Pass INT-250 for B&W 800's

@jeffreyw

Having heard the Pass 250.8 and INT-250 with the B+W’s several times, both do a very nice job. I should be up front. I do not love the B+W D3’s. I don’t think they are a bad speaker, but just not my favorites (they are very nice etc).

That said, having heard them with several amps (Pass, Moon, McIntosh, Luxman, Classe).

I felt they sounded best with the Classe and Pass (in fairness the store that had the McIntosh gear literally had them in the front showroom with glass EVERYWHERE).

But both the Classe (previous series) and Pass could drive them to very loud levels cleanly and the bass (and I love bass) was really, really good.

(It’s the highs on B+W that I don’t always agree with), but both the Pass and Classe smoothed things out ever so slightly. I own a 250.8 and while it’s currently paired with a XP22, I’ve run it DAC direct also and not had any issues.

My current speakers are Salk SS12’s which are 84db and can play down to 20hz. I listen loud at times and the 250.8 has NO problem driving them.  In fact, it rarely leaves Class A power (the needle on Pass amps indicate you are moving towards A/B power)

This Bi-polar vs mosfet transistor gibberish is a non-issue. The Gryphon, Pass, and many others will drive those without an issue.

Get the one who’s sound signature you feel matches best with your speakers to get you the sound you are looking for.

It doesn’t matter a hill of beans to me if you get a Pass, Gryphon etc... but I wouldn’t rule anything out that you are looking at.

Nice thing with the McIntosh integrated is they have built in EQ, which if you don’t have something like Roon could come in handy for you.

But, if you like Bass, a warmer (or at least not super detailed sound, and with your speakers I would be cautious as that tweeter is revealing). Pass, McIntosh, the Gryphon should all do the trick.

If you go DAC direct, the RME DAC’s are very nice and have all sorts of EQ available also.

but i can tell you that a bipolar amp will be better with b&w speakers but i also can tell you that the b&w speakers are volume limited so huge power may not be required in a normal room

So correct, also the bi-polar Gryphon Diablo 300 is not a huge 500watt, it’s 300watt amp similar to the Pass, but it can just do "current delivery" far better into low impedances with combination of -phase angle that the 800’s have better. So it controls better and delivers dynamics better with no strain into those loads. And it sounds typically Gryphon Class-A’ish without the heat penalty.

Cheers George

I would consider the pass as well as the luxman and accuphase integrated amplifiers but i can tell you that a bipolar amp will be better with b&w speakers but i also can tell you that the b&w speakers are volume limited so huge power may not be required in a normal room i would go with whatever sounds the best to you try and find a dealer in your area to try some of these beast integrated amps.

PennPencil,
You bring up an interesting point about utilizing just the 250.8 amp which I am seriously considering. I only require a digital system so I would have to obtain some level of streamer/dac/preamp with a volume control as a start. This opens up an entirely different thread as to what component would synergize with the Pass? Interestingly, I have noticed many state that these DAC/preamps sound better when a preamp is introduced into the chain. 

I have the 802D3s driven by an old Ayre V-5X amp. Even though is only 150watts the work very nice together.

jeffreyw


All the above recommendations will sound fine, but you bought the B&W 800 because they are B&W’s flagship speaker, why settle for an amp that is "fine" with them.
The Pass won’t have amperage ability of the Gryphon, and many say have the "Mosfet haze" to their sound, and the "transformer coupled" SS Mac’s, will have even less control. But they both will sound "fine".

Get the Gryphon Diablo 300 which will control them far better than any other mentioned here, and have the magic transparent class-A sound they have also.

Cheers George

One of my audio friends has the 802D2 and just purchased the new mac 12000 integrated amp. The sound is fantastic and it mates very well with his B&W's. I have a pair of 800D and I have been considering replacing my Edge pre and power amps with a high quality integrated. Both the mac and gryphon are under consideration. Best wishes.

I have tried McKintosh with 800d3 and 2. Far too "weak" for me and I use Bryston 7b3. It is a matter of taste though

I have the Pass 250.8 power amp and B&W 803 D3s and the amp has way more power to push the speakers than you'll ever use unless you need to broadcast in an airline hanger.  BTW, check the sound of the INT vs. the power amp to see which sound you prefer.

A Pass INT 250 won’t even blink with those. You will be most pleased provided you like the overall sonic integration of the two. IMO those two will play nicely. 

jeffreyw-There are some folks around here that have alarm bells (just like a firehouse) that go off, every time there is a thread about Nelson Pass. I think Nelson must have stole their girlfriend in high school, either that or they have something to sell. Your B&W’s will sound wonderful with a INT-250.

I drive Focal Maestro Utopia towers off a set of X260.8 Pass Labs monos. There is plenty of power and the sound is holographic, prestine and has plenty of authority. 

I would think the Int250 would have all the power you need. Worst case, Pass amps hold there value very well, especially if you buy used.

Fwiw, I never found my 802d3 to be very strong in bass, despite trying many different high end electronics. 

Yes, the Pass will push them, and push them well.

I wouldn't give it a second thought.  That new MA12000 does look pretty killer though!

The Maggies are just a straight benign resistive 4-6ohm load, nothing like the B&W800’s
And the Gryphon will give even more of that Class-A sound.

My friend a very good tech, has the 800’s and owned my NC500’s (Belcanto ref600m copies) monoblocks with linear supplies, and they could not drive the 800’s to his satisfaction, now he drives them with this like I have also, and it does sound so much better. As an integrated for your speakers you won't go passed the Gryphon Diablo 300.
https://ibb.co/4V9GPwy
https://ibb.co/56WcSqh

Cheers George

If you like the Pass sound which I do you should have no problems with the 250 plenty of power and current. It pushes my Maggie's without blinking.

jeffreyw

The more I look at the Gryphon Diablo 300 the more it’s the amp for you, it sticks out 300w into 8ohms and still belts out 950w into 2ohms!!! For an integrated this is unsurpassed from what I’ve seen, and should mate perfectly with the B&W800’s and their heavy load.

The extreme high current capability of the Diablo 300 allows it to double its output to 600 Watts in a 4 Ohm load and deliver a massive 950 Watts into 2 Ohms.

https://gryphon-audio.dk/shop/integrated-amplifiers/gryphon-diablo-300-integrated-amplifier/

Cheers George

jeffreyw


The 800’s are very current hungry, earlier ones even more so, look more towards large "bi-polar" (Gryphon) integrated ’s they will give more current into those demanding loads, rather than large "mosfets" (Pass).

There are minima of 3.15 ohms at 91Hz, 3.1 ohms at 620Hz, and 3.67 ohms at 21kHz. Given that there are current-hungry combinations of 4 ohms and –52° electrical phase angle at 62Hz and 5.3 ohms and –39° phase angle at 8.6kHz

Cheers George

I would listen to the following alternatives (listed from "cooler" to warmer)

Luxman
Ayre
Parasound

Best,

Erik