why a 75 dollar blue ray smokes all 2k CD players and any turntable???

I don’t agree if cables,speakers are the same 
if that were the case then why was Oppo 105,205 the worlds most in  demand dvd,Blu-ray player ,until they decided to stop building them. For the dac inside absolutely counts for sonics.

"The type of CD player does not matter either, as the speakers  introduce a degree of distortion and degradation that commonly outweighs any differences my many orders of magnitude."

Could there be some cumulative effect of those degradations? No matter how small of an impact CD may have, it may still be an impact.

I do not know why amplifiers sound different, but in my limited experience they actually do. Much less than speakers, but still.

grannyring
spot on ...

Perhaps some are interested in $300 Topping DACs or $30,000 active speakers using DSP.  Maybe some see the future of high fidelity there. We can't have an opinion? 

grannyring
spot on ...

So we have some folks saying a $300 Topping dac will sound as good, the same, as the new Mojo Audio Evo dac ($5500-$12,000) when inserted into the exact same high end system. “High End” meaning a system all reviewers and Aphiles would agree is capable of clearing that sonic hurdle.  If you folks believe that, then you have not actually done the listening tests. In addition, why would you even be interested in this site or even this hobby/passion? 

^^^^ x2)    I rest my case!      Enjoy that excellent box of Lambrusco and $5.00, gourmet pizza.    Some folks’ tongues exhibit the same incorrect anatomical connections, as their ears.   Then again; there are those that simply remain satisfied with mediocrity.       They (undoubtedly) save a lot of money!

+1 djones51 and cd318! Watch out for the mob carrying flaming torches! 

High End audio has increasingly been driven by fantasy, clever marketing and hearsay from the gullible! Same as the wine market where oeniriphiles swoon over the virtues of expensive bottles compared to the "cheap stuff"!

".......satisfactory sound."          And there you have it: all a great many seek and so easy/cheap, to accomplish!        Same reason Chef Boyardee and Little Caesars are still in business.    

@oleschool,

Many of us unfortunately only found out after going around the long way.

You are fortunate to have received such an honest and straightforward response. 

 Thanks for sharing.


"interesting that the world of true audio quality has been grossly mis-represented in the market place. This has mainly been driven by Hi-Fi Press and marketing vogue that perpetuate the myths that what makes a great audio system is some exotic, very expensive speaker cables, a 'high end ' player and some exotic amp.

[There are many vested interests at work]


Its also true that vintage audio products like valve amps and vinyl are creeping back into fashion - more of a symptom of the issue that audio quality has for the most part reached an impasse."

[The full circle end point for many audio veterans]


The main culprit - loudspeakers represent the main ceiling on audio quality and this really has not changed for many decades.

Put simply if you change the speakers to something that really does the sound transduction step (the most compromised part of the audio chain) much better then you begin to see the leap in improvement that is possible.

[Loudspeakers do indeed distort the most - it's been that way for decades]


For the most part the amp (as long as it is solid state and has decent power output) and the cable (as long as it is something a bit thicker than human hair) makes little to no audible difference to audio quality.

[Every attempt to prove otherwise has amusingly, but not unsurprisingly, failed]


The type of CD player does not matter either, as the speakers  introduce a degree of distortion and degradation that commonly outweighs any differences my many orders of magnitude.  

We have had really good reviews by the audio press but they still don't want to admit that the latest exotic looking £2000 CD player really does nothing special but helps sell magazines so perpetuating the scam!

[Magazines need a reason to justify their cover price in addition to posing as boutique catalogues]


Ridiculous really when you can get a BD player for £40 that trumps the CD spec in every aspect!

Don't get me started on vinyl! S"

[Almost everyone now knows about the billion dollar cable scam first initiated by Noel Lee back in the 1970s, and who would want to seriously argue that any BD player has an inferior technology to any CD player?]


Thanks again for posting, it might save someone a lot of money and time in their endeavours to get a satisfactory sound.

Another point he made about speaker tech not changing for decades is true in the audiophile world of passive speakers. There are companies driving the future of high fidelity like Buchardt, Kii, Dutch and Dutch, GGNTKT, Genelec and others with active designs incorporating DSP. I would also say the CD player isn't as relevant anymore either music reproduction is moving to streaming.

Specs are all that matter.  Forget about actually listening.  Doh!

The Naysayers’ religion doesn’t demand one puncture their eardrums, prior to baptism and membership (yet).            They just encourage the practice, to prevent back-sliding.      At some point, they’ll probably incorporate Myringa-Mohels, to simply slice them away, as a sign of the covenant.

There will always be Chintziphiles.  

You're getting some things confused he said as long as you're using a decent SS amp and cable you will notice little to no audible difference into the same speakers. The other part was you would notice no difference between a $2000 CD transport and a basic BD player, I agree if they are both used with the same DAC. I understand most don't agree with this but technology has made most components interchangeable except for the speakers. Your playback chain is only as good as the piece that produces the most distorion and nowadays that's speakers by a pretty good margin. Not to say there are amps and DACs, transports etc.. that are worse than a speaker the Border Patrol DAC comes to mind and a number of tube components. 

I'll never forget a 1987 demo of a cheap CD player with an Oxford Acoustics table with Air Tangent arm and Koetsu Rosewood, a Radford tube amp (IIRC) with $60 Wharfedale Diamonds. Night and day. The relatively expensive turntable made the speakers light up. Harpsicord music. We thought it was a trick.  

It would be so wonderful, and money-saving if OP's hypothesis was true; but the fact that many of us have known through personal experience for many years is that while a very good speaker will certainly show its worth with an average or even below average amp and source, it's true greatness and personality will only be exposed by a better source and amplification.
I recall many years ago, John Atkinson was reviewing a small monitor, maybe a Celestion, and at some point in his reviewing process , he used a Mark Levinson 23.5 (I think) to drive it. He made the comment that he wished everyone could hear and understand what a difference a really fine amplifier could make to the performance of even a modestly priced speaker. Through my own experience, I agree.  

speakers are the link yes ,but to make a statement like any ss amp and a 75.00 blue ray will produce no discearnable difference over a higher end set up is ridiculous to me because I've heard the difference myself . whatever paper says 

my response was basically its all up for debate and in many ways digital is superior on paper

Many things are superior.... on paper. "From each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs." Clearly superior.... on paper.

PS- Love the "in so many ways" qualifier. Admitting that even setting aside the one and only way that matters (how it sounds) digital isn’t clearly superior but only "in so many ways." Good one.

Vinyl is fine for nostalgia reasons . 

He's correct in his assessment that the biggest challenge anymore is the speaker not the DAC or amplifier etc.. which have exponentially less distortion than speakers. Most DACs and amps if they measure reasonably well are indistinguishable in blind tests. 

Not to be combative, so you agree a hair thick speaker wire and a 75.00 blue ray  is equal or superior to a say vac tube powered setup into a set of say thiel  or x reference speaker through a quality front end ? Not a million dollar setup but .... I sold gear for years and certainly spent a lot of time listening and swapping gear every night and certainly discearned many differences . 

I don't get it?? You do understand he's right.