@audioconnection what is the output impedance via the balanced and unbalanced outputs for the Ayre Codex? That specification is not provided in Ayre product literature.
Oppo 105 D vs. DAC-transport combination.
To my great dismay, the more I listen, I’m finding my Oppo 105 is outperforming a very well thought of DAC and transport combination for which I paid 3x the price. Basically the sound stage is wider and better defined.
Both the DAC and transport are less than a year old. I thought I was upgrading.
Played by itself, the DAC-transport combo sounds great. Until I compare it to the Oppo.
I can’t understand it!
Both the DAC and transport are less than a year old. I thought I was upgrading.
Played by itself, the DAC-transport combo sounds great. Until I compare it to the Oppo.
I can’t understand it!
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The main reason I bought a 105 maybe 4 years ago was to simplify my system, and I have ~ 50 SCADs/DD-As (and growing) . I upgraded from a Parasound P3 to a P5 pre/ dac. I tried the P5 dac using a toslink and after significant break- in, I did not notice much of an improvement About a year ago I installed an aftermarket wiring loom- silver wires to the power supply board connected to a Rhodium IEC. That was a big improvement. Later, I replaced the OEM power supply with a Linear Power Module, another big leap. I sold the P5 the using the 105 direct to my amps: OK at best on redbook. I came across a Hattor Passive Pre XLR which was a huge improvement, though an impedance mismatch with my amps. I bought a Audio Alchemy stereo amp, but it too was a mismatch, so I bought a AA DDP-1 (DAC/PRE, but just for the preamp. Finally, the music was coming to life. For grins I decided to try the DDP-1 DAC using the same WireWorld Toslinkk cable: WOW Next up was to dust off my decade+ old Pioneer PD 65 CD player, inverted platter with a Musical Concepts Stage 3 mod which included an outboard power supply: Amazing So, the 105 now idles until I want to spin high rez discs |
1graber2, I’m pretty sure you have something there. Interesting situation with the Cyrus. I ordered it from an English store. The power cord included had a European outlet end so I couldn’t plug it into the wall. To make matters worse, the other end, the end that connects to the transport, has only two prong holes instead of the normal three. As a solution I substituted a regular three hole plug and plugged two of the holes into the transport. The unit worked. As you mention it, It dawns on me now that this could very well be the problem. The dilemma is, where do you get a two hole cable with an American outlet plug? Anybody have a suggestion? |
Oppos are certainly terrific values for all they have to offer, But IMO it does many things pretty good, but nothing great. Someone above said the 105 is much better than the Oppo 95 which I base my experience on. As RV Piano has talked about, why the Cyrus transport not doing well? Not sure about the internals, but the first I do when I buy a piece of equipment is to replace the stock cord. I'm always amazed how much better the sound can get with a good entry level "audiophile" cord. I wouldn't spend more than $100 on the power cable, new or used. but lots out there to choose from ... |
@melm stick and stones....Just out of curiosity, what is the “quality of the musical experience “ that you missed with the Oppo compared with vinyl? I will assume that it isn’t the joy of cleaning dust bunnies from your stylus, or the tactile pleasure of hearing the walls of the Lp groove being shredded by the sewing needle attached to the cartridge. Is it the limited dynamic range of lp playback compared to digital that floats your boat? Personally, if I want to listen to Music with restricted dynamic range, I opt for MP3, because at least it’s quieter. But hey, enjoy. @noble100 Thank you for the kind words...at least you perceived that I was attempting to be humorous. And I agree with you that the gift of music emerging from a silent background is something to be treasured. Vinyl aficionados apparently prefer some of the background noise inherent to lp replay, and isn’t it great that we listeners are able to choose for ourselves which option we prefer? @rvpiano Don’t be shocked that the Oppo bested Cyrus ( a product that I have no direct experience with). Oppos are well engineered machines, and just because another product is more expensive doesn’t make it better. Oppos have been known to be terrific values |
Sorry for so many posts in a row, but I made a discovery. After finding that Tidal sounded better through the Gumby, I did as mahler123 had suggested and hooked up the Oppo with the Gumby. I A-B ed the two setups and, Voila, the Oppo/Gumby combo sounded better than the Oppo by itself. It’s hard to believe the Cyrus transport is inferior to the Oppo transport, especially considering the cost. I’m sending the unit back to them to check it out. It just doesn’t make sense. |
Mahler123 stated: "@melm Sorry the Oppo 105 didn’t come close to sounding like your vinyl. Perhaps if Oppo had figured out a way to compress their dynamic range, add speed instability and most importantly simulate the sound of frying bacon superimposed on the music, then they would still be making players." I don't believe mahler123 deserves to be called 'an ignorant fool' for his insightful and quite humorous comment. Listening to music emanating from a dead quiet background is a quality that I would think and hope we all can appreciate as a significant contributor to excellent sound quality in our systems. Tim |
Shardone Have you done a direct comparison? Meter reader has nothing to do with its performance Its op amps in the Benchmark Vs discrete devices in the Ayre If you listen you will switch I promise you its ugly but truth Listen to RCA Heifetz/Munch Boston/ violin hardest thing to do and the Ayre's finesse will be obvious with overtones all intact and you will thank me. Best , JohnnyR |
@audioconnection The Ayre Codex has only 19 bit resolution vs the DAC 3 21 bits. The Ayre Codex has 3rd harmonic distortion at (-60 dB) 0.1% at full output and 2nd and 5th harmonic is typically at -75 dB. For sure the Ayre Codex will sound different - such high 3rd harmonic distortion will likely give it a more euphonic sound similar to a tube amp. I don’t doubt some people will much prefer the Ayre Codex to the DAC 3. Ayre make excellent products. In comparison the Ayre may sound more rich and musical and the DAC 3 more lean or thin. |
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OP Have you tried using the Oppo as a transport for the Gumby? How did that sound compared to to the Oppo by itself? If you have already mentioned this I apologize but I didn’t see it. @audioengr I don’t follow your reasoning. The OP wasn’t complaining about the Oppo. He preferred it to the Cyrus/Schiit combo. How will reducing jitter in his preferred component change this perception? |
@rvpiano - There were many reasons for buying the 205. As it is still breaking in, won't make judgements yet. The 205 does sound great out-of-the-box. It's just that the 105 always sounded a little "in your face", a tad harsh with redbook CDs (which is why I often used a Rega DAC). SACD sounded fantastic, however. The 105 just started to sound its best in the last few months. I will say that the 205 makes quite a bit of noise when playing MQA CDs (I have only one). It sounds like a PC burning a CD at 3X speed. Don't know if it makes the same noise streaming. |
It’s the jitter on the S/PDIF coax output of the Oppo: https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=154408.0 The same jitter will not be experienced when using the internal DAC. It can be fixed and even improved however: If you add a Synchro-Mesh reclocker and a good BNC coax cable, the Oppo jitter is reduced to ~7psec at the end of the cable, rather than the 800psec of the Oppo and cable alone. More than 100X less jitter. You will not find ANY transport with jitter this low. Jitter is ALL that matters in a digital source. Steve N. Empirical Audio |
ICs are Morrow Toslink between the Cyrus and the DAC, Morrow MA4 out of the DAC to the preamp, MA 3 between the Oppo and the preamp (RCA’s). Stock power cords on both Cyrus and Oppo. Morrow MA 4 power cord between preamp (Currently Emotiva XSP1, while my Conrad-Johnson PV11 is out for repair,) and Nuforce (Reference 9 V3) mono-block amps. I have the Oppo 95. The 105 is light years better. |
@ OP, something seems to be wrong with this situation: What ICs are you using? AES or SPDIF or Toslink out of the Oppo? What power cords are you using? Did you A/B the Oppo vs the Cyrus/Schiit with the SAME ICs ? the SAME Power Cords? Same question for the Cyrus/Schiit combo. Unless Oppo has made gargantuan changes to the transport of the 105 over the 95. I had the Oppo 95, the transport on it was mediocre at best. |
There's a lot of high priced crap out there. I have an Oppo 105 and didn't play it very much as it didn't come close to my vinyl. I ran the Oppo into an LKS and the improvement was amazing. Better still when I ripped my CDs and SACDs and play them through a laptop directly to the DAC. I consider it on par with my vinyl . . . not the same, but as good. The Oppo still serves well for video-audio combo. |
Greetings Shardone I strongly disagree I have 3 customers that brought in their Benchmark DACs The Ayre Codex easily outperformed the above. one fellow in disbelief brought his 600 dollar power cord with him and insisted it would make the difference, The stock cord on the Ayre Codex was still obvious that it outperformed the Benchmark. An AQ thunder Power cord and Ayre Codex together are very special. Best, JohnnyR |
Not surprising as the Oppo is excellent. To best the 105 you probably should try Stereophile Class A+ DACs or the 205 from Oppo. https://www.stereophile.com/content/recommended-components-2018-edition-digital-processors The Benchmark DAC 3 is about 40% less than the next most expensive and 1/10 the cost of the most expensive one. Keep your Cyrus transport as Benchmark will take any digital input without fuss (I haven’t found any cable or any input or any reclocker to improve the sound out of the box with stock cable and connects). Benchmark is popular with classical listeners. |
