My 24 year old grandson finished his tour in the service recently and has been staying with us for the past several months. He got himself a good job, to help out and take care of himself, while deciding what to do in the future - back to school, etc. After he got a few good pay checks, I joking suggested he buy his Pa a new CD player. If looks could kill. "Why would you want a new CD player?" He asked. I told him "just to upgrade the one I have". "No one buys CD players anymore" he exclaimed. "Then what's your Idea of fine Audio, a WalkMan?" I asked. "WOW! There's not even any such thing as a WalkMan any more" he said. To which I replied, "Ya there is, we have a guy on our forum who swears by em". He just rolled his eyes and said "No - Streaming! Using an iPhone or iPad you can get a streaming package and get all the music you want". "Why would I want to do That?" I asked "I have hundreds of great LPs and CDs, that I'm perfectly happy with." To that he replied "OK Boomer". I guess that meant he knew I was right. Why is it that youngsters just don't understand the love that some of us old folks have for our old LPs and CDs and we have no interest in paying for another monthly service, to listen to all the music we already have?
I agree with @mkrus on this. 'OK boomer' and other terms do nothing but add to stereotypes and divide people. I'm 55 and my best friends range from 30 to 72. We share music, help each other out with tech stuff and respect each other, not to mention having a blast when we're together. I'm also into model trains and photography and have made some new friends on-line recently who are in high school!! We catch the local trains and have a lot of fun with video and photo editing. My advice is to have friends from all age groups---you might learn something.
People have 3 common needs - be liked, trusted and appreciated. We are all different and have had a different path which is a kin to music media - I have several hundred albums, a trunk full of cassette tapes, a server full of burned CDs and a Tidal subscription. I think the differences are minor until you are engaged with someone in the experience. Listening to vinyl, streaming or my server can all be very enjoyable. And I have had great discussions about music across generations. Heck this forum is intriguing because of the various viewpoints.
@stevencason Maybe he thinks if you want a new CD player you should buy it. When I help my family I never ask for anything in return.
No, pretty sure he knew I was kidding about the buying part. His response was more about why anyone would want or use CDs anymore and why even the need for a large audio system.
We get along great, but don’t always see things the same.....Jim
I love to stream music, it has opened my ears to a variety of music that I did not know existed. It’s also a great way to de-clutter your life. Living in apartment makes you realize how much space LPs and CDs take. Take the plunge, you might enjoy it. The "Boomer " comment was condescending and disrespectful in my opinion.
Ok Boomer. Basically, you are being called a stick in the mud.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with new technology. Without technological advances we would be in the dark ages. however, that does not mean that some are actually better than what was used previously.
The "market" drives much. Companies, dealers, etc. try hard to separate you from your money. and if new technologies are a way to do that, then they are fine with it.
I've compared streaming services to playing CD's through my transport and DAC combination and guess what? The CD's sound better. Remember, the streamer is also going through the same DAC. So the comparison was simple, Streamer vs CD Transport.
I also own a music server/streamer. I've taken the time to rip all of my CDs to the hard drive on my music server and although my music server rips "bit perfect", the CD/DAC combination still sounds better than my music server/DAC combination.
not jaw dropping differences, but they are there.
Now take a well recorded LP vs CD/DAC combination and the LP analog system is simply better.
What I'm trying to say is what is the goal here? is it to sit and listen to music? or to listen to music as background music while doing something else?
Remember, many people don't appreciate listening to music as much as you do. So they don't even understand the whole music thing in the first place.
You are basically speaking a totally different language to them that they would never understand. Unless they took the time to try.
Add to that the justification of the costs of your equipment and yes, they think you are crazy in the first place.
My youngest daughter is a dancer. She is thirty now and has danced since she was four. Ballet, jazz, modern, etc. mostly ballet. She grew up listening and dancing to outstanding music and appreciates it greatly. She even has an analog system.
When my oldest daughter went to college, she came back a jazz fan. imagine that.
It comes down to where people are in their lives and what is important to them and what isn't important to them.
Music and listening to music is important to me. it is a major stress relief and an enjoyment. I grew up playing classical violin, sax, clarinet, oboe, etc. good music is important to me, such that if it doesn't sound real, then it drives me out of the room. So, great equipment is necessary for accurate reproduction.
This is definitely not the case for many other people and there is nothing wrong with their priorities either.
The key is, do they hear a noticeable and appreciable difference when listening to music on your system vs how they typically listen? if the answer is yes, then it comes down to justifying the expense and time to invest in the system you have vs what they have.
in closing, technology advances or we stay stagnate. 45s, 78s, LPs, 8-tracks, cassette tape (and the noise reduction technology), DATs, CDs, MP3, USB drives, music servers, streamers and dont' forget the advent of remote controls.
But, if the sound quality is not to my expectations, I'm not jumping on the bandwagon anytime soon.
Give my music to my kids? All. of the stuff I've enjoyed is on a few portable SSDs if they are ever curious. They don't want it. They like what they like, as does EVERYONE. They don't want any of our photos either. We screenshot Snapchats of the grandkids. YRMV
FM tuner? Multiplex noise and commercials, pledge drives and bad news. Been done with that since the 20th century ended. The college stations I WAS tuning in sound better on Tune In. I avoid it in the car, bring my own music on all trips, rentals included. ISKC Blues Cafe is my idea of radio.
Streaming? Love it. The future is here. CD's CAN sound minutely better. Only for megabux in direct comparison. At least HQ streaming allows you to hear the quality of the "discovered" recordings so that you can acquire them if so inclined, files OR physical, whatever floats your dinghy. The biggest problem is maintaining the "handshake" with routers and modem. You can download any trax for when the the internet's down. In that case I'm calling for a bill credit before it comes back. I can usually restore (reboot) the "handshake" as fast as hanging a tape, dropping a needle or powering up a CDP. Besides, at least 1 out of 3 of my streamers is probably still comnected. I think that a streamer/player with a remote will always play local, no network needed. (If one existed with i2s out I still have room...) Portable SSDs work much better for me than my NAS. Especially in a network snafu circumstance. I can stream anything to a portable anywhere on my property, bypassing the phone streaming app.
Rent, own? My kids value space, I value stuff. I have the portable DVD player and Fender amp they were going to toss out. Probably be better off with someone that could use them. I use battery speakers for portable and flash drives for movies when out. Tablets on airplanes (if ever again.) Like George Harrison wrote about value.
Boomer? Name calling only reflects poorly on the caller. EXCEPT for family. Besides, if you're <60 you barely qualify for that term.
Vinyl? The SQ depletes with each play. It CAN sound better than the CD (for a finite time), often not. Dependant on the mastering (Doug Sax is gone) Today's best engineers like Cookie M. don't do vinyl. ... Seems like a a rich snobs medium. And I just bought a new phono preamp to enjoy my old records. Never buying any more LPs.
LP’s, CD’s, all I use, have a good collection, many of which I still have,not heard from the 80-90’s.
Most of my records, I recorded to my computer, cleaned up,a bit, added bass, mid and treble, recorded to taiyo Yuden cdrs’ for playback, I love the pops, crackles, and ticks from the LP to cd recording process!!!! The tone and sound is analogue, played t(rough my stereo from the CD player is great, they sound like records, and I love it!!
Have %80 of my CDs and LP’s on cd now. Have maybe 500 cds not on iTunes yet, my iTunes is over 90K+ songs. More than I’ll ever listen too.
When listening, I use my CD player or turntable. streaming is not for me.,... I’ll use my iPod hooked into stereo when low volume and background music is needed. otherwise it’s CD and LP.
As,mentioned here, it’s the,physical product I want/collect. I’ve bought maybe 2 albums and 8-9 single songs via iTunes ,I don’t like buying air,,so if I can buy the actual cd or LP, I will.
Come on over to my place. I'll change your mind with a mono promo copy of The Dave Brubeck Quartet's "Jazz Impressions of The USA." The album is 65 years old at this point and has been played a couple of hundred times at least, as it is one of my demo records. Paul Desmond's breath can be felt as it comes out of the end of his alto sax.
Except for isochronism take that whippersnapper behind the woodshed. Afterward, tell him, "now clean those records"! You trying to get me killed? At 69, I'm still pretty spry but he's nearly a foot taller and out weighs me by about 100 lb. Think I'll just give him a good talking to. LOL
So now thinking of a CDP/DAC, capable of high Rez streaming and will play SACD. Any such thing? On a budget, so I'm thinking used and would like to keep around $1K - $2K. My old Denon still works great and sounds pretty fair, until the music gets complicated. Looking for something that is smooth and musical without sacrificing detail and resolution and good at keeping things sorted and in place when the music and vocals get complicated - as in orchestration and Celtic, with multiple instruments and vocals. Thanks for suggestions....Jim
Good hearing from you again. After talking to you, I remembered that I had a matching set of speaker cables that I used for bi-wiring on a different set of speakers. My little Maggies are not set up for bi-wiring so I was only using one set of cables. I did add the second set of cables as you prescribed. I have been running it that way since and the little Maggies sound incredible. I have not made the jump to spend an extra $500.00 for matching IC cables, as I have to split my budget between audio and motor cycles. I had a Wonderfull sounding CA Audio, CDP but it stopped reading discs a while back, so had to dig out the old Denon. I found that repairs to the CA Audio deck would be expensive and unreliable, so now on the hunt for something that sounds as good, without breaking the bank...Jim
I guess I fall into the hard copy ‘old curmudgeon’ camp.
I stream to find new music, check out music I’ll probably never purchase, or when I’m extremely lazy, but, I grew up with the comfort and excitement of having a physical collection of albums, cassettes, CD’s, etc. There is a pride of having a collection of music that your can touch, feel, read, but most importantly own.
I never get the same feeling listening to music streamed. I only feel like I’m borrowing it temporarily, but a very real feeling of non-ownership, even though I pay for Tidal.
Beyond that, especially with vinyl, most often, it just sounds right.
I am very grateful to have made the jump to streaming/file playback. I likely never would have discovered on disc the fantastic - and I do mean fantastic - music I now enjoy if I had stayed with the silver discs. I can still play them, but the enjoy�men of so much more music is very worth the effort to get going with streaming.
With the advancement of the streaming setup, there is not much gap at all in performance between CD and streaming. I still have a transport ready if the music service or Net goes down temporarily, but I do all reviewing with streaming and file playback. At one time, when I used a Mac Mini and upconversion software the quality was not ready, but now, it's all plenty good.
Jim, if you heard the benefit of doubling speaker cables, that's nothing compared to Schroeder Method on ICs.
I’ve been fortunate. My sons, both in their 30’s, still call me for advice when they have big decisions to make. I try to respect them as adults and they return the favor.
As is so true of us “Boomers”, I was a slow adopter of technology. I was accustomed to records and tape and didn’t see the need to use CDs. My ex-wife actually showed me the advantages of the CD. I used VCRs and didn’t see the need to go to DVDs at first — using CDs made it an easier transition. But I still have 2 nice Sony VCR’s, just in case! And though I seldom play cassette tapes anymore, I still have the Technics in my equipment array, just in case and because I like the look.
I hadn’t played records for years until recently, but reading comments here about how great the sound of records can be . . and being a bit nostalgic . . and having a lot of records and having recently been given a lot more . . I bought a turntable and a Spin Clean and have been cleaning and listening like mad — what else can you do while sheltering at home? My sons stream — audio to them is their iPhone and ear buds. Will they care about any of my equipment? Probably not. But I’m just 65 and not planning on checking out anytime soon, and I enjoy it. Maybe they will too as they get older and more curious about why their Dad fiddled with all this bulky equipment. Or maybe they won’t. I hope they will know the value and sell these things for a decent return when the time comes.
Im 46 years old and I’ve been ripping CDs since 2000, purchasing hi-res FLAC files since 2010. I currently have 300GB of music on my MacMini with dual SSDs. I still purchase CDs, SACDs and rip them along with streaming Tidal and Qobuz. With the nice Schiit Yggdrasil I have CDs sound great compared to what I heard from them in 2000. They sound so good I’ve been purchasing them again and adding to my collection. In 2010 when hi-res hit the market I swore I’d never purchase a CD again. My new system has overturned that decision. I’m happy to listen to old CDs again. They sound great.
Ok I’m a Boomer. I admit it. Actually one of the first boomers, as I was born exactly 9 mos after VE Day. (If you don’t know what VE Day is - oh well.) After listening to CDs and streaming predominantly of late, I’ve rediscovered vinyl for real, and do most of my current listening in that format. Streaming is best for exposure to new music, and for checking out albums before committing to buying an LP. Vinyl sounds best (and all my equipment is pretty high end.) All formats have their place, and I would not give up any of them.
I have been looking through AGone and AudioMart listings for a used CDP that will play Red Book CDs, SACD and accommodate streaming. Maybe I'm wrong but, It looks like I might have to choose between one that is CD/SACD or one that is CD/Streaming capable.
A tough choice for me, as I have hundreds of CDs and a few SACDs from back when I had a Sony SACD player, but like the CA Audio, quit reading discs. The only streaming I have ever done with audio, is Pandora and UTube, through my AV system, so am sure I haven't really gotten much of an appreciation of how good Hi Res streaming can be. I am finding a few good options to go either way though...Jim
Now that make's me think that of all the removed posts I see, most probably were Goeff's. He'd be up to like 40,000 or more... Oh' the humanity of it all!!!!!
I’m using a Lumin streamer and a Modwright-modified Oppo 105 (vacuum tubes) for CD, SACD, and d/a conversion. 2 boxes plus power supplies. Competes favorably with vinyl. In another system, it’s a Cambridge CD transport, an Aurender streamer and a Mytek Brooklyn dac. Not inexpensive. Both are about equal in SQ.
Your assumption is wrong. If you use your bifocals you'd see that there are only three asterisks for the withheld' name (of whom I alway's enjoy the texts of). I won't suggest a whoopin' for you, as we see them words ain't tolerated aroun' here, boy!!!
Back on topic ... Jim, I'm with you on the software. I fell in LOVE with records while young ( besides tape) that's what there was! When CDs arrived, B&O came out with a player for $1000. I said I'll NEVER get CDs!! That is the only time in my life I went back on a " I'll never". I'm in the eastern tri-state area and even still enjoy NYC FM jazz and classical. I feel very safe in saying I'LL NEVER STREAM!!! HA
About 1/4 of my recent music purchases have been of music I already have on LPs (purchased just for the convenience of being able to use my streamer/server instead of the record player). Many of the currently available digital sources of reissues sound quite bad. I've looked on discogs for alternative CD sources, such as Japanese CDs, but, the prices are extraordinarily high. It seems that good CDs, like good LPs are still in demand enough to command a lot of money.
@isochronism I feel very safe in saying I'LL NEVER STREAM!!! HA
Yea, that's where I was a week ago, but now thinking - maybe just a little. LOL
@larryi Many of the currently available digital sources of reissues sound quite bad.
I've found the same, even on the re-mastered CDs of some of my old favorites. I did a side by side comparison a few weeks ago and found the re-mastered CDs to sound bad compared to the originals.
Jim, Now your grandson will say "see gramps, I told you so" and roll his eyes again!!! Then you can tell him "that so-called Bootcamp you went through didn't do it's job"!!! "now pass me that darn remote so I can do some streaming, boy"!! HA
I have been looking through AGone and AudioMart listings for a used CDP that will play Red Book CDs, SACD and accommodate streaming. Maybe I'm wrong but, It looks like I might have to choose between one that is CD/SACD or one that is CD/Streaming capable.
Jhills. Its older now but an Oppo 105 should do everything you are looking for. Certainly cd and sacd and stream Tidal, don’t think they can do Qobuz.
It is probably prudent to NOT voice those sentiments about your kids, after all, they may be making certain critical decisions about your life in your dotage.
This reminds me about how, when we were riding around in the family car and certain rock/pop songs came up on the radio that my father would mock. I would reply by singing some crap tune from the days when he was about my age, such as, Ish Kabibble's "Three Little Fishies."
My Dad would let me listen to top-40 station in the car, (I even thought many songs were lame) Example: Silence Is Golden by Tremeloes would come on, he'd exclaim: "then why don't they shut up"? Many don't appreciate the younger generation's music. I can understand that.
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