I'm an old fashioned guy. I like to make my audio purchases from a store and have a person I deal with, establish a relationship, and know that I have someone I can call when I need things. That is why I went into one of the larger stores in my area the other day, ready to audition a couple of things and buy my system. I had a very clear idea of what I wanted, asked to listen to a component with a view to buying it. The dealer had a completely wrong approach from the start, and it is not a unique situation. I know many good folks in the business are on these forums, so I want to ask why this happens. From the moment I set foot in the store he created an atmosphere of fairly intense pressure. He started with "you know, I only demo for buying customers". Throughout the visit, I felt continuously pressured to buy on the spot. I was forced to cut my visit short and I was unable to fully appreciate the component I was auditioning. I went from wanting to buy to wanting to run away - who feels comfortable buying something when pressured and rushed to do so right away? So I left the store unsure that I would want to do business with him. Had I had a good experience, and a knowledge that I can go to the store any time and have a good experience rather than have to find a way to "escape" the pressure I would not only have been happy to buy what I wanted, but would have been back often for other purchases. I cannot for the life of me understand where this comes from. One argument I heard is that store owners don't want to have people audition things and then buy online. Well, first off short of refusing to have a show room I don't see how you can make completely sure of that. So, wouldn't making the customer feel comfortable in your store be a better strategy? For me, I now want to shop online rather than go back. And here is one more twist. All online dealers for the product I was looking at make it clear they will not sell to anyone who has a dealer in their area. So I could not buy that online anyway!! Can anyone enlighten me? Why can I not go to a local store and have that be a pleasant experience any more?
Because many dealers' sales people don't know how to sell. They are selling a transaction instead of finding out what your needs are and listening to you. Tranactional vs. consultative selling.
I've been a corporate sales officer and have taught many teams how to sell on a consultative basis. As the other poster said, it means repeat business due the the value added for the buyer when a dealer can approach you and your needs from your perspective.
Unfortunately, most dealers don't understand this themselves and therfore don't know how to hire and/or train their salespeople.
If you can, find another dealer in the area and explain the type of experience and assistance you are looking for and make clear that selling pressure is the quickest way to have you head for the exit door.
On the reverse side though, many dealers don't invest in this type of personnel as when they do, some customers will pick their brains, demo their equipment at home then buy at the cheapest place in the area or used on-line.
Good story, sorry about the Saab, my experience was equally as good buying a Saab, then when it spent 8 out of 30 months in the shop, the luster faded!
Polk432,
I suspect I know which dealer in Tampa this was, don't feel bad, the guy refused to call or return any communications from a good friend who told him he ahd $75,000 for new HT gear for his new house!
Danlib,
I ALWAYS go shopping looking like a bum, living in Florida by the beach, I don't even own dress clothes! I have never had trouble in ultra high end watch stores, or car dealers, the Porsche dealer couldn't have been more accommodating to me (unfortunately I don't fit in anything but the Cayenne) and I've had watch dealers pull $180,000+ watches out in a heartbeat for me (DeWitt Tourbillion BTW)
Despite this, I too have been snubbed at audio stores. The last one I went into was closing it's doors in 3 hours, done, over, no more retail. I wanted to buy a TT and had cash in hand (well, in wallet) They asked for 20% off a MMF Demo??? I was amazed, well, didn't buy the TT, and laughed to myself as I walked out, it was pretty easy to see why they went out of business!
Thank you for all the replies. Wow, I tapped into a well of frustration here, I am glad to hear it's not me (I was worried it was me shifty eyes...). The number of replies shows the extent of the problem. Since someone mentioned this, in the 70 or so minutes I spent there I did not see one other customer walk in, on a week-end day in the middle of the day. I guess others had figured the store out before me... I always hoped audio dealers would have a love of this stuff and be a different category than car dealers (nothing against car dealers, I know plenty who are great people, but we all agree that business overall has a certain reputation). I guess I will give other stores a chance and look more closely to online options. To brighten the mood, I remember the first store I spent audio money in. In a small town, but with a lively music scene. I spent over two hours there the first time I went, and the guy (must have been one of the salesmen) spent that time taking my wife and I through hugely expensive equipment set-ups and just teaching us about audio in general - it was very clear we would not even dream of buying any of that. He just seemed to have a blast doing that. So, one year later (yes, I did not even buy anything for a whole year!), when I finally decided to buy a system, guess where I went? This is what I want in an audio store. Educate your potential customers, and make them feel comfortable and maybe even have lots of fun in your store. Most of them will be back to spend money.
That kid won't be in sales long. I usually pay cash for Mustang GT's but the Dealers try to work with people that finance to make more money. I always get more than one dealership involved and once paid a little more to another dealership to keep the money out of the other ones hands. Since then it has been yes Sir all the way anytime I step onto the lot. Too bad this great Country has gone to hell over greed and ego. I love cars, music, rare coins, guitars, and other things that I can live with out, but I can't understand why everyone today has to hit the home run every time. You won't get rich or last that way.
I generally find the dealers in Singapore and Malaysia much more friendlier.You could walk and have a chat and have a listen with no string attached for hours on end.
The biggest difference i see between here in Southeast asia and US is that most of the dealers in SEA are the owners themselves..You generally learn a lot from them and always feel welcome.
Many of my friends from abroad has started buying from here ..and there generaly could't believe how nice the dealers are compare to US.
Likewise,during my time in the UK,I find that most dealers there are very nice and knowladgeable
Reminds me of the recent experience I had at the local dealer.
As I walk in, the salesman asks me if I have any questions. I tell him what I am interested in auditioning, and he pretty much tells me that he doesn't want to go through the trouble of hooking things up unless I am serious about purchasing. I was a little taken aback by this. After all, my buying decision would have been based on the audition.
So after he finally gets things hooked up, he starts to 20 question me about what gear I own and where I purchased everything. Why does it matter anyway?
After listening to one of the setups, I asked to have a piece of gear swapped out for something that I was interested. It turns out to be defective, so the salesman tells me that he can sell it to me for a reduced price after they get it repaired. I asked him for a ballpark price so I could figure out whether it was in my price range. He wouldn't tell me. Instead, he told me to come back when the repairs were done and he then would talk price because he didn't want me to go and buy it off the internet. After this experience, I don't think I want to come back.
1. Do exhaustive preliminary research and decide what I want 2. Do extensive price research 3. Make sure what I want is in stock at the place of potential purchase 3. Walk into a shop/dealership and request a salesperson at the reception desk 4. Make it clear to the salesperson that I will finalize the sale today, if I like it after a demo - and also clearly state that I will allow him/her to make fair profit 5. Request to be left alone, and demo it/drive it by myself for a comfortable amount of time. 6. If I like it (and I usually know what I like due to my preliminary research), walk up to the salesperson and tell him/her what I'll pay, and explain why 7. Take delivery and move on to the next thing.
Never had a problem at any car or audio dealership. That said, I do avoid disreputable places and have been driving Saabs for ages now
Good story by Danlib 1...we're all guilty of pre-judging to a certain extent, and a lot of salesmen are even more guilty of it. It's a real challenge to hear different audio equipment in peace that's why I consider events like RMAF a blessing...
I too am pissed off to the max. I bought a Grado cartridge, a Teac X1000R reel to reel, and a Linn Kudos tuner from the same company in Tampa Fl. About $1500. in all over the past 7 years. A few days ago I spoke to a salesman asking the price of used or demo Linn products. He said he would call me that day. I called back later and he was in a meeting. I called the next day from a salesman I bought the products from and he said he'd call back with prices in 10 min. NO CALL BACK. Last night I left a message for the owner pres. If or when he calls I'll let him know I bought a mint cond. Linn Mimik cd player, and I'm also buying a Linn Sondek turntable right here on AG. Not only am I saving a lot of money, but I am going to inform Linn co. about this. The economy is not that good and people should be buying gold not stereo equip. I am lucky to have a few pounds. Why do dealers ignore the working man? BTW this place was dead on Fri. when I went in there.
Mlsstl reminded me that it's not just audio dealers who act this way. I'm in sales for a living, and had a unique experience buying my wife a car.
One Saturday, I drove my P.O.S. company car (it's free- new one every year or so) to the Lexus dealership to buy a Lexus for my wife. I had on jeans, tennis shoes, and a Santana T-Shirt. My plan was to make the purchase with $15k down, leave the company car on the lot, and come back with my wife on Sunday to pick up the POS.
Well, the 20 something salesman refused to let me test drive a car. I could not believe it. His excuse was that since I was buying it for my wife, I should bring her up there for the test drive with me. I pointed out to the guy that my wife hates dealing with car dealers, and that I would make the decision and the transaction.
Even after my explanations, the kid told me to come back with my wife and he would "let me drive a car". He obviously took me for a middle aged underfunded chump who had no business on a Lexus lot.
Unbeknownst to the little shit, my wifes's second choice was an Acura she really liked- and the Acura dealership was directly across the street.
I went across the street and dealt with a guy in his 50's- great transaction.
I bought the new Acura and drove it over to the Lexus dealership. I asked to speak with the kid who had dissed me, and gently explained that one thing you must learn in sales is that appearances can be deceiving, and that every customer should be treated with respect. He did not apologize, or say anything other than I had made a mistake and bought an inferior car.
So basically the kid learned nothing and still treated me like shit. I'm sure he's doing very well in the current economic downturn.
My suggestion is to take control of the situation from the beginning. Tell the salesman EXACTLY why you are there. If the salesman doesn't seem willing to comply, speak to the owner and explain that you came in prepared to audition and purchase, and the sales idiot would not comply to your wants. My guess is the salesperson won't be able to kiss your ass fast enough nor often enough.
Reminds me of my last auto purchasing experience. I was debating between Saab and BMW. Deliberately went to the dealerships wearing sweats. Was treated like a tire kicker at the BMW dealer; was treated like a real buyer at the Saab dealer. Guess who got the sale. The entire experience at the Saab dealer was pleasant. I was treated as if I were their only customer. Never before have I had a pleasant car purchasing experience, not once!
There's no way to know if someone is serious or not, and who knows when a buyer is deliberately trying to throw you off track.
I am in sales (printing and packaging in NYC). My job is to develop relationships with my customers not push for an order. I have some customers for almost 20 years. Your retailer needs to look at it that way too. Can my customers get a lower price if they shop around and around. Maybe. But I am selling more than price. My expertise is worth the few dollars more I might be. In many cases my experience and skill can get the customer a better product for less overall cost. So I am not afraid of the cheap print shops. You get what you pay for. This bums rush dealer does not sound like he has the right stuff to win you over so he resorts to pressure tactics in place of skill and knowledge.
If I sold audio, you would walk away from a meeting with me with some new information and ideas, a plan on how to make your music sytem better today and down the road, not just a price etc.
Just my 2c from my experience. If pressured by store owner or salesperson on commission, I simply walk out and never come back. It is that simple.
I have recently spoke with fellow audiophile who used to work in high end store in NYC. In short, he tried to explain his point of view and mentality behind the approach towards the potential customer. His argument was the owners expenses, time, effort and annoyance with those who abuse the dealer as the source of information and place to audition gear of interest.
As much as I like to understand his arguments, I do not understand how this mentality can build a successful business and clientele?
I have never bought a car without test drive, watch -before trying it on my wrist, house- before seeing it, inspection done by a pro and comparing the property to the similar offerings in the area , etc, etc, etc.
His arguments were weak at best.
There are dealers that will work with you, care and are accommodating and friendly. You just have to look around to find them.
I dealt with manufacturers who would go out of their way to please their customers as well. It is one of the reasons why I simply deal with people that are as passionate and enthusiastic about music and HiFi as I am.
My best advice to you is this: *Find a dealer you like ( there are plenty to choose from) *Dealers that refuse to let you audition particular gear - report to the manufacturer....as well as your experiences and such. *call the manufacturer directly if you are interested in the product, so they can assist/help you to get the best service. *there are plenty of companies that sell direct. Some even offer in home audition. *it is your money, it is your call, do what is in your best interest.
I suspect dealers who are like this fancy themselves so perceptive that they can spot which customers are serious buyers and which are tire-kickers. It sounds like in your case (and many others one reads about in forums like this) that said dealers are often wrong.
It's a pity that happens at all and doubly so that it seems to happen frequently.
Of course, there is at least one alternate explanation. It could be that this dealer is selling more equipment than he can handle as it is without having to waste time on serious audiophiles. No need to spend time on extensive listening sessions. Fewer complaints from hypercritical customers. Fewer hassles with returns. Fewer special orders for models not in stock.
Perhaps he quickly and correctly identified you as a member of the group of customers that he thinks are more trouble than they are worth. So he blows you off and waits for a non-audiophile to walk in the door and say "give me something expensive and fancy. Your call."
I've got a system that I greatly enjoy. Even though I have no urge to change anything, I do like giving the current products on the market a listen. I can't say I've been treated poorly but there is a noticeable lack of enthusiasm when I visit most of the local stores. I do this infrequently enough - easily less than once a year - so I doubt they know who I am.
Of course, audio dealers are not alone. About 25 years ago I walked out of an Audi dealership after being treated poorly. I guess they thought I was too young to be a serious buyer. Three years ago I was looking for a new car and walked out of the same dealership again after very poor treatment. Too old now? (Those were the only two times I'd ever been in there.) I ended up with a Volvo. Guess I just don't look like the one dealer's idea of an Audi owner.... ;-)
I rarely go into high end dealers because of the same pressure. In short, I am afraid to shop at traditional dealers as it really is not a fun experience. On saturday I had the first great experience in a Audio Dealer. I visited Resolution audio in Seattle and was shown around the place by the owner Larry. He offered to check my setup on my rega TT that I did not buy from him. As well, he has a top of the line record cleaner set up for anyone to drop by and use. Anyway.....I thought it was worth bringing up this dealer to anyone in Seattle who hates the usual dealer experience.
Who could explain it differently, the dealer was a jackass. Yes, the internet has created a need for a business model for store fronts that mostly carry brands that can not be discounted on line. VPI is a good example of that model. I also think that the used market has also made life very difficult for dealers, e-bay and Audiogon itself. You have not experienced rejection until you have paid a visit to Lyric/Kay in New York City.
Same thing happended to me last month. I went to a local store to listen and buy a pair of speakers that I was sure to buy. When I asked him to listen to them, he told me only if I accepted the price, he will let me to listen to them!! I ran away.
I gave up doling business with the only local high-end audio store for the reasons you so clearly stated. Also, I found that many of the staff were far less knowledgeable than me, and tended to push particular products rather than offer choices.
So I chose to purchase from a dealer in a city in an adjoining state. I not only received first-class service, but they hand-delivered the gear and set it up in my home!
And they are always available via telephone or email for almost-instant help and advice.
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