Does anyone know the intricate details of how these most current PPS eMats differ, aside by appearance, from the previous two generations of PPT eMat & eMat+?.any insight will be greatly appreciated...
The same, only better. No difference in terms of what they do or how they're used or where they work. I have them all, eCards too, and they are all the same in terms of sound.
Mats by the way can be bent, folded, rolled, cut up, you name it. They work great on a lot of stuff but seem especially good around speaker drivers, speaker cables, power outlets, any place with a lot of fluctuating power.
Seriously, you will have a hard time discerning any difference in terms of sound. Anything beyond that is impossible to say without getting into the details of exactly what is in there. Which we don't know. And you can trust me on this - wouldn't say if we did.
As opposed to one type of rebranded EMI absorbing mat, it is either a thicker rebranded mat and/or rebranded mat with a reflector back to ensure signals pass through both.
I remember looking at this company about a year or two ago. I understand they went under when the owner passed away. Realistically, they didn't appear to have the knowledge, manufacturing capability, or test capability to develop something like this. These are manufactured by companies like 3M, Laird, TDK, Kemet, and no doubt several companies in China.
You don't know a damn thing about this product. How it is made its composition or anything else. And these were made by the maker (now deceased) in New Hampshire located in the USA not offshore but onshore. Tom
Obviously I know a heck of a lot more than you about these things. I have no doubt the supplier stuck a sticker / backing on them, I understand some had a magnetic backing, perhaps he attached that. Makes it convenient.
However, given the website, writings of the owner at the time, etc. there was no indication at all of the ability to technically verify such items, to manufacture them, etc. Feel free to put forth evidence that proves me wrong.
A product such as this would require significant investment to develop, prepare manufacturing tooling, etc. test, etc. So where is this product now? This would be an estate or corporate asset.
It sounds like you got taken in by paying 4x for an audiophile branded EMI absorber. Don't get mad at me.
Not mad just disappointed in someone who knows nothing about the individual who developed this product his life or his death or his legacy. You don't so shut your receptacle..Did you ever converse with this person by phone, email or even text?? I doubt it. So again you have 0 experience of this product or this person. Tom
What you know or do not know is one thing. What you write however is quite another. Based on what you just wrote, what theaudiotweak just said is patently objectively unambiguously true. You know nothing. Absolutely nothing. Worse, what you have said is all false. There’s a few of us who absolutely do know what we’re talking about. You are NOT one of us. Furthest thing from it.
No wonder I get people PM me asking WTF is up with this clown? Meaning you. In no time flat you have established yourself as one of if not the biggest most pompous empty suits ever to soil this site.
That is more than enough. I am done with you now. Spew whatever you want. Won’t be reading it.
You never saw the manufacturing facility for these mats. You never saw them being manufactured.
You are just taking at faith what you were sold on. Some of us are not quite so naive. That is the truth. Tell us what happened to all the paid for tooling, intellectual property, etc. associated with these mats. You claim to be insider. So spill.
People don’t PM me asking what is wrong with you MC, they state it pretty clearly in practically every thread you post in.
This nonsense is ridiculous. MC, your input was greatly appreciated. I started this thread to hopefully satisfy my curiosity. Now this thread has imploded to the point of becoming volatile, thanx to Audio2Design. There hopefully will be more intellectual input as opposed to this childish banter...sort of like when tough guys hear about a fight and want to know the particulars before committing their interest and time....
You asked what was the difference mooncrikit. If you don't like the answer, getting mad at me is not going to help.
Obviously MC does not really know or he would have put some more detail into "the same but only better". How so? 3db more attentuation? Wider frequency range of operation?
If you just wanted to guess at the difference, why bother asking? That is all MC is doing. Ditto for audiotweak. I have no doubt they talked to the owner. I also have no doubt they never saw the manufacturing line or these being manufactured. They have no test data, nothing but someone's word. They don't have intricate details of any sort or they would post them.
Yes, you are correct. I did ask what the difference was. I didn't get "mad" at you...however since I asked for intelligent knowledgeable responses since I wasn't guessing, then your input here is suspect at best....please dropout of this thread like the gentleman you possibly can be unless you can offer up any responses that relate directly to the premise of what the difference is between these various versions. Whether you are a believer or not, which obviously you are the latter, doesn't give you or any doubter carte blanche to trash my thread. Being a sceptic is fine as long as you create and build your own thread to do so. So cordially, I ask you to stop pissing on my parade...oh and by the way...Thank you kindly for doing so..
Well said, mooncrikit, and thanks. Won’t do much good. You’re new so won’t know this but this site has a dedicated core of thread-wreckers. This is one the more despicable ones. We had one even worse and finally managed to banish him only to find his slot filled by this one. Sad. So sad.
This system is chock full of the stuff you are asking about. Before going into what little I am able to reveal you really should study the system and comments from those who have heard it such as:
The imaging was so good that I felt like the vocalist was performing right in front of me and that I could reach out and touch them. Chuck played a variety of genres so I was able to hear several different instruments and they all sounded very distinct...even the Piano! During the middle of one song (I had my eyes closed) ,Chuck took the cables off the Cable Elevators; I immediately heard the sound become distorted and muddy.
Did you catch that last line? Eyes closed. No idea what I was doing. Heard it. This alone blows away the BS of those such as the empty suits who do nothing all day but bash this stuff that others so obviously are able to hear. Makes you wonder if behind all their rage isn’t good old fashioned jealousy.
Here’s another one:
My listening impression was all the detail and nuances were presented to my ears in a most unique way. Unique to me because it was so far above any system I had heard including the last set of Monitor Audio Gold with a Prima Luna Integrated. I enjoyed hearing everything but was most shocked at Fleetwood Macs "Landslide" Hearing it so many times in the past and then not recognizing the intro because of the detailed soundstage. Then Chuck let Stevie Nicks sneak into the room and begin the vocals dead center right in front of me and the recognition set in.
In case you don’t know that PL is a much better amp than mine and those Monitor Audio Gold speakers are almost twice the price. In other words a lot of why my system sounds so good- and it does sound freaking good! - is exactly these tweaks you are asking about.
Okay so with my credibility thus established- already told you just about all I can. Well technically could tell you a whole lot more. But sometimes one of the ways you get to learn a lot of cool stuff is for everyone to know you are a) credible and b) ethical. As in, not about to go blabbing proprietary info all over the interweb. Which is what this particular loser seems to think he can goad us into doing. Not happening.
What I can tell you is this is entirely new, original, and proprietary. The Mats that are out there are all almost exactly the same material, which is NOT any of the BS the blatherer thinks, and they sound so much alike I’ve never heard any difference. There’s some eCards I tried that one was silver the other copper, the copper was ever so very slightly warmer. No one would ever know other than side by side, and a lot not even then.
The composition of what goes into this stuff I am not even going to hint at. What I will say though is what totally triggers the haters, and that is what it does or how it works.
What we think of as the signal is not just electrons moving in conductors. Its not just current in wire. Its mostly fields. Fields that emanate in 3D and off to infinity. That’s not new-agey BS that’s science. Electromagnetic fields radiate off into infinity. Intensity falls off with distance but never really goes to zero.
Okay so this is why the geometry of cables, and the insulator around a cable matters. Synergistic Research made cables for many years with Active Shielding, essentially a sheath with 30VDC on a mesh wrapped around the cable. Still have some. Makes a huge improvement.
Well now, what if you take some material known to have interesting outer electron shell properties and put that near your component? I mean, besides the empty suits head explodes?
@ audio2design , birds of a feather and all. They do not like people throwing water on their fire. I'm not entirely sure why this clannish behavior develops around audio products that can not possibly have any real benefit. Seems odd but hey, it is their money. I just pop in once in a while to justify my reputation.
Understand that MC and others commenting have neither the knowledge or experience to know at all what this thing is, or to understand what would be communicated about how it may work, be manufactured, etc. or to know if they were being fed a line or not. They have never seen it being manufactured. They just have the word of mouth from a company with very limited technical abilities.
I am giving them the benefit of the doubt they were selling a product that did something, but there is nothing that gives any indication they had the experience, knowledge, equipment, etc. to develop or manufacture something like this.
Like I said, I am giving them the benefit of the doubt, so I will give them the benefit that they took a readily available EMI absorbing mat, branded it, and sold it to audiophiles. The upgraded one probably took the standard version and upgrade to a multi-material mat and/or one with an reflective coating that causes RF to pass through the material twice which can improve effectiveness.
Now, you can listen to a post from someone who may have some clue how this could work, what was likely, and likely difference, or you could listen to MC whose understanding of electricity, dielectrics, RF, etc. wouldn't get him through first year engineering school.
Have at it in your thread. Easy but wrong answers are readily found here.
No, I have been unable to find any info on these particular PPS version mats, hence my inquiring post here...I have contacted Krissy via PM but have yet to hear back from her.
MC and others commenting have neither the knowledge or experience
to know at all what this thing is, or to understand what would be
communicated about how it may work, be manufactured, etc. or to know if
they were being fed a line or not.
The opinion of others here seems to be the equal of yours - you don't appear to have any unique insight into this.
You know how MC makes comments on masks and covid @cleeds , even though he clearly does not understand how they work, though working in a hospital one would expect he uses one regularly? This would be a similar thing. Using something and understanding it are clearly not the same thing.
Glupson... So far, the only one that contributed with an answer applying directly to my question was MC...The others including you have contributed zero beyond being negative (sceptics) towards the product(s) in question and to other posters. If one wants to post their negativity, by all means create your own thread instead of skewing this one (mine) off course.
I don’t think there is anyone posting here who has more PPT mats in their system than I do. I have both the original mats and the "Plus" mats.
The difference between the original PPT mats and the PPT "Plus" mats are exactly what MC said. The "Plus" mats are more powerful than the original mats. Both versions provide a significant upgrade to the SQ, but the "Plus" mats are more so.
I believe that the same technology was used in the mats as was used in the PPT Total Contact contact enhancer. Judicial use of Tim Mrock’s graphene formula under the label of the mat. And as for the mat itself, I believe that it was the same material as that used for refrigerator magnets. And yes, the mat material can be bought through Internet suppliers. However, the graphene formula used in developing the PPT mats died with Tim Mrock ... the genius who came up with all of these great ideas.
Those of us who fully committed to Tim Mrock’s products realize what a loss it was when Tim passed on. Why? Because with Tim and Krissy’s help, we have turned our audio systems into magic music machines. The results have to be heard in order to be believed.
Frank and I are two of a very select small group who actually knows what they’re talking about. Based both on extensive use of the products as well as lots of nice long talks with the people involved in developing them. Frank already confirmed I know what I’m talking about. Now let me reiterate neither of us nor anyone else who knows is about to be telling you or anyone else any of the information you seem so keen on getting. Nor will Krissy. You will be no better off in that respect than now.
What I can tell you, what Frank just said, what anyone can learn by reading my review- they are not refrigerator magnets! That’s actually the first thing I thought myself. Being completely opposite your average poster here rather than bloviating and pontificating and acting the fool I went and got a few refrigerator magnets and tried them out. Again, read my review! Compete fail!
Not only are they NOT refrigerator magnets, but if they were they would make the sound WORSE not better! Try it yourself if you don’t believe me. Always say that. Hardly anyone ever does. So much more satisfying to be like the empty suit pretending to know. Head so empty one day its gonna implode like one of those cool science experiments. Closest to science he will ever get.
Sorry for the attitude but the fact of the matter is you can learn everything you need to know by buying the stuff and using it. Anything beyond that is worth exactly zero, unless you are trying to rip them off by replicating it for yourself. Already told you everything there is to know. Only as usual no one is interested in the truth. The signal is not what you think it is. If it was Frank and I would have normal pedestrian level systems just like everyone else. Instead of what Frank said:
with Tim and Krissy’s help, we have turned our audio systems into magic music machines. The results have to be heard in order to be believed.
You realize PPT did not give any appearance of having the ability to mold/extrude these mats right? His "proprietary" formula is fairly well enough described in his patent on his contact enhancer which comes down to a conductor in a binding solution. Keep the comedy coming.
RF absorption is not the sort of thing you guess at. Again, no indication of the knowledge, experience, or equipment to even begin to develop something like this, let alone the in house manufacturing capability and no one is going to run something they are not pretty familiar with through their molding machine / extruder given the potential for damage.
I believe that the same technology was used in the mats as was used in
the PPT Total Contact contact enhancer. Judicial use of Tim Mrock’s
graphene formula under the label of the mat. And as for the mat itself, I
believe that it was the same material as that used for refrigerator
magnets. And yes, the mat material can be bought through Internet
suppliers. However, the graphene formula used in developing the PPT mats
died with Tim Mrock ... the genius who came up with all of these great
ideas.
Using something and understanding it are clearly
not the same thing.
Exactly! And that's precisely why so many here urge you to actually try some of the items you mention when you so forcefully assert your opinion (or speculation) as fact.
What gives audio2design the right to diss any product he choses without listening to it on grounds of superior insights, however acquired? Shouldn‘t the Moderator intercede on this type of counterproductive behaviour? I for one am fed up.
First off, thanx for offering your positive insight. I have seen many informative posts created to and responded to by you and appreciate them for their straightforwardness, convincing factuality and candor. (Please resist TROLLS!) However Sir, my question in regards to these mats is about the last, most latest/current version (I believe maybe @ V3?) labeled "Perfect Path Solutions" or PPS, not Perfect Path Technologies. Their appearance has both sides in all black with a Pink & light blue highlighted logo sticker on one side...
What gives audio2design the right to diss any product he choses without listening to it on grounds of superior insights, however acquired? Shouldn‘t the Moderator intercede on this type of counterproductive behaviour? I for one am fed up.
You’re not the only one. Almost everyone somewhere somehow manages to post something useful and worth reading. Most of the people in audio have little if any formal training in the field. Some do, sure. But you would be surprised how many of the very best in the business learned it all by listening and trial and error. Whatever engineering, acoustics, electrical knowledge or whatever they need they learned as and when they needed along the way. Hang around this site long enough, get good enough at doing this, you will come to realize as I have that formal education is one of the bigger stumbling blocks. The man who thinks he has all the answers has after all no reason to go looking.
That’s our empty suit. He posted his resume, as if anyone cares, which it turns out is all perfectly unrelated to home audio. Poor guy didn’t even notice the question he was answering was a diagram of a recording studio. The poor OP who came looking for help, you kind of expect he might miss something like that. For the guy who parades his superior education and professional experience to miss it, well what does that do but show him to be an empty suit? Empty as they come.
Except maybe for being full of himself.
mooncrikit, They changed the name. They changed the stickers. End of story.
For a person starting a thread with a question, you appear hostile to people not answering the question with what seem to be your preconceived answers. Why don’t you simply post an answer? You seem to know it anyway. Use deduction. You already know what is wrong so whatever will be left will be right.
So far, your contribution to this thread, apart from starting it, has been less than zero. You contributed only negativity.
If you do not like answers and explanations people give you, by all means, move to another thread and stop spreading your vigilant negativity here.
glupson definitely wins for the best comedy, though, realistically, MC provides an endless source of material.
MC, you work in a hospital and you don't even know how masks work. I hate to tell you this MC, but the physics of electricity and sound don't change between a recording studio, a mixing studio, and a home.
antigrunge2, I didn't diss the product by the way. I actually gave it the benefit of the doubt that it actually did something, probably even along the lines of some of the claims. Absent evidence (and I still don't see MC or Papa providing any), I have no reason to believe PP had the wherewithal to develop, test, or manufacture such a product from "scratch" i.e. roll extrude or mold an EMI mat. Absent such capabilities but giving them the benefit of the doubt it somewhat does what it says, a logical conclusion is they sourced and branded it. I have no issue with that. If people can do it with fuses, why not EMI mats?
Why do you continue with the "
roll extrude or mold an EMI mat" nonsense. Did you read my above post? There was no rolling, extruding, or molding involved. And Tim Mrock was no neophyte. While his hobby was audio, his products were originally intended for commercial use. Read all of the threads on the PPT products and you'll find how they save on energy consumption. Tim told me that he spent over 15 years in experimentation and research in order to end up with the final products. He was a semi-partner with Brian Kyle years ago in developing another contact enhancer. I tried it, and while good, did not come up the to standards of the PPT Total Contact. Not even close.
One thing about Tim Mrock ... he did not have a formal education in electrical engineering. Perhaps that is why he was able to keep such an open mind.
Just how do you think the EMI mat was made? Do you think it was poured into a flat mold and then allowed to harden?
I have never mentioned his contact enhancer.
How many people do you see leading the world forward in technical fields "without a formal education". The answer is pretty close to none. If you don't know what was done by those before you, it is impossible to build on what they have done.
Why does every time, or virtually every time, when PPT products are discussed talk shift to inventor instead of continuing with invention? To the point when proof that products are working as advertised is that inventor was a very friendly and chatty person. Why not leave the man in peace? His products are his products, they are not him. Let him rest.
Again, when it came to the mats, there was no pouring of anything into a mold.
One can pick up a pretty darned good education just from reading books, and then applying the knowledge learned from the research. As I said, 15 years spent in research, trial, and error in developing the products.
Too bad you never had the opportunity to speak with Tim. He was a fountain of information, albeit, much of which was over my head from a technical standpoint.
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