Interesting, and I'd buy one if my "original version" seemed noisy or lacking in some way, but it's interesting that Schiit seems to be listening to their critics. Another note, I've found the Tung Sols to be consistent but somewhat duller sounding than the NOS RCAs and Sylvanias that I prefer to use in mine. Neither of these tubes are particularly expensive and actually can cost about the same as the new Tung Sols.
Schiit Freya plus. Is this an upgrade?
Any opinions on this version versus the previous?
https://www.schiit.com/products/freya-2
"differential triode input with semi-circlotron follower stage"
????
https://www.schiit.com/products/freya-2
"differential triode input with semi-circlotron follower stage"
????
85 responses Add your response
This should be a considerable upgrade. Maybe transformational for Schiit. Any time you lower the noise floor in any product by 20db over the outgoing model, that's significant. The ability to shut down the tubes when not in use is a big deal to many and the stepped volume knob I guess is nice. With the ability to cycle the tubes on/off, one can leave the preamp on all the time, sort of like a stand by status, and then turn on as necessary. The Freya S (without the tube stage) provides a pretty nice balanced remote controlled linestage for less than $600 and is likely all the non tube camp should need without spending alot more money. Whether the Schiit sound (or lack thereof) floats your boat or not, what they are doing to make high quality audio gear affordable is refreshing. |
@ghasley - 20 dB reduction is very surprising. I haven't been able to find that information. Like @wolf_garcia , mine is very quiet. With the gear at idle, I measure 37dB room noise from my listening seat 11 feet away. Noisy is not an adjective I would use to describe my Freya. Curious that others have found it noisy. Tom |
A preamp that seems whisper quiet in a typical system can suddenly have very noticeable noise (from seating position) when placed in a system with high-sensitivity speakers & amps. If your speakers are below 90 dB, your system probably won’t be a stress test for preamps, and you’ll be wondering about others’ complaints of noise. My speakers are 96 dB / Watt, 8 ohm, and amps output almost 300 Watts at 1V input. It is definitely a stress test for preamps. Impressively, the ARC REF 6 is whisper quiet here. The Freya +’s noise spec of -115dB, if legit, is superb. Stereophile measured the REF 6 at -100dB, A-weighted. |
Interesting, and I'd buy one if my "original version" seemed noisy or lacking in some wayIf you have a look, there's 4 new preamps in the Freya/Saga range. And by saying the old was/could be noisy, it could have been only with measurements you could see this, not by ear, but this is enough to put the fear of god into some users to upgrade to the newer ones! Great Schiit marketing!!!! Should be some great used buying of older models coming up soon. Cheers George |
I also have been shocked and rendered defensive by those with noisy Freyas, although those mostly seemed from tubes. Maybe I can stop being such a "Schitt Defender." My speakers are 99db efficient and I’d know it if a pesky hum showed up...does the new Freya seem to have returned to the 12 db or so jump in tube mode? I’m used to that in mine, although it seemed later versions had lessoned that somehow...and the "tube shut-off" feature doesn’t matter to me since I only use the non tube modes to check on my tubes, and I turn everything off when I’m not around. So now I’m back to simply being a "me" defender. |
@tomcarr From the FAQ section of the Freya + on Schiit's website: "So what’s the difference between Freya+ and the original Freya?
Any way you slice it, if this outperforms the original Freya, then it is a stone cold bargain. |
I’ve got an original Freya with NOS tubes (CBS Hytron and GE) feeding a pair of PS Audio M700 monoblocks and have used that with both Zu Omens and Klipsch Heresy III’s and there was Zero noise audible with my ear right up at the speaker. The only complaint I had about the original is you can’t tell where the volume is set once you use the remote, and they seemed to have fixed that now, but that’s not enough to make me want to buy another one. I’m more than satisfied with the one I’ve got. |
@ghasley - wow, that is substantial. Thank you very much for taking the time to provide that information. I'm more than a little embarrassed that I obviously didn't do enough research of my own. I'm perfectly happy with my Freya, but I can see the draw of the Freya+ to those on the fence considering a purchase. Happy (quiet) listening :). Tom |
@tomcarr No worries at all! I’m far from being a knowledge base for Schiit gear, just a casual observer. They make amazing gear that most everyone can afford and enjoy. Frankly, I wish they had come along before I went down the rabbit hole chasing sound in ever more expensive ways. All the best and enjoy your Freya, it is a truly fine piece of gear and when you factor in the price to value ratio, there may not be a better proposition anywhere. |
I ordered a Freya on 3.30.2019 and received it about a month later because they were backordered. Went with the upgrade tubes which brought the price to just under $800.00. Now the price is significantly lower for that same unit. It would've been nice to know that they had an upgraded version coming in just a few weeks. No real complaints with the unit but having the ability to shut down the tubes without pulling them out when using the jfet and passive mode would make things easier. I would've waited for the newer model had I known. Maybe they'll offer an upgrade sometime soon. |
PS @ghasley - I applaud your common-sense statement: " in a normal home with normal ambient noise, the Schiit preamps may be all the typical audiophile ever needs". Well said. We are quite the neurotic group, audiophiles, always chasing the unknown, always concerned something's not right, forever searching... Tom |
I did have to battle a Hum Issue with my Freya at first.Tube shutoff would be a big plus as well.I usually leave My Freya on from Friday Night thru Sunday Evening and make sure I am going thru the Passive or Jfet section.I'm not sure how much faster I will burn thru Tubes but,I am willing to roll the dice to keep the engine warmed up and ready to go to 11 at a moments notice. |
tomcarr here is the link for that DIY Ground Loop Hum Eliminator posted by SeDeuced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuvDMjxhE68&list=PL6l4LFCWKu3nRwK94OFjbmA3ATSgMpSMq&index=24&t=0s |
@axameman- excellent link, thank you. @lobinero - I'm using a Vincent SP-331 stereo amp. I prefer the Freya in tube mode. My front end is an Oppo 103 as a transport and a Schiit Modi Multi for the DAC. I have run a dedicated AC line to a dedicated room with acoustic treatment on all four walls and the ceiling. I am very happy with the sound quality. YMMV. Tom |
An update on Freya models. I went on Schiit's website on 5/25 and purchased the Freya. Next thing i know its 5/29 and i see the above thread about a Freya upgrade. I went on the website and lo and behold, the Freya S-solid state & Freya + are listed. I was dumbfounded (not too difficult of a task) & needles to say i was upset because i thought i should have been contacted. A few emails later and i realized i had been contacted via email only it was an old email i rarely use but, it was the one on record. Schiit Audio May 28, 2019, 10:37 AM(2 days ago) to me Good Morning, We are sorry for the delay in shipping. The Freya now comes in two versions . The Freya S,Passive or Active Solid State Remote Balanced Preamp for $599.00 and the Freya Plus Passive or Active Solid State or Tube Remote Balanced Preamp which is $899.00. Please let us know which version you would like and we will charge you accordingly. Thank You Schiit Audio So, NO MORE FREYA as we knew it.. I opted for the upgrade so i am waiting with anticipation... |
I used headphone amps as preamps for a while. They can sound good, but a dedicated pre can be better optimized for that application because it never needs to drive loads below 10,000 ohms, which has implications for the choice of parts and design of the output stage. E.g. for many tube preamps that means the ability to use much higher quality, lower capacitance film caps (for output coupling) within budget. |
Can these globe fubes fit in a Freya? The spacing is tight. https://psvanetube.com/wordpress/store/products/treasure-globe-6sn7-se-pair-gf-limited-special-editi... |
Received the Freya plus and so far am very impressed. The volume clicks are louder than I thought, almost like a ratchet wrench but that is really not a problem for me. I don't move the volume while listening to music%-/ The led lighting of the 3 modes is a little too dim imo. My only gripe. Initially preferred passive and jfet but after several hours the tubes started sounding much better. Will have to continue to evaluate over 2 weeks. No noise hiss or hum, and so far not noticing a loss of resolution or transparency which was a main concern with preexisting oppo 205 direct to amps. |
Will be interesting to see which mode you go after a few weeks of analysing and listening to all modes recluse. BTW Where are you on the volume position for normal loud listening. Cheers George |
Interesting about the LEDs being less bright after I nearly went insane trying to get them into the little holes after taking apart my original version Freya...trying to put green marker on the LEDs to dim them. The new Freya changed the way those LEDs are used. I guess now they cemented the thing shut? Or some sort of hidden fasteners? Too bad as I like to take things apart to see the innards...I also wonder if the tube gain jump is still to the degree it is with my Freya, as I noticed later versions had reduced the difference somehow...I'm used to it of course, and also wonder why people are surprised by the volume relay click after maybe 10,416 mentions about that here and there. Note to those considering a Freya...CLICKS...you get CLICKS...not to worry... |
The clicks come from the unit and are about as loud as a socket wrench. I don’t move the volume much after sitting but the mute button comes in handy. So far the volume has been at 12o,clock with tube gain. 2oclock without. I have been running tube and ss amps through, also using different speakers. So far am very impressed for the money. It gets a little warm but nothing like class A amps can get. The tubes are what’s hottest and I believe they shut down if not in use? - maybe someone else can clarify this. I don’t think there is an amp that won’t mate well with it melm. It has three modes including gain and buffer so you can’t go wrong. I would definitely put it in the Best Buy category. You have 2 weeks to return for refund. There are others here on Agon that have more experience with the original Freya and other preamps in general.... |
I have owned both the Freya and Freya+. The solid state on both the original and + are dead quiet and have excellent resolution. The SS buffer is very good and in the class of the Adcom GFP-750 (Nelson Pass) and McCormack LD-2 that I have owned. I sold these as I fell in love with tubes. The best tube system I have owned to date is the ARC LS-26. The original Freya was better than my Conrad Johnson ET-3SE. The new Freya+ is a good as the LS-26. The original Freya has a great balance and bloom. With my system (Wyred4Sound Dac2 and self powered Martin Logan Purity Speakers), I loved the original Freya’s overall sound and bang for the buck but the noise floor and gain were a little too high with my very sensitive powered system (0.5 volts for full volume). It was sweeter sounding than the CJ ET-3 SE so besting a $3500 Pre-amp. The Freya+ is a nice step up. It is Dead quiet with tubes. Dynamics are greatly improved with the lower noise floor. Resolution/Detail is also improved. It is as good as the LS26. If you are looking in the $1000 to $5500 and want to use tubes, you will be pleasantly surprised. It is really good Schiit (lol). |
rrebello9, Thanks for your comments about the Freya. I have a GFP-750 and tried a Freya last year and was shocked at how much better the GFP-750 was, not subtle, but massive (in all modes). I was not sure if the Freya I got was defective, and Schiit never advised it was when I returned it. Seeing your post tells me that something was not right with my unit. Now the question is do I try the Freya +, or the Freya S? I am leaning towards the S, as it has the Nexus active stage with no gain, and I traditionally run in passive on my GFP-750. As I run balanced, I don't want (need) the extra 12db of gain from the tube section. My system is a Schiit Gungir Multibit, Sunfire Stereo Amp, NHT active crossover, Magnapan 3.5s (factory rebuilt last year), Rythmik E15 subwoofer. |
Oh, I should note, I am looking at going from the GFP-750 because volume knob is scratchy in the right channel when using balanced and the remote is getting flaky. The volume pot is still available, but other parts are becoming NLA (balance). I am worried I will have a paperweight in a few more years. |
mcreyn, I would try the Freya+. I am running upgraded tubes (Sylvania NIB NOS for the gain section - with the Tung Sol at the buffer). As I mentioned, I have a very sensitive amplifier section and the new Freya+ is dead quiet in the tube output for my system (Martin Logan Self Powered Purity). Worst case, you get to try both SS and tube. Have fun! |
I've recently found some NOS GE tubes here and there (mostly there), and having messed around with a bunch of 6SN7GTBs the GEs are my faves. My little Dennis Had SEP amp likes a little gain coming in so the tube output of my "original and possibly extremely valuable since they don't make this version anymore and it makes me very special and fortunate" Freya works nicely. |
I ended up with a Freya S which replaced my Adcom GFP-750. I will post my comments here that I have posted in another forum: Received my Freya S yesterday and hooked it up and let it run overnight so it would be nice and warmed up to compare this morning. For reference my system is as follows: Jriver Id (Intel Nuc) Music Server (Now using Roon to a SOTM 200) Schiit Gungir Multibit with Gen 5 USB Preamp- Was an Adcom GFP-750 NHT X1 Active Crossover Sunfire Stereo Amp- Rebuilt last year Magnepan 3.5 on Mye Stands (also rebuilt last year) Rythmik E15 Subwoofer Room Treatments from GIK Acoustics Interconnects for the above are all XLR from Worlds Best Cables on Amazon, constructed with Mogami 2534 wire. I used Wireworld for my RCA connections for things like my turntable. Speaker cables are older Cardas Crosslink. My ears are 46 years old and still work pretty well, but not as well as when they were 25. I previously tried the original Freya pre-amp and returned it, as it sounded very veiled compared to my Adcom. I am now convinced there was something wrong with that unit. For my comparisons below, I matched volume levels as close as possible by ear and swapped cables between pre-amps while the music was paused and then would re-listen to section. In comparison to my GFP-750, across the board the Freya has much better imaging, with voices being clearly defined in space. I have to wonder if my GFP-750 (despite a crackly volume knob) has wandered out of spec being nearly 20 years old. Passive Comparison- The GFP-750 is a bit more lively sounding that the Freya S. The Freya was much better in the imaging department. The Freya definitely reduces the volume, even turned up all the way in passive compared to the Adcom. With the Adcom, when cranked up the volume knob is at 2:00-3:00 in passive mode, never needing full volume. On the Freya, I had it maxed at one point with a quietly recorded disc. This isn't all bad, I can stick it in that mode to prevent my wife from blowing speakers when she gets a hold of the volume knob (really, it has happened, twice, first to my MG-12s, then my MG2.7s. I told my wife the next time would cost a set of MG20s, that seems to have fixed the issue). Active Comparison- Again, the Freya was the clear winner in imaging. The Adcom was slightly smoother in the upper midrange and lower treble, with the Freya S sounding just like it had a little glare in that area. I wouldn't take the glare as final, as the unit has less than 12 hours on it and no cycling. The high gain mode on the Freya sounds a bit punchier than the low gain. Miscellaneous Regarding the Freya: Passive v. Low Gain Active- Despite both having zero gain, when you switch from passive to active, the sound level increases about 3-4 db. This is true with XLR and RCA. I would expect them to be the same. The step from low gain to high gain sounds smaller than the specified 12 db. Improvements from the original Freya- I really like the improvements from the original model. Specifically: 1) The pause and mute for 5 second going to high gain mode, no more oh crap moments. If you hit it by accident, you have time to hit the button again and go to passive. 2) The volume knob following with the remote. I like a visual reference and this provides it. For me this is a keeper. At some point in the future, I might try the + and see what I think with the tubes, but for the time being, I am happy and find it a step forward from the Adcom. Please keep in mind, I am no "golden ear", just someone who likes listening to music and loves how Schiit and some other manufactures have brought back 1) great equipment for reasonable prices, and 2) the idea that this should be fun. And my follow up: So some interesting observations on the different modes and gain between the OG Saga and Freya S. I decided to pull out my SPL meter to check listening levels on my Saga for my desktop system, so I could note what volume positions net me 75db peak and 85db peak (using pink noise). As I will often be at my desk for hours at a time, I like to make sure I keep the volume below 75db peak. Keeping in mind I did this with a handheld SPL app on an Iphone X, so it may not be as accurate as if I ran it with room eq and the calibrated mic. On the Saga OG there is about a 2 db gain between passive an active, 2 clicks on the volume gets you within .5 db. The surprise was the Freya S (running from a Gungnir Multibit with balanced to a Sunfire amp with balanced). From passive to Gain 1, the Freya S jumps 7 db. From Gain 1 to Gain 4, it jumps another 13 db, or a total of 20db over passive. This is way above the rated 12db. I then gave a listen to both amps in passive vs active modes having calibrated the volume positions for each to get equivalent sound levels (well within .5-1db). Properly matched with an SPL meter, rather than by ear for levels, the passive and active modes on both are far closer sounding than my prior observations. With the passive, it sounds just a bit more laid back, a bit easier sounding, a bit less dynamic. When I say a bit, I mean a bit. That said, level matched, the passive is growing on me. (I am really sensitive to glare, I have tennitus that I have suffered since a child from a loud explosion which is currently being exasperated by a German shepherd puppy that feels the need to periodically bark inside). So an important reminder to all of us, with a cheap app it is worth checking to compare sound levels to make sure they are in fact close and differences being heard are not just overall loudness. |