100 watts. No need for anything above 150w. You can look at the posts in audiogon about having too much power. Good job on the AVR selection!

I made a mistake :
´´Tidal uses ´´ Leedh Processing ´´ and it is better with amplifier only.´´

It is Lumin that uses ´´  Leedh Processing ´´ .
It is the streamer ,I use to stream Tidal.

Hshf totally wrong the preamp in the denon will. Kill the systems Ultimate sound quality

We did a denon vs a Cambridgeu  audioreceiver and the Cambridgesoundeded way better

By all means do it! Most receivers have much better "front ends" than the power amp sections. It's a good place to start. As long as you have "Preamp Outputs" you can add multi channel power amps or multiple single or stereo amps (maybe just a stereo amp for your front speakers - let the receiver drive the center and rear channels). The DSP features of receivers and multi-channel sound synthesis are not to be ignored. If it's a receiver with multiroom capabilities, you can use those channels to drive subwoofers. Later, you can get a "real" front end like the Emotiva MC-700 and enjoy the amazing improvement. Look for used ones. Keep the receiver for the FM tuner and the ability to put god sound in other rooms.

I am in the exact same spot, having a relatively new dedicated room, and the need for both HT and 2ch music.  Since I am still on route I have a mixture of old and new.  You have great pointers from the guys:
1. using HT RV with amps
2. using two subs
3. upgrading room acoustics
4. upgrading components as budget permits (buying second hand is a great suggestion)
5. enjoying the route not only the end result...
This is what worked for me:  I went with the Canadian Anthem MRX720 7.2 (debated on Denon/Yamaha. The anthem has less bells and whistles but is said to be more solid for music) as my HT system core.  My next step would be adding amps to the two mains and using the anthem as a pre (which I am currently looking at and debating on mono’s if budget permits).  Another thing that really worked great was adding two subs (SVS4000 X2) which did in fact take the low end load of my old AR94’s and did a super upgrade (for time being until budget permits to upgrade the AR’s...which are 40 years old but still kicking).  Room acoustics is my next step, but if budget does not permit, then furniture and simple “books” on a book shelf will do a decent job meanwhile.

I was in a similar situation, wanting to double-duty my audio system for 2-channel listening and H/T. I also have a Denon AVR (X-4000). Because my main speakers are Magnepan MMGs that require more power than the Denon has to adequately drive them, I added a separate power amp (B&K EX-442 Sonata at 350 wpc/4 ohm) AND preamp with H/T bypass (Parasound P5). I also have a powered sub (Rythmik F12G).

The integrated setup you’re considering would combine my two separates (amp/preamp) into a single unit. Not sure of the ultimate sound of what you might end up with, but I’m exceedingly happy with the performance of the system I put together for the money that’s into it. The Key to the Kingdom for a sound system to do double duty is a H/T bypass feature.

On a strange side note, when I’m passing through my preamp with it powered on and the bypass engaged, the system sounds better than if I pass my signal through it when it’s powered off, as it will pass the signal either way. I get some measure of signal bump, so it’s always on - which is where you’d be with an integrated any way. I expect my next move might be an integrated, if I can find something that matches the B&K/Parasound output I’m getting now.

If you get a high quality preamp and amp(s) or a good integrated that has home theater bypass that allows you to skip the Denon, then you have an opportunity to experience a dramatic difference in sound quality.  Having said that, unless you get really lucky, you're probably not going to do that for $700.  If you like the sound of the Denon, stand pat.

Having said that, unless you get really lucky, you're probably not going to do that for $700.

Agreed

I’ll take a good, used integrated stereo amp for $700 over a mid-fi AVR any day. 

A little over your budget, but the Parasound New Classic 200 Integrated with pass-thru may be a good candidate to consider.

I tried using my ‘very good’ AVR for 2 channel. All I can tell you is I am much happier once I took the AVR out of the 2 channel chain. Now my AVR is for TV Only in a 5.1 setup. All my 2 channel is separate, but with a HT pass through to make the switch easy.

We have a video that discusses Combining the Best of High-end Stereo and Home Theater

 

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