2. amps-preamps
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Tube integrateds and Electrostatic Speakers

Any one out there experienced with Martin Logan or other electrostatics and tube amps? Am currently driving my ML Summit Xs with 185watts of SS power. I still love tubes and wonder how the complex impedance challenges they pose would work with something like a PrimaLuna Dialogue Premium HP.

Any thoughts would be most welcome.
adeep42
8 responses Add your response
adeep42 OP
118 posts
 
Thank you all for your super input. I've got plenty to think about.
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,794 posts
 
Many ML speakers have a very low impedance at high frequencies. You might find a set of ZEROs helpful in dealing with the load. I would try the amp 'with' and 'without'.

www.zeroimpedance.com
bradf's avatar
bradf
329 posts
 
Some time ago, Jarred at Upscale Audio mentioned to me a demo he set up using 1st generation PL Dialogue with ML and how impressed he was with the performance of the PL / ML combo.  You may find his advice helpful. Upscale sales both PL and ML.
Personally I like the idea of the Dialogue Premium Pre-amp and Dialogue Premium HP amp, and may very well consider the PL / ML someday.
I own / owned the PL Prologue P3 and P5 (stored), and P7 Mono pair (sold) and I still use the PL P8 CDP with my current Merlin TSM /Ars Sonus Filarmonia combo. There's better and worst, but for the dollar it exceeds most.
mb1audio02
188 posts
 
" Any one out there experienced with Martin Logan or other electrostatics and tube amps? Am currently driving my ML Summit Xs with 185watts of SS power."

Tubes are no problem. I drove my SL-3's with my VAC 30/30 (32 watts/ch). You don't need something that expensive, though. Quicksilver V-4, ARC VT-100, VAC PA 100/100, Cary V12's, SF Power 2 or 3, would all be good choices.
tomcy6's avatar
tomcy6
2,588 posts
 

Check out Robert Deutsch’s review of the Montis in Stereophile. He tried 3 different tube amps, including the PrimaLuna Prologue Premium integrated, and a Simaudio W-7 ss amp. He ended up liking the McIntosh Mc-275 the best.

I own a pair of the Summit Xs. They’re a great speaker aren’t they? I was using a Pass XA-30.8 but knew that "technically" the speakers could use more power. So I tried a D’Agostino Classic Stereo amp which has more power and doubles down to 2 ohms. The result is a more relaxed, cleaner sound that keeps me in the listening chair listening longer. The D’Agostino is more expensive and that could explain the difference, but I think the added watts and doubling down are significant.

I would like to try out a good strong tube amp with the Xs though.

tablejockey
3,892 posts
 
 I have the HP.

Not using personally, but have heard several ML setups with PL gear. Also Stereophile reviews mention PL. driving difficult speaker loads including ML.

If you follow your hearing and not tech specs, realistic/convincing sonics is what I've heard. 

I say this because subjective good sonics doesn't always correlate with electronics 101 principles. Spec data isn't stellar, yet great sonics when actually used with "wrong" gear.




bdp24's avatar
bdp24
9,788 posts
 
You want an amp with as low an output impedance as you can find, to keep the amp from affecting the frequency response of the speaker. One amp designer who takes this subject very seriously is Roger Modjeski of Music Reference. He designs and builds not only tube amps, but also ESL speakers---even one with integral direct-drive tube amps without output transformers! He doesn't offer an integrated, but recommends and will build a passive pre into any of his amps. Better than ANY integrated on the market, save perhaps the more expensive Jadis and EAR-Yoshino models.
maplegrovemusic's avatar
maplegrovemusic
1,113 posts
 
I have King Sound King stats which dip below 2 ohms and used a Primaluna Dialogue One integrated with zero problems . 35 watts v.s. correct me if i’m wrong 70 for the hp . Traded the Primaluna and will one day get the Dialogue hp mono blocks .
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